Help me reassure my IT teacher..

By teh h4x0r5
in Microsoft (Windows)

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teh h4x0r5

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Then how do you suggest I transfer the files? I don't own a floppy drive, they are by far outdated; I don't have any blank CD-R's, I have blank DVD+R's and DVD-R's but the machines in school don't have DVD-ROM drives, I have one pen drive which I have lent to my Dad, and all uploading sites are blocked (imageshack.us, rapidshare.de, everything). Oh, and why, may I ask, is the Gamma server insecure? ..Because CentOS isn't the latest version?

Experienced

phend-one

Posted
Posted

Just explain this analogy to her:

What is the difference between what I was doing earlier (accessing my home machine to retrieve a file) and bringing a floppy/burned cd with the same file to school if my home computer was already infected with a virus? It doesn't make the school any more secure using either method.

You should also tell her (nicely) that you didn't like the fact that she walked off when you were trying to explain something to her and that just because you are a student, doesn't mean she doesn't have to listen to you.

A teachers's duty is to the students. If a teacher doesn't trust their students, they shouldn't be teaching. ESPECIALLY as a teacher, she should understand that to learn, there has to be an exchange in knowledge, therefore communication. How she got her teaching degree is beyond me. I mean, listen to your students and then find out for yourself!

EDIT: Take the advice of the person a few posts back and just send the attachment to yourself through email. Saves you from idiocy like this.

Enthusiast

user name 2

Posted
Posted
EDIT: Take the advice of the person a few posts back and just send the attachment to yourself through email. Saves you from idiocy like this.

586830140[/snapback]

As he said, everything with the word mail is blocked so that's a non starter.

I too use such remote access solutions, but without any problems, but that's probably because I was at college and not school and they're usually fairly relaxed about these things.

I often use some VNC software to read my email/bank/do confidential things such as job applications at home from college, and I see no problem with that whatsoever, seeing as nothing gets deleted off the hard drives when you log off a computer (they do not use roaming profiles or employ logoff scripts which delete the temporary internet files from your user profile folder on the c: drive).

One thing I find rather silly is that they block FTP access. I see no point in blocking it, as it's an easy and relatively secure way of transferring files. No disks to break, no memory keys to lose, and you'll know that the files are there when you get back and openable. And only I will be able to access the files as the FTP/HTTPS site is passworded - and no stealing of data unless someone used a packet sniffer on the college machine or the network. Floppy disks and other media are so passe in my opinion.

OK, so not many people will have the technical capability to use it, but let those who do, use it. I also loathe mandatory profiles with a passion, but that's for another thread. Other stupid things they block here is the use of Task Manager. An application hang usually means a reboot to kill it. More wasted time, more productivity lost.

As for your school, they should be getting decent antivirus protection. Any antivirus software worth its weight should have on access scanning enabled and be able to pick up and/delete or quarantine virussed files upon creation/opening. If it's not able to do that at the very minimum, then perhaps it is time to re consider their choice for software?

IT teachers really do seem out of touch with the technical side of IT - they seem to think it's all about screenshots, word and writing about the friggin' screenshots. If she thinks you can simply get a virus from accessing your own site, then I do question her reliability as an IT teacher, somewhat. Yes, there is the potential to ingest a virus into the network, but if the AV software is up to its job then it will detect it and remove the virussed files. Such things are not limited to downloading content over the internet - viruses and malware can be brought in via numerous sources, including floppy disks, memory keys, CDs and even audio CDs (ref: Sony "Rootkit" scandal that broke recently)

I speak from experience here, I used to be an A Level ICT student. God do I wish that I never took that damn course; most of it has nothing to do with the practical side - and all we seemed to learn was to write extensive amounts of crap about screenshots that we took, and how to use the f.cking print screen key. Grr!!! :angry:

Grand Master

Japlabot

Posted
Posted (edited)

Teach her how the Internet and DNS works

http://computer.howstuffworks.com/internet...rastructure.htm

If not, refer her to the campus computer technician so he can vouch for you.

And copy all the good replies of this thread and paste into into a word document, and then add at the end of each quote (to the right and in italic) --"Quick Reply", Melbourne, Australia or "user name 2", The Internet and print out all the sensible quotes/replies

Edited by Quick Reply
Grand Master

+Nik Louch Subscriber²

Posted
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Posted

I wouldn't even bother dude. She has her idea of how things are, and the fact she walked off half-way through a conversation is amazingly rude and shows she doesn't care to learn.

Rather go to her direct superior. Explain firstly what you wanted to achieve, secondly how you are achieving it, and then the attitude that was shown by the teacher when you were demonstrating, and trying to show her how things actually work.

Here is where you need to be careful... When she was talking to your head of year - I'll bet the words "virus", "hacker" and such came up. You need to make it clear that:

1) What you were doing is safe.

2) Your computer is virus free.

3) Moreover, what you were doing is a legitimate way of transfering files.

4) You have no interested in "hacking" or negating technologies and policies.

5) If there is a computer policy in place, talk through it and try to identify alternate ways of bringing work in.

Really, you need to come across as wanting to work within their rule system, yet not negating your own learning.

Enthusiast

teh h4x0r5

Posted
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Posted

Before I tell you the outcome, sorry for the double post.

Anyways, the technicians as well as a senior member of staff seemed to agree with my teacher.. that access to a home machine is not allowed because things cannot be blocked when the site is accessed via it's IP. Said something they shouldn't have? :ninja:

Lmao, well this will sure be fun accessing all the blocked sites simply by pinging them and copying it's IP. :p ..at least for ones on a dedicated IP anyways.

As for being able to access my coursework, I have a spare domain or 2 in my NameCheap account which happens to offer a DynDNS service... i.e. I can use my home PC with one of my domains.. silly IT techies, they should think of these things. :p

Over and out,

Danny.

Enthusiast

MattL

Posted
Posted

Think I have got a book around here somewhere with how the internet works for beginners, I'll dig it out and she can have it!

Danny I know what they can be like but they have to cover their backs nowadays. I have worked both in school and at the main council offices where alot of it was controlled locally, just doing it to be safe and I know what teachers can be like as I only left school earlier this year. Luckly they didnt question me because they knew what I was doing and got an work experience placement with the local team.

Tell her to go to collage and re train in IT!

Enthusiast

teh h4x0r5

Posted
  • Author
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Well, seeing as this has been bumped, just thought I'd update you guys on the situation. Well anyways, I was taken out of chemistry, last lesson on Wednesday and taken upto the main IT office, they said "take a seat", so I did and they pulled out a few sheets of print-outs - my records of sites visited and keypresses made including the logs of my IP address being visited, and even the URL I had linked it to using an 'A' address record. (http://home.fgt-tracker.com). So, one of the teachers I quite respect started talking.. saying how I was told not to access my coursework from my home machine in school and vice-versa and how I "Would have been sacked if this was in a business", to put it in her words. I had a long lecture anyways and at the end of it I was told that there would be a 'series of severe punishments' coming my way; they started off by saying that most of my rights on the network would be removed including internet access, some program access, VPN access (which I was previously told nobody had access to anyways), and so on, but they then hinted towards a suspension or even being expelled. Well, let's just say I got a cold at just the right time, lol. :p I think I'll be back in school on Monday, I'll let you guys know what my 'series of severe punishements is' then. ;)

Laters guys,

-Danny.

Veteran

Leddy

Posted
Posted

Before I tell you the outcome, sorry for the double post.

Anyways, the technicians as well as a senior member of staff seemed to agree with my teacher.. that access to a home machine is not allowed because things cannot be blocked when the site is accessed via it's IP. Said something they shouldn't have? :ninja:

Lmao, well this will sure be fun accessing all the blocked sites simply by pinging them and copying it's IP. :p ..at least for ones on a dedicated IP anyways.

As for being able to access my coursework, I have a spare domain or 2 in my NameCheap account which happens to offer a DynDNS service... i.e. I can use my home PC with one of my domains.. silly IT techies, they should think of these things. :p

Over and out,

Danny.

My school blocks IP traffic. Of course, there's ways around it (eg using ports above 6,500) to connect to VNC.

Enthusiast

teh h4x0r5

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Right, seeing as they brought logs out on me, I think I'll do the same back hey?

Well, I got all my ZoneAlarm logs from H:\WINDOWS\Internet Logs, did a batch rename from *.txt to *.html, then got FrontPage to search for their IP (212.248.225.6). It found 3 results. Two on 16/11 and one on 29/11. So, I renamed the files from them 2 dates back to .txt and opened them up in WordPad.

Here are the access attempts:

FWIN,2005/11/17,12:07:24 +0:00 GMT,212.248.225.6:0,84.13.70.215:0,ICMP (type:8/subtype:0)

FWIN,2005/11/17,12:10:08 +0:00 GMT,212.248.225.6:0,84.13.70.215:0,ICMP (type:17/subtype:0)

PE,2005/11/29,19:50:16 +0:00 GMT,VNC Viewer Enterprise Edition for Win32,212.248.225.6:5900,N/A

You think I should use this against them? ..Maybe not the first 2 seeing as they could've been me, but definately the last one. VNC? ..at 7.50pm?

Veteran

Leddy

Posted
Posted

Right, seeing as they brought logs out on me, I think I'll do the same back hey?

Well, I got all my ZoneAlarm logs from H:\WINDOWS\Internet Logs, did a batch rename from *.txt to *.html, then got FrontPage to search for their IP (212.248.225.6). It found 3 results. Two on 16/11 and one on 29/11. So, I renamed the files from them 2 dates back to .txt and opened them up in WordPad.

Here are the access attempts:

FWIN,2005/11/17,12:07:24 +0:00 GMT,212.248.225.6:0,84.13.70.215:0,ICMP (type:8/subtype:0)

FWIN,2005/11/17,12:10:08 +0:00 GMT,212.248.225.6:0,84.13.70.215:0,ICMP (type:17/subtype:0)

PE,2005/11/29,19:50:16 +0:00 GMT,VNC Viewer Enterprise Edition for Win32,212.248.225.6:5900,N/A

You think I should use this against them? ..Maybe not the first 2 seeing as they could've been me, but definately the last one. VNC? ..at 7.50pm?

And what exactly do you plan do threaten them with? Those logs? What do you think they'd do?

Grand Master

primexx

Posted
Posted

Right, seeing as they brought logs out on me, I think I'll do the same back hey?

Well, I got all my ZoneAlarm logs from H:\WINDOWS\Internet Logs, did a batch rename from *.txt to *.html, then got FrontPage to search for their IP (212.248.225.6). It found 3 results. Two on 16/11 and one on 29/11. So, I renamed the files from them 2 dates back to .txt and opened them up in WordPad.

Here are the access attempts:

FWIN,2005/11/17,12:07:24 +0:00 GMT,212.248.225.6:0,84.13.70.215:0,ICMP (type:8/subtype:0)

FWIN,2005/11/17,12:10:08 +0:00 GMT,212.248.225.6:0,84.13.70.215:0,ICMP (type:17/subtype:0)

PE,2005/11/29,19:50:16 +0:00 GMT,VNC Viewer Enterprise Edition for Win32,212.248.225.6:5900,N/A

You think I should use this against them? ..Maybe not the first 2 seeing as they could've been me, but definately the last one. VNC? ..at 7.50pm?

dont push your legal rights. get a lawyer who knows what he's talking about and go offer them a out of court settlement.

Enthusiast

user name 2

Posted
Posted

Well, seeing as this has been bumped, just thought I'd update you guys on the situation. Well anyways, I was taken out of chemistry, last lesson on Wednesday and taken upto the main IT office, they said "take a seat", so I did and they pulled out a few sheets of print-outs - my records of sites visited and keypresses made including the logs of my IP address being visited, and even the URL I had linked it to using an 'A' address record. (http://home.fgt-tracker.com). So, one of the teachers I quite respect started talking.. saying how I was told not to access my coursework from my home machine in school and vice-versa and how I "Would have been sacked if this was in a business", to put it in her words. I had a long lecture anyways and at the end of it I was told that there would be a 'series of severe punishments' coming my way; they started off by saying that most of my rights on the network would be removed including internet access, some program access, VPN access (which I was previously told nobody had access to anyways), and so on, but they then hinted towards a suspension or even being expelled. Well, let's just say I got a cold at just the right time, lol. :p I think I'll be back in school on Monday, I'll let you guys know what my 'series of severe punishements is' then. ;)

Laters guys,

-Danny.

Firstly, let me say that I've never heard such crap in my entire life from a school. From your previous posts, I assume that you have not been doing anything illegal - such as attempting to hack the network, or downloading porn or playing games, just merely trying to get your coursework off your home machine, which I see no problem with - what difference does it make if you take it off your home machine or in on a floppy disk? A file's a file for god sake, and it doesn't matter which way it comes in. It can still have a virus or whatever on it, and there should be adequate antivirus protection on the network to negate that problem of viruses being brought in.

I think your school have been extremely harsh and anal about this, and there are worse things you could have done other than transfer your work from your home machine to the school, which in my opinion is a legit usage of the school's connection. If I were your network manager, I wouldn't have bollocked you for it in the slightest and in fact I would have encouraged such an inventive method of taking your work between A and B. However, if you were using the school's resources for stuff like downloading porn, music or playing games, then I wouldn't be so nice and I would have went down the route that they have done. :)

Do they still allow people to take stuff in on memory sticks, floppy disks and CDs? Do they still allow people to connect their MP3 players to the system to take files home on them? If so, then I really think they need to get their heads out of their arses, these are all methods in which virii can be transmitted.

Also, I would recommend you get IN WRITING, a copy of the school's usgae policy for the internet, and read through it carefully. I would also recommend you get IN WRITING what they have alleged you to have done "wrong" with all the details of your alleged offence. You should get your parents involved too - because it's inevitable they will find out that you've been suspended or whatever, and you should get them on side.

Good luck! :cool:

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