Microsoft profit slides on slumping PC sales

[COKid]

Windows as we know it today won't exist in 5-10 years, except for the people who refuse to stay current.

 

Where is it written that one has to "stay current"? With anything. Do you buy a new car every year? New appliances? I doubt it.

 

I tell ya, I don't know if it's a generational thing or what, but this notion of always needing the latest version of a software program is assinine. Newer doesn't always mean better.

 

But like anything else, to each her/his own.

[gohpep]

It's mainly when people attempt to apply their old methods of using a computer without objective (and dare I say, positive) guidance that you have negative feedback.

^This. People expect something to else to happen because it's Windows, and since it's Windows, it has to have a 1995 interface or else everything goes haywire. Change the name to iOS, Android, or Ubuntu, and everything's fine again.

[Myrdhinn]

People have been crying the death of MS on every OS release. Apple can only dream of having the desktop market share of Windows. Linux, it's been claimed to take over the desktop market for years but it's still a small minority. Android, lol, a nice toy but that is it, good for smartphones, tablets as a cheap way to browse, email, uncomplicated documents but it'll be years and years before it has apps like photoshop, premiere, vegas, aperture, final cut, etc (actually maybe never). It's still going to be MS and Apple as top dogs for quite some time, probably out last my lifetime. lol

[techbeck]

Yeah? Why not post an entire article instead of the very first clickbait heading that uses stupid words like "slide" ?

 

 

He kept the original title of the article and followed the rules.  And I got an email from a MOD saying to stop posting full articles and only post a little and link back to the original or next time I will be warned.  Even though I have been doing this since I signed up on Neowin.  I guess that is violating the rules....ah well.

 

Anyway, this is to be expected.  No need to upgrade as often as you used to.   Things are slowing down.

[Auditor]

Windows days will be numbered when other software makers start publishing their software for either Linux or OSX platform as well. The sole reason many people are stuck with windows are because most of the programs are windows exclusive. But that might change in a while as many people are adopting Android and OSX in masses and sooner or later it publishers will find a huge market for their softwares beside windows. MS has to be blamed for providing such a shoddy job with windows 8 and they better change their course sooner otherwise MS will be another IBM or Xerox. 

[Raa]

The sole reason many people are stuck with windows are because most of the programs are windows exclusive.

This pretty much right here sums it up.

 

Until I can take my hardware and software and simply plug it in/insert it/download it/run it on <OS>, I can't see myself or the world majority switching platforms in a hurry...

[techbeck]

MS has to be blamed for providing such a shoddy job with windows 8 and they better change their course sooner otherwise MS will be another IBM or Xerox. 

 

Not to mention the XBOX ONE.  I like my XBOX ONE but think it is #### for them to release an "improved" version with many features missing from the old version.  And features lots used on the 360.  Like buying a cell phone and having to wait a while for an update in order to send text messages. 

 

Anyway, hopefully with MS new leadership, they can get back on the right track.  I have been liking a lot of what I have been seeing so far.

[notchinese]

Windows days will be numbered when other software makers start publishing their software for either Linux or OSX platform as well. The sole reason many people are stuck with windows are because most of the programs are windows exclusive. But that might change in a while as many people are adopting Android and OSX in masses and sooner or later it publishers will find a huge market for their softwares beside windows. MS has to be blamed for providing such a shoddy job with windows 8 and they better change their course sooner otherwise MS will be another IBM or Xerox. 

 

OSX will never be adopted in mass unless Apple decides it will be sold for cheap. The average Windows PC sales price is around $400. Also, who in their right mind would replace Windows with Android on a productivity machine?

[Auditor]

OSX will never be adopted in mass unless Apple decides it will be sold for cheap. The average Windows PC sales price is around $400. Also, who in their right mind would replace Windows with Android on a productivity machine?

 

I totally agree with you the only reason for low adoption of OSX is Apple restriction to put OSX on their over priced hardware. But with Maverick, Apple is going free on OS front and which I think is laying up positive foundation for mass adoption. Economically a typical good configuration hardware last for at least 5 years for average user. The same good configuration hardware will cost around $600-$800 on average. If someone has to buy windows twice for during the course of five year at average price of $150 then the total cost will be around $1,000 which might be at par with Mac range computers and then you don't have to deal with all those activation, antivirus and lots of other bloatware crap inherent in windows. 

 

You are also right in saying in today's time no one in right mind will replace windows with Android on productive machine. But Android is not meant to be on productive machine as it is meant primarily for content consumption and this clear cut differentiation is a strong point for Android as people know what to expect from Android unlike MS trying to shoehorn Desktop on 8 inch tablet and claiming it to be a productive machine. Never seen such a confused corporation. But growth of Android will open the doors of Linux wide open in near future. Technological landscape changes very quickly. Who would have thought just 5 years back that Blackberry will be in such a hot water or in just two decades, Apple which was on verge of bankruptcy and was kind of bailed out by MS, will  not only competing with MS but also beating MS with a huge margin. 

 

MS has gone too complacent and they are too big to carry their own weight. I don't care what MS fanboys believe themselves but market is giving signals to MS to either innovate in right direction or be prepared to keep loosing ground. 

[PGHammer]

We already knew PC sales were in decline. The decline started before Windows 8.

And here's another fact - hardware requirements for the current flavor of Windows since VISTA have been practically flat - and Vista came out *when*?  (Fewer than ten percent of PCs that were Vista-capable are incapable of running Windows 8.1 update 1; therefore, for the vast majority of non-movers, the question has been "why upgrade"? In fact, that same question has been uttered time and again by most of those that haven't moved right here on Neowin.  They have refused to move.)

 

I am running Windows 8.1 update 1 TODAY on Vista-era hardware, and without a quibble - however, I'm also not a refusenik.  WQhat have I been hearing, over and over again, from those unwilling to upgrade?  "I don't want to move."

[PGHammer]

I totally agree with you the only reason for low adoption of OSX is Apple restriction to put OSX on their over priced hardware. But with Maverick, Apple is going free on OS front and which I think is laying up positive foundation for mass adoption. Economically a typical good configuration hardware last for at least 5 years for average user. The same good configuration hardware will cost around $600-$800 on average. If someone has to buy windows twice for during the course of five year at average price of $150 then the total cost will be around $1,000 which might be at par with Mac range computers and then you don't have to deal with all those activation, antivirus and lots of other bloatware crap inherent in windows. 

 

You are also right in saying in today's time no one in right mind will replace windows with Android on productive machine. But Android is not meant to be on productive machine as it is meant primarily for content consumption and this clear cut differentiation is a strong point for Android as people know what to expect from Android unlike MS trying to shoehorn Desktop on 8 inch tablet and claiming it to be a productive machine. Never seen such a confused corporation. But growth of Android will open the doors of Linux wide open in near future. Technological landscape changes very quickly. Who would have thought just 5 years back that Blackberry will be in such a hot water or in just two decades, Apple which was on verge of bankruptcy and was kind of bailed out by MS, will  not only competing with MS but also beating MS with a huge margin. 

 

MS has gone too complacent and they are too big to carry their own weight. I don't care what MS fanboys believe themselves but market is giving signals to MS to either innovate in right direction or be prepared to keep loosing ground. 

Microsoft was anything BUT complacent with Windows 8 - it was designed for newer hardware types that were - and are - entering the marketplace; however, it also works just fine on older hardware. There are, however, two rather large issues - while newer hardware types ARE out there, older hardware is not being retired - instead, it's being passed down, or even kept in place.  How many refurbs are sliding into non-big-box retail or e-tail today? (Yes - I DID say e-tail, and specifically Amazon - how many of you know someone that purchased a refurbished - factory or otherwise - PC from Amazon merely in the past year?)  Also, where are the applications that would drive folks to upgrade to newer hardware?  Other than games (and not much in the way of PC gaming is driving hardware upgrades, either), what is driving folks to upgrade their hardware?  It isn't applications - the application base - other than nicheware - has been flat since Vista, if not XP.  Nine frigging YEARS of "meh" - and users largely don't even CARE!  They are, by and large, quite happy they don't have to move!  If they want exciting, there's mobile - they are quite satisfied to have "meh" on the desktop.  Desktop software?  Stay in your cage, Windows - I don't want to move.  This isn't Vista - it's worse; while Microsoft (and the IHVs) are actually in agreement (and for the first time really since NT 4), it's the user base acting like a bunch of Missouri mules and staying put - especially in terms of desktop hardware.  And with desktop hardware unchanged, there is also far less reason to upgrade desktop software - which is what developers are saying themselves - why put extra energy into writing software for a flat hardware base?  Meh is FEEDING meh.

 

WHat you really are saying is that you want mobile because it's not in the cage you are trying to force Microsoft - and Windows - back into.

[George P Global Moderator]

People didn't look at the solid numbers huh?  Every part of MS had growth, even Windows sales, up 4% with OEM Pro sales up 19% (mostly because of upgrades not new PC buys, but to MS it doesn't matter). 

 

Saying Windows is doomed is silly, people seem to have a narrow view about what Windows is, at BUILD they showed you that it's much more than a PC OS, it can run on lots of devices that you don't think about as a "PC" without issue.   Also, the number this quarter is lower than last mostly on the back of a $790 million EU fine as well.    Add that back in and the profit would be $6.45 billion.  ($5.66 billion + $790million).  Which would best the YoY numbers.  Bet hell, let's totally ignore that little fact and once again go on and on about how MS is doomed.

[Hum]

I don't know about being 'doomed', but Microsoft certainly faces more competition, not so good economies around the world, and a saturated computer market.

[Dot Matrix]

I don't see Windows existing in 5-10 years. It's just obsolete these days.

That's just incorrect. Windows will continue to exist for years yet, and with a new CEO and a fresh attitude, so will Microsoft. They'll be a strong contender in the market for a long while.

Windows as we knew it, however, is dead. The 9x paradigm which we have known since Windows 95 is being left with Windows 7. Windows 8 is the start of a new Windows, which you will see transformed in new ways. Don't kid yourselves, universal applications are going to bolster Microsoft's mindshare.

[bandit_liberty_rumble]

Windows days will be numbered when other software makers start publishing their software for either Linux or OSX platform as well. T 

Linux is still not a viable consumer platform. And OS X or rather Macs are too expensive for the masses. Until that changes it will always be a minority platform. With the amount of developer support it gets, I don't really see that as an issue though.

 

One thing's for sure though, the days of total market domination by Windows are thankfully numbered. It's only one of many valid options now.

[+Anarkii Subscriber²]

That's just incorrect. Windows will continue to exist for years yet, and with a new CEO and a fresh attitude, so will Microsoft. They'll be a strong contender in the market for a long while.

Windows as we knew it, however, is dead. The 9x paradigm which we have known since Windows 95 is being left with Windows 7. Windows 8 is the start of a new Windows, which you will see transformed in new ways. Don't kid yourselves, universal applications are going to bolster Microsoft's mindshare.

I agree with you on your first sentence, but saying Windows as we know it is dead is just not true. We will never have a exclusive start screen with apps on the desktop. NEVER. Metro is built for touch devices only, and everyone knows it. Desktops require the desktop UI or some form of it with windows and multitasking. I simply cannot see a future for M$ if they choose to go the one UI of Metro for both touch and desktop computing. 

I cant imagine ever using my 3D intensive programs or Photoshop within a Metro app. It would be so dumbed down it would be unusable. So Windows 9 will be based on Windows 7 (which is evident through the start menu) and the recent windows 8.1 update. 

Once they seperate the UI, they will be onto a winner, and it may pick up hardware sales as well.

[Dot Matrix]

I agree with you on your first sentence, but saying Windows as we know it is dead is just not true. We will never have a exclusive start screen with apps on the desktop. NEVER. Metro is built for touch devices only, and everyone knows it. Desktops require the desktop UI or some form of it with windows and multitasking. I simply cannot see a future for M$ if they choose to go the one UI of Metro for both touch and desktop computing. 

I cant imagine ever using my 3D intensive programs or Photoshop within a Metro app. It would be so dumbed down it would be unusable. So Windows 9 will be based on Windows 7 (which is evident through the start menu) and the recent windows 8.1 update. 

Once they seperate the UI, they will be onto a winner, and it may pick up hardware sales as well.

On the contrary, that is exactly where Microsoft is heading. Even if things don't look *exactly* the same, the experience is going to be the same. Between Live Tiles, universal apps, and OneDrive syncing of devices, Windows *is* changing, and Metro is a big part of that change. Windows, as we knew it, is dead. Windows 7 is the last of the "pure" desktop operating systems. Windows 8 has ushered in a new era in how we do things.

 

(BTW, you've used Metro on the desktop for years with a mouse. Why all of a sudden is i "just for touch?" Hint: It's not. ;) )

[bandit_liberty_rumble]

Windows, as we knew it, is dead.  

if you say so...

[neo1911]

Microsoft should have bridged the gap better, and it sucks when you're trying to sell a computer that has bad reviews, only for the reviews to be about Windows 8 and absolutely nothing to do with the hardware at hand. :/

Same applies for Android based handsets.

I for a change am enjoying the changes in Windows 8.1 update 1.

Windows 8.0 was unusuable. If you buy a PC which has 8.0 installed by mistake then the update process is long and tedious.

[COKid]

Actually, those who are saying Windows is dead might be spot on. Case in point:

 

25 Apr 2014

 

Based on its conference call, Microsoft's new CEO wants to distance the tech company from its storied operating system as soon as possible, CNBC's Jim Cramer said Friday, describing the strategy as a Soviet-style "purge."

 

It was Satya Nadella's first earnings call after taking the helm of the massive company in February, and Cramer said the new chief executive was looking to reposition the tech stalwart as a cloud computing company.

 

Windows, the operating system that helped bring personal computing to the masses in the early 1990s, will still make Microsoft money?but the company just doesn't want to talk about it, Cramer said.

 

"This is a Window's purge call," Cramer said on "Squawk on the Street." "You cannot hear Windows. They try to avoid it. It's almost as if he's rebranding the company right here, right now."

 

Read More Microsoft earnings: Nadella has a message for Wall Street

 

Microsoft beat expectations when it reported fiscal third-quarter earnings Thursday, sending shares on an up-and-down ride during Friday's trading session. The shares opened higher, only to fall slightly before noon.

 

Source w/video: http://www.cnbc.com/id/101614218

[(Account no longer active)]

I bought a Windows 8.1 disc but ended up returning it because Windows 7 does everything I need, and I prefer it. I'll never forget the day trying Windows 95 for the first time (coming from a Macintosh background). I remember thinking 'wow, this works so much more smarter' (in relation to the 'new' Start menu at the time).

 

On another note, I was disappointed that Windows 7 Upgrade/Full Retail was no longer available for purchase (to upgrade a family member's PC still running XP).

 

I was going to buy a Windows Phone however after trying it out for a while at the store there just wasn't any 'wow' factor. I went to the store with high expectations having waited a year to see what Windows Phone would evolve into. I left after deciding to stick with Android.

 

My PC is about two years old and should last me another five years, at least.

 

Many people are in the same situation as me. Unfortunately, this isn't good for Microsoft, and I don't think there's much they can really do about it.

 

When I look back, there was some amazing turnarounds at Microsoft over the years. Microsoft learned lessons from Windows ME and Vista, and ended up producing pretty much perfect OSs (XP, 7). Windows 8 can be the basis of something great - I just hope they deliver with Windows 9.

 

Finally, Office Online and similar apps have given users a whole lot more flexibility with OSs.

[Dot Matrix]

Pfft. Jim Cramer is a buffoon.

[bandit_liberty_rumble]

Pfft. Jim Cramer is a buffoon.

Isn't he basically saying the same thing as you? Just replace "Windows" with "Windows as we knew it":

 

 

This is a Window's purge call," Cramer said on "Squawk on the Street." "You cannot hear Windows. They try to avoid it. It's almost as if he's rebranding the company right here, right now."

 

And they are in fact (thankfully) also getting rid of the brand "Windows" in a lot of their products

[PGHammer]

I don't know about being 'doomed', but Microsoft certainly faces more competition, not so good economies around the world, and a saturated computer market.

The saturated computer market and a FLAT requirement base (what are the hardware requirements for Windows 8.1 compared to Vista, for example) means that it's certainly not existing software - even in terms of the OS - pushing a need to upgrade.  Not upgrading the operating system is the "chicken choice" - however, it's also the EASY choice as it costs nothing to stay put.  Mobile hardware obsolesces MUCH faster than desktop-formfactor PCs - in fact, it obsolesces faster than portable PCs.  Therefore, instead of upgrading their PCs, folks are buying smartphones or tablets or phablets - ALL of which obsolesce faster than a PC of any sort.

 

In fact, the fast obsolescence of mobile hardware is ALSO getting complained about here on Neowin - smartphones that are useless before the contract is over are beginning to REALLY hork folks off.  (That's why T-Mobile's UnCarrier strategy is working - why go with a two-year contract for a device that will be overtaken by events at the contract's halfway point?)  However, can Google - or Apple - afford to slow down the pace of mobile hardware upgrades?  (Apple HAS slowed down - dramatically - the pace of upgrades for the iPods - and where are they today?  Largely moribund, if not outright flat.  I think that is one reason why both companies are pushing - and pushing - change after rapid change for both Android and iOS, despite the demand from consumers that both companies slow down the rapid obsolescence of mobile hardware; they are afraid of winding up where Windows is - locked into a cage of largely-unchanging requirements.

[Melfster]

Guess what the most popular version of android is?  Its not the lastest version.  Its  4.1 followed by gingerbread 2.1.  Kikat is only at 2% market share.  This is also major problem for google.. Because nobody is upgrading their OS.