Microsoft: Apple has it wrong, it's a PC+ era

[.Neo]

How can anybody say MS is lacking direction or vision

#3

[Melfster]

For me it's a symbol of what's wrong with Microsoft lately: They lack a clear vision.

No they do have a clear vision. Its 3 screens and the cloud stategy. The problem they have currently is implementation. If you think of it the heart of Windows is Win32/64 apps. Sure there is .Net but the performance of these apps is simple not at same level as apps running as apps written in c++. WinRT Metro apps are answer to drive forward the platform. Its really immature at this point but it is part of their strategy.

[DeadEndAccount]

How are such stupid people allowed to have accounts on Neowin. The Post-PC world does not mean that PC's are going to disappear but rather they're no longer going to be the centre of the universe - the cloud is is now the centre and the desktop/laptop/tablet/phone are but one of many devices that will interact with the cloud and keep things synced between all the devices connected to said cloud.

As for Surface - no isn't going to replace every PC in the world just as laptops haven't replaced every desktop and just as every server hasn't suddenly made mainframes obsolete. There will be certain end users where Surface can replace their laptop for all their day to day work such as those who simply use their computer to send emails, surf the net, update their Facebook and twitter feed, maybe skype some friends online, and write the occasional document. Those people will be happy and served well with the Surface but there will still be people who need a fully kitted out desktop, laptop or workstation to do their work as well - sorry but the PC isn't going anywhere, it is staying right here along side the smart phones that the very same idiots claimed would one day replace laptops but never did.

No they do have a clear vision. Its 3 screens and the cloud stategy. The problem they have currently is implementation. If you think of it the heart of Windows is Win32/64 apps. Sure there is .Net but the performance of these apps is simple not at same level as apps running as apps written in c++. WinRT Metro apps are answer to drive forward the platform. Its really immature at this point but it is part of their strategy.

There wouldn't be this problem if Microsoft provided a complete WinRT stack so that you can write Metro and traditional desktop applications using the framework. If they rocked up to the developers and said, "yes, here is a new framework - you can write your traditional applications using it as well as Metro style ones" the response would have been a lot more positive. The reality is that the complaints I have heard from win32 developers is that there is no path forward for those applications that simply cannot be written using the Metro style language and thus they feel as though the desktop side of the platform has been ignored at the expense of chasing after Apple.

I can promise you all those people with an ipad have at least 1 PC in their home. In my case, my work ipad is joined by my work laptop, home PC and home laptop. So I would say PC+ era is dead on.

Who are you replying to? use the quote function rather than just throwing a random comment out there which is devoid of context. The way you were phrasing it sounded like you were replying to me - but how do I know if you don't quote?

[selphj]

I can promise you all those people with an ipad have at least 1 PC in their home. In my case, my work ipad is joined by my work laptop, home PC and home laptop. So I would say PC+ era is dead on.

[.Neo]

No they do have a clear vision. Its 3 screens and the cloud stategy. The problem they have currently is implementation. If you think of it the heart of Windows is Win32/64 apps. Sure there is .Net but the performance of these apps is simple not at same level as apps running as apps written in c++. WinRT Metro apps are answer to drive forward the platform. Its really immature at this point but it is part of their strategy.

My point is that Microsoft failed at anticipating three key markets: Music (iPod, iTunes Store), Smartphones for the masses (iPhone) and new generation of tablets (iPad). Microsoft's response to this was at first denial and then simply reactive when they turned out to be wrong.

[siah1214]

iPad sale figures beg to differ. Anyway, I also seem to remember this one:

Steve Ballmer was right, no one wanted a $500 phone. It didn't take off until carrier subsidies brought the price levels down to $2-300.

[redfish]

iPad sale figures beg to differ. Anyway, I also seem to remember this one:

Hrm...

M [Walt Mossberg]: A lot of people think given the success youive had with portable devices, you should be making a tablet or a PDA.

J [steve Jobs]: There are no plans to make a tablet. It turns out people want keyboards. When Apple first started out, "People couldnit type. We realized: Death would eventually take care of this." "We look at the tablet and we think itis going to fail." Tablets appeal to rich guys with plenty of other PCs and devices already. "And people accuse us of niche markets." I get a lot of pressure to do a PDA. What people really seem to want to do with these is get the data out . We believe cell phones are going to carry this information. We didnit think weid do well in the cell phone business. What weive done instead is weive written what we think is some of the best software in the world to start syncing information between devices. We believe that mode is what cell phones need to get to. We chose to do the iPod instead of a PDA.

M: Do you have plans for movies on the iPod?

J: Iim not convinced people want to watch movies on a tiny little screen. To paraphrase Bill Clinton, "Itis the music, stupid, itis the music!" Musicis been around for a long time, will continue to be, itis huge. Not speculative, a real tangible market.

http://www.macobserv..._Lots_Of_iPods/

[Kelxin]

Why isn't touch allowed to augment the desktop?

Yea, anyone wanna bring their greasy paws over and try to touch my monitor? I've got a metal ruler right next to my computer ready to slap anyone's hand that tries.

[Stoffel]

I think it augments the desktop quite nicely. Especially on AiOs and Transformers.

I'm right there with you on that

[.Neo]

Steve Ballmer was right, no one wanted a $500 phone. It didn't take off until carrier subsidies brought the price levels down to $2-300.

Please, people were standing in line for the initial iPhone. There was a huge black market in countries where it wasn't released yet as well. Way to twist history.

[.Neo]

Hrm...

At the time it was probably true. Ballmer's response was just complete nonsense all around.

[greenwizard88]

Please, people were standing in line for the initial iPhone. There was a huge black market in countries where it wasn't released yet as well. Way to twist history.

Yeah, but there are lines for new OS releases too. All that means is there's a large enough group of people that want the newest Apple toy the day it's released. That doesn't mean it appeals to the masses at all - and in that sense, Balmer was right: No one wanted a $600 phone.

[bandit_liberty_rumble]

Steve Ballmer was right, no one wanted a $500 phone.

there's a large enough group of people that want the newest Apple toy [...] Balmer was right: No one wanted a $600 phone.

You guys are awesome! :D

[TheLegendOfMart]

Please, people were standing in line for the initial iPhone. There was a huge black market in countries where it wasn't released yet as well. Way to twist history.

Yeah the Mac fanboys who stand in line to buy anything that has the Apple name on it.

[Daedroth]

It isn't a Post PC era or a PC+ era. It's a computing era in general. With the rise of mobile operating systems, touch devices and standard desktops/laptops, the computing market is just becoming more diluted.

Microsoft need to get a mobile friendly operating system otherwise they'll remain out of that lucrative market. Windows 8 may be...different to previous versions, but it will be an excellent stepping stone for Microsoft to carry on with. Maybe then they can create a different genre of operating system, mobile, and separate it from desktop and server...but it'll still be based on the same source.

Microsoft's operating systems are as follows;

Home/Enterprise - Same operating system with more or less features.

Server - Based on the Home/Enterprise operating system.

It will be;

Home/Enterprise - Same operating system with more or less features.

Server - Based on the Home/Enterprise operating system.

Mobile - Cut down but based on the Home/Enterprise operating system.

[.Neo]

Yeah, but there are lines for new OS releases too. All that means is there's a large enough group of people that want the newest Apple toy the day it's released. That doesn't mean it appeals to the masses at all - and in that sense, Balmer was right: No one wanted a $600 phone.

Apparently you don't seem to know what the definition of "no one" is. It's also pretty obvious the first generation of a totally new product is going to cost you something. The original iPhone came with 4-8 GB of internal flash memory which in itself was basically unheard of at the time. Price drops are always likely to occur which makes Ballmer's quote even more meaningless.

Yeah the Mac fanboys who stand in line to buy anything that has the Apple name on it.

Yeah, except that argument doesn't fly anymore when something is selling in the millions. It's also complete nonsense what you're saying, but whatever helps you sleep at night.

[BajiRav]

Steve Ballmer was right, no one wanted a $500 phone. It didn't take off until carrier subsidies brought the price levels down to $2-300.

I think there were multiple factors, we will never know which one actually was the main catalyst when it took off with iPhone 3G (that was my first and only iPhone purchase :) ).

• price drop (immediately after release too)
  
• 3G
  
• App store
  
• carrier subsidies
  

[grik]

Steve Ballmer was right, no one wanted a $500 phone. It didn't take off until carrier subsidies brought the price levels down to $2-300.

Really? lol

Check this 2007 iPhone 1 Launch video, to be ironic here?s the quality of the cameras that phones had at the time, it was filmed with a BB.

This is what we had if iPhone vision of the future didnt show up:

[Scorbing]

MS trying to strike back!!! too bad MS is losing ground to Apple..

http://www.theverge....ong-pc-plus-era

"Apple makes great hardware," - Correction: Apple does not make hardware, they design it and FoxConn makes it for them.

Apple doesn't make anything. The only thing they actually make is their OS and other software such as Aperture, iMovie, etc

[Scorbing]

Another thing: They are both wrong. The PC and the Mac both have their pros and cons. Each can do things better than the other at some tasks. Neither one is the best.

[.Neo]

"Apple makes great hardware," - Correction: Apple does not make hardware, they design it and FoxConn makes it for them.

Apple doesn't make anything. The only thing they actually make is their OS and other software such as Aperture, iMovie, etc

In order to produce something you have to design it first. I'm certain Apple is highly involved with the companies who actually produce their products.

[paulheu]

Tablet != Desktop PC

Should Show MS that people aren't buying tablets like they are desktops, and should be solid enough proof to show that the two worlds don't need to merge.

This is where Apple and MSFT differ on tablets. One offers it as a scaled up iPod while the other sees it as part of a unified ecosystem where all form factors share the same codebase and basic feature set while they differentiate in the application of the specific form factor.

Let's be honest here, iPod, iPhone and iPad are mostly the same device in a different packaging.

[wellofsouls]

Tablet != Desktop PC

Should Show MS that people aren't buying tablets like they are desktops, and should be solid enough proof to show that the two worlds don't need to merge.

OTT and overly dramatic, having a start menu instead of a start screen isn't going to kill the desktop PC or Microsoft, keep touch ui where its supposed to be, on tablets.

That's what Nokia thought a few years back, they thought touch-only phones will never be mainstream, physical keypad will always be needed on a "real" phone, and smart phones will never replace feature phones. Apple's 2% market share will never pose any threat to their 40% market share. Now they are nearing bankruptcy.

With Win8, Microsoft is doing its best trying to avoid Nokia's fate.

[Dot Matrix]

Yea, anyone wanna bring their greasy paws over and try to touch my monitor? I've got a metal ruler right next to my computer ready to slap anyone's hand that tries.

Ok, but that hasn't stopped anyone from buying tablets.

[redfish]

OTT and overly dramatic, having a start menu instead of a start screen isn't going to kill the desktop PC or Microsoft, keep touch ui where its supposed to be, on tablets.

People on the one hand are complaining about a "touch ui" on Windows 8, and on the other hand are complaining about Media Center being removed .. Media Center being the prototype for Windows Phone. So which is it, do people want a "touch ui" (Media Center) or don't they (Metro)