Microsoft to Lock Pirates Out of Vista

[ht990332]

To stop piracy, MS has to reduce the price of windows to under 100.

80 to 90 dollars is OK

It may be sold for low prices in the US but where I live XP Home is 300$ and pro is 490$.

They should also increase the frequency if service packs. Service packs should be delivered each 6 months or so.

[ScottKin]

To stop piracy, MS has to reduce the price of windows to under 100.

80 to 90 dollars is OK

It may be sold for low prices in the US but where I live XP Home is 300$ and pro is 490$.

They should also increase the frequency if service packs. Service packs should be delivered each 6 months or so.

Where do you live, that XP is priced so high?

Remember: If you don't live in the US, the prices you are paying are indicative of your country's currency exchange rate .vs The US Dollar.

--ScottKin

[Daybreak]

It'll hurt consumer adoption of Vista for sure, and possibly corporate adoption. Sure, Microsoft is within their rights to implement all these measures, but that doesn't mean that everyone will like it.

Not only that but compare OS X 10 to 10.5 and the interface is almost identical. Look at the jump from XP to Vista and it's very, very different.

Also, consider that in addition to free service packs and upgrades, Windows customers also get free software such as Photo Story, Internet Explorer, Media Player, PowerToys, and more as part of Windows Genuine Advantage (WGA). In a sense, you are paying for this already but on the other hand, look how many new software programs were developed and given away to XP customers even years after XP's initial release (and hence your initial investment). Apple certainly does not offer this, at least, not on the same scale.

Always remember that a large sum paid upfront always appears more expensive then the same amount spread out over a period of time. The jump from XP to Vista may be very different, but likewise, the jump from OS X 10.0 to 10.4/10.5 (same timeframe) is likewise major.

As for your comparison about the additional WGA "features", how many are there really? Media Player and IE7 are the only flagship WGA products which offer any real additional value that I can think of. And they have their arguably-superior match in Safari/iTunes. Windows Defender isn't needed in Mac OS X, PowerToys are minor trinkets. Perhaps the only WGA software that doesn't already have an integrated Mac counterpart is Photo Story. Quite frankly, I see little advantage provided to the consumers by WGA, only that it helps Microsoft reduce piracy.

[C_Guy]

Mac OS X includes the iLife applications (iTunes, iPhoto, iChat, iDVD, etc), AppleWorks, Safari, Mail, Dashboard, QuickTime, and quite a few others right off the bat.

Yes but that's not the point. Those are initial offerings. Windows has that too (Movie maker/DVD maker, Internet Explorer, Media Player, Outlook Express, etc.) but I was talking about programs developed and updated after XP's launch such as Photo Story.

And if you're complaining that Mac OS X 10.0 to 10.5 look pretty much identical, well Vista still has pretty much maintained most of its ergonomics since Windows 95, backed up by some of the stuff from as far back as Windows 3.1!

Take a look around and you will see that Vista has many, many changes and enhancements that set it far apart from Windows 9x and XP. One example is the completely re-designed Start Menu. Contrast that to the 'Dock' which hasn't changed much since X's initial release. Or, the Apple menu bar which hasn't changed since very, very early editions of Mac OS.

After all, with all the hassles you have to put up with Windows, it's just not worth dishing out $300 US for such a POS!

If you really feel that the changes from OS X 10 to 10.5 are worth $500 then please go buy it. No one is making you buy Windows but it's easy to see how it's a better value in terms of what Microsoft offers you for free after your initial investment.

[Dark Reaper]

With all the money and time they're investing in anti piracy, I find it somewhat stupid that they just don't lower the price on the OS.

If the price was sub $200, that would be perfect.

[hagjohn]

Wouldn't that be considered Spyware? *gets ready for lawsuit*

I'm sure in order to use the software, you will have to agree to the call back.

[Fourjays Veteran]

It will only end up hurting the honest consumers. The pirates will find a way round it, and those who own genuine copies will end up with problems.

I bought Black Hawk Down a year or two ago, and went to play online. Someone already had the key registered so it wouldn't let me, and mine was definitely a genuine copy and after sometime I managed to get Novalogic to realise this and let me use my copy.

What is to stop the same happening with this? To stop a pirate somehow obtaining a key that belongs to a genuine copy? Then locking the user who owns the genuine copy out of their PC. I'm all for anti-piracy, but not when it makes life harder for the honest users.

On a side note, one game I have has no (not even against CD copying) copy protection on it and it has little or no piracy compared to games and software that are packed with anti-piracy features. I can't help but feel that for the crackers, it isn't so much as getting something for nothing, but for the "thrill" of cracking it.

[revvo]

If only they focused this much effort into making more features instead of trying to fight piracy, Vista might of become something better than what we expect it to be.

Vista has so many restrictions being put on the user compared to XP it ain't funny. Just becuase they have the right to do so doesn't make it right.

I know I would only get Vista if it came on a Laptop but for the desktop, XP will do fine thank you, but I'm sure they'll find a way to force ppl to use Vista, which is gay because just recently they stopped supporting Windows 95 I think. Vista is about to come out and they're already forgetting about XP or any other OS for that matter and what ppl to focus on Vista.

Besides, they'll never stop pirates. You can try but a small group will always prevail. The problem with the internet? That small group is capable of creating the biggest group within days. Too bad for them I guess.

I'd buy an an Operating System for its features, but if the damn thing has more anti-piracy features than actual OS features then what's the point.

[KZWings]

Hartje cited data from the Business Software Alliance that indicated 35 percent of all software installed in 2005 was pirated and unlicensed. This represented some $35 billion in lost revenue for the software industry.

So in other words, 65% of the software installed was legit and earned the companies positive revenue of $65 billion. Not too bad. Of course, they really need that extra $35 billion for advertising, lawsuits, bloated salaries for the executives, and other miniscule things.

If Vista was more around the $50.00 mark for the standard basic home user (I don't need Aero, nor do I need some of the other "eye candy" Vista offers) I would definitely go out and get it. If not, after my RC1 (RTM?) copy expires next year I will scrub the drive (after backing up my important information) and it will be back to XP Pro SP2.

Thats not really a good way to look at it. Thats saying that everyone who pirated the software would have purchased it.

[Stalk3r]

Haha how many times have we heard this before :D

[OhMuffin]

I feel sorry for Microsoft. Anyone remember how the XP Launch went? There was a picture of a guy holding a burnt cd of XP and having a VLK that bypassed activation.

I say this will be hacked and up on the net wayyy before the "offical" vista launch.

[Hitman2000]

This maybe a very stupid quetion for the l33t h4x0rs out there, but why is it so hard to find a crack of say something like steam to run CS, but windows can be easily cracked by your average 12y.o who can apply the wga patch workaround?

About the price, I believe lowering it will defenitly see more sales. Yes you may arugue there are those free everything people but at the end of the day they make up maybe 2%. The mom and dad users and students can fork out 99 bux, rather than 300 in one go. Im assuming majority of members on neowin are in the 19-30 demographic who go to college and have part time jobs, you guys should know how hard it is to spend 300bux one 1 thing in 1 payment.

[pyehac]

So, I'm guessing that I'll have to buy one disc for every computer to install vista on? (one box = one license)

If that's the case, then if if the cheapest version will cost $100, and I want to get two of the ultimate versions for $200 each (figuratively speaking) then I'll have to spend $700! I can buy a new computer with that!

(of course, 4 of the computers came with XP already installed, and I had to install everything on my SFF computer)

Good bye Windows. Hello Linux.

[zeta_immersion]

Firstly let Wista be installed on any computer as many times as you want ... you paid the cash then that cd with whatever is on it is YOURS .... that is why you paid for it ... it is called Trading goods ... then ... do not focus on anti-piracy ... that is stupid ... for every reaction there is an opposite and equal reaction ... so ... you slap .. bang you get slapped ... none the less ... MS should realize focusing on code is more important than some bucks they will loose for a few pirated copies ... OS X is better, more stable and fixes come a few every now and then, anything can be implemented with a few code and you find free code and programs everywhere (same with *nix) but people are too ignorant to use those OS's ... Windows is for dummies ... get the most retarded dude, show him candy ask 20$ for an M&M and there you go, you have Vista and the world ... off to work on my windows machine now :D ... cheers :beer: ...

oh and some people cannot afford internet and vista at the same time so yeah ... i mean ... yeah you know know already ... get a pirated vista and then have internet with the money saved .. man this makes sence is like energy is conserved (and not destroyed)

[zhangm Supervisor]

Lowering the price will not help much at all. There isn't a smooth gradient of people who will pay for an OS if it is 100$, or even 200$ cheaper. Rather, it is split between the people who will legitimately own the OS (less than a week's wages or something like that), or pirate it whether it costs 6000$, or 9.95$.

Remember how many people bitched and moaned over the 1.50$ download fee for Office 2007 Beta 2? You're getting the use of a freaking office suite for several months, for literally the cost of a bag of chips. But no, too expensive. That's what we see in the piracy world - people who simply aren't willing to pay, no matter how low the price is.

[L3thal Veteran]

Ahhh, but that's where you're wrong. While contracts are usually enforceable, they have limitations. This is where "common sense law" comes into play. I like to use unrealistic examples to illustrate the point, but the principle applies to all contractual agreements: if Windows' EULA said that, by agreeing to its terms, you must allow them to come and kill you, do you think they'd have a legal defense against murder? Of course not. While it's an extreme example, the point is that a contract is not absolute.

What does murder have to do with software? :rolleyes:

Yes, I understand you are using a bizarre example, but that example makes no sense. When you install a program that has spyware built into it and it makes that clear in their EULA, you cannot say anything about the spyware because you agreed to the terms which specifically mentioned that third-party software would be installed, e.g spyware.

I feel sorry for Microsoft. Anyone remember how the XP Launch went? There was a picture of a guy holding a burnt cd of XP and having a VLK that bypassed activation.

Too bad VLK's won't work as they did under XP :whistle:

Lowering the price will not help much at all. There isn't a smooth gradient of people who will pay for an OS if it is 100$, or even 200$ cheaper. Rather, it is split between the people who will legitimately own the OS (less than a week's wages or something like that), or pirate it whether it costs 6000$, or 9.95$.

Remember how many people bitched and moaned over the 1.50$ download fee for Office 2007 Beta 2? You're getting the use of a freaking office suite for several months, for literally the cost of a bag of chips. But no, too expensive. That's what we see in the piracy world - people who simply aren't willing to pay, no matter how low the price is.

Exactly my point (Y)

Good bye Windows. Hello Linux.

Funny you say that, but I can bet that you will end up either pirating or buying Vista. Everyone likes to bitch and moan about Windows and how they will move to Linux but they never do or if they do, they come right back.

[Schentler]

I said goodbye to windows a long time ago ... i'm using mac most of the time :p

[Shof]

there is NO way i can pay atleast 200-800 dollars for vista :angry:

[Xerxes]

I'm all for it, but it won't stop the pirates, don't be surprised if you read "Vista Cracked" a few days before (or after) it is released.

Anyway, what concerns me is all this stuff about "false positives" and what if a pirate gets lucky and gets your paid for CD key and activates before you? while I've never have much trouble with WGA and Activation I've heard plenty of stories of people not so lucky, to me all this anti-piracy measures are just gonna annoy the unlucky few people who's paid copies of Windows are flagged as "non-genuine" by Microsoft, while the pirate don't need to worry about it as it would of been removed or cracked...(I'm all for MS trying to make it harder for people to pirate Window, but it seems to annoy the paying customers more then it does the pirates...)

[riahc3]

This maybe a very stupid quetion for the l33t h4x0rs out there, but why is it so hard to find a crack of say something like steam to run CS, but windows can be easily cracked by your average 12y.o who can apply the wga patch workaround?

Steam/HL2 took a while to hack but its already hacked. The first version of HL2 froze up but recent versions have been fixed and now are all over the internet.

Vista will be cracked just like any other software in the world. If it can be done by man, it can be undone by man.

[pyehac]

Funny you say that, but I can bet that you will end up either pirating or buying Vista. Everyone likes to bitch and moan about Windows and how they will move to Linux but they never do or if they do, they come right back.

Unless I'll need to use Vista's features, then I won't upgrade. The only way I'll get vista, is when I buy a new laptop.

[remix17]

I bet this thing will get cracked even before it hits the shelves.

[cyoung1616]

Make the wall higher....they'll only extend the ladder.

But sooner or later the ladder get so tall it's not worth the trouble. If Microsoft can make it so tuff on the avg. pirate then they will win. The so called masterminds may crack it to heck and back but if you have to recrack something every time you turn around it will get old quick.

Cody

[iconoclast]

In other words, Vista will constantly try to call back to Microsoft. What about the people with no internet? Are they off the chart?

no longer a targeted demographic. They can use a Mac or linux or WinXP or lower. You really thing someone who is going to buy Vista doesn't have the internet?

[Avatar Viper]

No protection is secure enough for the hacker/cracker. Someday, somehow it will eventually be broken :)