official Windows 8 Consumer Preview Discussion

[.Neo]

You're on a desktop computer. Focus yourself on desktop apps. Let the tablet users focus on the Metro apps. It's really not that complicated. Basically, a touch device won't be big enough to handle more than 2 apps at the same time. The goal of Metro is tablets.

Edit: Man, I missed this kind of back-and-forth on forums. It's been a while... :)

Metro is deployed across all devices as the new default interface. Microsoft isn't targeting it at tablet users alone, they clearly stated those intentions and that's the whole thing. If Windows 8 detects I have a 27-inch screen with a whopping 2560 x 1440 resolution I should be able to have multiple apps open at the same time. In my opinion Metro adapts to larger screens rather poorly.

If you're telling people to just focus on the Windows 8 desktop, you might as well tell them to stick with Windows 7.

[TheLegendOfMart]

Then stay on Windows 7, what's forcing you to use Windows 8? Stick with your Windows Mobile 6 device and let the technology advance. :p

What the frick does WM6 have to do with me not liking Metro?

Microsoft is forcing me to use Windows 8 if I want 'behind the scenes' improvements, App developers will start to target metro and I will lose functionality, eventually Windows 8 will get things Windows 7 won't have, seriously do you guys ever engage your brain or are you blind to all criticisms of Windows 8 and Metro where you can only reply in "lol dont use it then troloololololloll".

[Calum Veteran]

After playing around with the CP for a while now, the main thing that annoys me is the inconsistency of how to scroll to the right and left.

Sometimes you can just run your cursor to the edge of the screen (like in the start screen)

Sometimes you can use the side of your trackpad (up or down) to scroll horizontally

And then yet on other times you have to use the horizontal part of the trackpad or the keys to make it scroll

Hope that in the RC you can always just go to the edge of the screen to scroll, I think I like that the best

Yeah, this annoys me. I would like to be able to just move my mouse toward the edge of the screen in any app, to move across, like I can on the Start screen.

[Calum Veteran]

[. . .]

Microsoft is forcing me to use Windows 8 if I want 'behind the scenes' improvements, App developers will start to target metro and I will lose functionality, eventually Windows 8 will get things Windows 7 won't have [. . .]

Of course. But Microsoft can't please everyone. If Microsoft had developed Windows 8 to be the way you'd like it, they'd have probably lost me as a customer. As I say, they can't please everyone.

[playXray]

Of course. But Microsoft can't please everyone. If Microsoft had developed Windows 8 to be the way you'd like it, they'd lose me as a customer. As I say, they can't please everyone.

I just don't buy the "can't please everyone" line with Windows 8. Often that's true, but there are so many people complaining about how unintuitive and user-unfriendly Windows 8 is, that they're hardly pleasing anyone at all.

[TheLegendOfMart]

Of course. But Microsoft can't please everyone. If Microsoft had developed Windows 8 to be the way you'd like it, they'd lose me as a customer. As I say, they can't please everyone.

Why does it have to be either, or?

There is no physical or technical reason why it can't have both a Metro version and a 'Legacy' version of the UI, let the ones that want it enable Metro, the ones that don't continue to use Legacy UI.

It doesnt make any sense to **** off all the legacy UI crowd just to try and take a bite of the Apple pie (no pun). Metro doesnt work on a desktop no matter how many videos they put out saying "omg we havent forgotten about you, look how awesome we have emulated touch navigation and transplated it onto a mouse".

The very fact that they now consider the Desktop a Metro App just shows you the direction they are going.

[efjay]

Sad to see so many "techies" feigning ignorance because they don't like Metro. For one, I have never worked at a corporation where a major software change has not been made known to users well in advance as well as documentation on the new features and when the upgrade occurs it staff were walking the floors to assist users. Lets just keep up the fud and ignore the fact this is still beta and any benefits the OS brings. Microsoft should not move forward and allow the competition to take over the market.

[Stoffel]

I just don't buy the "can't please everyone" line with Windows 8. Often that's true, but there are so many people complaining about how unintuitive and user-unfriendly Windows 8 is, that they're hardly pleasing anyone at all.

Most of the people trying out Win 8 right now are the more experienced pc users, they usually have been playing around with PC's forever and for the first time in 17 years they might have to change their way of doing things, and they don't like it.

Most people these days have a pc at home but if they pick up a tablet they get around pretty fast.

I believe that the same thing will be true for Win8. You just got to start with a fresh open mind set and don't try to think, this is different to Win7 so I don't like it

[br0adband]

OK, why the hell does one of my computers show Seattle Weather (I don't know how to change this to something useful!!) and the other shows the weather of the city I am actually in? Any ideas? EDIT: Uninstalled it because I couldn't find a way to remove Seattle

You give up way too easily, really.

Open Weather, right click to get the options menu, choose Places. Add a new location (type a city name and state abbreviation or whatever, doesn't seem to work with zip codes yet), when the new location is listed, right click on it and make it the default - then you can remove what was the default previously.

I mean really... people, this is new stuff basically, there ARE ways to get things done, it's just going to take time for them to become habitual.

[bandit_liberty_rumble]

By the way, what is the advantage to getting rid of shadows for background windows? :s

I like that they reduced the size of the borders though.

[br0adband]

I just don't buy the "can't please everyone" line with Windows 8. Often that's true, but there are so many people complaining about how unintuitive and user-unfriendly Windows 8 is, that they're hardly pleasing anyone at all.

What that actually means is the same thing I've been saying for years now, pretty much since Vista was first mentioned and seen in screenshots:

People don't like change.

Yes, they can and do adapt as time passes, and then some aspects become completely habitual and performed by rote and not even conscious thought anymore. But whenever something new comes down the line, we get the same crap every time: people moaning and whining for days if not weeks after a beta or preview of the next version of "whatever" comes out, and then after it quiets down a little, the same people that were moaning and whining put more time and effort into the new version and wham, suddenly they have their epiphanies and big moments of "A-HA!!! NOW I GET IT!!!" and suddenly it's not such a bad thing anymore.

This has all happened before, folks, and it will happen again many more times in your lives. This is not a new thing.

It's basic humanity and people disliking change, in almost any form it comes in.

You'll figure it out.

[Detection]

Anyone worked out a way to get the Mail app to make a sound when you get an email ?

[br0adband]

Sad to see so many "techies" feigning ignorance because they don't like Metro. For one, I have never worked at a corporation where a major software change has not been made known to users well in advance as well as documentation on the new features and when the upgrade occurs it staff were walking the floors to assist users. Lets just keep up the fud and ignore the fact this is still beta and any benefits the OS brings. Microsoft should not move forward and allow the competition to take over the market.

Windows has roughly 90% market share, held for 25+ years now, at best that is changing about .5% per year even with the popularity of Macs nowadays (not that Mountain Lion is being seen as a good thing so far from user opinions). Linux? Don't even, it's irrelevant in terms of consumers and will always be relegated to developers and enthusiasts of which the barely-there 1% share exists.

Windows isn't going anywhere anytime soon. It has no competition to speak of, it never will.

Also, don't confuse the fact that Microsoft is a software company and Apple is a hardware company - they're still not in direct competition with each other in that respect. The only products they've ever had that directly competed are the Microsoft Zunes and the Apple iPods.

[Glen]

Now here's a beautiful example of how many people will react. They'll see something new, and freak out.

Here's the thing: it's all the same, but it has extra features that you will get used to.

Firstly, you should really read up on Windows 8. You've really missed a lot.

1) That is the Start Screen, and those boxes are Live Tiles which update over time with the contents of the app. For example, the Mail tile will change when you get a new email.

2) There is no need for a start button. a) it's on your keyboard, where it's always been. b) That pixel in the very corner is all you need. When you aim to click on the Start button in Windows 7, where does your cursor travel? To the very corner.

3) Because not everyone is used to using the button on the keyboard. Besides, where else would they click to get to the start screen?

4) Yes, by adding a 'Show Desktop' link into your 'Startup' list. Hopefully there'll be an easier way to do this in the future, for those that require the desktop prominently.

5) There is a LOT they've changed. Windows Explorer has a ribbon, the Task Manager is a lot more user-friendly and there are many back-end improvements that will improve your experience over time.

6) There are shortcuts for everything. Windows Key + I may help you there, look at the bottom.

The improvements are primarily for touch, for now. Windows 7 is almost perfect for normal desktop use, but is a pain on tablets. Microsoft needs a way to fight the iPads, and this is it. Spend some time with Windows 8. Learn your way around it. Then you'll learn to love it.

While I agree with some of your points, I'd like to point out a few other things:

1) The default start screen (not the 'all apps' screen), is like the initial state of the start menu with the addition of live tiles. Just like the start menu, you can search by just typing when it's showing, and also just like the start menu, you can switch between favorites (or most used in Vista/7) and all applications. The live tiles are a nice touch, but won't be useful to everybody.

2) The is a need for the start button (IMO). Instead of relying on users learning mouse tricks to reveal functionality, there should be icons / buttons to access those areas of the OS as well. A new start button on the desktop could show the start screen when clicked, thereby giving it familiar functionality for those that are used to previous version of windows. This just makes sense from a usability perspective.

3) See #2

4) Agreed, and hopefully MS will put back the little button on the right of the task bar that people have been using in Win7. Again, user experience that makes sense.

5) Also worth mentioning that boot times are faster and everything appears to be much more fluid in the UI, both in Metro and the desktop environments.

6) Keyboard shortcuts are great (I personally use them most of the time), but they aren't intuitive to many computer users who are mouse oriented and neither are the right-click, move-to-the-edge mouse tricks. Having an icon / button somewhere on every screen to access functionality would be a better user experience.

I agree with you and many others that the more you work with Windows 8, the more you learn to like (or love) it's way of doing things. When I used the developer preview, my initial impressions were not good. Now with the CP, I'm seeing much more potential, but I still believe that it needs a bit more tweaking to be a usable desktop / laptop OS for the masses.

[King Lizzle]

That's the thing though, a lot of us like Metro and find it very usable, even on a desktop with no touch input.

There is a little learning curve, but once you get it, it's no different then getting things done in Win7

Some people will like it and want to use it, others won't. It's all down to personal preference and I don't have a problem with people thinking either way. All MS need do is give everyone an option to choose the method they prefer - a simple toggle to click in the post-OS installation first use options. That way everyone wins and MS actually has a "no compromises" OS which will sell well on desktop.

[playXray]

What that actually means is the same thing I've been saying for years now, pretty much since Vista was first mentioned and seen in screenshots:

People don't like change.

Yes, they can and do adapt as time passes, and then some aspects become completely habitual and performed by rote and not even conscious thought anymore. But whenever something new comes down the line, we get the same crap every time: people moaning and whining for days if not weeks after a beta or preview of the next version of "whatever" comes out, and then after it quiets down a little, the same people that were moaning and whining put more time and effort into the new version and wham, suddenly they have their epiphanies and big moments of "A-HA!!! NOW I GET IT!!!" and suddenly it's not such a bad thing anymore.

This has all happened before, folks, and it will happen again many more times in your lives. This is not a new thing.

It's basic humanity and people disliking change, in almost any form it comes in.

You'll figure it out.

Here's the thing: I agree with you. People don't like change. People go mental every time there's a Facebook update. People went crazy over the new ribbon interface for Office. The problem is, I don't consider myself one of those people. I have been in favour of almost every major Windows update since 98. I have almost always found Facebook's updates to be great (except when they took away the option to show statuses chronologically - which they soon put back!). I love the new iOS every time it comes out. I love the ribbon interface of Office. In short, I don't tend to be one of these "I hate change" people, and I consider myself to be someone who embraces change.

However...

MS seem to have made a few very poor choices with Windows 8. Number one: Metro. Number two: removing the start button.

Now you accuse all the people who don't like Windows 8 of being people who "don't like change". I would fire that back on you. You, and all the other people who think the Metro/Start menu removal are positive changes, are people who like change for the sake of change. MS need to wake up and smell the coffee - there are too many people who don't like the new Windows 8 interface for it to simply be the usual moaners.

[King Lizzle]

Then stay on Windows 7, what's forcing you to use Windows 8? Stick with your Windows Mobile 6 device and let the technology advance. :p

Windows 8 actually brings some important UI and performance improvements to the desktop (lthough I'm not sure those changes necessitate a new OS version - a Service Pack would probably be suffice). It's a shame if desktop users have to miss out on that just because MS refuses to be flexible and give everyone a choice as to whether to have the Metro UI enabled.

Metro is deployed across all devices as the new default interface. Microsoft isn't targeting it at tablet users alone, they clearly stated those intentions and that's the whole thing. If Windows 8 detects I have a 27-inch screen with a whopping 2560 x 1440 resolution I should be able to have multiple apps open at the same time. In my opinion Metro adapts to larger screens rather poorly.

If you're telling people to just focus on the Windows 8 desktop, you might as well tell them to stick with Windows 7.

Agreed. I do my computing on a 40" screen which works great for the traditional desktop, but in the Metro UI there is an incredible amount of wasted and un-utilised space.

[Detection]

MS live in the future, they already know what they release will work UI wise, we don't because we don't have their time machine

They have already tested it and know it will work, it always does.... most of the time anyway :D

[King Lizzle]

Microsoft is forcing me to use Windows 8 if I want 'behind the scenes' improvements, App developers will start to target metro and I will lose functionality, eventually Windows 8 will get things Windows 7 won't have, seriously do you guys ever engage your brain or are you blind to all criticisms of Windows 8 and Metro where you can only reply in "lol dont use it then troloololololloll".

I don't think Metro apps will ever replace desktop applications. Developers may have a stripped down Metro version install alongside the main desktop app but it will be more supplementary as opposed to being a replacement. I can't see there ever being the demand for a full switch to Metro. I tend to think of Metro apps and the MS Store as their Win tablet equivalent of the Apple App Store for iPad - simple apps designed to run on much less powerful hardware for casual/portable computing.

Why does it have to be either, or?

There is no physical or technical reason why it can't have both a Metro version and a 'Legacy' version of the UI, let the ones that want it enable Metro, the ones that don't continue to use Legacy UI.

Sorry, common sense isn't allowed when talking about Win 8/Metro. Go sit on the naughty step! :D

[Cereal Bawks]

Does Windows Server 8 come with a Go Live license, i.e. can be deployed in actual use? Are the on-disk formats of ReFS and Storage Spaces stable, or will be upgraded seamlessly with RC and final?

Does anyone know? Without a proper beta, it's hard to find out, since there's no MSFT people to get an answer from.

[br0adband]

4) Agreed, and hopefully MS will put back the little button on the right of the task bar that people have been using in Win7. Again, user experience that makes sense.

It's still there as you can plainly see that little "gap" - of course, I use my Taskbar on the left side of the screen since the Taskbar actually works properly when placed on the side since Windows 7 but that's just me.

But the "Show Desktop" functionality is there as it has been since Vista.

[Glen]

It's still there as you can plainly see that little "gap" - of course, I use my Taskbar on the left side of the screen since the Taskbar actually works properly when placed on the side since Windows 7 but that's just me.

But the "Show Desktop" functionality is there as it has been since Vista.

I have my taskbar on the top of the screen (like I do in Win7), and the "gap" button was not obvious like it is in Win7. I'll have to look again when I boot back into the CP.

[BeerFan]

Does anyone else feel like this OS should have been called "Windows 7 - Tablet" or "Win7 - Touch"? I'm enjoying testing out the CP. But to me, everything about it, aside from the Start screen, is so very much like windows 7 that I don't think it warrants being called an entirely new OS. It's more like an adaptation of windows 7 for devices with touchscreen interfaces. Just my $.02 (And yes, I know it's still in the pre-release stages.)

[Muhammad Farrukh]

Okay, this is really, really frustrating.

I am currently browsing Neowin and another forums, and no matter what I click, I get logged out and redirected to homepage.

Any kind of link. Any kind, is redirected to homepage.

Tried IE, Chrome and Opera.

Works for a little time, and then its back to it.

Anyone?

[encarta]

Here's the thing: I agree with you. People don't like change. People go mental every time there's a Facebook update. People went crazy over the new ribbon interface for Office. The problem is, I don't consider myself one of those people. I have been in favour of almost every major Windows update since 98. I have almost always found Facebook's updates to be great (except when they took away the option to show statuses chronologically - which they soon put back!). I love the new iOS every time it comes out. I love the ribbon interface of Office. In short, I don't tend to be one of these "I hate change" people, and I consider myself to be someone who embraces change.

However...

MS seem to have made a few very poor choices with Windows 8. Number one: Metro. Number two: removing the start button.

Now you accuse all the people who don't like Windows 8 of being people who "don't like change". I would fire that back on you. You, and all the other people who think the Metro/Start menu removal are positive changes, are people who like change for the sake of change. MS need to wake up and smell the coffee - there are too many people who don't like the new Windows 8 interface for it to simply be the usual moaners.

I totally agree with everything you've said. I've been using computers for the last 25 years (since I was 5) and Win8 was the first OS where I could think nothing but WHAT THE F*CK IS THIS CRAP? Microsoft still have time to make some drastic changes. So chop, chop, back to the old drawing board.