Mom died day after class `joke'

[Matrix XII]

That's ****ed up.

[illicit]

Very disturbing story... :|

I would have to second that.

[Fred Derf Veteran]

Bathtub-murder sister granted prison transfer

Move allows convicted killer to obtain government-paid university education

Aug. 31, 2006. 04:11 PM

BOB MITCHELL

STAFF REPORTER

One of two Mississauga sisters convicted of murdering their mother in the infamous bathtub slaying will soon be transferred to a federal women's prison.

Justice Bruce Duncan today granted the 20-year-old woman's request to move from a an adult provincial facility to a federal penal institution, likely the Grand Valley Institution near Kitchener.

The convicted killer requested the move so she could obtain a government-paid university education as well as receive more and longer visits from family members.

She and her younger sister, now 19, were convicted last Dec. 15 of first-degree murder in the bathtub drowning of their 44-year-old alcoholic mother on Jan. 18, 2003. They got away with the crime for more than a year until a friend went to police and they were arrested Jan. 21, 2004.

Until just recently, the older sister had been in protective custody at the Vanier Instutition for Women, an adult provincial facility in Milton at the Maplehurst Correctional complex.

The woman appeared in a Brampton courtroom dressed in a green sweatsuit with her hair tied back in a ponytail. It was among the few times that she has appeared in court without sitting beside her younger sister, who continues to serve her sentence in a provincial youth facility.

They were both sentenced on June 30 to the maximum 10 years allowed under the Youth Criminal Justice Act (YCJA). The law requires them to spend only six years in custody, the rest under community supervision.

They were 16 and 15 when they got their mother drunk and nearly unconscious with Tylenol-3 pills. Both helped their mother undress but it was the older girl who held their mother's head under the bathtub water for four minutes.

After the murder, they met three close friends at a Jack Astor's Restaurant in Mississauga as part of their carefully orchestrated alibi and returned home later to make a well-rehearsed 911 call. Along the way, the girls revealed details about the murder, and even sent provocative pictures of themselves to an American website. The older girl sent several nude photos of herself, including one posted the day they were convicted.

Legal experts said it was the first case of its kind in Canada where such young daughters had ever been accused - and eventually convicted of the crime of matricide. Their identities as well as the identity of their deceased mother remain forever protected.

For now, the younger sister will continue to serve her sentence in the same youth facility she's been in since her conviction. She'll likely be transferred to Grand Valley once she turns 20 next summer.

Crown prosecutors Brian McGuire and Mike Cantlon said during the sensational eight-week trial that the girls killed their mother, partly because she was ruining their lives with her alcohol use, but also because they stood to gain their share of her $200,000 life insurance money.

In their pre-sentence reports, both girls said they viewed their mother's murder as a mercy killing because they believed she was killing herself through her alcohol abuse and ruining their lives.

http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentSe...epath=News/News

[Tomi]

Quite an odd story. What I'm curious of is how did the police find their chat logs? That's pretty stupid of them to keep chat logs if they're actually murderers.

Also, can we please cut the bad generation crap/stereotyping already? It's getting pretty annoying. We're only bad because our parents (the generation that's always calling us bad) hasn't taught us better, kind of like what John said.

[Arkaic]

Dont pretend this sort of thing hasnt always happened. It's not like its happening in every town on a daily basis, you get a sick story once in a while and you accuse todays younger generation of being "dumb" and their being something wrong with us. Forgive me if I'm wrong, but its your generation that is sending troops into Iraq over apparent Nuclear Missiles, that is struggling against or for terrorist and generally setting the path my generation is now moving into. And before that there was the gulf war, Vietnam, WW2 ect. And they are only the wars, theres hundreds of smaller examples where atrocities have been commited in the past 100 years and beyond.

I mean seriously, dont act like one generation is better than another. Every single one has commited atrocities. Yes, its the very small minority that are doing anything wrong, the one in a million or hundred thousand or anything, but it would be very easy for me to say "what is wrong with my prior generation, look at the world they have left me to live in"

Being 19 I'm kind of sick of hearing how our generation is so off the rail when really none before us have been any better and looking over history many have done alot worse. I'm not defending what has happened, but throwing out stereotypes like that is grosely incorrect and insulting to the general population that go by their daily life in the exact same manner anyone else does. Yes, what these kids have done (if they did do it at all), is sick. It's extremly upsetting but its also upsetting that their mother didnt do a better job at raising the kids and controlling her addiction. She certainly deffinetly didnt deserve to die, its just sad to hear stories of families like this.

I really do hope that the girls are in fact innocent, although I really dont believe they are unfortunatly.

Perfectly said bud! :yes: :)

Me and my friends are good people and help improve this world. At one time no we had issues ourselves, its called defining yourself in teenage years. :yes: But we are good people and are some of the best you'd see. :D

Ok, let me say most kids do stupid things. Yes, I did stupid things too,, actually some of them really stupid :laugh:, but it never resulted in someone else seriously getting hurt, usually just myself.

Yet I survived teenhood and myself and the world. I'm a week away from being 20 at the university and studying psych now to improve the world because I care about it. :)

But most kids are not like this, yes there are some disfunctional ones or ones that have problems, but remember this is a rarity news item. Not a normal occurence. Also remember today's society is much more open then in the past, its not that bad things didn't happen in the past, its that they were swept under the rug. :no:

Edit:

I'd say a good portion of the people of my generation and age are growing up quite well and better then even our parents. Why? simple I'm not lying I learned firsthand why alot of things are bad and morals are important. By doing all the bad crap and learning the consequenes I GREW UP and am functional. :) So are my friends, they grew up, years ago we were just as stupid and disfunctional in society. But some of our caring teachers saw beyond our problems and said "These are not bad kids! Their in pain and misguided, but not bad".

Edited September 3, 2006 by Cierro

[whitebread]

Justice Bruce Duncan today granted the 20-year-old woman's request to move from a an adult provincial facility to a federal penal institution, likely the Grand Valley Institution near Kitchener.

:| That's near me....... Eek.

[Fred Derf Veteran]

Bathtub killer speaks

Dec. 5, 2006. 06:50 AM

ROSIE DIMANNO

Wan and mousy to start with, the mommy-killer has already developed a distinct jailhouse pallor.

Yet there is no other outward sign of what she is: A convicted murderer, guilty of matricide, among the most abominable of crimes.

Dark, lank hair tucked behind her ears, fringe brushing her eyelids, she galumphs into the witness stand with shoulders slouched. Friends always did criticize her posture. And when she speaks, the voice is halting, nasal, a little bit breathless, in the cadence of vapid Valley Girl.

At her own trial last year, she never did take the stand in her own defence. Nor did her younger sister, as they both went down for first-degree murder in the death of their mother. The girls were 16 and 15 when they drowned mom in the bathtub, purportedly sick of the woman's alcoholism and incompetent parenting.

Yesterday, in a Brampton courtroom, was the first time that the young woman, now 20, has ever spoken publicly about those events. She appeared as the Crown's star witness against a 19-year-old Mississauga man charged with conspiracy to commit that murder. The teen is alleged to have counselled the sisters on the how-to of killing and provided the drugs used to sedate the victim before her daughters coaxed her into the tub.

Because of their ages at the time of the Jan. 18, 2003, murder, none of the principles, including the accused, can be identified, nor even the poor slain mother, who will forever remain as anonymous as she appears to be un-mourned.

"She was dead already,'' the daughter stated flatly, describing the uselessness and palpable deterioration of her mother in the months prior to the crime, as she lost yet another job due to her prodigious drinking. "I truly believed that she was hopeless because of her alcoholism. I thought she was going to die really soon.''

So why not give mom a hand ? over the mouth, pressing the nearly unconscious woman's head into the water and holding her down for about four minutes, while Little Sister stood in the doorway watching, even at one point ducking out to answer the ringing phone. Not a good time to call, Little Sister hissed into the mouthpiece. The friend on the other end knew exactly what was happening in the Mississauga townhouse, and would that evening help provide the sisters with an alibi.

Big Sister recalled that she had been musing on murder since the end of the summer, but waited a while before broaching the idea with Little Sister. "I wanted to come on strong,'' she said of her don't-argue-with-me posture. "I guess I was over-compensating in case she said I shouldn't do this. She just got all quiet and asked me ? are you sure?''

But Little Sister was cool with the idea, although Big Sister insists the planning and doing was all hers. "I ran my ideas by her, just to see. But I felt I had the authority on all these decisions.''

Later in her testimony, with a note of Big Sister exasperation in her voice, she added: "I was the only one that did almost everything.''

It was Little Sister who allegedly divulged the plan to the accused. He, the Crown asserts, had access to Tylenol-3. Big Sister would feed four of those pills to mom, spaced half an hour apart.

"My plan was to draw her a bath and go from there ... wanted to make it look like an accident, let things happen on their own as much as possible.''

Earlier murder schemes ? overdoses and "spontaneous combustion'' (setting mother aflame) ? were rejected after consideration. Previous weekend killing dates had also come and gone, either because mother was not sufficiently inebriated or their 6-year-old half-brother was in the house, rather than with his dad.

On this weekend, everything aligned properly. Wearing plastic gloves, the victim's oldest child carefully led mother ? already smashed on vodka and wine, numbed by the painkillers ? into the tub.

"My mom bruised easily. I remember thinking that trying to carry her would pose a lot of problems.''

Even during the commission of the crime, plying mother with pills, Big Sister was online to a friend, providing play-by-play. In an MSN "chat'' retrieved by police, she describes her mother's compliance in swallowing the drugs. "She just takes them and forgets. She's just stupid.''

Within a minute of the drowning deed, both girls were out of the house, on their way to a suburban restaurant, ditching gloves and leftover pills at the bus terminal.

They sat around a table with two friends, including the accused, discussing what had just transpired, but behaving normally. "We ordered some food, sat around. Eventually we decided there was no point in sitting around anymore. I don't really remember what we talked about because I was in my own world at that point.''

But she remembered the role she had to play once she and Little Sister got home, even acting out the scenario. "I knocked on the (bathroom) door and opened it.''

Then she made the call to 911, spun the tale of how they'd earlier taken the opportunity of mom's drunkenness to lift money from her purse ? to go out ? and then returning home to find their mother dead.

It's a story that held together for a year, until police reopened the case, after a family acquaintance came forward with his suspicions.

The daughter says now that she regrets the murder; that she acted out of desperation. "I felt constant pain. I was, like, really deep in my hopelessness.''

But out of all this tragedy, the murderer admits there were only two things that surprised her. First, the coroner's report, at trial, which showed the victim was only in the very early stages of cirrhosis, and not likely to die of alcoholism any time soon.

The other: How it feels to kill a person, that way, the look of a drowned corpse.

"It wasn't what I had expected.''

http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentSe...ol=969483202845

[Fugi]

Dam...

[ambiance]

They are too sick to have any freedoms and too stupid to be criminals. Sad story, but good post Fred.

[Fred Derf Veteran]

No jail for friend of `Bathtub Girls,' judge urged

Guilty in conspiracy to kill sisters' mom in 2001, 19-year-old not `violent person'

Feb 06, 2007 04:30 AM

Bob Mitchell

Staff Reporter

A young man convicted of his role in the "Bathtub Girls" murder of their mother should be spared a jail sentence, his lawyer says.

"Guide him, supervise him but don't lock him up," Alison Mackay urged a Brampton court yesterday.

"He is not a violent person ... he didn't commit murder ... he was far removed from the crime.... He was party to a plan that was well underway (by the time he became involved)."

Prosecutor Mike Cantlon is seeking a term of three years, the maximum allowed under the Youth Criminal Justice Act, for the 19-year-old Mississauga man's conviction of conspiracy to commit murder in the 2001 slaying.

Madame Justice Francine Van Melle will render her decision March 5 after hearing sentencing submissions yesterday in connection with the sequel to the trial that led to first-degree murder convictions of the 43-year-old woman's daughters.

The girls were 16 and 15 when they plied their alcoholic mother with booze and Tylenol-3 pills before the older daughter drowned her in their bathtub.

They got away with the crime for nearly a year until a close friend went to police and later secretly recorded confessions.

Now 20 and 19, they were convicted Dec. 15, 2005 and sentenced June 30 to 10 years, the maximum penalty under youth laws. In convicting Mackay's client on Dec.7, a jury believed the man, 15 at the time, joined a criminal conspiracy with the girls to murder their mother, either as a full partner in a three-way murder plot or as a party to the murder by assisting or encouraging them to kill.

But Mackay suggested her client was a "minor party to the conspiracy" and his crime wasn't a "violent offence" because he wasn't the one who murdered the woman.

"A young woman's hand caused her death," she said. "What killed her was her daughter's hands pushing her head under the water in the bathtub."

Seeking incarceration, Cantlon said his pre-sentence report showed he lacked remorse and insight into the harm his involvement caused. He still denied committing the act and thought an incriminating Internet chat was "a poor-taste joke."

"He played an integral role in creating a plan where (the girls' mother) would be murdered and the murder would go undetected," Cantlon said.

"He had a high degree of responsibility. He may not have been present when she was murdered but he had the recipe. He provided the Tylenol-3s that were used."

A key part of the Crown's case was a disturbing MSN instant message between the man and the younger sister ? five days before the murder. He offered advice on the drowning process and how to act for police.

The chat also indicated he knew details of the plot, including their alibi of having dinner at Jack Astor's restaurant.

The older sister also testified her sister told her he provided the Tylenol-3 pills used to help render their mother unconscious, although he steadfastly denies doing so.

Cantlon told jurors in closing arguments the chat was like "listening to a wiretap of a mob hit man about to kill someone" and described the pills as akin to "putting bullets in a gun."

Mackay insisted her client never believed the sisters were serious about killing their mother when he chatted with them online. She also read into court a letter from a one of his former teachers who said she never saw a "dark side" or any "sinister personality" in from the well-liked, kind and dependable student.

Although the prosecutor agreed the teen had no previous criminal record, Cantlon said he "dove into the deep end of the pool" for his first involvement with criminality.

The identities of the convicted man, the girls and their dead mother are forever protected by Canada's youth laws.

http://www.thestar.com/News/article/178534

[red.]

geez, you couldn't make this stuff up. i'm almost speachless.

[+Mystic MVC]

Wow, just can't believe some of the stuff happening these days.

[Raa]

Fred, you missed this :

"Charges dropped against bathtub girls' cousin"

Source: http://www.thestar.com/News/article/174540

[Edrick Smith]

I'm waiting for the Lifetime 2 Hour TV Movie Special....

[Boffa Jones Veteran]

I feel bad for the girls. The mother was an incompetant drunk, ****ing up their lives.