Microsoft Sued over Windows Genuine Advantage

[revvo]

The problem with WGA is the software can be classified as spyware.

1) You are forced to install it, or no updates or no new software like IE7. Sure you have the option to not install it at all but this is the only option given if you want software that you are eligible for by legally owning Windows.

2) It does more than what it claims to do. Regular calls at MSFT to check if the copy "remains" legal? Isn't Microsoft capable of spyware? Or is it that it's not called spyware because it's Microsoft? Putting aside who wrote WGA, just forget that for a second and analyze WGA alone.

3) If the rumors of the ability to access remotely and disable windows is true (again, I said right now IF), another reason why to call it spyware, heck this is similar to malicious attacks. Do something to a computer remotely without the user's conscent.

Sure the pirates deserve this but what about the people who bought a computer and payed for windows, or at least that's what it seemed but their copy of windows ends up not being validated by WGA and seem like it was illegal? There's much more people who thought they bought windows and who are getting screwed by WGA than pirates/crackers. There's thousands of these small computer stores that try to make the most profit possible, by any means necessary.

You know, I don't see Apple do any of this. How come Apple has no problem with whether or not the person legally owns OSX? Yes I know Apple makes money mostly out of hardware but it's not like they don't care about their software.

Yep, Bill Gates decided to leave at the right time. Microsoft's going down with all this shananigans of "Vista Removing Features" And WGA/spyware.

FYI, I'm not a fanboy of neither linux or apple. I'd never use those as my day-to-day operating system. I just think Microsoft is really abusing this power of being a monopoly over their customers. They are screwing more trusted customers who payed for their software than crackers.

[Sniper101]

if people knew how to Disable updates they wouldnt have this problem :) like me i disabled it due to i hate my computer been full of rubbish, and i do have a Valid key :) well 3 valid keys.

[DreadBoat89]

The problem with WGA is the software can be classified as spyware.

1) You are forced to install it, or no updates or no new software like IE7. Sure you have the option to not install it at all but this is the only option given if you want software that you are eligible for by legally owning Windows.

2) It does more than what it claims to do. Regular calls at MSFT to check if the copy "remains" legal? Isn't Microsoft capable of spyware? Or is it that it's not called spyware because it's Microsoft? Putting aside who wrote WGA, just forget that for a second and analyze WGA alone.

3) If the rumors of the ability to access remotely and disable windows is true (again, I said right now IF), another reason why to call it spyware, heck this is similar to malicious attacks. Do something to a computer remotely without the user's conscent.

Sure the pirates deserve this but what about the people who bought a computer and payed for windows, or at least that's what it seemed but their copy of windows ends up not being validated by WGA and seem like it was illegal? There's much more people who thought they bought windows and who are getting screwed by WGA than pirates/crackers. There's thousands of these small computer stores that try to make the most profit possible, by any means necessary.

You know, I don't see Apple do any of this. How come Apple has no problem with whether or not the person legally owns OSX? Yes I know Apple makes money mostly out of hardware but it's not like they don't care about their software.

Yep, Bill Gates decided to leave at the right time. Microsoft's going down with all this shananigans of "Vista Removing Features" And WGA/spyware.

FYI, I'm not a fanboy of neither linux or apple. I'd never use those as my day-to-day operating system. I just think Microsoft is really abusing this power of being a monopoly over their customers. They are screwing more trusted customers who payed for their software than crackers.

1) how are you so sure that without installing, you aren't gonna get any updates... microsoft even published how to remove the tool, and when removed you still can get updates and other new goodies.

2) What else does it do? I'm pretty sure the call back feature is gone...

3) rumor

You apple comment... apple's market share is so small... y would crackers care? It could be out there, but if it is, it sure isnt anything close to the problem microsoft is facing...

[laz45]

Are we forgetting that we actually DONT own Windows XP we only have a license to use it so I'm pretty sure they can do whatever they need/want unless its not in the EULA. I'm pretty sure WGA is all legal, Microsoft is not that stupid to omit what WGA does in the EULA....

[L3thal Veteran]

That depends. If you installed it through windows update page, yes, you know what you are installing. Sometimes, you even have to agree EULAs in order for things to install. The case here is, that the user can claim WGA was installed posing as a critical security update, or something like that. Add the fact that microsoft was late to tell people that WGA called home. There are strong arguments against microsoft.

It doesn't matter. When you agree to any EULA, you accept the terms imposed in the EULA. Its not Microsoft's fault people don't even read the title of the EULA and just click yes. They do not force you to install anything on your computer. Even if it does show up as critical, it doesn't make you grab your hand and click install.

Are we forgetting that we actually DONT own Windows XP we only have a license to use it so I'm pretty sure they can do whatever they need/want unless its not in the EULA. I'm pretty sure WGA is all legal, Microsoft is not that stupid to omit what WGA does in the EULA....

You are correct. There have been rumors in the past that Microsoft may start leaning towards a subscription based "license" in which you pay a yearly subscription to have Windows.

Microsoft has never given you full rights of the copy, only a license to use it, hence the End User License Agreement that you have to accept before installing Windows.

[nautiqueskier]

You know, I don't see Apple do any of this. How come Apple has no problem with whether or not the person legally owns OSX? Yes I know Apple makes money mostly out of hardware but it's not like they don't care about their software.

In the past Apple hasn't had a problem because OS X only ran on Macs which came with a copy of the OS anyways.

And even now its difficult (not impossible) to install OS X on a non-mac and have it function 100% correctly which prevents piracy from being a big issue.

[madnuke]

And thats why I love Windows Server 2003 Standard edition and action packs. No WGA for me! Its only the pirates that are moaning, piracy? All it does to check to see if your CD key is from some dodgy keygen that plays strange music when you run it.

[Aahz]

This would be why you remove the thing (or better yet not install it in the first place) and use other means to update XP.

The state of a person's software license is irrelevant in this case as it's not about him caring that MS wants to verify that their software is legal but rather HOW they are performing that verification. It's a nag, it runs in the tray, it runs at the login screen, it runs in the background, it calls home, and now there are rumors of remote shutdown and considering how it's update what monthly now it wouldn't surprise me in the least that they are playing with the EULA to see what they can and can't get away with. The bottom line is that that all adds up to spyware period.

I doubt he'll get anywhere near winning but it'd be nice. I'd like to see all kinds of these 'protection' schemes looked into from software to games to whatever as all they do is **** off the end user to no end while being a tiny splinter in the side of pirates. It just makes me not buy products with this kind of crap in it.

[revvo]

I love how everyone thinks they know what WGA really is. How does anyone know what it can truly do? Why do we have rumors floating about remote access? There has always been anti-MSFT users out there extremely loyal to other systems (gay fanatics), so why come up with such a fake rumor now, after so many years of "Microsoftage"?

You know this will eventually lead to an operating system full of DRM, Vista being the beginning.

Sure, you don't "own" Windows, you own the license to use Windows but for christ sake, they could stick anything in there in the near future and you'll be like "YEAH ITS OK THEY ARE ALLOWED'. Of course they are allowed, I'm not saying it's illegal what they're doing. I'm saying it's highly unethical and incredibly punishing towards paying customers.

Most of the population are paying for those few badapples that break the law (if any). How is that right? Forget the whole "But it only affects pirates! I bought it and I'm ok with it!" argument and think. Is it ok to be treated like a thief? Is it ok to prove to microsoft in dozens of ways that you payed for Windows or any piece of software in the future for that matter? How further can they go in making sure the users using their products legally own _a license_? They could expand and add new ways in checking that and many of you would still say "IT's FINE. I BOUGHT IT SO BLAH" But see, that... NOT RIGHT. Was it like this before? With Windows 2000? With Windows 98 SE? Don't tell me P2p didn't existed back then, because USENET was always there and software was pirated as much as today. Sure the population of the internet grew but the percentage of it that infringes copyrights probably remains very close to what it used to be at the time of win 95/95/nt/etc.

No? Still not convined. Ok, go to the airport, and try to enter a foreign country that isn't so friendly with "your kind". Then get a full cavity search and you'll see the similarities with what Microsoft is doing to their users.

Yes, I know, I sound like I make Microsoft look evil but, you have to take this matter seriously. You can't just say "They're just another company it's ok..". No. They are the biggest, they control most of the market, they have no true competitors to their biggest products like Windows and Office. Power corrupts. Haven't any of you seen any decline in Microsoft's general performance since Vista? There sure as hell is one. Ballmer throwing chairs, key people leaving without any reasons, features of the next big thing being torned appart, bill gates slowly stepping back as chief engineer, etc..

flame away

[SaLiVa]

Did they put Paint in the EULA? It's not spyware... it's more like confirmware... they're just making sure you have a legal copy. There isn't much of a case... how is this actually harming the user's computer, data etc? They're not even getting statistical data off of your computer...

Paint doesn't run in the background unwantingly though.

They are getting statistical date off the computers I think. To check how many Windows computers are legit, which Activation Keys are used often among other things.

[Miuku.]

You probably (again I am ASSuming) bought it from a shady store that didn't exactly follow the procedures when selling a OEM product. If you did not buy it or did not install the hardware that came with the OEM license, technically it is a pirated copy.

Actually you're wrong - in a way - the OEM license does not define *what* hardware you must buy in order to be allowed to use the license - hence if you buy 4 harddrive screws for your computer and an OEM copy of Windows - you're completely within the EULA, it does not require you to buy a whole computer or for example a motherboard.

It does however, nowadays, forbid you from moving the 'once installed OEM' copy from a computer.

The bottom line is as far as Neowin is concerned:

If Sony did this - you would be ready to crucify them but because it's Microsoft, all is forgiven.

[Brian M. Veteran]

I believe if it hasnt been installed and activated, technically in the eyes of the EULA, its not linked with that computer, so its still legal to move, use, sell it etc...

Its only if you purchase it without an original component OR after it has been moved/activated that it breaks the EULA.

[Barney T. Administrators]

Here is Windows XP EULA in plain English.... straightforward...... :yes:

http://linuxadvocate.org/articles.php?p=1

Barney

[DreadBoat89]

nice explaination

so it does say that by accepting the eula... you allow microsoft to do something like WGA

Bill doesnt even need lawyers... he just needs to show the court that it is written in the eula...

[MulletRobZ]

About bloody time someone sued Microsoft over this! They don't realize that the only way to reduce piracy is to reduce the price of the software, not by adding more barriers as they will eventually be cracked! :p

[Popcorned1]

Microsoft is not liable even if they break the terms of this agreement.

:rofl:

[Scirwode]

As far as I'm concern, WGA has done nothing wrong to my computer as I'm using an original version of Windows. When it does start to become a hindrance to me even when it's a legal copy, that's when I start to get ready to rumble with Microsoft, and not in a good way too.

PSG22?

[Julius Caro]

so it does say that by accepting the eula... you allow microsoft to do something like WGA

Didn't we already know this? All those things always says that the company can do whatever they want, whenever they want. That's why they're evil :devil: :devil:

[kickenchicken360]

About bloody time someone sued Microsoft over this! They don't realize that the only way to reduce piracy is to reduce the price of the software, not by adding more barriers as they will eventually be cracked! :p

dude thats a wow great though never thouhg t about that!!!! good job! wow microsoft sucks ihate them overpriced crap like the ipods or ipoop

[Xerxes]

I'm sorry but that person is an idiot, buy a legal copy of Windows it's that simple...MS are only protecting thier work, sure I find WGA annoying but I also understand why MS do it. If you legally own Windows then you got nothing to worry about and if you did buy a copy of Windows and WGA decides it's not, just ring MS support and they'll fix it..there is no excuse. That is my rant.

[K-illuminati]

I'm sorry but that person is an idiot, buy a legal copy of Windows it's that simple...MS are only protecting thier work, sure I find WGA annoying but I also understand why MS do it. If you legally own Windows then you got nothing to worry about and if you did buy a copy of Windows and WGA decides it's not, just ring MS support and they'll fix it..there is no excuse. That is my rant.

Your statement is 100% correct, Maybe people should try to see Microsoft's view on this. They are only protecting their software, Maybe we should try to ignore this <sarcasm>HUGE</sarcasm> annoyance.

[Trong]

I'm sorry but that person is an idiot, buy a legal copy of Windows it's that simple...MS are only protecting thier work, sure I find WGA annoying but I also understand why MS do it. If you legally own Windows then you got nothing to worry about and if you did buy a copy of Windows and WGA decides it's not, just ring MS support and they'll fix it..there is no excuse. That is my rant.

:) Good words.

@Webgraph (If you're even going to look at this again): Even if they lower the price, there will still be piracy. DVDs are only $20 and going to see a movie at the movies is $7. Those are a fraction of the price of Windows XP and that stuff is pirated just as much as Windows.

[E t h a n]

Typical of Microsoft to think they're above the law and that the rules don't apply to them. Spyware is spyware, and if it's not made clear what it's actual purpose is, then it's illegal in a lot of countries. :no:

[Berserk87]

heres there plan

step 1: find something in windows that they feel they can sue for

step 2: get a class action suit against microsoft

step 3: pirates unite! they all get in on the class action suit, complaining about the ridiculously stupid thing that no one cares about

stepp 4: windows settles not wanting to waste more time on the stupid case and everygets $$$....FREE WINDOWS FOR PIRATES EVERWERE! YAY!

:fun: :pirate: :fun: :pirate: :fun: :shiftyninja: :pirate: :fun: :pirate: <----PIRATE PARTAY!(and a ninja)