MS comes down on Kol and his Vista visual style

[KoL Veteran]

That is such a wrong statement, on so many different levels.

Of course they have things to lose. When I make a design, I, as the author, own the distribution rights for it. I and I alone, decide where, when, and how it can be distributed. For a large company, the ramifications of this must be huge. You are, like it or not, stealing their rights from them. Sorry to get personal here for a moment but, I know some see you as a design God who should praised, but I see you as little more than a common thief of other people's work, creativity, ideas, and efforts. That, to me, is shameful and not somethign to be celebrated. This action by MS is long overdue in my opinion. Moreso as, as has already been stated by others, if someone did it to you, you would be crying foul. You can't have it both ways.

You think that's wrong I think that right, that's my opinion.

Since your first post you can see you have something againts me. I really dont care. Like I said before thank god that people and companies dont think like you and they contacte me to create graphics for their companies.

BTW The whole post is my opinion on intellectual property and big companies. If they really want to protect their IP you'll see them taking down every themes, wallpaper and stuff using their copyright, trademar and trade dress material.

Edited December 15, 2005 by KoL

[TheDogsBed]

You think that's wrong I think that right, that's my opinion.

So I can quote you on that, the next time you cry foul at someone stealing your work, right?

Since your first post you can see you have something againts me.

Please, you are starting to believe your own hype now. I don't know you well enough to have something against you personally. I am well-known for vehemently chasing people who steal our copyrighted works. I just happen to have a passionate dislike of thieves who's only talent lies in stealing the hard work of others. It's low, it's shameful and it's damned annoying.

However, I shall bow out of the thread as I can't see you shifting from your stance of actually being proud of what you do and there's not a prayer in hells chance of me having a single ounce of respect for what you do.

[Vice]

Please, you are starting to believe your own hype now. I don't know you well enough to have something against you personally. I am well-known for vehemently chasing people who steal our copyrighted works. I just happen to have a passionate dislike of thieves who's only talent lies in stealing the hard work of others. It's low, it's shameful and it's damned annoying.

Don't you think you're being a bit harsh? he wasn't selling his themes they are available freely. He created his themes himself with the same look as Vista he didn't rip any files... It's like when Microsoft tried to get court injunctions placed against Open Source projects that offered software similar to theres like Microsoft Word etc..

I feel quite sorry that KoL has been the target for Microsoft's rage only a small minority of internet users will use KoL's theme and I doubt by them having this theme for Windows XP would make them not purchase Windows Vista, Maybe they don't trust there own product and they hope the new flashy interface will win over consumers.

Anyway, Good Luck KoL.

[shihchiun]

So if I get a book, and instead of photocopying the pages, I typed them all out, that would be fine? I could put my "original" book up on the Internet for anyone to have? You don't see anything wrong with that?

I agree. Even if he gave Microsoft credit, he would still have to have their permission.

[cep_head]

@ kol

it sux that they only picked you out of the multi but i agree that its because the theme was so popular :yes:

also thanks for the links :D lol

[daydream nation]

I know You didn't notice

No, you don't know anything about me, and why you would write "You" with a capital letter is beyond me.

but it is not Stardock doing skins You dislike. They do the software.

They endorse the skins and choose which ones they include in releases of their software. While they may not make the skins they certainly do approve. See here; and notice the phrase "This is Stardock's Aura Skin. If Stardock were making an operating system, this is the design it would go for. It comes with WindowBlinds 5."

And of course the 1269th Tiger or classic clone is so much more inventive than the skins that windowblinda authors invented themselves.

I don't use Tiger clones. I would've bought a Mac if I wanted Tiger. Besides there are plenty of OS X clones for WB so I don't know what you're getting at. The reason why classic gets remade alot is because it is simple and easy to use (instead of a bloatfest), which after all is the criterion for a good interface

If You want to see a really ugly interface go open Your StyleXP.

Once again you spoke too soon, I don't use StyleXP and I don't think anyone should.

[AltecXP]

I can not beleive for one single second that a person continued to use windows over switching to linux or a mac simply because of a third party theme.

I did, and now that I cant use it (which was the only reason I bought WB5) I'm trying to move to Linux 100%.

[berlamont]

I can't believe how many ignorant comments have been made on here about not ever using MS software again. ANYBODY that has ever used a decent build of linux KNOWS how easy it is to never have to purchase a single damned piece of MS software ever again. In fact I find there are sooo many damned linux programs available 99% of them for free, that there is no way I could ever not find something I need. I use MS by choice, but if I needed to stop using anything MS it would be EASY. So before you think your giving him a reality check, study up on linux(and/or mac) and you might broaden your computing horizons. :rofl:

Also although him not purchasing MS stuff anymore is just a drop in the bucket, when tons of other people feel the same way and move to linux or mac that DOES have an effect on MS's bottomline.

[kermalou]

i think google might hire KoL

[ProjectRAGE]

This many pages cause someones theme got shut down, freaking crazy..

ITS THE END OF THE WORLD! "sarcasm"

[fires]

Sniperx I think you are abit harsh with your comments . You obvioulsy dont understand the philosophy behind skin making. Kol did not make money from his skins. He wasnt trying to do any harm. He did it because he loves skinning and sharing it with the community. People emulate themes like vista because its a celebration of microsofts software not a grab for thier intellectual property. Most people who skin are fans of ms and use their software for thier creative juices. Personally I think ms are being alittle heavy handed but they have the right to do so. However it would have been nicer to have said to him earlier on and let others know of thier intentions.

[JiveMasterT]

Being a designer myself, I can appriciate what KoL has done here. He has taken an unreleased theme and made some modifications and made it available to the public. Really, I think if someone did this with my stuff, as long as there was enough of a modification and credit given to me, I don't think I would have a problem. They are different enough in my eyes to be considered seperate themes and I think the reason MS went after him was for two reasons...

1. They are buddy buddy with stardock and I'm sure that stardock does not want MS going after designers that help promote their precious WB. It would be bad business.

2. It was called VistaXP. While the name makes sense, it takes from two copyrights that MS has and I'm sure this is not pleasing to them. Had it been named differently I don't think we would be having this thread.

It was definately the best longhorn type theme out there, so I can see why everyone is up in arms. It was different enough for KoL to call his own, but at the same time, it was similar enough where people could call it a Vista theme. I think it should be heavily modified and released under a different name. KoL is a good designer and I think it is possible for him to keep the elements of the theme but make a radically different one that is pleasing to all.

This is afterall the problem with ports and themes designed to emulate another product... they attract the attention of companies when they become better than what they have. It becomes a jealousy thing when it really comes down to it. I'm sure the theme design team at MS was like "Wtf? This dude is ripping us off and he's hugely popular! Down with him!"

In all actuality, he was not ripping MS, especially since he obviously made a number of the images himself, he processed them, packaged them, spent the time on it. You can't say it's a rip... that would be converting the theme directly from Vista and calling it his own, which he obviously did not do.

Oh, and to that n00b up above who keeps bashing on Kol, go to hell. You have no clue what you're talking about. Bashing a great contributer to the theme community is a really messed up thing to do. Hold your tounge and learn that people on the internet are people and have feelings and I'm sure that someone acting like a jackass saying "OMGWTFBBQ he st0l3d from M$!!!!" is offensive. But that's ok, I laugh at you for your uninformed behavior, and I will refuse to believe you have been serious here. ;)

edit...

Just realized it was SniperX. Eh, whatever. I've always noticed you seem to be a spiteful person here on Neowin. I feel bad you need to be like this to feel good about yourself.

[Zxian]

So I can quote you on that, the next time you cry foul at someone stealing your work, right?

Please, you are starting to believe your own hype now. I don't know you well enough to have something against you personally. I am well-known for vehemently chasing people who steal our copyrighted works. I just happen to have a passionate dislike of thieves who's only talent lies in stealing the hard work of others. It's low, it's shameful and it's damned annoying.

However, I shall bow out of the thread as I can't see you shifting from your stance of actually being proud of what you do and there's not a prayer in hells chance of me having a single ounce of respect for what you do.

Dude... have you looked at the rest of the people in this thread and some of KoL's other work? Not all of his stuff comes from "stealing the hard work of others". If he used something that other people made, he has given credit where it is due.

So there's no respect from you for any of the graphics work that KoL has done elsewhere? Have a look at the recently released AveScripter desklets for example. Are these stolen from anywhere else?

I think you're gonna bow out of this thread because you realize that you have a half-valid point of view, but you're too stubborn to admit that you were wrong.

As for KoL himself - I think that you've done some great work. Yes, it's unfortunate that MS used you as their scapegoat, but I think that you're holding the high ground by being co-operative and simply pointing out their flaws in their IP protection (what with the long list of themes that you found). As for your other work - keep it up. (Y)

[Bant Veteran]

i think this thread is heading in the wrong direction. MS is not the devil for doing this, and its not fair to wage war against them without knowing all of the facts.

kol should probably contact the person that asked him to stop distributing his theme and ask what the main reasons were for their actions, and what he could do to modify it so that it can be rereleased. if there is nothing he can do, then it is time to ask them why they havent approached the other vista themes. if their response were that they werent as popular that is actually PERFECTLY reasonable... as others become more popular because kols isnt available, im sure they will be contacted as well.

honestly though, i would much rather see kol put his energy into something more original and his own, vista is coming whether we like it or not, and its gonna look like vistaXP... so lets see something else.

[Corris Veteran]

this topic is still going..... :huh:

its over now, theres no point moaning about it, not much can be done about it.....

and anyway, x-mas soon :santa:

[Chad]

i think this thread is heading in the wrong direction. MS is not the devil for doing this, and its not fair to wage war against them without knowing all of the facts.

kol should probably contact the person that asked him to stop distributing his theme and ask what the main reasons were for their actions, and what he could do to modify it so that it can be rereleased. if there is nothing he can do, then it is time to ask them why they havent approached the other vista themes. if their response were that they werent as popular that is actually PERFECTLY reasonable... as others become more popular because kols isnt available, im sure they will be contacted as well.

honestly though, i would much rather see kol put his energy into something more original and his own, vista is coming whether we like it or not, and its gonna look like vistaXP... so lets see something else.

Great post (Y) It's obvious Kol is able to make themes that look better than the Vista theme. This just gives him more time to concentrate on them.

Because this thread is getting a little out of hand, and it's quite evident how all of you think about the topic at hand, I'm closing it down.