PureEdit Posted October 10, 2002 Share Posted October 10, 2002 MSSTYLES vs. WindowBlinds What do you think is better and why? Me? I like MSSTYLES, they are faster (For me at least), more compatable, and more intergraded into the OS, I just like it more, plus it is FREE :) WB does have nice skins, but all the good ones will be ported to MSSTYLES Soon :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MxxCon Posted October 10, 2002 Share Posted October 10, 2002 this question has been beaten to a pulp already:ermm: search msgboard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanctified Veteran Posted October 10, 2002 Veteran Share Posted October 10, 2002 wb is as fast as msstyles in my system, also wb skins are more flexible and looks better more compatible with the os? stardock are the makers of the xp ui skining engine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PureEdit Posted October 10, 2002 Author Share Posted October 10, 2002 Originally posted by MxxCon this question has been beaten to a pulp already:ermm: search msgboard Yeah, but not a whole thread, just people talking about it :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mercury Posted October 10, 2002 Share Posted October 10, 2002 Well, I'm kinda biased since I've paid for the whole Object Desktop for the past 3 years. However, I do run TGTSoft on the backup machine, just to try out all that's available, and I just like Windowblinds better. Speed isn't an issue, because I've never really noticed a lag in either program (just lucky I guess), but Windowblinds is a much more feature rich program. The fact that TGTSoft as a company came off cocky and overbearing when they first released their "program" really didn't help in my decision either. But, everyone has their opinions, and I'm not going to hold it against you (even though I think you're wrong.:p ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanctified Veteran Posted October 10, 2002 Veteran Share Posted October 10, 2002 Originally posted by PureEdit Yeah, but not a whole thread, just people talking about it :) not a whole thread? I remember a 50+ pages thread about this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PureEdit Posted October 10, 2002 Author Share Posted October 10, 2002 Originally posted by [saint dark]wb is as fast as msstyles in my system, also wb skins are more flexible and looks bettermore compatible with the os? stardock are the makers of the xp ui skining engine Well, I like the way XP Loads the theme, it preloads, then shows it. WB just loads it and show things, and you see them updated, just makes me think it is going to get screwed up :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PureEdit Posted October 10, 2002 Author Share Posted October 10, 2002 Originally posted by mercury Well, I'm kinda biased since I've paid for the whole Object Desktop for the past 3 years. However, I do run TGTSoft on the backup machine, just to try out all that's available, and I just like Windowblinds better. Speed isn't an issue, because I've never really noticed a lag in either program (just lucky I guess), but Windowblinds is a much more feature rich program. The fact that TGTSoft as a company came off cocky and overbearing when they first released their "program" really didn't help in my decision either. But, everyone has their opinions, and I'm not going to hold it against you (even though I think you're wrong.:p ) It does have more feautes, but I dont need any of them. Sure it is nice to move the control buttons, but I like them in the same location on all themes, so I can change themes and remember where the windows controls are :) The MP3 player is nice, but I have a winamp control in my taskbar, which I prefer :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mercury Posted October 10, 2002 Share Posted October 10, 2002 That's great, because like I said, everyone in entitled to their own opinion. The fact that we have a choice of customization programs only helps everyone. It would be nice if there was a standard skin format, and that way people could use which ever program they wanted to use. The way it is now, some people will always see Windowblinds as slow and buggy, some people will see StyleXP as a hack, and the rest won't really care either way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neoguy17 Posted October 10, 2002 Share Posted October 10, 2002 *rolls eyes :ponder:, rubs eyes and then looks again, smacks self in the face then moves on :s * All I gotta say is this topic has been killed to death in the past... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PureEdit Posted October 10, 2002 Author Share Posted October 10, 2002 Originally posted by mercury That's great, because like I said, everyone in entitled to their own opinion. The fact that we have a choice of customization programs only helps everyone. It would be nice if there was a standard skin format, and that way people could use which ever program they wanted to use. The way it is now, some people will always see Windowblinds as slow and buggy, some people will see StyleXP as a hack, and the rest won't really care either way. Very good point, I wish there was a standerd format to :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bant Veteran Posted October 10, 2002 Veteran Share Posted October 10, 2002 one of the main problems i have with WB is its lack of real quality skins.... theres nothing i really find good enough to use in WB, so i have no real need to switch from patched uxtheme.dll... WB feels different for me, like im layering stuff on top of my os, it just feels fake, if that makes sense. i know there is no "fake" lol, but it feels that way. i look forward to the newer releases of WB, since it will in fact improve performance over msstyles, at which point i may become a WB skinner ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frogboy Administrators Posted October 10, 2002 Administrators Share Posted October 10, 2002 Are you talking formats or are you talking engines? Engines Engine wise, they are basically identical. The XP visual style engine is based off of WindowBlinds so saying it's more "native" isn't justifiable. That said, Microsoft added a host of new API calls into Windows XP to use on their engine. For instance, WindowBlinds on 2000, 98, and ME had to use a "fake titlebar" to do its thing. That's why people on those OSes would run into problems of windows shrinking when reloaded or moving or whatever. Microsoft ran into the same problem (obviously) so on XP they changed the windowing code to not have that issue. WindowBlinds on XP thus inherits that. But there are other APIs in XP that haven't been tapped into yet. WindowBlinds is faster at drawing than XP because WindowBlinds visual styles are hardware accelerated. But WindowBlinds skins are slower at loading into a new process than msstyles. That's why you see these debates sometimes. A person who is constantly loading and unloading programs may find WB slightly slower. A person who sends to have the same programs up all day will find WB faster. I'm a biased source (I work for Stardock) but there is one big advantage engine-wise - WindowBlinds continues to move forward on a monthly basis. Compare WindowBlinds 3.0 from last year to WindowBlinds 3.41 and even there you have a big difference. And WindowBlinds 4 is already in internal alpha which is even more feature rich, uses even less memory, and is even faster. And Stardock has the support of both Microsoft and the hardware companies who can specifically accelerate the functions visual styles need (which will help msstyles too but it'll help WB more since we use their drivers more). Coloring There is also the advantage that WindowBlinds can colorize skins on the fly. You don't need 500 variatoins of Luna. You just need one and can colorize it as you want. WB 4 will build on this further. I can even make my skins become grayscale, modify the gamma on them and even invert the colors entirely which is pretty neat. Plus all the other features it has. And remember, even with all these features, it uses less memory than a visual style does because of years of optimizing for memory (admittedly, if we were writing just for XP WB wouldn't be so tight but WindowBlinds has to work on Windows 98 too and thta means every kilobyte counts). There is also the advantage that you don't have to repatch or anything when a new version of Windows XP arrives. WindowBlinds 2.x will work on Windows XP service pack 1 (as well as WB 3 and in fact I've heard that WindowBlinds 1.x even works). And it'll work on Longhorn. The formats Now if you're talking .msstyles vs. .uis then things get more complex. WindowBlinds is a superset (for the most part) of msstyles. It has vastly more features and flexibility. But it doesn't do shellstyles yet (WB 4 will) - shellstyles are the task panes on the left side of your folders. On the other hand, WB keeps adding nice things to XP that become quite noticeable in a hurry. For instance, WB can skin the mouse over highlight area on your XP start menu (on an msstyle you get a colored block, on WB it can be skinned which can look quite nice). By WindowBlinds 4, UIS will be a complete superset of .msstyles so at that point, it would be hard to argue that msstyles is superior. By then I think it'll be a "uxtheme.dll patch is free, WindowBlinds is $20". And I think that's a pretty valid argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bant Veteran Posted October 10, 2002 Veteran Share Posted October 10, 2002 good post frog ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dayle Posted October 10, 2002 Share Posted October 10, 2002 msstyles is free || wb is not big file size || smaller file size less resources consumed || needs more resources doesnt update often(cool) || new versions (suck) in short i love msstyles cos they are free and short and sweet to use..wb is not Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
em Posted October 10, 2002 Share Posted October 10, 2002 Just remember that if it wasn't for the likes of Stardock and 545 Studios amongst others that customisable GUI's wouldn't be where they are today. As a developer I can tell you that WB does what it does very well considering the difficulty of the task of drawing everything on your system and like Brad said, who did MS turn to for the skin engine in XP?. This whole WB vs MSSTYLES is as dead as John Denver. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SOOPAH256 Posted October 10, 2002 Share Posted October 10, 2002 i personally like msstyles. even though windowblinds is supposedly faster...i like how msstyles doesn't require 3rd party software. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frogboy Administrators Posted October 10, 2002 Administrators Share Posted October 10, 2002 dayle: 1) WindowBlinds skins are smaller 2) WindowBlind uses fewer resources 3) You don't have to update to a new version of WB. WindowBlinds 1.x works on Windows XP SE 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nO-One Posted October 10, 2002 Share Posted October 10, 2002 Well just like most if the msstyles skins better than most of the WB skins I see, I haven't seen WB styles like e-platino, Sosumi and Rhodium Edge. EB skins tend to look too busy too me, not a clean look like the skins I mentined above. However I do relise it's all up to the skinner and I simply haven't looked hard enough for the really good looking WB skins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morpheuss Posted October 10, 2002 Share Posted October 10, 2002 I have a small doubt on the resource usage of windowsblinds. Am I right in assuming that WB requires the MS theme engine to be running. So if I am running WB that means that I am running WB+mstheme. Therefore WB uses more resources. I hope frogboy clarifies this. That said I beleive a lot of peopl who do skin their machines have at least 256MB RAM. So is that not enough for WB and msstyles. WB takes around 5-8 MB for me. I am ok with that. Does the reg version take less? And I do not think that there are no good themes for WB. Admittedly there are no chaninjas there but some of the work is top notch. Most of the skinners here would like to use something that is free for all which I beleive is the reason for the skins that we see for msstyles. I am no skinner, but I have noticed that msstlyes skin do not change the tooltip. Can anyone tell me the reason for this. Cant this info be stored in msstyles ? WB skins do support this. That is my opinion. I definitely would not mind having WB on my machine. But no cash. Hope I win Object Desktop in the Neowin give away ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vachon Posted October 10, 2002 Share Posted October 10, 2002 Originally posted by Frogboy dayle: 1) WindowBlinds skins are smaller 2) WindowBlind uses fewer resources 3) You don't have to update to a new version of WB. WindowBlinds 1.x works on Windows XP SE 1. Well said Frogboy, no more is needed to say Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlowNeasy Posted October 10, 2002 Share Posted October 10, 2002 Originally posted by Frogboy And WindowBlinds 4 is already in internal alpha which is even more feature rich, uses even less memory, and is even faster. Frogboy - any idea when OD user's will be able get a peek? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
honz12 Posted October 10, 2002 Share Posted October 10, 2002 Originally posted by nO-One Well just like most if the msstyles skins better than most of the WB skins I see, I haven't seen WB styles like e-platino, Sosumi and Rhodium Edge. Actually, I have my own private copies of sosumi, e-platino, brushed, simplicity, smoothstripes, prophecy and underling, all for WindowBlinds. EB skins tend to look too busy too me, not a clean look like the skins I mentined above. A WindowBlinds skin can be as clean as the author wants it to be....chosenOS??? However I do relise it's all up to the skinner and I simply haven't looked hard enough for the really good looking WB skins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Concept Posted October 10, 2002 Share Posted October 10, 2002 give me an estimated learning curve for skinning windows blinds... and/or reference it to msstyle skinning? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
honz12 Posted October 10, 2002 Share Posted October 10, 2002 Originally posted by Concept give me an estimated learning curve for skinning windows blinds... and/or reference it to msstyle skinning? The Tutorial: there are more around the net. http://www.spoono.com/tutorials/skins/window_blinds/ The Program: http://www.stardock.com/products/skinstudio/ First time I tried skinning WB it was a royal pain in the ass, nowadays it's a breeze =] [EDIT] Hmmm, maybe the tutorial wasn't such a good example. You don't need notepad to skin WindowBlinds, the skinstudio program will cut all that nonsense out.[/EDIT] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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