Creative Goes After Driver Modder

[theyarecomingforyou]

Wow. Still, Creative has had terrible products support for years - it started going downhill when they withdrew driver downloads from their website for "cost" reasons. Ridiculous. I really hope some other companies take the audio market seriously and develop serious rivals to Creative cards - EAX isn't as important as it used to be and with Vista it is even less relevant. I like that Razer and Asus have stepped into the market, though they need to bring out cheaper products to compete with Creative's more diverse product lineup.

[imis]

it is not strange, this is the way these big companies cheat the poor customers. i will take more care while buying. thankx for information.

[PixilEyes]

http://spykes.net/exfi.jpg

[XIII]

This was posted on their forums by a newegg rep, they're ****ed:

Can I say "OWNED"?

Seem like their stock also go down significantly because of this event:

http://forums.creative.com/creativelabs/bo...ing&page=28

Post 6th from the bottom

[Yusuf M. Veteran]

Wow. Still, Creative has had terrible products support for years - it started going downhill when they withdrew driver downloads from their website for "cost" reasons. Ridiculous. I really hope some other companies take the audio market seriously and develop serious rivals to Creative cards - EAX isn't as important as it used to be and with Vista it is even less relevant. I like that Razer and Asus have stepped into the market, though they need to bring out cheaper products to compete with Creative's more diverse product lineup.

Agreed. I'm currently looking into HT Omega.

it is not strange, this is the way these big companies cheat the poor customers. i will take more care while buying. thankx for information.

I guess things spread fast on the internet. Every tech forum I visit has "Creative hate" in it and now I understand.

http://spykes.net/exfi.jpg

Pwned! Hahahaha.

[Eric Veteran]

This needs to move from BPN to the front page...

[Rigby]

Creative's web site is down now.

Edit: Nevermind, it's back up.

Edited March 31, 2008 by TRC

[Eric Veteran]

Creative's web site is down now.

It's working for me @ http://us.creative.com

[DrCheese]

http://forums.creative.com/creativelabs/bo...essage.id=23909

Guy says that one of the coders of the creative drivers posted some feedback about the recent mass flamefest

'Ok, I see a lot of negativity here. Please lets cut the bad talk. We try our best to get working drivers and sure we might not be the best coders but god knows you're really only paying for the low end cards anyway, if people want the professional stuff they would be getting the true pro stuff, its a get what you pay for thing, so don't complain so much, we'll get the drivers working eventually.'

The creative rep got it removed but still. I do feel sorry in a way for them as it's really probably not the coders fault that certain choices were made within the company about the whole vista drivers thing.

Also I'm not really sure about that newegg post being official, There is zero proof that it is actually from newegg.

[Denis W. Veteran]

This was posted on their forums by a newegg rep, they're ****ed:

LMFAO! Owned like mad hell. When people said they're boycotting Creative products, they meant it. No playing the "I'll pretend to send out threats because it's cool" here. :D

edit: Actually I mirror DrCheese's comment. Who posted that comment, a Newegg forum moderator/administrator? And where's the source?

Edited March 31, 2008 by rm20010

[theyarecomingforyou]

Guy says that one of the coders of the creative drivers posted some feedback about the recent mass flamefest

That's nonsense. My soundcard is the EMU 1820M, part of Creative's "professional" lineup for digital audio work, and it took them a long time to get beta drivers up for Vista and even longer for the final release (with two lengthy delays that were only announced days before each supposed release date). At the end of the day Vista has been out for a long time and had been available for testing long before release - to have been upstaged by a driver modder without full technical specifications is simply pathetic.

[L3thal Veteran]

I never had trouble with my X-Fi card and Vista ever since Vista went gold to OEM. Nonetheless, I won't be buying anymore sound cards from them.

[X'tyfe]

iv been watching this for sometime

gotta say, im not sure what to think

i always thought that creative was the main player in soundcards the "only choice" i guess

then i hear everyone bad mouthing them for whatever reason, but drivers and what not

ya i agree there drivers are bloated and need work, but theres no excuse for them not to have "working" drivers

they have had plenty of time, but instead they dicked around trying to figure out how they could make money out of it

well, now there gunna burn for it seem. im thinking that i will also opt for a better brand next system build...

[xankazo]

they deserve all this mess. they're ripping what they have sown, actually.

[pixated]

Glad I didn't buy the X-Fi when everyone started pushing for them.

[d3nuo]

This was posted on their forums by a newegg rep, they're ****ed:

beautiful! me loves newegg!!!

[Xerxes]

Meh, the guy's drivers aren't that great to be honest. They still don't fix my Audigy 4 in Vista :pinch: no matter what I do, I cannot get more then 2 speakers to work and the advanced audio functions (EAX etc) just won't work, even with the Alchemy thing :(. Even my apparent 5.1 capable on-board chip on my new machine, won't work with more then 2 speakers no matter what you do.

I primarily use headphones so it's not a major issue, but it is annoying when I setup my 5.1 speakers to only have 2 of those speakers actually work with the other 3.1 silent (the sound works perfectly in XP, full 5.1 surround sound so it's not the hardware at fault).

All I know is, I'm not buying any new sound hardware while Vista is my primary OS. I don't think it's just Creative just been lazy [with drivers], I feel it is the changes that MS made to the sound sub-system in Vista, they changed too much. Let's just hope MS don't screw it up more in Windows 7...

This is purely my opinion and should be taken with a grain of salt.

[O.G]

I feel it is the changes that MS made to the sound sub-system in Vista, they changed too much. Let's just hope MS don't screw it up more in Windows 7...

This is purely my opinion and should be taken with a grain of salt.

Firstly, they are not *his* drivers, they are Creatives drivers. He has no access to the source code so is limited pretty much to messing around with files withing the respective Creative driver packages. So its Creatives drivers that aint all that great, something everyone already knows.

Secondly, the Creative driver techs already done all the work to the drivers, including near full support for features previously enjoyed in XP, so M$'s changes are somewhat irrelevant to the fact your card does not work in Vista as the drivers are written to work with Vista. Again, if you find that not to be the case, thats down to Creative, not Microsoft. During the entire Longhorn beta period, Creative refused to write any drivers for Vista because as they put it "We do not support beta o/s's". That meant driver developement was a rush job when Vista was released to OEM's and the sum total time spent on drivers for existing ranges was around 4 months ( at the very most). Driver packages released since are pretty much based on those original driver releases. I might also add that the main reason for the changes in Vista regarding hardware level access mainly lie with Creative and Nvidia, because the majority of BSOD related errors generated in previous o/s's were cuased by their drivers.

As for believing this is not down to Creative, let me just quote Brite Spark Phil, Creatives VP of Corporate Communications;

"We are aware that you have been assisting owners of our Creative sound cards for some time now, by providing unofficial driver packages for Vista that deliver more of the original functionality that was found in the equivalent XP packages for those sound cards. In principle we don't have a problem with you helping users in this way, so long as they understand that any driver packages you supply are not supported by Creative. Where we do have a problem is when technology and IP owned by Creative or other companies that Creative has licensed from, are made to run on other products for which they are not intended. The difference in this case is that we own the rights to the materials that you are distributing. By enabling our technology and IP to run on sound cards for which it was not originally offered or intended, you are in effect, stealing our goods. "

As you can clearly see, there is an admission of guilt. Functionality was purposefuly disabled and it is Creative who intented not to make those features available, not Microsoft. The DDL issue asside, all other features enabled by daniel_k were features people bought and paid for, and there is no legitimate reason why they should be disabled.

Im not to confident that the newegg post on Creatives forums is genuine, I guess time will tell. However, another online retailer has stopped distribution of Creative soundcards, heres hoping other follow suit.

http://www.afwarehouse.com/category_s/50.htm

[+mrbester MVC]

...its a get what you pay for thing, so don't complain so much, we'll get the drivers working eventually.

There are two alternatives here:

1. This is a troll.

2. This is genuine.

If 1 then the coder is an idiot as this will direct flame from Creative as a whole to him/her as an individual.

If 2 then heads should roll. How long was Vista in beta so drivers could be developed for it? How long has Vista been gold so drivers could be developed for it? There's even a Service Pack for the operating system ffs. "Getting drivers to work eventually" gets me a refund under the Sale of Goods Act as this is proof (along with "you get what you pay for": people paid for something that was supposed to work) that the item was sold under false pretences as to suitability and no guarantee that it would ever work as stated. This can also result in hefty fines against the company. I don't know about the US, but surely there is a breach of consumer law here?

Of course, the consumer is supposed to bend over and take it without complaint. Sorry, doesn't work that way.

[Digitalx]

:rofl:

[webeagle12]

157 pages :laugh: I will thinks twice before buying anything from that company

[The_Decryptor Veteran]

...

All I know is, I'm not buying any new sound hardware while Vista is my primary OS. I don't think it's just Creative just been lazy [with drivers], I feel it is the changes that MS made to the sound sub-system in Vista, they changed too much. Let's just hope MS don't screw it up more in Windows 7...

This is purely my opinion and should be taken with a grain of salt.

MS made changes, but they didn't "cripple" much, my cheap 'n crappy sound card was supported (entirely) out of the box.

That's optical out and 7.1 channel, all supported by default.

[tiagosilva29]

WTF, creamhackered?

[Xerxes]

MS made changes, but they didn't "cripple" much, my cheap 'n crappy sound card was supported (entirely) out of the box.

That's optical out and 7.1 channel, all supported by default.

Wish mine would work :( both my soundcard/soundchip have been considerably crippled by Vista and I've been looking for ages for possible solutions. While I gave up on the Audigy 4 long ago (as it's old technology and it was never intended to work fully in Vista to begin with) but I've still got a faint glimpse of hope my onboard might eventually play nice with Vista. The most frustrating part is my onboard chip is suppose to fully support Vista and it doesn't. The machine in question isn't that old and it shipped with Vista, yet despite it saying it supports 5.1 (it might of been 7.1 but I think that was wishful thinking) and having 5.1 speakers bundled with it, it is very frustrating only 2 of them work! (the problem isn't the speakers, they have been replaced already once and they work perfectly when I tested them with a XP system) so this problem (for me) isn't limited to Creative, which is why I feel it might be something MS did is all.

If someone knows how to get surround working in Vista, I'm all ears as I'd love to be able to watch my movies in 5.1 sound on my PC again!..2.0 is just not the same :( (my onboard is a SigmaTel HD)

[Ji@nBing]

LMFAO!!!! To top everything off, their forums don't seem to render properly in anything but IE (text is cut off at the right). Great coders accross the board over there at Creative!!!