Windows 8 HAS NO START MENU

[TheLegendOfMart]

Ubuntu awaits you.

Christ, do you even have a clue.

My argument is that im going to lose functionality if i dont buy it and your solution to that is to use an OS that is completely incompatible and will lose all functionality????????????????

[KingCrimson]

Christ, do you even have a clue.

My argument is that im going to lose functionality if i dont buy it and your solution to that is to use an OS that is completely incompatible and will lose all functionality????????????????

At least Ubuntu will give you the "classic" UI experience you are used to and can't you just use a Windows 7 VM for everything legacy?

[Calum Veteran]

[. . .]

because they have gone in this Tablet UI direction.

[. . .]

I seriously cannot believe you continue to imply Microsoft are lying when they haven't told us much about Windows 8 and you haven't yet used it :rolleyes: It's concerning that there are people in the world who actually think like this.

[KingCrimson]

Can't we all calm down until the BUILD conference?

[ViperAFK]

At least Ubuntu will give you the "classic" UI experience you are used to and can't you just use a Windows 7 VM for everything legacy?

The classic aero desktop is still included in win8... Clearly shown in the videos you can easily switch between start screen and aero.

[TheLegendOfMart]

At least Ubuntu will give you the "classic" UI experience you are used to and can't you just use a Windows 7 VM for everything legacy?

Again you completely miss the point, i give up.

I seriously cannot believe you continue to imply Microsoft are lying when they haven't told us much about Windows 8 and you haven't yet used it :rolleyes: It's concerning that there are people in the world who actually think like this.

Again with the rolleyes, your 'opinion' isnt any more right than mine is stop acting like you are the foremost authority on all things Windows 8.

You are condescending and belittling me with every post. I know Microsofts track record, i know WP7, all the articles and videos of Windows 8 and the Start Screen and im of the opinion that it is nothing more than a necessity to create some parity between their platforms for the sake of it, there is no logical reason to have a touch orientated UI (and you cant say otherwise despite your protests that Microsoft are great and they know what they are doing) on a desktop computer.

The classic aero desktop is still included in win8... Clearly shown in the videos you can easily switch between start screen and aero.

Yeah but because the start screen is there, wether you can disable it or not, developers are going to actively target this default setup to introduce functionality. A tablet ui on a non touchscreen computer is just ridiculous.

[KingCrimson]

Again you completely miss the point, i give up.

You want a perfect world where nothing changes. I'm suggesting there are always work-arounds for problems. You are the one who doesn't want to listen, just whining.

[Athernar]

It appears you still don't understand my position on this. The tiles are different on each platform; they look different and display different amounts of information. Due to that, I'm not looking at the tiles themselves; I'm looking at the concept. The concept, the feature, the notion of a "live tile" feature. The search feature is a feature, and the live tile feature is a feature. The search feature also has a user interface, but as with the live tile concept, I'm not looking at the user interface; I'm discussing the feature and its usefulness.

Different? Yes. I still don't see how it is at all useful in the context it's being used.

Since you brought up search. I'd like to hear your rationalisation for how "tiles" are at all useful or more efficient for launching applications than the search in Vista/7.

What attempt at a strawman? You erroneously claimed I'm naive in regard to user interface design, so I informed you I'm a designer.

And then you asked what I do. I never asked what you do.

Please, at least try to understand what I'm posting. I am speaking English after all.

:rolleyes: Please, at least try to understand what I'm posting. I am speaking English after all. It would help if you've seen the user interfaces of both Windows 8 and Windows Phone. I assume you haven't because you're erroneously claiming Microsoft are trying to reuse a phone user interface on a desktop operating system :blink: Please, take a look at the user interfaces of both Start Screens. When you do, you'll realise that the user interface of the Windows 8 Start Screen is different enough to the user interface of the Windows Phone Start Screen in order for it to be usable on a desktop PC.

I have, and it isn't.

I'm looking at the concept. The concept, the feature, the notion of a "live tile" feature. I'm not looking at the user interface; I'm discussing the feature and its usefulness.

It's an inferior concept being shoehorned in merely for the sake of it. It provides no benefit in the context of launching applications, and demonstrates a lack of effort in creating a new effective replacement for the aging startmenu.

No, I don't; I agree with that. Just like I agree that the interface of the Windows 8 Start Screen is specifically tailored to scale well on all of the screen sizes it supports. The two user interfaces are different. If you do not understand that, then you're possibly beyond help.

So what -is- the design pricipal/goal of the interface then? Because I've yet to see any use for it in for Windows.

Tiles would make great desktop gadgets/widgets/whatever, but I see no benefit for cramming them into a screen and claiming they're a replacement.

[KingCrimson]

Yeah but because the start screen is there, wether you can disable it or not, developers are going to actively target this default setup to introduce functionality. A tablet ui on a non touchscreen computer is just ridiculous.

Ballmer did say that Win 8 will be the riskiest thing they've ever done. No doubt this is a bold move.

[TheLegendOfMart]

You want a perfect world where nothing changes. I'm suggesting there are always work-arounds for problems. You are the one who doesn't want to listen, just whining.

Before you start slinging insults i suggest you think really really really really really really hard and try and understand what the issues are.

Im not whining im just offering an opposing argument, just because you dont agree with what i say doesnt mean that im some kind of whiner just because there may be alternatives.

[KingCrimson]

So what -is- the design pricipal/goal of the interface then? Because I've yet to see any use for it in for Windows.

Tiles would make great desktop gadgets/widgets/whatever, but I see no benefit for cramming them into a screen and claiming they're a replacement.

Tell me what purpose the current Windows desktop serves with static icons as a "launch pad" for apps? This new start screen is a more dynamic thing that gets you to the apps you need. Remember all apps will be full-screen. Once you launch an app the "live tiles" disappear. You are just too used to the 25 year old UI paradigm. I give Apple credit for that, but ancient is ancient.

[TheLegendOfMart]

Tell me what purpose the current Windows desktop serves with static icons as a "launch pad" for apps? This new start screen is a more dynamic thing that gets you to the apps you need. Remember all apps will be full-screen. Once you launch an app the "live tiles" disappear. You are just too used to the 25 year old UI paradigm. I give Apple credit for that, but ancient is ancient.

Computers are supposed to be multitasking, why the hell would i need a startscreen full of massive icons and when i click one of those icons for an app to run full screen.

This is a ridiculous mentality pandering to the idiotic iPad generation.

Dont gimp my PC usability for the sake of the idiots who dont know how to use a computer.

[Athernar]

Tell me what purpose the current Windows desktop serves with static icons as a "launch pad" for apps? This new start screen is a more dynamic thing that gets you to the apps you need. Remember all apps will be full-screen. Once you launch an app the "live tiles" disappear. You are just too used to the 25 year old UI paradigm. I give Apple credit for that, but ancient is ancient.

Sorry, but hitting the start key, typing the first few letters of the app I want and hitting enter > pointless "tile" interface.

Enjoy your gimmicks if you want, but I'd prefer UI design fitting for the use case and form factor.

[KingCrimson]

Computers are supposed to be multitasking, why the hell would i need a startscreen full of massive icons and when i click one of those icons for an app to run full screen.

This is a ridiculous mentality pandering to the idiotic iPad generation.

Dont gimp my PC usability for the sake of the idiots who dont know how to use a computer.

The phenomenal iPad sales have definitely made MSFT a little crazy. If that's what the consumer wants, you can't blame MSFT for adopting survival strategy.

Sorry, but hitting the start key, typing the first few letters of the app I want and hitting enter > pointless "tile" interface.

Enjoy your gimmicks if you want, but I'd prefer UI design fitting for the use case and form factor.

What makes you think you will have that functionality taken away? I would miss that one. Obviously one of the perks of using a desktop OS is having a full keyboard and using it.

[TheLegendOfMart]

The phenomenal iPad sales have definitely made MSFT a little crazy. If that's what the consumer wants, you can't blame MSFT for adopting survival strategy.

How is introducing a touch ui onto a desktop computer that doesnt have a touchscreen monitor but mouse and keyboard controls going to combat iPad sales, people who want a tablet will buy a tablet.

[KingCrimson]

How is introducing a touch ui onto a desktop computer that doesnt have a touchscreen monitor but mouse and keyboard controls going to combat iPad sales, people who want a tablet will buy a tablet.

MSFT is trying to appeal to the "hip" and "cool" kids. I have no other explanation for it. Just to any Apple store and look at the demographics.

[Woelfel]

How is introducing a touch ui onto a desktop computer that doesnt have a touchscreen monitor but mouse and keyboard controls going to combat iPad sales, people who want a tablet will buy a tablet.

How many times do people have to say it's not a "touch ui"...it's just a UI that also works well for touch input, and yes that is a big difference.

[Athernar]

What makes you think you will have that functionality taken away? I would miss that one. Obviously one of the perks of using a desktop OS is having a full keyboard and using it.

...

This entire thread is about the Start Screen replacing the Start Menu. I shouldn't need to explain that hitting start, then waiting for a fullscreen menu to load, animate in, and then potentially require more clicks or keystrokes to focus a search that might not even be similar (or exist) to the one in Vista/7 is far more inefficient and jarring then simply making a small menu pop up.

I do not want, nor need to be assaulted by a fullscreen collection of tiles each time I just want to launch notepad or etc.

[KingCrimson]

...

This entire thread is about the Start Screen replacing the Start Menu. I shouldn't need to explain that hitting start, then waiting for a fullscreen menu to load, animate in, and then potentially require more clicks or keystrokes to focus a search that might not even be similar (or exist) to the one in Vista/7 is far more inefficient and jarring then simply making a small menu pop up.

I do not want, nor need to be assaulted by a fullscreen collection of tiles each time I just want to launch notepad or etc.

You think MSFT won't notice that during user trials? OTOH, if 90% lurve going to the tiles then that's what wins. Remember most people use the browser and media players, not notepad. You're not thinking like a typical iSheeple.

[Apalis]

IMO, Metro should only belong to phones, tablets and media center. Implementing it on professional PC makes it look like children's toys. The ways they implement it makes it look like they will force upon the users. I don't want my OS to have any social media crap built-in. If I can't find ways to disable it, I will just stick to windows 7. It WILL be another flop :rolleyes:, especially this UI is not even tried and true. WP7 has not even become mainstream yet. Implementing this on a cash cow is simply too risky.

[TheLegendOfMart]

How many times do people have to say it's not a "touch ui"...it's just a UI that also works well for touch input, and yes that is a big difference.

Why were the live tiles created, oh wait for Windows Phone 7, the only reason Windows 8 has this UI is because Microsoft wants a portion of the tablet market, it is PRIMARILY a TOUCH UI, end of story.

[KingCrimson]

IMO, Metro should only belong to phones, tablets and media center. Implementing it on professional PC makes it look like children's toys. The ways they implement it makes it look like they will force upon the users. I don't want my OS to have any social media crap built-in. If I can't find ways to disable it, I will just stick to windows 7. It WILL be another flop :rolleyes:, especially this UI is not even tried and true. WP7 has not even become mainstream yet. Implementing this on a cash cow is simply too risky.

Ballmer is staking his entire reputation on this. The good news is if Win8 flops, the board will finally can monkey boy.

Why were the live tiles created, oh wait for Windows Phone 7, the only reason Windows 8 has this UI is because Microsoft wants a portion of the tablet market, it is PRIMARILY a TOUCH UI, end of story.

If MSFT is smart they will find a way to make the Desktop UI non-intrusive while Metro will be THE Tablet UI.

[+Frank B. Subscriber²]

Um.

Why don't some of you f***ing chill until BUILD, which is when MS are going to share more details about Windows 8? You are arguing over a small preview they've given at AllThings D and tidbits found in old leaked builds which can and will change between the time the leaks were compiled and beta/onwards.

This entire thread is utterly pointless at this stage. Relax, grab a beer or play Minecraft, k?

We now return to the regular 'OS-X-is-so-much-better-than-Windows-no-it's-not' programming....

[KingCrimson]

Um.

Why don't some of you f***ing chill until BUILD, which is when MS are going to share more details about Windows 8? You are arguing over a small preview they've given at AllThings D and tidbits found in old leaked builds which can and will change between the time the leaks were compiled and beta/onwards.

This entire thread is utterly pointless at this stage. Relax, grab a beer or play Minecraft, k?

We now return to the regular 'OS-X-is-so-much-better-than-Windows-no-it's-not' programming....

Hey I'm all for chillin'!

[holori]

By the looks of this, it would be great on my tablet but not so much on my PC. When I upgraded to Windows 7, I expected to use it for almost as long as I used XP, maybe a little less time because of how fast technology is moving, but my rig and its OS keep me very happy. It will be a long while till I get sick of Win7.