why are apple laptops so expensive?

[Xtreme $niper]

Apple laptops are expensive because Apple is the only one that manufactures them, so they have complete power over the price point since they have no competition. Thats the main reason, then theres always the other typical reasons like components and the Apple brand name, etc.

[saxondale.]

Well i guess the whole Adobe Creative Suite is Complete Garbage, and well Adobe Premier, or Pinnacle / Avid Liquid Professional is a joke.

How can you say that the mostly used platform contains no software available.

I really dont see you arguement, you say that all editing software is a joke for windows, when it is far from it.

I never said it was a joke, i was saying macs are more designed for this, with companies making BETTER products which is just designed for macs. Like companies make the software just for windows, but it so happens that the stuff made on macs are better. You name me a better:

Audio editing program

Video editing program

Macs

Pro Tools 7 - If you know anything about music editing, you would know windows is shocking at doing it and Pro Tools is used on pretty much every single cd you listen to. With macs using coreaudio, its an awesome feature to use with this software

Final Cut Studio 5.1 - A highly advanced piece of software, name me a piece of software on windows which can top this, is budled with stuff like Motion 2 (Motion 2 is Apple's award-winning professional motion graphics application offering breakthrough functionality and seamless workflow to artists, editors and independent producers. Whether you're animating broadcast graphics, corporate presentations, feature film titles, or DVD menus, you'll find an original, fresh toolset and new features such as GPU-accelerated rendering, amazing new filters and effects and more.)

You pay for this service, if you are into this stuff, you will realise that a mac is worth every penny, once windows can achieve this, and get developers producing this standard of software, not saying the stuff you mentioned is crap, but definitely no way near on par with the software on macs have to offer. If you want to get a job done to such a high standard you will pay that bit more, you get something which is a hell of alot better.

If you are not that serious about that stuff then get a PC, i recommend you get a PC if you are not intending to use it for these purposes. Thats exactly why i got my iMac, windows can NOT offer the same quality macs can, simple as that.

[Alladaskill17]

Prices are high, only reasonably priced Apple models are the PPC ones, and thats because they are obsolete. :cry:

I WANT A MACBOOK PRO! :angry:

[AltecXP]

If you are a professional video producer, music producer you will not be using windows.

hmm thats odd I work for one of the highest rated Interactive advertising agencies in the country and we only use 1 mac for productions, a huge majority of the work is done on dual processor Operon boxs. Even the graphics dept, is about 50% pc/mac. And dont say we are not professional, some of our video dept worked on The sixth Sense, and they still prefer PC.

[SomeAzn]

If you are a professional video producer, music producer you will not be using windows. These are 2 very creative things, you have companies like Avid, dedicated to Apple, making hardware run hand in hand with Pro Tools, possibly the best music editing software in the world, all designed for Macs. You have Final Cut which is a very industry standard software for video editing, same with acid, all dedicated to Macs. Windows has none of that.

It doesnt make you more productive but the programs designed for Macs are for people into that stuff, which tend to be creative people, and you obviously want to do it good, Macs help you do it good, like i said, you have companies dedicated to Apple making the best software in the world for these creative hobbies/jobs, where as you dont for windows.

Wow, enjoy smelling your own farts?

I'd LOVE to see the study that found ALL professional video producers and music producers use Apples. Also, I'd think that you are ****ing off plenty of dedicated software engineers who make software for Windows that are insulted that you say they are not dedicated to their job.

We've studied Apple's business in my Intermediate Corporate Accounting class. There are a few very basic reasons that Apple laptops tend to cost more.

1. They are the only producers and have no competition within their niche market. If you want to buy a Windows based laptop, you have plenty of companies to choose from. For example: Sony makes a laptop that costs $1,000. Dell looks at the laptop and says: "I can make the same laptop and I'll charge $950 and take over the market." Then eMachines looks over and says: "I can do it even cheaper." etc etc. Apple doesn't worry about that. They have a 100% lock on their software and a 100% lock on their hardware. Thus, they can charge more. In addition, since they have less production abilities than Dell or Sony..etc, they have to charge more to get their costs back.

2. Marketing. Apple has based their marketing scheme on portraying Apple owners as very individualistic people. They play off the fact that they have a very small market share by telling Apple owners that they are special and that they are unique. I'm not knocking their strategy. In fact, this strategy is shared by many other companies such as Starbucks and Nike.

3. Bundling. They bundle extra software into their products and that way they can charge you extra for it. When you buy an Apple, it comes with iLife and all this other stuff that you may not want. But they say: "Hey, look at all this great software!" and they hope you don't notice they extra money they are charging you for it. Think of it this way: everyone knows that when you go buy a car, the car salesman is going to push hard for you to buy all the extra features. Do those floor mats REALLY cost $300? No, but they hope you'll pay extra for it. Apple has moved beyond that step and just basically bundles the floor mats with the car with the extra $300 tacked on. I like how people get mad when Microsoft bundles IE with Windows but no one complains about iLife and OSX.

[saxondale.]

hmm thats odd I work for one of the highest rated Interactive advertising agencies in the country and we only use 1 mac for productions, a huge majority of the work is done on dual processor Operon boxs. Even the graphics dept, is about 50% pc/mac. And dont say we are not professional, some of our video dept worked on The sixth Sense, and they still prefer PC.

Well thats odd, the environment i've been in, and i've asked around, macs seem to be the prefered choice, this is going around independent to some major film production labels, they do have PCs but the final end job is always completed on a Mac.

In the music industry, well, Mac. Thats it really.

[LTD]

Very simply, Apple makes a better product. And that's not even considering the applications.

I know that may be tough to stomach for some, but it's true.

I paid a bit over $1,700 CDN for a 17" imac core duo. Quite a bit. But this thing running OS X Tiger makes even better-equipped PCs look like trash and Windows XP feel absolutely brutal. Plus, if I want to run XP on this, I can.

[KeR]

You might as well have asked why are BMW's or Mercedes Benz cars more expensive then a Ford or Saturn.

[aristotle-dude]

Are you guys still going on about the price difference between the US apple site and the UK one? Get over it. Unless you are willing to fly to the US to pick it up, you are complaining for nothing. The wages in the UK are higher so prices are higher. Get over it and take an economics class for goodness sake.

[saxondale.]

Are you guys still going on about the price difference between the US apple site and the UK one? Get over it. Unless you are willing to fly to the US to pick it up, you are complaining for nothing. The wages in the UK are higher so prices are higher. Get over it and take an economics class for goodness sake.

?

[aristotle-dude]

?

Basically, the way things work with companies that have a brick and mortar presence is that prices are adjusted to the cost of doing business which is somewhat related to the cost of living in that country.

Say for example if a loaf of bread from a specialty bakery cost 2 pounds in the UK and 1.50 USD in a similar bakery in the US. Now if you performed the currency conversion and you got 3.57USD for the bread loaf in the UK. Now if that 2 pounds was the general going rate for bread, would knowing what it cost in USD matter to you at all? Consider the fact that currencies fluctuate on a daily and weekly basis. Imagine if the prices and wages fluctuated in each country on a daily or hourly basis to keep things "fair". You would have utter chaos.

The chances are that people in the UK generally get paid more than their US counterparts do. Because of this, Apple ends up charging a bit more for their goods in the UK to keep their online prices in line with their retail and third-party retailers in each market.

I've heard people complain about paying more for iTMS and other apple products in the UK before and so I thought I would try to explain why they cost more over there.

PS. The VAT in included in the UK prices but there is no VAT in the US, there are differences between duties from China to the UK and from China to the US and finally, the currency exchange rates fluctate between now and the time Apple set the prices.

[JustGeorge]

Very simply, Apple makes a better product. And that's not even considering the applications.

I know that may be tough to stomach for some, but it's true.

I paid a bit over $1,700 CDN for a 17" imac core duo. Quite a bit. But this thing running OS X Tiger makes even better-equipped PCs look like trash and Windows XP feel absolutely brutal. Plus, if I want to run XP on this, I can.

May I ask why Apple hardware is better? Didn't they just strike a deal with Asus to produce laptops for them? Apple runs intel cpus, Asus is making components which tells me they're no better than normal PC hardware. Apple has three advantages:

1. OSX

2. Style

3. Less vulnerable to malware

Any advantage OSX has over Windows is immediately killed for me because the software selection is nowhere near as good. Yep, I could load XP onto it and thats taken care of but I can build a PC for less plain as that. OSX isn't a virus/spyware playground like windows, but if your going to interact with Windows based PCs and you will be, it irresponsible to not run AV IMHO. You might not get infected with something, but you couold share a file with someone that can be infected. Apple hardware is eye candy and thats my 2 cents. I'll be buying a mini soon but only to play with OSX. The chances of me switching are pretty slim at this point.

[yudi_lks]

3. Bundling. They bundle extra software into their products and that way they can charge you extra for it. When you buy an Apple, it comes with iLife and all this other stuff that you may not want. But they say: "Hey, look at all this great software!" and they hope you don't notice they extra money they are charging you for it. Think of it this way: everyone knows that when you go buy a car, the car salesman is going to push hard for you to buy all the extra features. Do those floor mats REALLY cost $300? No, but they hope you'll pay extra for it. Apple has moved beyond that step and just basically bundles the floor mats with the car with the extra $300 tacked on. I like how people get mad when Microsoft bundles IE with Windows but no one complains about iLife and OSX.

Err, that because Microsoft bundles integrates IE so deeply into Windows and it's almost impossible to remove it... Where in iLife you could just... Drag... and drop it to recycle bin.. Or perhaps just run uninstall.. I never did it though

[LTD]

May I ask why Apple hardware is better? Didn't they just strike a deal with Asus to produce laptops for them? Apple runs intel cpus, Asus is making components which tells me they're no better than normal PC hardware. Apple has three advantages:

1. OSX

2. Style

3. Less vulnerable to malware

Any advantage OSX has over Windows is immediately killed for me because the software selection is nowhere near as good. Yep, I could load XP onto it and thats taken care of but I can build a PC for less plain as that. OSX isn't a virus/spyware playground like windows, but if your going to interact with Windows based PCs and you will be, it irresponsible to not run AV IMHO. You might not get infected with something, but you couold share a file with someone that can be infected. Apple hardware is eye candy and thats my 2 cents. I'll be buying a mini soon but only to play with OSX. The chances of me switching are pretty slim at this point.

What software do you want to run on OS X?

Available for mac:

MS Office, the entire Adobe Creative Suite, Messenger, Quicken, Firefox and the entire Mozilla Suite, iLife apps (which are best in their class), Pro apps like FinalCut, and alot more that I'm forgetting. Nearly every major (quality) Windows app has an OS X version, or there is an app for OS X that does the same or better job. Windows - OS X file compatibility is at an all time high in terms of breadth and quality.

With all the commercial software available for OS X, plus all the open source apps out there, the whole argument regarding not enough software available for OS X doesn't really hold water. Of course, there is indeed more out there for Windows - BUT . . . there is alot of duplication (i.e., 25 apps that do the same thing) and alot of utter crap with horrid interfaces.

In any case, you say you're going to buy a mini soon. Does that mean your experience with OS X is marginal at best? Have you ever used OS X for any length of time for work, play, etc.? Have you any experience with iLife apps? Pro apps?

As little as 10 minutes of OS X use has made switchers ot of many (including me, a former Windows fanboy.) Don't underestimate it.

[LTD]

Wow, enjoy smelling your own farts?

I'd LOVE to see the study that found ALL professional video producers and music producers use Apples. Also, I'd think that you are ****ing off plenty of dedicated software engineers who make software for Windows that are insulted that you say they are not dedicated to their job.

We've studied Apple's business in my Intermediate Corporate Accounting class. There are a few very basic reasons that Apple laptops tend to cost more.

1. They are the only producers and have no competition within their niche market. If you want to buy a Windows based laptop, you have plenty of companies to choose from. For example: Sony makes a laptop that costs $1,000. Dell looks at the laptop and says: "I can make the same laptop and I'll charge $950 and take over the market." Then eMachines looks over and says: "I can do it even cheaper." etc etc. Apple doesn't worry about that. They have a 100% lock on their software and a 100% lock on their hardware. Thus, they can charge more. In addition, since they have less production abilities than Dell or Sony..etc, they have to charge more to get their costs back.

2. Marketing. Apple has based their marketing scheme on portraying Apple owners as very individualistic people. They play off the fact that they have a very small market share by telling Apple owners that they are special and that they are unique. I'm not knocking their strategy. In fact, this strategy is shared by many other companies such as Starbucks and Nike.

3. Bundling. They bundle extra software into their products and that way they can charge you extra for it. When you buy an Apple, it comes with iLife and all this other stuff that you may not want. But they say: "Hey, look at all this great software!" and they hope you don't notice they extra money they are charging you for it. Think of it this way: everyone knows that when you go buy a car, the car salesman is going to push hard for you to buy all the extra features. Do those floor mats REALLY cost $300? No, but they hope you'll pay extra for it. Apple has moved beyond that step and just basically bundles the floor mats with the car with the extra $300 tacked on. I like how people get mad when Microsoft bundles IE with Windows but no one complains about iLife and OSX.

Why would anyone *not* want iLife? It's an excellent addition to OS X, and it's among the best software in its class. In fact, people have bemoaned the lack of such a suite for Windows.

IE is just a cancer. What a nasty idea it was to integrate such garbage so tightly with the OS. There can be absolutely no comparison between IE and iLife.

[lammmetak]

May I ask why Apple hardware is better? Didn't they just strike a deal with Asus to produce laptops for them? Apple runs intel cpus, Asus is making components which tells me they're no better than normal PC hardware. Apple has three advantages:

1. OSX

2. Style

3. Less vulnerable to malware

Any advantage OSX has over Windows is immediately killed for me because the software selection is nowhere near as good. Yep, I could load XP onto it and thats taken care of but I can build a PC for less plain as that. OSX isn't a virus/spyware playground like windows, but if your going to interact with Windows based PCs and you will be, it irresponsible to not run AV IMHO. You might not get infected with something, but you couold share a file with someone that can be infected. Apple hardware is eye candy and thats my 2 cents. I'll be buying a mini soon but only to play with OSX. The chances of me switching are pretty slim at this point.

first: windows starts faster on a mac

second the software and hardware are made for each other

third: EFI instead of a bios.

i heard that you are in 20 seconds in windows.

for real time benchmarks:

my ibook ( powerpc) boots faster then my AMd 64 both with 1 gb memory.

these are all facts.

And about iLife: its ideal for the normal computer user. it is not the final cut pro but it gets the job done for a lot of people because it is so goddamn easy.

If you would like to edit video the professional way you would know that final cut studio is the dominant leader in that kind of software.

[Alladaskill17]

Its simple, Apple can charge more many reasons:

1. People will pay the prices

2. More stable [DONT FLAME] then the average [HAPPY, AVERAGE] PC.

3. Less voulnerable to viruses/malware/etc. [PC users could change that statistic somewhat if they would watch what exactly it is they are downloading and installing, but yes...most of the "BAD CODE" is written for the Windows platform].

4. Apple is exclusive with their hardware, they are a hardware company...less of em = higher prices.

Oh, P.S. - I AM a PC user, but hopefully by the years end that will change.

[JustGeorge]

What software do you want to run on OS X?

Available for mac:

MS Office, the entire Adobe Creative Suite, Messenger, Quicken, Firefox and the entire Mozilla Suite, iLife apps (which are best in their class), Pro apps like FinalCut, and alot more that I'm forgetting. Nearly every major (quality) Windows app has an OS X version, or there is an app for OS X that does the same or better job. Windows - OS X file compatibility is at an all time high in terms of breadth and quality.

With all the commercial software available for OS X, plus all the open source apps out there, the whole argument regarding not enough software available for OS X doesn't really hold water. Of course, there is indeed more out there for Windows - BUT . . . there is alot of duplication (i.e., 25 apps that do the same thing) and alot of utter crap with horrid interfaces.

In any case, you say you're going to buy a mini soon. Does that mean your experience with OS X is marginal at best? Have you ever used OS X for any length of time for work, play, etc.? Have you any experience with iLife apps? Pro apps?

As little as 10 minutes of OS X use has made switchers ot of many (including me, a former Windows fanboy.) Don't underestimate it.

You made some valid points. My experience with OSX totals about 15min in the Apple store. The software I want for OSX isn't for business purposes but for entertainment. Don't laugh, but the main reason I can't leave windows is that I'm an emulation nut. If I can't have updated versions of MAME, Nestopia, Kega Fusion, etc in a timely matter, then no sense in bothering. There is no denying that OSX is a wonderful OS, but it cannot fill my needs wholey at this point. I still would like to hear justification for the claim that Apple hardware is better. It would appear that apple designs the look and specs, then farms out the actual hardware manufacturing to a traditional PC component company. If Asus is involved, there is litle doubt of quality, but no different than the Asus parts in my PC. Also, upgrading a Mac isn't as carefree as a PC, correct? Other than memory, I cannot run to the local PC shop and buy a part to get up and running again. It seems the only Mac Apple makes with upgrading in mind is a PowerMac and thats way out of my price range.

For the record, there is a little more to it than emulation, just sick of typing :laugh:

[LTD]

You made some valid points. My experience with OSX totals about 15min in the Apple store. The software I want for OSX isn't for business purposes but for entertainment. Don't laugh, but the main reason I can't leave windows is that I'm an emulation nut. If I can't have updated versions of MAME, Nestopia, Kega Fusion, etc in a timely matter, then no sense in bothering. There is no denying that OSX is a wonderful OS, but it cannot fill my needs wholey at this point. I still would like to hear justification for the claim that Apple hardware is better. It would appear that apple designs the look and specs, then farms out the actual hardware manufacturing to a traditional PC component company. If Asus is involved, there is litle doubt of quality, but no different than the Asus parts in my PC. Also, upgrading a Mac isn't as carefree as a PC, correct? Other than memory, I cannot run to the local PC shop and buy a part to get up and running again. It seems the only Mac Apple makes with upgrading in mind is a PowerMac and thats way out of my price range.

For the record, there is a little more to it than emulation, just sick of typing :laugh:

Well that's fair enough. There are certain speciality apps out for Windows that simply don't exist for OS X, no doubt about it. Perhaps you can find an OS X counterpart, but I suspect you'll be booting into Windows for that emulation software.

Why is Apple hardware better? It's not so much the parts as it is the design and tight integration between hardware and software. My imac core duo is not only gorgeous, it's also nearly inaudible. I need to put my ear right up to it to hear it. And it runs nice and cool as well. Most of the parts are cusotmized to Apple specs. Plus, there are some very sophisticated touches. Go to www.apple.com for a full list. Not all of it is Apple marketing spin, either. ;-)

If you're looking for ease of expandability - and that is a priority for you, then a PowerMac will be your best bet, but you might go with a PC anyway. Technically, an imac *can* be upgraded to a degree: whatever isn't soldered to the board can likely be swapped out. But it involves quite a bit of work and plenty of patience. Instructions can be found around the web, with diagrams and photos, etc. But most people won't be doing this, I should think. From what I've found out, however, mac minis are quite expandable.

For myself, up until I got my imac core duo, I was quite into expanding my PC and mixnig and matching parts, though I'm not as committed as some people are. Since I switched, expansion really hasn't been on my mind. Maybe it was never really a priority for me. Go figure.

Anyway, you can always dual boot Windows with Boot Camp, but that still doesn't resolve te expandability issue.

In any case, enjoy your mini, if you're getting one after all. The core duo does HD quite well.

[JustGeorge]

You might have a point. I'm kinda going into the mini with the idea that it is what it is and not even consider upgrading it. One good thing about emulation is that most of it is software rendered and doesn't tax the gfx card so maybe boot camp will meet my needs. Just doesn't seem right booting Windows on a Mac or vice versa. I don't care much for Apple themed VSs for Windows either.

[Quillz]

As little as 10 minutes of OS X use has made switchers ot of many (including me, a former Windows fanboy.) Don't underestimate it.

Could you believe that... dare I say it... there may be people who don't like OS X? Stop kissing Apple's ass. Yes, OS X is good, but I know of many instances where people have been sold on Windows just as easily as some are sold on OS X.

[Brodel]

it's still an interesting topic but anyhow, as much as I'd like a mac the fact is I can't afford one right now so there isn't much I can do about that. I just ordered a Dell 630m, Pentium M 1.7ghz, 512mb, 60GB HD for ?445 so I'm pretty happy. No it's not a mac, doesn't look as good as a mac, can't do this and that but I'm used to XP and fine with it and it's in mystudent> budget, unlike the macs with student discounts.

[LTD]

Could you believe that... dare I say it... there may be people who don't like OS X? Stop kissing Apple's ass. Yes, OS X is good, but I know of many instances where people have been sold on Windows just as easily as some are sold on OS X.

I just hope that those who have been sold on Windows also bothered to use OS X.

People who rely on screenshots and tech site reports (instead of actual hands-on use) are in a very poor position to judge.

That's really all I'm concerned about.

Oh, and one more thing: This forum is about SWITCHERS > to APPLE. We're allowed to extol the virtues of OS X in here. And there are plenty of virtues to discuss. Switchers from Apple to Windows have their own area, but as expected, it's pretty quiet in there.

[Quillz]

I just hope that those who have been sold on Windows also bothered to use OS X.

They did. Yes, OS X is much easier to use and user-friendly. I'm not denying that at all. But not everyone is going to prefer OS X to Windows. That's all I'm saying.

Anyways, sorry... I didn't realize at the time that this was in the Switchers forum.

[LTD]

They did. Yes, OS X is much easier to use and user-friendly. I'm not denying that at all. But not everyone is going to prefer OS X to Windows. That's all I'm saying.

Anyways, sorry... I didn't realize at the time that this was in the Switchers forum.

Hey, no worries. That's a very fair statement. I know of plenty of people, for example, who have chosen to swicth to Linux from OS X. What it all comes down to in the end truly *is* personal preference, regardless of what common conceptions are and what the accepted gospel is about each OS.

I could list an ocean of reasons for you or anyone else to switch to OS X, but if there's something about Windows that is a particular draw for you, or there is something about Linux wich you absolutely love, then all my pontificating - though informative perhaps, is really just hot air.