Windows 8: A


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The mouse is not emulating touch. Nor was it ever designed to, and Windows 8 IS NOT replacing natural mouse movements with touch emulations.

The same can be said with webpages on a tablet, but we've known for a while now that the scroll wheel on the mouse makes our lives easier. The scroll wheel is the most efficient way to scroll. Duh.

So, why are you using the scrollbar? I've known since the betas that Start can be scrolled using the wheel...

wow talk about completely missing the point... no one said it was replacing the mouse, I am saying I want it to ACT CONSISTANT!

I've known since the first scroll mouse came out you can scroll, point being?! Like I said... every touch UI I've ever worked with, if you can tap and drag, you can also click and drag... which works EVERYWHERE in windows except on the start screen

wow talk about completely missing the point... no one said it was replacing the mouse, I am saying I want it to ACT CONSISTANT!

I've known since the first scroll mouse came out you can scroll, point being?! Like I said... every touch UI I've ever worked with, if you can tap and drag, you can also click and drag... which works EVERYWHERE in windows except on the start screen

You cannot click and drag anywhere in the OS... Windows 8 is not meant to replace the mouse with touch emulators. Touch and drag is the last thing you want users doing.

You cannot click and drag anywhere in the OS... Windows 8 is not meant to replace the mouse with touch emulators. Touch and drag is the last thing you want users doing.

I can click and drag metro apps at the top of the screen...

I can click and drag metro apps in the metro task switcher...

I can click and drag the title screen to get to the login screen.....

need I continue?

these where all designed as touch UI interfaces and are emulated with the mouse just fine...

I can click and drag metro apps at the top of the screen...

I can click and drag metro apps in the metro task switcher...

I can click and drag the title screen to get to the login screen.....

need I continue?

these where all designed as touch UI interfaces and are emulated with the mouse just fine...

Now you're talking about moving apps, like you currently move windows on the desktop, not scrolling using click and drag. So what is it?

Now you're talking about moving apps, like you currently move windows on the desktop, not scrolling using click and drag. So what is it?

you are the one that said you can "You cannot click and drag anywhere in the OS" nothing about scrolling... I'm the one that said it should be consistent, anything that is touch and do an action should be able to also be done with a mouse click

you are the one that said you can "You cannot click and drag anywhere in the OS" nothing about scrolling... I'm the one that said it should be consistent, anything that is touch and do an action should be able to also be done with a mouse click

You were talking about scrolling, not moving windows around. Clicking to scroll is the least efficient method to move the screen. You can't do that to scroll a webpage, so naturally you can't do that to scroll an app.

You were talking about scrolling, not moving windows around. Clicking to scroll is the least efficient method to move the screen. You can't do that to scroll a webpage, so naturally you can't do that to scroll an app.

lets just agree to disagree on what is and isn't most efficient

lets just agree to disagree on what is and isn't most efficient

Was the behavior you're describing click+drag to move the metro screen like Mission Control on a Mac? If so I find that far more intuitive than a scrollbar... I agree. Or another example of bad design is using the scroll wheel up and down on the mouse that moves metro left and right... (makes sense right?!)

You humans get stuck on doing things a certain way. Resistance to change and all. When effieciency is achieved in a fluid use of both touch and mouse. Both have their positive sides. Windows 8 is not altogther that different than Windows 7. Windows 8 is faster, more fluid in use, more functional in different ways, more intuitive than Windows 7. That's not to say Windows 7 isn't good. I was resistant to Windows 8 and the Start Screen. I've learned to use it. Still don't like the extra clicks but it's worth it.

The idiot in the article needs to not post on the internet period. And go back to windows 95SE.

Clicking to scroll is the least efficient method to move the screen. You can't do that to scroll a webpage, so naturally you can't do that to scroll an app.

Thats debatable since that very feature has been (and remains) in browsers and other apps (like Acrobat Reader) for quite awhile (middle click). The more pressing issue is why scrolling is still so finicky that people prefer to use the dragable scroll bar.

You humans get stuck on doing things a certain way. Resistance to change and all. When effieciency is achieved in a fluid use of both touch and mouse. Both have their positive sides. Windows 8 is not altogther that different than Windows 7. Windows 8 is faster, more fluid in use, more functional in different ways, more intuitive than Windows 7. That's not to say Windows 7 isn't good. I was resistant to Windows 8 and the Start Screen. I've learned to use it. Still don't like the extra clicks but it's worth it.

The idiot in the article needs to not post on the internet period. And go back to windows 95SE.

Is that because his opinion is different then yours?

Why is it worth extra clicks? It's not for me, so I'm just wondering.

Because if take the time to setup a dual boot you'll see how much more functional 8 is over 7.

That's what I did to compare on the hardware. Since setting up 8 I've only used 7 a few times. I meant overall the inconvenience of a few clicks is worth getting a better OS. 8 is not that much different than 7. Just better. I honesty did not expect it to be.

Thats debatable since that very feature has been (and remains) in browsers and other apps (like Acrobat Reader) for quite awhile (middle click). The more pressing issue is why scrolling is still so finicky that people prefer to use the dragable scroll bar.

It's pretty simple, the scrollbar basically compresses the page into one view allowing you to quickly jump to any point on it (and some apps like Chrome or certain Visual Studio addins even add extra useful stuff like indicating points of interest directly on the scrollbar, which the scrollbar click-and-drag mechanism makes it easy to get to), while with click-and-drag or even scrollwheel you have to move one screen at the time. Even with touch, although inertial scrolling helps with this, I often find myself wanting a scrollbar so I can jump somewhere more quickly.

You humans get stuck on doing things a certain way. ...

What are you? A dog? (Looking at your profile pic) :D

I don't want to be rude, I just found it very funny you started your post with: You humans.

Seems like you didn't feel you belong to the same group

As well as how to drag and move live tiles easily [drag down slightly and hold for a sec, then drag is smooth].

Ha, you actually still don't have this right. You're not supposed to "hold for a sec", you can just pull it out directly with no waiting necessary.

BTW there's an interesting video here -> http://channel9.msdn.com/Events/TechDays/Techdays-2012-the-Netherlands/2373 where the designer of the Windows 8 touch UI talks specifically about how they tried to design select and rearrange so that they would be "self-teaching", including to avoid giving people the "superstitious beliefs" that they needed to press and hold. (you can skip to 33:00 for this, including footage of usability tests, though the whole video is interesting). Guess it didn't work in this particular case though ...

So what you are saying is you don't want to be bothered with learning. Well you can down grade for free. Then pass me your Win8 key thank-you very much.

I'd give it to you for $15

Not even joking the fact you want it for free even shows you wouldn't even pay for Windows 8, and that's a bit funny but mostly sad.

What are you? A dog? (Looking at your profile pic) :D

I don't want to be rude, I just found it very funny you started your post with: You humans.

Seems like you didn't feel you belong to the same group

well I...:p

I'd rather get a lump of coal in my stocking, than a copy of Windows 8.

Just pass that copy and key my way. Thank you very much. :)

It is official folks, even if we like a product, we can NEVER.....NEVER say anything that irritates us again. Let's just get rid of movie, game, and product reviews since we cannot say anything about a product. If a company want to make a defective video card, it is their product and can do whatever they want with it.

Wow, Dotty really got you, didn't he? Seriously guy, I agree with your point of view, but you really need to calm down a bit. It's only Dotty... Ignore him! :p

It's hard to ignore his condescending attitude towards people, don't like Windows 8? Tough, it must be something you are doing wrong because he thinks Windows 8 is the second coming and he can't possibly be wrong because Microsoft is God.

  • Like 2

Well, yeah. It's kinda annoying, but not enough to stress over. Personally, I kinda like Windows 8, but the start screen gets up my nose a bit, and I almost never use any of the metro apps as they just use too much screen space (and I have 2 monitors).

Also, full screen apps on a 24" monitor look horrible.

But it's fine. I quite happily use the desktop, with Classic Start, and I don't generally have any problems until I start to game. Then the hotspots tend to get irritating as, to aid multi-screening, I play games windowed.

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    • Russia was able to invade Crimea because of those people. But my point is that I've personally heard how great it was to be "back in Russia" right afterwards - look how great it is now. I've asked you a question in another comment which you haven't answered, so I'll ask it again: is it better now without "Europrats"?
    • ZimaBoard 2 1664 Starter Kit review: it's a cool and affordable DIY NAS by Steven Parker IceWhale Technology reached out to me asking if I was interested in testing the ZimaBoard 2, and after convincing them to send me the Starter Kit, it arrived at my doorstep in May. A bit of background: it is a Shanghai-based Chinese company founded in 2020, which specializes in single-board servers and personal cloud solutions. From searching around online, user feedback on the company and ZimaOS is mostly positive, so we're off to a good start. In addition, I should probably point out that although they do not have a large portfolio of NAS devices, with just four of what they do offer, they seem to have covered everything from a relatively low-priced entry point with the ZimaBoard 2, right up to the high end, with the ZimaCube 2 Creator Pack that even includes an NVIDIA RTX PRO 2000. Anyway, as already mentioned, what we have today is the ZimaBoard 2 Starter Kit, and here are the full specifications: ZimaBoard 2 Model 832, 1664 CPU Intel Core N150 (4x E Cores/Threads, Max burst up to 3.6 GHz) TDP: 6W (Base) 10W (Max) Graphics Intel UHD Graphics 24 EUs (1.00 GHz) Memory 8 GB, 16 GB DDR5 4800MT/s non ECC SODIMM (soldered) Disk Capacity 60 TB (30 TB x 2) Supported RAID Types TRAID, TRAID +, RAID0, RAID1, RAID5, RAID 6, RAID 10 Storage 2 x SATA 3.0 6Gb/s Ports with Power Bootloader 32 GB, 64 GB eMMC Network 2x RJ-45 2.5 GbE PCIe 1 x PCIe 3.0 (via LPC) USB Ports 2 x USB-A 3.1 (5 Gbps) Display Mini-DisplayPort 1.4 (4K@60Hz) Hardware Transcoding Engine H.264, H.265, MPEG-4, VC-1 Maximum resolution: 4K (4096 x 2160); Maximum FPS: 60 Virtualization Intel® AES New Instructions Intel® Virtualization Technology (VT-x) Intel® Virtualization Technology for Directed I/O (VT-d) Size (H/W/D) 140mm x 83mm x 31mm Weight 0.4 kg (only ZimaBoard 2 device) Power 12v 5A Power Supply Warranty 1 year (Global) 2 Years (EU) OS ZimaOS v1.6.1 MSRP $339, $399 ($548.60) As you can see above, there are two variants of the ZimaBoard 2. The lesser variant has half the eMMC storage and 8 GB less RAM, although it also costs $60 less than the top variant we are testing today. The above pricing is only for the ZimaBoard 2. I put the MSRP of the Starter Kit next to it in brackets, although as of publishing, it is discounted to $534.50. The ZimaBoard 2 started life on Kickstarter and shipped to backers in August last year. It became available via the official website in late 2025 and Q1 2026. This hobbyist NAS contains the still relatively new N150 Intel CPU released in the first quarter of 2025, with support for DisplayPort 1.4, HDMI 2.1, although in this case, the memory is integrated into the board itself, so it will not be possible to upgrade or expand the amount. It also supports AV1 decoding, as well as H.264, VP8, VP9, H.265 (8 bit), and H.265 (10 bit). The different capabilities in the Alder Lake-N (and Twin Lake) series are listed below. Processor E-cores L3-cache Turbo clock GPU GPU-clock TDP Intel N355 8 6 MB 3.9 GHz 32 EUs 1.35 GHz 9 W Intel Core 3 N350 3.9 GHz 1.35 GHz 7 W Intel Core i3-N305 3.8 GHz 1.25 GHz 9 W Intel Core i3-N300 3.8 GHz 1.25 GHz Intel N250 4 3.8 GHz 1.25 GHz 6 W Intel Processor N200 3.7 GHz 0.75 GHz Intel N150 3.6 GHz 24 EUs 1 GHz Intel N97 1.2 GHz 12 W Intel Processor N100 3.4 GHz 0.75 GHz 6 W The CPU is part of the Twin Lake series that sits near the bottom of the N-series, designed for low- powered systems and entry-level laptops, and as such has a base level TDP of just 6W. As I have noted before, we are seeing another NAS with a great amount of RAM. It's important to mention that the ZimaBoard 2's memory is integrated into the base board (which is why they have two variants of it). As a reminder, up until a couple of years ago, it was commonplace to only get 2 or 4GB max on a flagship Synology or QNAP home NAS. Ever since the likes of TerraMaster and more have entered the market with ample RAM sizes included in their NAS offerings, it has gone a long way in forcing the hands of the traditional makers to up their game a bit. First impressions The Starter Kit came in one outer box with several packages inside it (shown above). I forgot to take pics of it because when it arrived, it wasn't clear what was inside, and I had to confirm with my contact that I received the entire Starter Kit. In the box ZimaBoard 2 ZimaBoard 2 HDD Expansion Bracket + PCIe card frame Zimaboard Mini DisplayPort Male to HDMI Female Cable 4K 60Hz Zimaboard PCIe 3.0 x4 to Dual NVMe M.2 SSD Adapter Card Quick guide [full online guide] Limited warranty notice Screws Design Where to start? You'd be forgiven for mistaking it as an SSD enclosure if not for all the ports on it. It is completely made out of metal, and the top is an entire heatsink. It has a premium feel about it, but it definitely looks like a hobby device. As you will see, the completed build looks like it belongs in a server or meter closet rather than as a showpiece on someone's desk. On what I am calling the rear, there's a Mini DisplayPort (1.4), two 2.5 GbE ports, with Type A 3.1 USB ports, and then the barrel connector port. Around the front, there are two SATA6 ports with a power connector in the middle. Left side Right side One side is completely free of ports. On the other there's a slit that allows for the feed of a CPU fan cable, and a PCIe 3.0 X4 slot. Top Bottom The top is entirely made up of a heatsink except for the extended height for the I/O on the rear. Around the other side, you can find the ZIMA branding and some regulatory information stamped near the bottom. As you may see from the bottom of the ZimaBoard 2, it scratches quite easily from just moving it around on my Ikea island. Teardown Before we get started, let's have a look at this thing on the inside. The steps to get to the board are as follows: Remove the four smaller Torx screws on the bottom of the ZimaBoard 2; Remove the four larger Torx screws on the sides of the device; Carefully unstick the CMOS battery from the PCB; Remove two Phillips screws on the PCB; Lift out the PCB. Yes, as you can tell from the instructions, you need three different tools to remove Torx and Phillips screws (10 in total), and unhelpfully, one of the screws is located under the CMOS battery, which is stuck onto the PCB. Building Now comes the fun part. Because the ZimaSpace website does not provide any guidance on how to put the Starter Kit together. They only have guidance for connecting the CPU fan. However, they did upload a video to their YouTube channel that shows the entire process. To install the fan, first remove the four screws on the bottom of the ZimaBoard 2, then on the inside, there is a CPU FAN connector where you can attach the fan, reattach the ZimaBoard 2 frame, and feed the fan cable through the provided slit. Then remove the nearest screw on the side and attach the fan frame to the side of the device using the same screw. ZimaBard 2 screws Aligning the screws Bottom view Remember those four screws we removed to access the CPU FAN? Longer screws are provided in the box with the HDD Expansion Bracket, which is what you will now need to attach the ZimaBoard 2 to it. Helpfully, the orientation on how to attach it is made obvious when the frame can only be screwed on at the same overall length as the ZimaBoard 2. If you do it the wrong way around (which is what I did initially) one side hangs off the frame, and it becomes difficult to attach the PCIe Adapter Card cable. PCIe card frame Other side PCIe slot connector Next, it's time to attach the PCIe card frame, which is fastened with the help of 3.5-inch SATA HDD (3 screws). These are toolless screws that you can just use your fingers to fasten them with. Then it is time to connect the provided PCIe cable with the slot connector on one side of the ZimaBoard 2, feed it through the bottom of the HDD frame, and fasten it with two standoffs. Both bracket options 2280 standoffs with 2x 4TB MP44Q The PCIe 3.0 X4 card comes with a short bracket option, handy if you decide to place it inside a different NAS or rack server, but here we need the long bracket. Oddly enough, the M.2 standoffs were preinstalled into the 22110 position, but extra standoffs are included in the box, which I installed at the 2280 position for our use. I added a couple of MP44Q M.2 PCIe 4.0 SSDs (2 x 4TB) that can be availed on Amazon for $478.99 (the lowest price for 3 months) that TEAMGROUP supplied us with Then we have the almost completed build, you just need to push the card into the PCIe slot. Unfortunately, IceWhale Technologies did not provide a screw for the PCIe card frame (this is also apparent in their own video). Here it is at several different angles, with the last pic showing the SATA Y-Cable connected to the two WD Red Plus 4TB drives. Setup and Usage Next, you connect your cables to the I/O, and the ZimaBoard 2 powers on automatically, as there is no power button on the device. Power is controlled through the Settings in ZimaOS. BIOS The ZimaBoard 2 includes an Aptio BIOS from American Megatrends [1, 2, 3], and you can setup pretty much everything here including the boot order, which is locked to the UEFI OS, however above that choice you can enable or disable booting to a SATA/USB bootloader so this would still allow you to switch to an alternative bootloader and boot from it, or disable it to instead always start from the first disk with an OS installed on it. Initial Setup Upon connecting to the LAN and booting up, the ZimaBoard 2 can be reached by navigating to the IP address (shown if you have a monitor connected), or you can find it using the ZIMA Client desktop application, which is essentially a Zima device finder. Initializing the ZimaBoard 2 The ZimaOS setup process is pretty straightforward, through a wizard, and in full above, it basically consists of setting up an account and some handy tips, and that's that! Post Setup (ZimaOS update) Upon first boot, you are alerted that there is a ZimaOS update from 1.5.0 to 1.6.1, which I applied; the full process is shown above with the changelog. ZimaBoard 2 Storage Setup Next, it is time to set up the storage. ZimaOS actually throws everything onto the eMMC flash drive; it is also the default location of AppData, which is definitely something to be wary about, as the 45GB available storage could fill up quickly. HDDs I first attempted to create a Storage Pool using the two 4TB WD Red Plus NAS drives, and got an error message: After several attempts and then looking online, I discovered it was a bug with ZimaOS where the fix was simply to reboot ZimaOS and then try again, this time I was able to create a RAID mirror using the two drives. SSDs I did the same for the SSDs, as you will see in the above gallery, when I created the second Storage Pool, it only allowed me to select available drives. 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In my case, all I had to do was add the media path I just created, which you can also browse to using the folder icon in the path field. In addition, you can now map the new Media library in Windows Explorer using the Zima Client. Oddly enough, it is not possible to access the ZimaBoard 2 over the Network Neighborhood; you must map drives using the client, which is shown in the last image in the above gallery. I watched one of my Blu-Ray rips, which is Dolby Vision with Dolby Atmos, and the content played fine with no stuttering or buffering, which is what anyone needs in this scenario. ZimaBoard 2 Zima Client mobile app There's also a client for mobile. It is pretty barebones, as shown in the above gallery, for example, the Apps screen launches the WebUI for that app, and the Backup must be done manually. On opening Backup, you can select internal storage folders on your phone to backup to the ZimaBoard 2's storage, and although this is constantly scanned, the backup action itself must be manually triggered. There is an option to allow foreground backup (last image in the above gallery), but this basically means the queued backup gets triggered when you manually open the app. Benchmarking SATA PCIe 3.0 X4 A CrystalDiskMark test on a mapped network drive from within a Windows 11 25H2 PC (image above) connected over a 2.5 GbE was well within acceptable ranges. Writes were generally better on the SSD RAID mirror. SATA PCIe 3.0 X1 I also ran the NAS Performance tester, which tests the link speed performance. As you can see, it pretty much maxes out the 2.5GbE connection. Of course, you can also opt to bond the two 2.5 GbE connections for a bit more umph, but I didn't do that. Thermals Top PCIe card SATA HDDs Next, I measured some hotspots while playing content on Plex. It's fair to say this will perform better than a NAS that is enclosed in a metal or plastic case, as almost everything storage-wise is exposed! Anyway, the ZimaBoard 2 did not break a sweat with Plex streaming or disk benchmarks. ZimaOS Factory Reset ZimaOS does not include a factory reset option. Instead, you have to download the ZimaOS image and flash it to the eMMC manually. The flashing process is shown in the above gallery. The steps to do so are listed below: Download the ZimaOS image here; Open BalenaEtcher (Run as Administrator) and select the image; Select your inserted USB drive (min 8 GB) Flash to it; Connect your USB drive, monitor, keyboard, USB hub (optional), mouse (optional), and network cable (recommended) to the ZimaBoard 2; Connect power and press F11 continuously; Select your USB drive starting with UEFI in the boot device menu; Press Enter on the Install ZimaOS option; Select /dev/mmcblk0 (MMC) flash drive as target; Confirm with (three times) to wipe the target disk; Wait a couple of minutes while ZimaOS installs; Remove the USB drive and confirm with a reboot; Your ZimaBoard 2 has been factory reset. However, you don't have to stick with ZimaOS, in fact the company also offers official CasaOS images, that are based on Debian; or as they say themselves, put anything you want on this "hackable single board server" it's up to you. Conclusion I had a lot of fun putting this together. I've custom-built all my own PCs and servers since the 90s, and this is the first time I have had to put a NAS together. Even if the actual base ZimaBoard 2 was already a completed build, it still feels pretty custom. I just wish that IceWhale Technology included a getting-started guide in the box for the Start Kit, which would have really completed this kit. Instead, I had to search for the official video on the YouTube channel to make sure I wasn't doing anything wrong. So who is this for? Definitely the hobbyist who is comfortable building their own PC and servers. It also has a much smaller footprint than its nearest equivalent (in terms of specs), like the Beelink Me Pro, which is another NAS I will be testing soon. Although the Beelink does not come with the PCIe 3.0 X4 expansion, the ZimaBoard 2 Starter Kit suddenly looks to be a great bargain, even if it only offers the two 3.5-inch bays over the four in the other example. It makes a lot of sense to use Intel's N150 chip inside a NAS; it is more than capable of doing what the ZimaBoard 2 is intended for, media streaming and backup. It also looks like the IceWhale Technology staff are quite active in the official forums helping people with issues they come across with ZimaOS and the devices, peer support seems to be good as well, I was quickly able to find why I was not able to create a new Storage Pool in ZimaOS v1.6.1 even though that is quite a serious bug, hopefully it will be fixed in the next update. If you are comfortable with the command line and Docker, you'll be fine. You can do great things with this hardware. This was my first time with ZimaOS. It seems a bit barebones in comparison to the likes of Synology DSM, TOS, and UGOS, but it has a ton of apps to get you started with your home or small business NAS. Where to buy As of publishing, IceWhale Technology is running a discount of up to 5% for the Starter Kit. If you opt to get just the ZimaBoard 2 itself, it does come with a SATA Y-Cable, so you will be able to connect up to two 3.5-inch HDDs to it. ZimaBoard 2 1668 Starter Kit for $534.50 on Amazon US (was $548.60) ZimaBoard 2 832 Starter Kit for $372.88 on Amazon US (was $390.60) Zimaboard 2 1668 (16GB+64GB) for $419.90 on Amazon US Zimaboard 2 832 (8GB+32GB) for $359.90 on Amazon Disclosure: IceWhale Technology provided a free sample without any editorial input or review pre-approval. Good to know The Amazon link is U.S. specific, and not available in other regions unless specified. We only use first-party seller links (at the time of article publishing); ensure that you purchase from a first-party seller link only. Check out Today's Deals on Amazon | or our recent tech deals. Become a Prime member (for Students or SNAP) via Neowin Get Prime Access - Prime for half price (for qualifying Medicaid, EBT, SNAP) Subscribe to Prime Video, Audible Plus, Music Unlimited or Kindle Unlimited via Neowin As an Amazon Associate, when you purchase through links on our site, we earn from qualifying purchases.
    • It's in the Insider's group so yes it's technically beta, though these days it's hard to see much of a difference unless you opt for the most extreme beta builds, which I don't. When I moved here from the Release Preview channel I did so primarily because I wanted to see how well the restored taskbar functionality (restored from Win10, and earlier) is working and whether it was time to finally abandon SAB--and it is--working fine, so far. Not as polished as SAB, but it'll do for me.
    • I've been using MWB Premium for a number of years so that along with Windows updates and updated browser should be fine. Thanks for that.
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