Opera 11 is better than the latest Chrome and Firefox Nightlies

[Marius F]

i'm biased so Safari FTW!

[ArKeYa]

Well, this whole thread is blatant flamebait, but what the hey. Just a few days ago I went and installed all the nightlies of Opera 11, Chromium, and Firefox 4. (I went with Chromium as I don't need the inane "update services" and all that other Google crap running in the background.)

Chromium, at least on my rig, handled javascript exceedingly quick, but the rest of the browser not so much. Wasn't slow, but it certainly wasn't impressive either.. not sure if it was a configuration error, but out of the box it as pretty underwhelming. Wasn't terribly impressed with the memory usage as well.. a few times it flew past FF4's usage. The one thing that struck me interesting was it's 'app store'. Novel idea, but my desktop runs desktop apps, and if I wanted an 'app store', I'd buy an Android or iPad.

Opera was pretty much identical in performance.. fast under the hood, but the browser itself was a "meh" at best. The few extensions that I tried failed miserably (at best buggy, at worst didn't run at all or even crashed the browser), but granted that's a "new" concept for Opera and it is a nightly, so to be expected I guess.. hopefully they get it worked out. As it stands currently though, borderline useless. Other than that, it's the same super-inflexible Opera that I've grown to dislike.

FF4 (Minefield nightly, not B7) on the other hand was almost as fast as Chromium in the JS department, but the browser itself was very fast.. just for a test IE's Fishtank demo for example, FF4 was the only one that I got a framerate that capped at my display's refresh speed, the other browsers weren't even close. Same with Futuremark's browser benchmark, overall I had better results with FF4. Regular browsing was near instant, no waiting. Plus FF4 still has by far the most and best extendability of any browser, period. I have still yet to find another browser with an AdBlock/NoScript type setup that actually comes even close to being as good.. they all have knockoffs, but they all fail to impress.

If pure JS speed is all that matters for you, then by all means go with Opera or Chrome. Me though, I prefer my browser to be a bit more flexible. Does it really matter what I think? Not in the least, nor do I care in the slightest what anyone else thinks. Find the one you like and stick with it, pat yourself on the back for making a decision. No need to start these inane threads though.

Flame on.

:laugh:

[SharpGreen]

This is not the same as clearing your history upon exit, and there is no option to go into incognito mode every time within the browser. You have to actually add some information to the shortcut, which Google knows most people simply won't do.

Point being, I find this whole "omg google is spaiing on me" crap just a bit tiring. Don't like don't use it. But it's far better than Opera. At least Google didn't have to complain to the EU to get a >1% increase in its market share. That is the main reason I don't use Opera on my desktop. Opera Mobile on the other hand is the best. I'll agree there.

I don't use email or IRC either. It doesn't even get in my way. I just think it's funny that a Chrome installation is 30 MB while the Opera 11 installation is only 7 MB despite all that extra stuff. :whistle:

I have 1.5TB of hard drive space., why do I care how big it is? :p

EDIT:

On Windows, Opera is now installed via a custom self extracting 7Zip archive, so it's lighter than a ZIP :p Heck, you can rename it as .7z file and extract out of it yourself, and Opera also allows portable installations by default now too (: It's also got the smallest install file of any Windows browser.

And if you don't need the Mail or IRC, just don't take notice. Many, many people who use Opera don't have clue it was a working mail client or IRC, because their out of your way, and they don't clutter or effect your interface in any, or effect memory usage.

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What I meant was there is no installer with a zip file. I wasn't talking about size. Who cares about size right? :p

[Knife Party]

^ yawn, i'm sorry but I have to agree with Jen here, its pure flamebait. Coming here, making a thread then saying browser X is better than browsers A and B, then only focusing on the shortcomings of those rivals is one sided and driven by flawed logic. Opera has shortcomings just as firefox, chrome and others do, and honestly he is yet to reply to my question fully, I asked for flaws of the browser, I get an answer which doesn't even mention things such as lack of hardware acceleration, poor addons system compared to Firefox, somewhat excessive memory usage sometimes due to agressive caching, slow startup relative to Chrome for example and so on. Those would be critiques of Opera....

[polyarchist]

so other than low marketshare and only recent extensions , you're arguing that Opera has no flaws? :rolleyes:

If you'd like to point some out to me, I might agree with you.

^ yawn, i'm sorry but I have to agree with Jen here, its pure flamebait. Coming here, making a thread then saying browser X is better than browsers A and B, then only focusing on the shortcomings of those rivals is one sided and driven by flawed logic. Opera has shortcomings just as firefox, chrome and others do, and honestly he is yet to reply to my question fully, I asked for flaws of the browser, I get an answer which doesn't even mention things such as lack of hardware acceleration, poor addons system compared to Firefox, somewhat excessive memory usage sometimes due to agressive caching, slow startup relative to Chrome for example and so on. Those would be critiques of Opera....

Ah, there we go. Had to edit this response in.

1) Lack of hardware acceleration? Really? I mean, there isn't even a stable browser that has this fully implemented yet! Are you really going to call that a negative? It will probably pop up in Opera 12, which will in all likelihood start going into alpha soon after Firefox 4 goes stable, which doesnt look like its going to happen for another 3-4 months at the pace its going. Also, Chrome doesn't even have this fully implemented yet even in Chrome 10 nightlies. Until most stable browsers have this as a standard feature, you can't call the lack of HW acceleration a negative, because there isn't anything to negate from in the first place!

2) Poor addons system? It's practically the same open standard found in Chrome. I don't have to restart to install my extensions with either browser, and you're calling that poor?

3) Sorry, but while Firefox may use less memory than Opera, Chrome uses the most memory. Opera uses less than half the memory of Chrome.

http://lifehacker.com/5711040/browser-speed-tests-ie-9-firefox-4-beta-chromes-crankshaft-and-opera-11-beta?skyline=true&s=i

4) It starts up the same as Chrome for me, and this link shows it as well.

Boot-Up and Warm Loading—Winner: Tie—Chrome 10 (Canary) and Opera 10!

When it comes to cold boot-ups (a.k.a. just after booting up), Opera has the ever-so-slight edge. When booting up again, or bringing up after a little inactivity, Opera and Chrome 10, in its "Canary" form, are nearly instant in raising up—so close that human-measured timers might be too close to call. Firefox 4 beta 7 had some seriously long start-up delays, such that we were throwing out 20-second results more than once to try and reach equilibrium.

http://lifehacker.com/5711040/browser-speed-tests-ie-9-firefox-4-beta-chromes-crankshaft-and-opera-11-beta?skyline=true&s=i

Maybe you need to get a better computer because Opera works fine in terms of startup, and I've been a Chromium user for a year now before I switched to Opera.

Edited December 12, 2010 by polyarchist

[xrandallx]

i will stick to my firefox for now and from time to time i go to chrome but only when im in the mood :) i have never liked opera and will never download it , it really dislikes my pogo games when i play them

[polyarchist]

i will stick to my firefox for now and from time to time i go to chrome but only when im in the mood :) i have never liked opera and will never download it , it really dislikes my pogo games when i play them

How do you explain me playing Pogo Monopoly right now on Opera with no issue?

[Denis W. Veteran]

Okay, even as an Opera user I find the 'spying' allegations made against Google a bit ridiculous. You can disable search suggestions if you like, and for the record all other browsers do the exact same thing as Chrome. Actually, for Opera I can't find a user-configurable option to prevent search suggestions from appearing.

[xrandallx]

it never works for me and i get errors from opera so its just not pogo i have other reasons for not liking opera

How do you explain me playing Pogo Monopoly right now on Opera with no issue?

[thenaes]

I really like Opera, but there are still some rendering issues with some websites that I run into. Also sometimes the smooth scrolls starts stuttering when there are flash elements (such as embedded youtube videos) on a page.

[polyarchist]

I really like Opera, but there are still some rendering issues with some websites that I run into. Also sometimes the smooth scrolls starts stuttering when there are flash elements (such as embedded youtube videos) on a page.

Webkit is just weird on some pages as Presto can be. Trident and Gecko are the only ones that have few problems simply because most webmasters test their sites with IE and Firefox because they are #1 and #2. It's as simple as that. Chrome had to remove their smooth scroll when it was causing browser crashes. You can turn it off easily.

[KeeperOfThePizza]

Honestly. Every browser is gonna have its strong points and weak points... it's really whatever your happy with using. just my opinion.

[Tekkerson]

I really like Opera, but there are still some rendering issues with some websites that I run into. Also sometimes the smooth scrolls starts stuttering when there are flash elements (such as embedded youtube videos) on a page.

This. Plus I really wish I could use Opera. It's just really wonky at times. The most stable browser for me has been Chrome. Firefox crashes every once in a while and I lose all my tabs. Not fun. Opera is my secondary browser with chrome as the first. I also love chrome's minimalism with only 3 buttons. Yum. More space to view the page with :)

[Neoauld]

Why i probably wont use Opera

Legal issue creating that 'click to activate object' on youtube videos/anything with flash...irritates me

Chrome/Opera wont have has good extensions as firefox

Website Compatibility with Firefox is still top notch compared to the alternatives

Why i even considered opera

Speed

UI is great, i love it

Stability

Smooth scrolling is just perfect in it

[Lachlan]

Hello everybody, I've been reading this forum for a long time and decided to finally post something I felt was lacking in this subforum.

I've been using Firefox since before it was called Firefox, and I've switched to Chrome last year but recently I've been using Opera 11 and its become my default browser.

Why Firefox is lacking: The interface is terribly slow compared to the other 2 browsers, Gecko is notorious for being very slow due to the sheer amount of code, and even the Minefield nightlies continue to lag behind even Chrome and Opera stable versions in terms of compliance and speed. While it may have the biggest amount of extensions, it is only this fact that is keeping people in the Firefox world. Once extensions development approaches the comprehensiveness of Firefox's ecosystem, I see many users going to Chrome instead of Firefox. In other words, unless Mozilla can rewrite Firefox from scratch, I don't see how it can possibly compete with the Webkit browsers alone and I can see Chrome being the #2 browser for Windows by 2014 or so.

Why Chrome is lacking: Despite its massive gains over Firefox in terms of speed, compliance and UI responsiveness, it still has a lot of basic issues to deal with that continue to be ignored by Google: Why can't I manage the cache? Why can't I delete my history upon exiting the browser. I would say that that has a lot of to do with the spying that Chrome does with your browsing sessions. It can't create a profile of your browsing habits efficiently if you keep clearing out your history, as many people would choose to do. Also, the download manager is terrible and copy and paste functions continue to be extremely buggy on many website. Why does it have to save every torrent file I open? Why does it have to open the download bar when I right click save an image? All these things should have been fixed by now, but they aren't, because Google is too busy on only 2 things: 1) Performance 2) Finding new ways to mine your data, such as their sync, cloud print, and DNS options. While Chrome is faster than Firefox in many ways, it is not as good a browser in terms of features and privacy options, simply because Google is an advertising company, and the more control you have over your browser, the less of your data it can keep. There's a reason why there's an 11 page thread on this forum called "Things you hate about Chrome", you know!

Why Opera is best: Recent benchmarks show that Opera is similar to Chrome in terms of speed, and the interface is just as responsive while still using less memory than Chrome (but still more memory than Firefox) Best of all, Opera 11 now has extensions that are very similar to Chrome and every Chrome extension can be easily ported to Opera. Through these open standards, it is easier than ever to write an extension for a browser. With Opera, you get all the strengths of both Firefox and Chrome: You get Chrome's speed and Firefox's featureset, with even more built-in, like native content blocking, email, IRC, etc. You even get built-in Greasemonkey script support! There is really no reason to use either Chrome or Firefox when Opera simply combines the two in a lightweight installation.

Try Opera 11 when it becomes stable this month, guys, and get all the benefits of Chrome while not sacrificing even the basic browser that Firefox provides, and start from scratch with its new extension support.

Love how you have been reading the forum for a long tim but decided to join today? Was it just for this post or are you actually going from site to site promoting it. You have never commented on anything in this entire forum and yet you will join one day and write a topic? Kinda hard to trust you.

[polyarchist]

Why i probably wont use Opera

Legal issue creating that 'click to activate object' on youtube videos/anything with flash...irritates me

I guess you didn't see the new features of Opera 11. Check out new feature #9.

1. Tab stacking

Opera pioneered powerful tabs. In Opera 11, tab stacking lets you drag one tab over another to create a group. Now, you can keep dozens of webpages open, organized and under control.

Watch video

2. A safer address field

Opera's new address field hides the complexity of long web addresses and gives you better control of your security when browsing. Click on the badge for the website to see information about the site you are visiting. You can even get information about Opera Turbo data savings.

3. Extensions support

You can now browse Opera's extensions catalog to add new functionality easily and customize Opera just how you want it.

4. Visual mouse gestures

Mouse gestures are another Opera innovation that has been made easier-to-use with the addition of an interface that guides you. This allows new users to discover the speed and power that mouse gestures offer.

5. Better performance

Our developers have been hard at work fine-tuning our browser engine to put Opera even further ahead in a number of benchmarks. In Opera 11, pages load faster and complex applications run more smoothly.

6. Enhanced HTML5 support

Support for new standards and HTML5 technologies means that rich, dynamic web applications and multiplayer games can be supported by Opera 11.

7. Extended auto-update

A new auto-update system ensures that your extensions and Opera Unite apps are always up to date with the latest enhancements.

8. Search predictions from Google

Search suggestions predict queries as you type, making searching quicker and easier. Google search predictions are now built into Opera. When using the search field or searching from the address field with the 'g' search keyword, Google search predictions will appear.

9. Plug-ins only on demand

An option has now been added to have plug-ins such as Flash content load only when clicked. This is especially helpful to speed up browsing on computers that have difficulty handling lots of plug-in content.

10. Enhanced email in your browser

A new mail panel gives you control over the order in which your accounts and mail items show up. You can just drag items where you want them. The mail panel can also show your mail panel when you are using it and hide when you leave a mail tab.

11. Faster installation

Even with its many new features, Opera 11 is 30% smaller than Opera 10.60. That means that Opera downloads more quickly and installs in fewer steps. Getting Opera on your computer is easier than ever.

[Tim the Enchanter]

....Other than that, it's the same super-inflexible Opera that I've grown to dislike....

LOL user-error/incompetence :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

[SaltySalsa]

Yeah, but the logo sucks (only 50% joking) :)

Seriously though... Opera 11 wastes space.... the Menu button could be alongside your first tab. Instead though it's above and you have all that glass above your tabs just wasted. Secondly, separate search bars are completely and utterly unnecessary. Can I remove it and search from the address bar like most other browsers are doing now?

1) You clearly didn't try to maximize your window since it does this when maximized:

2) Yes, you can remove the search from the address bar. Right click on it, go down to customize and then select "Remove From Toolbar" and it goes away.

[Ryoken]

I can't stand Opera, I've never liked it..

There's a reason why it lives at ~3% market share.. And it's not because no one knows about it, hell even my parents knew about it in the late 90's because it would be on the news about being an alternative to IE NN and crap like that.. It was meh then and it's meh now..

Add to that the company I hate.. Where's their ballot screen for e-mail and IRC when you install their browser ? After all that bitching about IE bundled with Windows you'd think they would hold themselves to the same standard..

Plus as a web developer I find Opera to be the most finicky of all browsers.. IE has it's issues but after a few months you know them.. Chrome and Safari get it right 99.9% of the time, FF get's it right 99.8% of the time.. Opera there's always something I find that just wants ti fight with me.. Rarely do I waste the time on it though, for the 0.2% of the people that hit the site with it, it's not worth my pay.

I'll stick with Chrome for my day to day stuff ( Normally Chrome Canary, only been one build [ read one day ] that I found it to be buggy enough to not want to use ), with IE9 as my backup..

FF is ok but I don't care to use it because I find the community has almost as big a chip on their shoulders as Linux people.. That is to say they generally say if you aren't using it your an idiot and look down on everyone :p

Safari is great on MacOS, but not close to being there on Windows yet..

[XP1]

Point being, I find this whole "omg google is spaiing on me" crap just a bit tiring. Don't like don't use it. But it's far better than Opera. At least Google didn't have to complain to the EU to get a >1% increase in its market share. That is the main reason I don't use Opera on my desktop. Opera Mobile on the other hand is the best. I'll agree there.

You think Opera complained to get an increase in market share? You think Google and Mozilla??complained to get an even bigger increase in market share?

You shouldn't use Google and Mozilla either. You should use Microsoft.

http://www.google.co...lain+mozilla+eu

What a stupid reason.

Why i probably wont use Opera

Legal issue creating that 'click to activate object' on youtube videos/anything with flash...irritates me

Patch the DLL:

http://my.opera.com/...-bites-the-dust

http://my.opera.com/...es/blog/xanocta

[XP1]

I can't stand Opera, I've never liked it..

There's a reason why it lives at ~3% market share.. And it's not because no one knows about it, hell even my parents knew about it in the late 90's because it would be on the news about being an alternative to IE NN and crap like that.. It was meh then and it's meh now..

Do your reasons prove that Opera has small market share? Sorry, not everyone watches the news like your parents. Sorry, not everyone is born before the late 90s.

Skyfire has been on the news. Does this mean that everyone knows about Skyfire?

Add to that the company I hate.. Where's their ballot screen for e-mail and IRC when you install their browser ? After all that bitching about IE bundled with Windows you'd think they would hold themselves to the same standard..

Sorry, ballot screen only applies to monopolies and illegal-ness.

[-KJ]

Opera is a great browser. It's what I use today.

But I think this thread reeks of Opera fanboyism and is hurting their image here more than it is supporting them.

Oh, I have one complaint: the inability to drag and drop a tab into a bookmark folder on the bookmark tab. That should've been standard. So it's half as useful as it could be.

[ViperAFK]

The only flaws I can see are that it isn't as popular (less than 3% marketshare) and only has 195 extensions at the moment.

No native menus, poor menu structure, its interface isn't very complaint with some web apps (try using meebo and popping out windows, opera absolutely refuses to do this properly)

-opera user.

[polyarchist]

No native menus, poor menu structure, its interface isn't very complaint with some web apps (try using meebo and popping out windows, opera absolutely refuses to do this properly)

-opera user.

I'll agree that menus need a bit of work, and you're right, I just tried popping out a window with Meebo and it screwed up. Good thing I don't pop them out at all. I guess these are issues that should be addressed.

[Ji@nBing]

Can I remove it and search from the address bar like most other browsers are doing now?

Yes, you can.