Lets hear it! Iimmersive UI (Start Panel) in Windows 8 (Desktop) Good?

[Vice]

How is it any different that what we have now? There's tiles instead of icons. Other than that, what's changed that people hate so much?

The point that we are using a mouse instead of a finger is a pretty big one. The mouse is an incredibly accurate pointing device, much more accurate than a finger. Metro was designed for fingers with its giant squares and large text. The whole point of buying a large display has always been view more stuff at once. Metro throws that out the window and says have a larger everything. Instead of putting 3-4-5 apps on screen lets put two.

Do you see the point now? And I don't hate it, I just want an off switch because the start menu was better for me and I don't need a finger touch UI when I don't own a finger touch display.

[Tharp Daddy]

The point that we are using a mouse instead of a finger is a pretty big one. The mouse is an incredibly accurate pointing device, much more accurate than a finger. Metro was designed for fingers with its giant squares and large text. The whole point of buying a large display has always been view more stuff at once. Metro throws that out the window and says have a larger everything. Instead of putting 3-4-5 apps on screen lets put two.

Do you see the point now? And I don't hate it, I just want an off switch because the start menu was better for me and I don't need a finger touch UI when I don't own a finger touch display.

I was under the impression you can resize tiles as desired, they also showed at CES people running 3+ applications side by side (a mix of metro apps and traditional ones none-the-less). Multitasking and the such is not being removed. You can still have multiple apps visible on the screen, even metro apps.

[PGHammer]

the huge downfall of windows 8 metro UI for me is that i can't do any heavy mutli-tasking that i can do now.

btw, i hate tabbing. :)

In short, you click among the icons on the Taskbar (labelled or not) - basically the same method of *multitasking* that's been used since NT4/9x moved to a common UI.

I have nothing against those that prefer the traditional method (or the traditional UI, for that matter).

My beef is with those that want to *banish* the very idea of UI choice *outside* of enterprises and corporate usage.

I have said - repeatedly - that Metro as a UI isn't for everybody - not even everyone with a touch-screen device. Some folks with the SAMSUNG Series 7 may prefer the customized touch UI overlay that ships with it for use with the Windows 7 UI, for example.

But because I dared speak out in favor of Metro UI - and on a traditional desktop - one would think that I was found in bed - with a nun - in St. Peter's Basilica - by the pope. (In other words, an *ultimate act of heresy*.)

Last I heard, computing isn't a religion. (Neowin has a subforum for religion - completely separate from computing.)

[Ci7]

Last I heard, computing isn't a religion. (Neowin has a subforum for religion - completely separate from computing.)

PS. it is a thread not sub-fourm

[V23]

Because it works.

It not anything to do with being afraid of change, there is "change" and there is going backwards.

The new UI does not make things faster or easier in ANY way at all. It does not belong on a non-touchscreen PC in any form.

The layout of the current Windows desktop is set out to get you where you want to be in as few clicks as possible, there is nothing wrong with it.

You think if they suddenly decided to build cars with the drivers seat facing backwards and wheels on the roof, people should still "Give it a chance" ?

Cars have remained more or less the same layout since the beginning, why? Because it is the best design and easiest way to drive them

The very first car worked but it was improved and upgraded to make things easier (among other things). I actually believe it would be faster to use this UI. You can:

- Press the Windows key to instantly change to the desktop

- Search programs just as quickly as in Windows 7

- Instead of opening up outlook to check if you have any new emails, the outlook live tile will show you at a glance without opening it

Windows 7's UI might (still dubious on this) require less clicks to get to where you want but Windows 8 will give you a lot more information just by glancing at the start screen.

Anyway, let's wait until the Consumer Preview before we dismiss Windows 8 entirely.

[The_Decryptor Veteran]

More information like? I'm sure you could load the start screen up with widgets to show you random bits of information, but you can do the same with Windows 7 as well.

To somebody who doesn't cover their desktop with widgets, the only thing the start screen does is make everything bigger and show less items at once.

Edit: And programs already have the ability to show things like "Number of unread emails" on their icons.

[V23]

More information like?

- New email messages

- Current weather

- Facebook/Twitter updates

- Progress/achievements in a game

- Currently playing song

- How many people on Windows Live Messenger

- Recent Word/Excel/PowerPoint documents

- Current download progress in Firefox/Chrome

Etc. Etc.

[PGHammer]

The very first car worked but it was improved and upgraded to make things easier (among other things). I actually believe it would be faster to use this UI. You can:

- Press the Windows key to instantly change to the desktop

- Search programs just as quickly as in Windows 7

- Instead of opening up outlook to check if you have any new emails, the outlook live tile will show you at a glance without opening it

Windows 7's UI might (still dubious on this) require less clicks to get to where you want but Windows 8 will give you a lot more information just by glancing at the start screen.

Anyway, let's wait until the Consumer Preview before we dismiss Windows 8 entirely.

Hear, hear.

And FYI - not even Henry Ford invented the automobile - the first working *horseless carriage* dates back to - believe it or not - the sixteenth century. (Chase down - using your search engine of choice - Cugnot; he predates Daimler, Mercedes, *and* Benz - let alone Ford - by at least two centuries in the case of the three Germans, and three in the case of Ford. What Ford *did* do - and even Daimler and Benz credit him for it - was use assembly-line techniques to make the automobile far more accessible in terms of budgets.)

And what did the French do when they first saw Cugnot's *horseless carriage*? Those well-intentioned French - through their legislature - promptly banned it.

[techguy77]

- New email messages

- Current weather

- Facebook/Twitter updates

- Progress/achievements in a game

- Currently playing song

- How many people on Windows Live Messenger

- Recent Word/Excel/PowerPoint documents

- Current download progress in Firefox/Chrome

Etc. Etc.

All useless for professional like people, otherwise you will be on iPhone or Droid for all that.

[V23]

All useless for professional like people, otherwise you will be on iPhone or Droid for all that.

I'm confused, are you referring to enterprise? The original desktop is still there as well though, Windows 8 should be the best of both worlds.

[chrisj1968]

Man, why the Metro UI? If this is all they are touting for Windows 8, I'll stick with 7. All I'm seeing is Metro this and Metro that.

[BajiRav]

All useless for professional like people, otherwise you will be on iPhone or Droid for all that.

How about,

- New email messages

- Time/venue of next meeting

- Voicemail and/or missed calls

- Maps showing directions for customer site

- Engineering/enterprise software showing some relevant information but then switches to desktop UI for fully featured UI. (e.g. a collaborative CAD software showing updated designs from team members that allows you to resume your work)

Don't use words that you don't understand. Metro can be incredibly useful for all kinds of applications using enterprise. "Professionals" don't magically require complicated or full-featured UIs, they just need tools to get things done..and quickly.

[remixedcat]

I still think the live tiles may be great for certain enterprise uses, like quick system info, or schedules, or for restaurants (multi uses).

however I am concerned with high information density apps though. they might look cluttered with just text and no chrome to help "put the stuff into neat little shelves" so it's not a jumbled mess..... mabye little lines instead???

now anyone in the food service industry on this forum care to develop an app for W8 metro and care to let us test it? that would be gr8.

[~Johnny]

I still think the live tiles may be great for certain enterprise uses, like quick system info, or schedules, or for restaurants (multi uses).

however I am concerned with high information density apps though. they might look cluttered with just text and no chrome to help "put the stuff into neat little shelves" so it's not a jumbled mess..... mabye little lines instead???

now anyone in the food service industry on this forum care to develop an app for W8 metro and care to let us test it? that would be gr8.

You're perfectly allowed to put some chrome in to help neaten and distinguish things out. A lot of the Microsoft Metro apps, and the sample apps in the developer preview separate things out with boxes or lines. They don't have to follow the design to the letter - but as long as they make a perfectly good Kiosk-style app, that should be good enough.

Though I think in a lot of cases, we'll probably still see people using traditional desktop apps used for a while - if only because most industries are so lazy with re-writing applications, and don't wish to waste the expenditure on writing new ones.

[remixedcat]

ok, because I'm kinda interested in making a restaurant application.

also an app like media jukebox that's more advanced than zune or wmp would be nice to have for the tablet experience as well.

[Dot Matrix]

I can't wait to give the beta a go. It's going to have a nice, real world test, when I throw it onto my laptop for use in school. Not everyone is going to like it, but I still have hopes it's going to work from what I've seen of the new leaks. It's come a long way since the DP, where I did have reservations myself.

[Cereal Bawks]

I don't have an issue with it. Some people are complaining that it covers their whole desktop. I'm not entirely sure what's so offensive about it. When I'm looking for something in the start menu, be it the old roll out or not, I'm focusing on it, not the desktop or it's dumb background picture.

[Chris123NT]

I don't have an issue with it. Some people are complaining that it covers their whole desktop. I'm not entirely sure what's so offensive about it. When I'm looking for something in the start menu, be it the old roll out or not, I'm focusing on it, not the desktop or it's dumb background picture.

I like to watch videos/movies a lot and like them not to be covered up when I click the start button. There should at least be an option to make it where the start screen doesn't take up the whole screen, turn it into a metro style menu for all i care but give me my screen back.

[Cereal Bawks]

Makes sense. I'm on a dual monitor setup, so it never bothered me when I ran WDP for a while.

[Chris123NT]

Makes sense. I'm on a dual monitor setup, so it never bothered me when I ran WDP for a while.

I have dual displays too, but i usually run my chat/twitter client on Monitor 2 so I can see them all the time.

[pack34]

I like to watch videos/movies a lot and like them not to be covered up when I click the start button. There should at least be an option to make it where the start screen doesn't take up the whole screen, turn it into a metro style menu for all i care but give me my screen back.

Or the desktop could dim and blur (similar to when the UAC prompt comes up) and the tiles come in from the side, floating above the desktop.

[techguy77]

How about,

- New email messages

- Time/venue of next meeting

- Voicemail and/or missed calls

- Maps showing directions for customer site

- Engineering/enterprise software showing some relevant information but then switches to desktop UI for fully featured UI. (e.g. a collaborative CAD software showing updated designs from team members that allows you to resume your work)

Don't use words that you don't understand. Metro can be incredibly useful for all kinds of applications using enterprise. "Professionals" don't magically require complicated or full-featured UIs, they just need tools to get things done..and quickly.

People use Droid and iPhone 4 for all this and iPad 2, they are not going to bother with Windows 8 which wont even have Metro interface available at work (disabled). As I said Windows 8 is complete waste of time by MS. You think that most people would want to deal with Metro, hell no? They need to get work done in environment they are familiar with and MS does not understand this. Again, Microsoft didn't give a single demonstration of why Businesses should move to Windows 8. Honestly, i am not sure what's their Market Aim since Windows 7 users especially games don't have reasons to upgrade not to mention Businesses who just upgraded their systems and many of them refuses to go from Windows XP since it works for what they do. All this i said is backed with Market Share data where after so many years Windows 7 just took over by small margin. What Microsoft needs is incremental upgrade to Windows 7 with some basic UI changes (Ribbon interface is fine) since lot of people are familiar with same interface in Office with additional changes in Kernel and enhancements not visible to human eye instead of packing Windows 7 SP2 + Metro into new OS with full blown price. Give me a break... The reason i said they should stick with updated version of Windows 7 is because people are start to like it more and more and MS needs to create good Market Share instead of releasing something completely different ultimately shooting themselves in the foot. As far as Mobile, Tablet market goes, they need to separate that from Desktop and Servers. Metro makes sense on mobile phone as only way to communicate with End Use. Desktop, Servers, and Laptops do not need Metro because since we already have interface called Desktop which perfectly works for home and professional users. I don't want to mention that MS created Metro forgetting all unused space Desktop itself has. I don't want to sound harsh every time but MS has most terrible designers and they all need to be fired along with Steve Ballmer who is driving MS into Oblivion.

[djdanster]

MS should let the Windows 8 Metro interface go the way of longhorn...

It has 0 practicality in the workplace. It's inefficient, and is completely unfamiliar with to the classic Windows shell.

It's also plain stupid on desktops, even with a touchscreen...

OR MS could integrate the metro UI into the classic Windows environment deeper, such as an interactive background. Theres no debating that the taskbar is the easiest and most productive option currently shown!

BTW, I can't wait to see what MS has up their sleeves for the Consumer Preview, and they better pull off something good! I know the Developer Preview was basically an Alpha and not focussing on the UI, I'd be stupid to write it off at this stage!

[BajiRav]

People use Droid and iPhone 4 for all this and iPad 2, they are not going to bother with Windows 8 which wont even have Metro interface available at work (disabled). As I said Windows 8 is complete waste of time by MS. You think that most people would want to deal with Metro, hell no? They need to get work done in environment they are familiar with and MS does not understand this. Again, Microsoft didn't give a single demonstration of why Businesses should move to Windows 8. Honestly, i am not sure what's their Market Aim since Windows 7 users especially games don't have reasons to upgrade not to mention Businesses who just upgraded their systems and many of them refuses to go from Windows XP since it works for what they do. All this i said is backed with Market Share data where after so many years Windows 7 just took over by small margin. What Microsoft needs is incremental upgrade to Windows 7 with some basic UI changes (Ribbon interface is fine) since lot of people are familiar with same interface in Office with additional changes in Kernel and enhancements not visible to human eye instead of packing Windows 7 SP2 + Metro into new OS with full blown price. Give me a break... The reason i said they should stick with updated version of Windows 7 is because people are start to like it more and more and MS needs to create good Market Share instead of releasing something completely different ultimately shooting themselves in the foot. As far as Mobile, Tablet market goes, they need to separate that from Desktop and Servers. Metro makes sense on mobile phone as only way to communicate with End Use. Desktop, Servers, and Laptops do not need Metro because since we already have interface called Desktop which perfectly works for home and professional users. I don't want to mention that MS created Metro forgetting all unused space Desktop itself has. I don't want to sound harsh every time but MS has most terrible designers and they all need to be fired along with Steve Ballmer who is driving MS into Oblivion.

I had a hard time grasping what you said there but isn't Win8 with disabled metro is basically "incremental update of Win7"? So MS has that market cornered. For enterprise market, MS doesn't really care 7 or 8 as long as they sign up for Windows (& office etc). Metro makes good sense for tablets and enterprise tablet market is still untapped even with noticeable inroads by iPad.

Your claim of firing designers responsible for metro is laughable as the UI has been praised even on Win8 (most objections are for desktop use but even critics agree that it makes sense for tablets). The business decision of integrating it all doesn't belong to the designers. What's the point of firing them?