Samsung could face 15 billion in fines for trying to ban apple products

[(Spork)]

http://bgr.com/2012/...-europe-271856/

Samsung (005930) could face a $15 billion fine in Europe alone for using ?standard-essential? patents in its attempts to ban devices like the iPhone in its ongoing patent battle with Apple (AAPL). The Guardian reports that the European commission could impose a massive fine of up to 10% of Samsung?s global turnover following its investigation into Samsung?s use of standard-essential patents in complaints filed against Apple in Europe. Samsung?s revenue totaled $148.9 billion in 2011, so fines in Europe alone could reach $14.8 billion.

The commission?s investigation began in January and took an interesting turn late last week. Among other issues, it is troubled by Samsung?s use of patents that had previously been deemed ?standard-essential.? This means the IP owner ? Samsung, in this case ? has made a formal commitment to license these technologies to all parties that wish to utilize them for a ?fair, reasonable and non-discriminatory? fee. If fees cannot be agreed upon by the parties involved, The Guardian explains, a price must be set by a court.

Apple had offered to license the relevant patents in the past, the commission noted, but it was unable to strike an agreement with Samsung.

Samsung withdrew its motion asking to ban sales of the iPhone and iPad across Europe last week, just days before the European commission made its objections to Samsung?s use of standard-essential patents public.

?Samsung remains committed to licensing our technologies on fair, reasonable and non-discriminatory terms, and we strongly believe it is better when companies compete fairly in the marketplace, rather than in court,? Samsung said in a statement at the time. ?In this spirit, Samsung has decided to withdraw our injunction requests against Apple on the basis of our standard essential patents pending in European courts, in the interest of protecting consumer choice

[siah1214]

The EU found another piggy bank.

[+Majesticmerc MVC]

The EU found another piggy bank.

I really wish you idiots would stop spouting this crap.

I think it's great that the EU is actually doing something to stop this nonsense. If a 10% fine is what it takes, then so be it. Trying to ban a product from sale using standards-essential patents is (a) anti-competitive and (b) bad for consumers.

[thealexweb]

Why are fines calculated by revenue and not profit? Makes low margin firms like PC OEMs big targets.

[Conjor]

I really wish you idiots would stop spouting this crap.

I think it's great that the EU is actually doing something to stop this nonsense. If a 10% fine is what it takes, then so be it. Trying to ban a product from sale using standards-essential patents is (a) anti-competitive and (b) bad for consumers.

It's funny... Apple does the same things *COUGH* rounded corners *COUGH*.

[tsupersonic]

I really wish you idiots would stop spouting this crap.

I think it's great that the EU is actually doing something to stop this nonsense. If a 10% fine is what it takes, then so be it. Trying to ban a product from sale using standards-essential patents is (a) anti-competitive and (b) bad for consumers.

So...it's not a problem when Apple does it, but it is a problem when Samsung does? I think both companies should be fined heavily, maybe not 10%, but a big amount.

[+Majesticmerc MVC]

So...it's not a problem when Apple does it, but it is a problem when Samsung does? I think both companies should be fined heavily, maybe not 10%, but a big amount.

I agree, but Apple wasn't withholding standard-essential patents like Samsung is accused of doing. It's a technicality, but that's the reason.

[Brandon H Supervisor]

I agree, but Apple wasn't withholding standard-essential patents like Samsung is accused of doing. It's a technicality, but that's the reason.

technicalities, in normal world speak that would be called "making excuses"

[TPreston]

I wish they would focus on forcing Apple & Microsoft (in RT) to stop their anti competitive policy's in their marketplaces.

[BoredBozirini]

Great news.

[+Majesticmerc MVC]

technicalities, in normal world speak that would be called "making excuses"

Sure, it is making excuses, except for the part where I agree with you. I think Apple should be held accountable for anti-competitive practices of filing obvious and vague patents and litigating to maintain an unfair advantage rather than competing based on the advantages of the product. At the same time however, all these things are perfectly within the law. If anyone is primarily to blame, it's the patent offices for approving these patents.

It's not like the EU are in bed with Apple. The EU has pressured Apple into clarifying that they offer a free 2 year warranty inside the EU, and the UK have forced them to publicly apologise to Samsung for bringing a smear campaign against them. They never get fined though because they comply with EU orders.

What Samsung are accused to have done wrong is use standards essential patents to try and force Apple out of the market. Standards essential patents are required to be available under Fair, Reasonable and Non-Discriminatory terms. If they're found not to have done this, they're deservedly in a world of hurt. Apple (nor anyone else) are required to do this for non standard essential patents. Like I said, it's a technicality (personally I think it should be a requirement that any patented technology should be available under FRAND terms), but they're within the confines of the law.

[Growled Member]

Whether they fine them or not is their business, but I object to the size of the fine. It seems excessive to me.

[The_Decryptor Veteran]

Not really surprised about this, they're being investigated in the US for the same reason. Microsoft claimed Motorola was doing the same thing too.

[Praetor]

The bigger problem in this is that tech patents, in its the current form, are wrong. And all of this enterprises are using them to knock out competition, leaving us, consumers, in a crippled environment.

That fine is excessive but if only could end this pathetic patent war...but it won't.

[Shaun N.]

And where is the fine for Apple for trying to get Samsung products banned?

[evo_spook]

And where is the fine for Apple for trying to get Samsung products banned?

Its not about trying to get products banned, its about using standards patents.

does anyone actually read the story before commenting?

[+Majesticmerc MVC]

if it was MS would you say the same?? yeah!! I you would lick their ...

You accidentally a word there, but I get the jist of it. If you go back to any of the numerous front page articles about Microsoft vs the EU, you'll see that I'm supportive of the EU there too. Don't mistake my support of consumer rights to be some kind of weird fanboyism.

[SharpGreen]

I wish they would focus on forcing Apple & Microsoft (in RT) to stop their anti competitive policy's in their marketplaces.

What exactly is anti-competitive about an OS with less than a 1% market share such as Windows RT?

[HawkMan]

It's funny... Apple does the same things *COUGH* rounded corners *COUGH*.

Umm Apple never released their patents of round corners for fair use, round corners are also not "essential".

This is a fine because Samsung tried to do what Motorola is trying to do, usa patents that are released under the fair use license to stop other companies, I expect Motorola and Google will be next.

if it was MS would you say the same?? yeah!! I you would lick their ...

If MS was found abusing fair use patents, then they would be just as wrong as Samsung and Motorola.

[HawkMan]

my point being, the reason why you support EU is because its not MS.I really dont care about EU or samsung. all i care is the judgement is fair.

15 bn in fine??? thats not fair in any world. would you say OK when MS has to pay 15 bn a year for wireless patents to motorola. yeah. you view would be opposite.

so MS never abused fair patents?? check the history book again. exactly why my point. just to point out people like you exist.

What does history matter, MS has paid their fines many times over. and that history is 15 years old now. and they have changed a lot since then.

And actually, they never did abuse the fair patents, that's never been what they've been charged with, they've been charged with abusing a monopoly situation, though I don't necessarily agree with that, since internet people back then where pretty much all tech geeks and know how to change a browser, and people where switching away from a terrible netscape to a superior IE before it was included with windows.

As for your MS and Motorola example, Motorola is the one that's actually abusing the fair use patents, and using them as a weapon after releasing them as fair use MPEG4 patents.

get YOUR facts straight. MS has done bad things, they have been fined for them, but it's never been about fair use patents.

[javagreen]

Where are they getting this ludicrous figure from? 15 Billion?

Are they pulling a Dr. Evil? 15 Million Billion Bazillion Gazillion Fifillion US dollars!

[HawkMan]

Where are they getting this ludicrous figure from? 15 Billion?

Are they pulling a Dr. Evil? 15 Million Billion Bazillion Gazillion Fifillion US dollars!

RTFA ?

[javagreen]

RTFA ?

GTFO?

[FloatingFatMan]

GTFO?

If you bothered to read the article, you would know where they got the $15 billion figure from.

So, yeah.. What HawkMan said.

[Alwaysonacoffebreak]

Doesn't matter what people actually think, the fact remains that Greece/Spain/Italy etc. needs another bailout package and EU found a new cow to milk to do it. Money doesn't grow on trees and countries like Finland and Estonia are actually asking for assurances already that they'll get their money back.

It's funny how people from Norway speak out on this while they don't pay anything into the bailout funds while the rest of us actually suffer under this crap and see exactly whats going on. F***** economy specialists.

Also HawkMan, you can write paragraphs of text here but that doesn't automatically mean those are all facts and everybody else is stupid and doesn't know what they are talking about. Gotta love your ego tho, can I borrow it sometimes?