Which of these subs for my Home Theater?

[Jeston Veteran]

Hello all. So, I recently purchased the Klipsch RF-82 II system and it came with a free sub (Premier Accoustics PA-150) with the intention of later purcahsing the Klipsch RW-12D to replace it. Well, the price is right, so I have to come ask if it's a good upgrade.

Specs of PA-150:

15" Active Subwoofer

Sensitivity: 85DB 1 Watt 1 Meter

Ohms: :4 Ohms

Frequency Responses: 25HZ-180HZ

Wattage: 250 (rms) - 1000 Watts(peak power)

Product Size: 21.1" x 17.9" x 19.2" (H X W X D )

Shipping Size: 28.7" x 24.7: x 24.7" (H X W X D )

Weight: 87 pounds each

Warranty: 5 Year Warranty On Woofer, 2 Year On Amplifier

Color: Black

Specs of RW-12D:

FREQUENCY RESPONSE 24-120Hz +/-3dB

AMPLIFIER POWER FTC Rated Power: 350 watts continuous @ <2% THD / Dynamic Power*: 825 watts

MAXIMUM ACOUSTIC OUTPUT 116dB @ 30Hz 1/8 space, 1m

DRIVE COMPONENTS 12" (30.5cm) Cerametallic? cone, front-firing woofer

AMPLIFIER BASH? digital hybrid

ENCLOSURE TYPE Bass-reflex via front-firing CornerPort?

INPUTS L/R Line-level RCA jacks, L/R High-level speaker binding posts

OUTPUTS None

HEIGHT 19.2" (48.8cm)

WIDTH 14.6" (37.1cm)

DEPTH 21" (53.3cm)

WEIGHT 49lbs (22.2kg)

FEATURES DCS control and feature set w/ 3 system presets

FINISHES Black Ash woodgrain vinyl

VOLTAGE 110/120 VAC 60Hz

EXPORT VOLTAGE 220 VAC 50/60Hz

Should I just stick to the PA-150, or jump on the RW-12D while the price is hot ($350)?

[goji]

The RF 82 II has a range of 33hz at the low end and 24khz at the top.

Both subs hit pretty low at 24 and 25hz respectively though the upper regions of each sub tell a different story. The PA-150 rolls out on the top at 180hz where as the RW-12D rolls out about 120hz. Number wise the PA covers a wider sound range which is absolutely unnecessary; subs do one thing: hit low!

Because the RW-12D hits pretty hard at 116db at 30 hz I'd say go with the Klipsch. It is better matched to the system and will compliment the towers cut off at 33 hz with a nice slam from the sub at 30hz and lower.

[Astra.Xtreme]

Go with the Klipsch. I have Promedia speakers for my PC and they literally shake the walls.

[shakey]

Both subs hit pretty low at 24 and 25hz respectively though the upper regions of each sub tell a different story. The PA-150 rolls out on the top at 180hz where as the RW-12D rolls out about 120hz. Number wise the PA covers a wider sound range which is absolutely unnecessary; subs do one thing: hit low!

Because the RW-12D hits pretty hard at 116db at 30 hz I'd say go with the Klipsch. It is better matched to the system and will compliment the towers cut off at 33 hz with a nice slam from the sub at 30hz and lower.

That's what I thought as well. While one has a higher end, that doesn't matter too much on a sub, because that is what your speakers will really be hitting anyway. The RW has the same low, 1mhz is not going to be noticeable without equipment, but it does give the max output... the other you listed either isn't as good, or they just skimped on the specs. But from what you posted, for sure get the RW-12D

[Jeston Veteran]

Thanks for the replies everyone, though I wish they had come sooner as the price is now back up to $500 so I'm back to waiting :p

Is there a better sub I should go with in the same price range, or is the RW-12D really the best match for my system? I'm not in a huge hurry as the PA-150 is definitely a decent sub, but I know there are much better ones out there.

[goji]

Oo sorry about that. I don't hop on as frequently as I'd like to.

Aside from price, what are you hoping to achieve with the sub? Do you want something that is simply loud or do you want a deep hitting bass producer? Figuring out what you want will help and if you have wiggle room of up to say 400 USD then I'm sure we could find something for ya!

[Jeston Veteran]

Oo sorry about that. I don't hop on as frequently as I'd like to.

Aside from price, what are you hoping to achieve with the sub? Do you want something that is simply loud or do you want a deep hitting bass producer? Figuring out what you want will help and if you have wiggle room of up to say 400 USD then I'm sure we could find something for ya!

I think instead of just loud I'd rather get a pure deep sound. I use the system mostly for movies and some video games, not much regular music. Unfortunately, I know next to nothing about subwoofers, so i'm not exactly sure what I need for my situation. I'm not against going up to $500 or so.

[goji]

Whew, I wasn't aware of sub pricing, particularly the Klipsch RW-12d. 350 apparently was a hot price! Sorry we didn't get back to you sooner. :blush:

[Jeston Veteran]

Whew, I wasn't aware of sub pricing, particularly the Klipsch RW-12d. 350 apparently was a hot price! Sorry we didn't get back to you sooner. :blush:

It's alright, I can wait for another sale if that's the sub I should go with. I'd rather make sure i'm getting the best sub I can afford than get one while it's on sale ;)

[arrrgh]

With subwoofers you definitely get more for your money if you avoid big name brands like Klipsch.

In $500 price range, I would seriously consider the following subs:

Epik Legend - http://www.epiksubwoofers.com/legend.html

Emotiva Ultra 12 - http://emotiva.com/ultra_sub12.shtm

Elemental Designs A5s-300 - http://www.edesignaudio.com/product_info.php?cPath=2_41&products_id=681

HSU VTF-2 Mk3 - http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/vtf-2-mk3.html

Rythmik FV12 - http://www.rythmikaudio.com/FV12.html

SVS PB10-NSD - https://svsound.com/products-sub-box-10nsd.cfm

For movie use, I would probably go with Epik Legend, very well build sub that digs nice and deep.

[Jeston Veteran]

With subwoofers you definitely get more for your money if you avoid big name brands like Klipsch.

In $500 price range, I would seriously consider the following subs:

Epik Legend - http://www.epiksubwoofers.com/legend.html

Emotiva Ultra 12 - http://emotiva.com/ultra_sub12.shtm

Elemental Designs A5s-300 - http://www.edesignaudio.com/product_info.php?cPath=2_41&products_id=681

HSU VTF-2 Mk3 - http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/vtf-2-mk3.html

Rythmik FV12 - http://www.rythmikaudio.com/FV12.html

SVS PB10-NSD - https://svsound.com/products-sub-box-10nsd.cfm

For movie use, I would probably go with Epik Legend, very well build sub that digs nice and deep.

Thanks, I will definitely take a look at those.

Just out of curiosity, since as I mentioned I know very little about subs, what characteristic makes one sub better at movies than music and another sub better at music than movies?

Also, I currently have a small room (my bedroom) that is about 12.5'x12.5'. I will be moving these into a living room or actual theater room when I move sometime in the next year or so. That being said, if I were to be able to save up more and could afford the bigger brothers to some of these, say the Epik Empire or the VTF-3 MK3, would they sound like utter crap in my current small room? I'm sure they'd be overkill for the time being, but I'm trying to plan for the future. I guess what I'm wondering is would they just put out too much bass, or would they still sound great with the volume throttled back a bit?

[Jeston Veteran]

I think for the moment I am leaning towards the HSU Research VTF-3 MK3, but in addition to my questions above, I'd also like to ask if the VTF-3 MK3 is worth the extra $150 over the VTF2 MK3. I know the next room these will be setup in will be bigger, but I doubt it will be a "huge" room like the site says this sub is best for. I'm guessing it will be a "large" room at best. That being said, I plan to have this setup for many, many years to come, so I want to get something with lots of staying power.

[arrrgh]

I don't believe there is such a thing as an overkill when it comes to movie bass. :) Seriously though, even if you have a smaller room you can easily dial back the sub by turning down the gain on the sub's amp. Bass is the toughest part of a movie track to reproduce (especially in a living room) so I usually err on the side of what would commonly be called overkill.

A very rough generalization would be that ported subs like HSU Research VTF-3 MK3 give you more bass feel (better for movies) while sealed subs are more "accurate" (better for music). Though these differences are very small and very hard to hear outside side-to-side comparisons. As long as the sub is well designed and built, both designs work just as well.

The biggest difference between mk2 and mk3 is probably the beefier amp in mk3, mk3 is also heavier so you pay more for shipping.. It really ultimately depends on your budget. A lot also depends on the room, if you have a sealed room, you'll get off with much less than you would if the room opens up to a larger room. If you have medium/large sealed room, I bet that either will do fine.

I have not had a HSU sub personally but AVS forum has a lengthy owner's thread at http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=808485 if you want to read through actual owner experiences. Here is also the official Epik sub thread: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=885079

[goji]

If you can get the RW-12d for 350 it is worth it.

Many of the subs macel posted are actually quite good with the Epik serious enjoying a very healthy cult following. It boils down to your budget and what you feel comfortable in purchasing. And to second macel, there is no overkill in quality bass. Boomy bass however is another thing (problem).

[Jeston Veteran]

Thanks again, goji. My friends and I decided we were going to go on a trip to Vegas in a couple months, so I'm not going to buy anything until after that to make sure I have enough for the trip first. That being said, I should have plenty left after saving for the next couple months, so I will weigh my options again closer to then. I will, however, keep an eye on the prices for some of these and might just jump on one if I find the right price before then, now that I know what I'm looking for ;)