Finally joining Club SSD

By shiven
in Hardware Hangout

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Grand Master

strekship

Posted
Posted

I have both the Plextor M3 128GB (in the desktop) and the Crucial M4 (in my laptop). I can't really do a good comparison since the laptop is Sata II and the desktop is Sata III, but they are both sufficiently fast. Even crippled by Sata II, the M4 in my laptop is way faster than the crappy Seagate 320gb 7200rpm drive it replaced.

Veteran

NextGen_Gamer

Posted
Posted

As a new owner of the 128GB Vertex 4 (see my thread here) I have to say that it is a no-brainer to buy it. Right now it is only $149.99 at Newegg.com, but it includes a $15 gift card with it.

For those that don't know, the Vertex 4 is based on an updated design of the same Marvell controller that is in the Crucial M4 SSDs. OCZ was stretching the truth a bit when they said it was Indilinx Everest 2 based. But although the controller is pretty much the same, the firmware is 100% OCZ designed, and that is what truly counts. Like others already mentioned, the new v1.4 firmware doubles the write performance of the 128GB drive, which puts it in a class of its own. It is quite simply the world's fastest 128GB solid state drive right now.

As far the as the firmware update process goes, I will say that is pretty bad, but not something that should deter you from buying it. The whole process shouldn't take more than 15 minutes, but it is not user friendly. And you will need to update it as I just bought my Vertex 4 on Monday last week and they are still shipping with v1.3 firmware. Firstly, it is a destructive update, meaning all data on the drive will be destroyed. This won't matter to you, but should be mentioned. Secondly, the OCZ SSD ToolBox tool has to be run from a Windows PC to do the update. So before you go destroying your current setup, you'll first need to plug in your Vertex 4 into a spare SATA port on your motherboard, boot into Windows using your current VelociRapter, and run the OCZ update tool from there. Thirdly, the tool has problems running with Intel's ACHI SATA drivers, so you will need to into your Device Manager, locate your IDE ATAPI section, find your Intel ACHI SATA controller, right-click and select Update Drivers, select Browse My Computer..., then select Let Me Pick.., and finally select the Standard ACHI 1.0 SATA Controller driver. I've included a screenshot below showing you. You will need to restart after doing this. Be sure that after the update the process is done you switch back to the Intel ACHI driver from the standard one. And finally, after you run the tool it will say update completed successfully, but sometimes the update doesn't "stay" properly. So after updating the SSD firmware, you should fully shut-down your computer (don't just restart), let it stay powered-down for about 60 seconds, and then turn it back on. You can run OCZ's tool once more just to verify your firmware version.

If you do everything above correctly, you'll install v1.4 no problems :)

post-58800-0-56885800-1338164652_thumb.j

Mentor

shiven

Posted
  • Author
Posted

As a new owner of the 128GB Vertex 4 (see my thread here) I have to say that it is a no-brainer to buy it. Right now it is only $149.99 at Newegg.com, but it includes a $15 gift card with it.

For those that don't know, the Vertex 4 is based on an updated design of the same Marvell controller that is in the Crucial M4 SSDs. OCZ was stretching the truth a bit when they said it was Indilinx Everest 2 based. But although the controller is pretty much the same, the firmware is 100% OCZ designed, and that is what truly counts. Like others already mentioned, the new v1.4 firmware doubles the write performance of the 128GB drive, which puts it in a class of its own. It is quite simply the world's fastest 128GB solid state drive right now.

As far the as the firmware update process goes, I will say that is pretty bad, but not something that should deter you from buying it. The whole process shouldn't take more than 15 minutes, but it is not user friendly. And you will need to update it as I just bought my Vertex 4 on Monday last week and they are still shipping with v1.3 firmware. Firstly, it is a destructive update, meaning all data on the drive will be destroyed. This won't matter to you, but should be mentioned. Secondly, the OCZ SSD ToolBox tool has to be run from a Windows PC to do the update. So before you go destroying your current setup, you'll first need to plug in your Vertex 4 into a spare SATA port on your motherboard, boot into Windows using your current VelociRapter, and run the OCZ update tool from there. Thirdly, the tool has problems running with Intel's ACHI SATA drivers, so you will need to into your Device Manager, locate your IDE ATAPI section, find your Intel ACHI SATA controller, right-click and select Update Drivers, select Browse My Computer..., then select Let Me Pick.., and finally select the Standard ACHI 1.0 SATA Controller driver. I've included a screenshot below showing you. You will need to restart after doing this. Be sure that after the update the process is done you switch back to the Intel ACHI driver from the standard one. And finally, after you run the tool it will say update completed successfully, but sometimes the update doesn't "stay" properly. So after updating the SSD firmware, you should fully shut-down your computer (don't just restart), let it stay powered-down for about 60 seconds, and then turn it back on. You can run OCZ's tool once more just to verify your firmware version.

If you do everything above correctly, you'll install v1.4 no problems :)

post-58800-0-56885800-1338164652_thumb.j

Wow, this is great! I'm probably going to end up going with the Vertex 4 (sorry all you M4'ers out there :p), so this will definitely come in handy! Thanks so much!

Grand Master

TheLegendOfMart

Posted
Posted

In a word - reliability - Crucial's track record is as good as the most reliable SSD makers. OCZ on the other hand have a reputation that suffered horribly through using SandForce controllers. With the recent price changes, the M4 is a very compelling offering.

Seriously???

So you shouldn't buy an SSD that has an updated version of the Marvell controller you suggest in an inferior drive just because some of the manufacturers previous drives used a Sandforce controller?!?!?!

Grand Master

spaceelf

Posted
Posted

It can be faster. Nothing is totally instant and until it is, it can be faster. I am pretty sure there isn't a single SSD in the world that makes things instant. I guess a PCIe based SSD would be better but still not instant.

The funny part is, the first Revo (which I own) is both lacking in TRIM and Windows detects it as an HD.

I think they cleared up everything with Revo3 at any rate.

Grand Master

neo1911

Posted
Posted

Guys, me too joined the club. Got myself a Corsair GT 120GB. It went in my 2010 MBP. I noticed increased responsiveness straight away in OSX Lion as well as Windows 7 X64. But speed tests indicate Maximum read/write speeds of 252/164 mBps only? The packaging had this huge ass sticker which mentions read/write speeds of 500/500 mBps. What gives?

Its on latest firmware and looks like the controller on my MBP is Sata2 and AHCI is not enabled. Bugger!!!!

Grand Master

+Fahim S. MVC

Posted
  • MVC
Posted

Seriously???

So you shouldn't buy an SSD that has an updated version of the Marvell controller you suggest in an inferior drive just because some of the manufacturers previous drives used a Sandforce controller?!?!?!

No - I wouldn't buy an SSD built by a manufacturer based upon my perception of the quality of their previous (now obsolete) product. Especially given that other manufacturers also released SandForce drives that didn't suffer from the same issues, or in fact any issues. This to me speaks volumes in terms of OCZ's ability to engineer, test and release to market a quality product - doesn't matter what hardware they are using.

The M4 might be inferior to the OCZ product in performance - although I would argue the performance difference would be negligible - Crucial products certainly are not inferior in terms of quality. I have far better things to spend my time on than dealing with RMAing my purchases in the hope of a small performance gain - so reliability always beats performance to me.

I am not recommending either product - the OP has to make his own decision. I am just offering my perspective.

Grand Master

Noir Angel

Posted
Posted

Unfortunately the comments about the SF-2281 drives are correct.

When I built my rig I purchased a 60 gig OCZ Agility 3, and whilst it's still miles faster than a mechanical hard drive, random reads and writes aren't amazing and I don't get the instant on effect some people with higher end SSD's get. As I only purchased it as a boot drive it suits my needs but if you're going to use your drive for other things I can only +1 the recommendation to avoid Sandforce drives.

Mentor

shiven

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Unfortunately the comments about the SF-2281 drives are correct.

When I built my rig I purchased a 60 gig OCZ Agility 3, and whilst it's still miles faster than a mechanical hard drive, random reads and writes aren't amazing and I don't get the instant on effect some people with higher end SSD's get. As I only purchased it as a boot drive it suits my needs but if you're going to use your drive for other things I can only +1 the recommendation to avoid Sandforce drives.

I've still yet to order this drive for some reason. The OCZ V4 has an Indilinx controller, right? Not Sandforce?

Grand Master

Astra.Xtreme

Posted
Posted

Vertex 4 is definitely a great SSD. I personally have two Vertex 3 in raid 0 and they are blazing fast.

Honestly, between the Vertex 4, Vertex 3, and M4, you really won't see a serious difference between the realworld speeds. If one is significantly cheaper than the other, then just go with it.

I bought both of my 120GB Vertex 3 drives for $100 each, so if you can find it close to that, I'd say definitely go with it.

Grand Master

LaP

Posted
Posted

I have a vertex 3 128M and honestly i did not have any problems with it. The price was awesome i think it was 120$ CAD. I did not get it at lauch tough only 6 months ago and i updated it to the last firmware before installing windows. I never buy products at lauch it's always a bad idea even from reliable companies.

I don't think there's going to be much of a difference between M4 and Vertex 4 for real life usage. If M4 is 50$ less and is well rated by reviewers then i would go for this one.

But i don't think you can go wrong with a vertex 4 either.

Mentor

shiven

Posted
  • Author
Posted

After quite a bit of cogitation, I have ordered the Vertex 4! In the end, it came down a variety of factors: warranty, reviews/benchmarks, controller, and of course, cost/value relationship (which may seem ironic). Thanks to everyone who helped me, and I'll re-post an assessment here once I've installed the drive. :)

Grand Master

Noir Angel

Posted
Posted

I've still yet to order this drive for some reason. The OCZ V4 has an Indilinx controller, right? Not Sandforce?

Correct, the Agility series are budget drives, the Vertex 4 indeed does have an indillix controller. It's far better than the drive I have

Grand Master

neo1911

Posted
Posted

^^

7200RPM 500Gb 2.5" Seagate drive.

The Force GT is definitely faster but not as instant what everyone claims SSDs are.

Installing Windows 7 takes 20 min (starting from setup screen next to drive partition) on Seagate while it takes 18 min on Corsair Force GT.

Speeds have settled to 140 mBps write and 230 mBps read which is a far cry compared to 550/550 write/read printed on the packaging.

TRIM is enabled by default in Windows and can be enabled using a utility in OSX ML DP3.2.

Things holding me back:

1. AHCI is disabled and needs some MBR patching, hackery in OSX and lot of registry tweaks in Windows. What a load of Bull.

2. 2010 MBP is Sata2 @ 3Gbps (Now confirmed by me) which is a bit of a downer.

Need to throw the whole laptop in bin and start from scratch for best possible experience I guess.

SSDs being more expensive in India is a nice cherry on top. (I got it for Rs. 10150 or ~ $180 and it retails for $129 in US on Amazon or Newegg)

Veteran

NextGen_Gamer

Posted
Posted

^^

7200RPM 500Gb 2.5" Seagate drive.

The Force GT is definitely faster but not as instant what everyone claims SSDs are.

Installing Windows 7 takes 20 min (starting from setup screen next to drive partition) on Seagate while it takes 18 min on Corsair Force GT.

Speeds have settled to 140 mBps write and 230 mBps read which is a far cry compared to 550/550 write/read printed on the packaging.

TRIM is enabled by default in Windows and can be enabled using a utility in OSX ML DP3.2.

Things holding me back:

1. AHCI is disabled and needs some MBR patching, hackery in OSX and lot of registry tweaks in Windows. What a load of Bull.

2. 2010 MBP is Sata2 @ 3Gbps (Now confirmed by me) which is a bit of a downer.

Need to throw the whole laptop in bin and start from scratch for best possible experience I guess.

SSDs being more expensive in India is a nice cherry on top. (I got it for Rs. 10150 or ~ $180 and it retails for $129 in US on Amazon or Newegg)

Yeah, you're definitely being held back. I built a PC for my friend about 9 months ago - it had a Core i7 2600K and 256GB Crucial M4 SSD. I believe Windows 7 took around 7 minutes to install.

The new computer I just built for work has a Core i7 3770S and 128GB Vertex 4, and Windows 7 installed in 4 minutes, 33 seconds. I should have recorded it with my phone instead of just timing it - oh well. Part of the reason for the speed-up on my "Ivy Bridge"/V4 versus my friend's "Sandy Bridge"/M4 setup is that I installed Win7 from a Patriot Supersonic USB 3.0 drive. So it was the most ideal install setup you could have (super-fast CPU, super-fast SSD, super-fast USB 3.0 install media).

Mentor

shiven

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Yeah, you're definitely being held back. I built a PC for my friend about 9 months ago - it had a Core i7 2600K and 256GB Crucial M4 SSD. I believe Windows 7 took around 7 minutes to install.

The new computer I just built for work has a Core i7 3770S and 128GB Vertex 4, and Windows 7 installed in 4 minutes, 33 seconds. I should have recorded it with my phone instead of just timing it - oh well. Part of the reason for the speed-up on my "Ivy Bridge"/V4 versus my friend's "Sandy Bridge"/M4 setup is that I installed Win7 from a Patriot Supersonic USB 3.0 drive. So it was the most ideal install setup you could have (super-fast CPU, super-fast SSD, super-fast USB 3.0 install media).

Just popped into my head: How much does the emptiness/fullness of the drive affect the speed? For example, when I get my SSD, I won't be doing a cold install. I'm going to transfer my entire drive (80GB used) to it. It shouldn't be noticeable, right?

Grand Master

Noir Angel

Posted
Posted

The Corsair GT 120GB drive I am using has not substantially improved my boot times. What a pure unadulterated waste of money! :(

With my Agility 3, my boot time decreased from about 45 to 25 seconds, which whilst an improvement isn't the mammoth "almost instant on" that some people are reporting. From what I heard the higher capacity drives are a lot faster than the slower ones.

Just popped into my head: How much does the emptiness/fullness of the drive affect the speed? For example, when I get my SSD, I won't be doing a cold install. I'm going to transfer my entire drive (80GB used) to it. It shouldn't be noticeable, right?

Very little. SSD's don't suffer from any of the problems that inhibit the performance of mechanical hard disks so although it's still advisable to keep a little space free for system writes, having a full drive won't really degrade performance too much.

Grand Master

Astra.Xtreme

Posted
Posted

^^

7200RPM 500Gb 2.5" Seagate drive.

The Force GT is definitely faster but not as instant what everyone claims SSDs are.

Installing Windows 7 takes 20 min (starting from setup screen next to drive partition) on Seagate while it takes 18 min on Corsair Force GT.

Speeds have settled to 140 mBps write and 230 mBps read which is a far cry compared to 550/550 write/read printed on the packaging.

TRIM is enabled by default in Windows and can be enabled using a utility in OSX ML DP3.2.

Things holding me back:

1. AHCI is disabled and needs some MBR patching, hackery in OSX and lot of registry tweaks in Windows. What a load of Bull.

2. 2010 MBP is Sata2 @ 3Gbps (Now confirmed by me) which is a bit of a downer.

Need to throw the whole laptop in bin and start from scratch for best possible experience I guess.

SSDs being more expensive in India is a nice cherry on top. (I got it for Rs. 10150 or ~ $180 and it retails for $129 in US on Amazon or Newegg)

Well if you don't have a SATA 3 port, you'll definitely be holding back about half of the potential speed. But it still sounds like it's a little on the slow side.

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