Linus Reviews HTC One M8 for Windows

[+LogicalApex MVC]

Very good review overall. The reality is Windows Phone isn't a platform for an enthusiast as it just lacks far too much and Microsoft seems content with the status quo. Sadly, Windows Phone is more locked than iOS without the marketshare and clout to force developers and users to cater to its limits.

 

When I look at what was great about Windows Mobile I see it living on in Android. Sadly, Microsoft has failed to gain traction in an iOS clone (business model, not UI) and they likely are too late to correct it.

 

Yep they threw the baby out with the bathwater. Only time will tell if throwing their existing Windows Mobile customer base off a cliff will help them or harm them...

At the very least it will give their competitors a large influx of customers (as many have delayed purchases to see how 7 shakes down) as many switch from Windows Mobile to something else...

They are starting not only the OS over, but their customer base too. Not to say it will make Windows Phone 7 a failure, but it definitely makes the success story a lot harder to achieve. And if they don't get strong sales early on they might run into a problem convincing OEMs and Carriers to pickup the platform.

They aren't too late, but they do need to be gambling wisely.

 

Throwing the enthusiast market to Android has proven to be the biggest blunder MS made in mobile...

 

I see. That's crazy. Unbelievable how the three big companies sometimes seem more interested in tripping each other than to offer us better solutions.

 

The sad reality of competition. The companies will only work together to the extent that it helps themselves.

 

Oh yes, on the topic of dialing: Either set up speed dial, pin the contacts to your start screen, or just tell Cortana to call that person. Seriously, learn the phone you're reviewing.

The lack of T9 is a drag. It should be included. I don't use voice services on any platform (I don't like them). I also wouldn't pin contacts to my screen. Just not something I like to do. I prefer to dial via T9. I was always hoping it would come to Windows Phone during my 2 years with the platform.

[vcfan]

came in here with a bag of popcorn expecting a Linus Torvalds windows product review. left disappointed. 

[Dot Matrix]

So no "official" app then?

Yes, there is an official app, but Google forced Microsoft to essentially castrate it. All it is now is just a web wrapped to the mobile site.

 

It's right here, if you want to take a look: http://www.windowsphone.com/en-us/store/app/youtube/dcbb1ac6-a89a-df11-a490-00237de2db9e

[+Random Stranger Subscriber¹]

came in here with a bag of popcorn expecting a Linus Torvalds windows product review. left disappointed. 

 

you are not the only one....

[+Warwagon MVC]

Review was spot on. It was my experience on the Windows phone as well.

 

I just didn't find it very useful.

 

I will give WP 8 one complement though, the voice dictation was incredible.

[BajiRav]

un-objective....

   

 

 

can you name points why it is?

 

 

everything i have heard from actual users points to me that WP is way behind, not only in developer support, but in basic usability.  

as a long time MS fan, i am disappointed, but i am not going to dismiss the points as humorous. i find them mostly upsetting.. as i expected much better of them!

His problem with Windows Phones are

 

- Google services are missing : we all know the history

- He doesn't like the UI : subjective

- OS doesn't work like Android : subjective

- keyboard is horrible : highly subjective and the first time I have heard anyone complain about WP keyboard.

 

He could have put more efforts to not come off as anti-WP but when he begins his video by clearly biased statements (all the good points are thrown out as meh nothing special), there is nothing objective left in it.

[+Heartripper Subscriber¹]

Sorry if it's a dumb question, what do you mean with T9 dialing?

[articuno1au]

You can't get Google apps because Google doesn't want to support the Microsoft platform. They have actively blocked the development of a YouTube app by Microsoft because "its not built with HTML 5". This requirement is something they enforce nowhere else. Microsoft released an awesome YouTube app, but Google cease and desisted it..

 

He is right in shooting down that a lot of Google Apps aren't available.

 

His complaint at the start is that apps he regularly uses aren't available for WP. Swype isn't, nor is it for iPhone, but he paints over this by saying it's coming.. Ignoring that Microsoft already support the same functionality (and in my experience it's better on WP, although that's subjective). Wow, he complained about the lack of Swype then says he doesn't use swype typing -_- What a ###### nut.. Also, using a 5.5 inch device and complaining about the size of the keyboard.. Douche hat.

 

He also attacks an app that requires specific hardware support to use (unsurprising given that the HTC One M8 is the only hardware the supports it and it just released.. Oh and it comes with a HTC version of the app he is whinging he doesn't have..).

 

He proceeds to lambast Microsoft for scam apps.. Certainly something they should fix.. Not like they don't exist on other platforms though. Google in particular has had serious issues with scamware and ###### apps. This isn't unique to MS and attacking the OS as a whole for this issue just reeks of bias.

 

His attack on the navigation is semi justified. It is a little counter intuitive. That having been said, it's merely a different way of approaching navigation. It's not stupid, and in the context of the rest of the operating system it does make sense. He does, however, overplay the issue.

 

His T9 dialing (pressing a number and having names suggested that contain that number) issue is a pain in the ass, especially given Microsoft had it in Windows Mobile 4 (which is older than me >.>). However he overplays this by going Phone -> People -> Phone instead of cutting out the original step and going straight to people to dial. He also has multiple phone numbers set on the Windows Phone side whilst he has default dialing on Android. Bit of ###### again.

 

He does highlight some awesome things with regards to notifications and alarms as well as quick access to customisable toggles. He calls out Cortana for being awesome (which it really is.. I love Google Now, but Cortana is definitely it's equal in a lot of ways (not in some others)). He complains that you can't control volume or screen brightness by voice... Seriously? Press the damn button you ######. Also, technically you can control these, you just need to install an app. He is right about having to hit the button repeatedly. It's annoying as balls and has been addressed in part in the next operating system release (8.1 GDR2).

 

He proceeds to complain that you need third party apps like YouTube, which I addressed in part above, but he ignores that IE will play YouTube videos without the need for an App, and the OS provides this functionality to any app that chooses to call it. He complains that pebble's third party app doesn't work for calls (due to lack of API). Well no ######, it only just got full BT support. It will come, but it's not the deal breaker he claims it is for the OS in general. It might exclude some people, but not everyone. DropCam point is moronic.

 

His complaint really is that it's not Android. He has a workflow that he likes, and he's bitching out the OS for not supporting him seamlessly. Seriously..

 

Windows Phone isn't for everyone, but attack it for the stuff it realistically fails at. This video is appalling. I generally like his reviews, but this is pants.

[George P Global Moderator]

The whole Google apps/services bit is a joke in this case, let's blame the OS for google not wanting to support it, ok.   It's also funny how they wanted MS to make the youtube app HTML5 and said this is a requirement but then not even their own official apps for android and iOS use HTML5.  It's so petty and silly at this point, good thing I don't care about Google apps and services like some of you seem to, I'm good with the alternatives and my one throwaway gmail account works just fine on WP, so that's all that matters in my case.

 

Metrotube is also great, if you haven't bothered to even try it and complain about no good Youtube app then your review is a joke from the get go, in many cases, even on the other platforms, the 3rd party apps can be better than the official ones.   Sure there's still an app gap, no doubting it, but it's changing, Spotify, which I use, is now on par with the other platforms.    MS is also doing what it can, it's only being slowed down by the carriers holding back updates.  WP8.1.1 is another nice update to the OS, and what i'm hearing about update 2, or 8.1.2 if you will, sounds good to.  

 

In short, this review is a joke if I've ever seen one.

[Guest]

I guess I am no one. I love it, it feels good.

[(Account no longer active)]

WP users: go and try an Android M8 before commenting (note UI completely customizable).

[Steven P. Administrators]

Microsoft had a YouTube app but Google being what it is, blocked it and that's not the only service they "dumb down" or block for Windows Phone. https://www.neowin.net/news/scroogled-google-blocks-microsofts-youtube-app-again

[George P Global Moderator]

WP users: go and try an Android M8 before commenting (note UI completely customizable).

 

 No one said anything about Android and only about WP,  we should suddenly go and get the Android version of the M8 now, for what exactly?   You could say that trying any Android phone is the same, the OS is what the OS, like any WP phone will give you the same thing.  Unless you love HTCs blinkfeed so much, but I doubt it.    There's no need to do what you suggest in this case. 

[Dot Matrix]

WP users: go and try an Android M8 before commenting (note UI completely customizable).

What does that have to do with anything here?

[theyarecomingforyou]

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/05/24/microsoft_pulls_youtube_winphone_app/

 

TL:DR Microsoft made a gorgeous youtube app for WP8.  Google issued a takedown notice, Microsoft made changes that they asked for and republished, Google proceeds to make up ###### and issue another takedown notice, Microsoft caves and reverts to the terrible previous app.  Google are ######.

According to that article it was removed because it didn't display ads and allowed users to download videos, both of which are against the T&C. I'd be surprised if it wasn't removed. Given how popular YouTube is Microsoft should have done everything in its power to work around Google's demands, as Apple has done.

 

Therein lies the problem.  He calls it as HE sees it, not everyone else.

 

I rather see an unbiased review, not some twit telling everyone who a phone is for(or in this case not for).

I think his assessment is spot on. When you consider that Windows Phone has less than a 3% worldwide market share it's hard to argue that he's wrong for saying it's a phone for 'no-one'. His review isn't biased, he just doesn't like Windows Phone.

 

The whole Google apps/services bit is a joke in this case, let's blame the OS for google not wanting to support it, ok.   It's also funny how they wanted MS to make the youtube app HTML5 and said this is a requirement but then not even their own official apps for android and iOS use HTML5.  It's so petty and silly at this point, good thing I don't care about Google apps and services like some of you seem to

People don't care why they can't access Google services, just that they can't. The reality is that most people do use Google services and it's a perfectly legitimate criticism to bring up.

 

In short, this review is a joke if I've ever seen one.

I disagree. Linus calls it how he sees it from the perspective of a tech enthusiast. I love being on the cutting edge of technology?from mobile phones to PCs?and Microsoft just isn't delivering that with Windows Phone.

[jakem1]

A video by and for people who don't know what they're talking about.

[+LogicalApex MVC]

I think the people who are most annoyed with the review and its attack on WP may be helped to see it from the perspective of where the HTC One M8 for Windows is positioned. It is positioned as an enthusiast phone, but Windows Phone as an OS is severely lacking in areas that are important to enthusiasts. This forms the basis for him saying the phone is a phone for no one. I think people are incorrectly extrapolating his assertion to encompass Windows Phone irrespective of device.

 

The problems for Microsoft with Windows Phone are immense. They gambled wrong and I don't see them making any realistic attempts to right the ship. Although the OS appeals to some, we all have different needs, it won't be doing enough to actually become a real threat to iOS or Android in the foreseeable future. It is a lot like walking. Imagine that there is a person 2 blocks ahead of you that you want to catch up to so you can say hi. It isn't enough to actually walk at their pace if you hope to close the gap between you two. You have to walk 2 or 3x as fast as they do as the only way to close the gap is for you to move faster.

 

Google built Android for a simple purpose... To drive people deeper into Google's ecosystem of services which ultimately feed its Ad machine. This means to pull people off Android you have to top Google's ecosystem of services and make people switch from those as well. The longer Android is allowed to dominate the harder this becomes as the deeper those ties become for the user. This is why Google is so hostile to offering Microsoft parity access to their ecosystem and it won't be changing anytime soon. As icing on the cake, for enthusiasts, Android is also extremely customizable so enthusiasts can make the devices do almost anything and run on almost anything.

 

Apple has the purchase ties that make users reluctant to jump ship in any serious manner. Not only do they have a strong brand, but iOS users tend to buy their apps and content and not pay cheaply while doing so (in addition to often getting new apps first). The longer iOS exists and has a domineering position the more costly it is for the user to switch. They would be losing hundreds of dollars in content (apps, etc.) investments on iOS and might even lose access to sub ecosystems entirely (such as an app that doesn't support third party clients and has no official WP client). In order to counteract this Microsoft needs to continue to get parity among apps, try and get first release priority, and pay users in marketplace credit to switch. None of those are easy.

 

I have said it countless times in the past, but Microsoft adopting an iOS style business model was a problem for Windows Phone. In doing so they lost the enthusiast crowd overnight and the enthusiast crowd tends to be developers and power users who drive a lot of traction for the OS. It is a shame that places like XDA-Developers were founded for enthusiasts on Microsoft devices (Windows Mobile Phone PDAs) now cater solely to Android.

 

tl;dr: It isn't about apps. It is about an incorrect marketing choice by Microsoft and their inability to actually compete with the dominate platforms. Windows Phone lacks any realistic edge that can pull users its way. It is too late for Microsoft to correct this as they haven't even acknowledged that they see the problem yet...

[ctebah]

I think the video is spot on.  People have to realize that the major reason why WP has such a low share is that NOBODY is buying it.  Except for the 3-4% of course.  But seriously, it could be that the majority of the people are just no interested in that platform.  Carriers are not supporting it, OEMS aren't making as many products and developers are not making as many apps.  It's simple, WP is a very minor player when it comes to smartphone market.

[Dot Matrix]

Windows Phone lacks any realistic edge that can pull users its way. It is too late for Microsoft to correct this as they haven't even acknowledged that they see the problem yet...

It has plenty of edge. It offers much in the way of the iPhone, without out being overly open, and succumbing to the multitude of issues Android is. At this point in my life, I don't need a thousand and one fart apps, and I don't need to be flashing my phone with whatever ROM is popular this week. I don't have time for those games anymore. I need a phone that just works, and stays working - and that phone is Windows Phone.

[Guest]

WP users: go and try an Android M8 before commenting (note UI completely customizable).

 

68k-like users, my phone Lumia 920 works just fine, yet you don't see me whine about other phones.

[+LogicalApex MVC]

It has plenty of edge. It offers much in the way of the iPhone, without out being overly open, and succumbing to the multitude of issues Android is. At this point in my life, I don't need a thousand and one fart apps, and I don't need to be flashing my phone with whatever ROM is popular this week. I don't have time for those games anymore. I need a phone that just works, and stays working - and that phone is Windows Phone.

What edge is there? Honestly.

 

As I said earlier, Microsoft has to counter the competitive advantages of each platform appropriately. Android's big pull is Google's ecosystem and its secondary pull is its catering to the needs of enthusiasts users. Microsoft has no answer to either one of these. At present they are left begging Google to bless them with access to its ecosystem. The enthusiast market is very important due to the large percentage of developers that encompass it. Developers passionate about tinkering with the platform usually invest the time to code apps for it...

 

They have an almost 1:1 business model copy of iOS, but they are failing because they lack the historical advantage of iOS. Windows Phone offers a decent alternative to iOS users except they have to counter the reality that users have invested heavily in iOS content and they haven't convinced developers to target their platform first. They also locked the platform so much that they are almost always behind on trends. Like the restrictions mentioned in the video that prevent wearables for properly targeting Windows Phone if they wanted to at present, for instance. There was also the missing Bluetooth LE support that prevented things like the FitBit from coming out with Windows Phone support at the same time as iOS (I think this has been added now).

 

The best the Windows Phone offers at present is a different UI and some interesting hardware features. It doesn't offer any serious edge...

 

This may change in the future, but it is likely too late for Microsoft. They are busy trying to show users that major apps are on the platform while they seem unaware of the real reason people are choosing their competitors.

[ctebah]

What edge is there? Honestly.

 

Windows Phone has virtually no edge over Android or iOS platforms.  Nothing that would be seen as a major feature worth switching.  No matter how many megapixels their high end cameras have, no matter how much free stuff like the office may come bundled, it just isn't enticing to users. 

[Max Norris]

Coming from somebody who owns both a WP and Android phone, I can say there's quite a lot of crap in the thread. They're both quite solid, and I use both about equally. (Although neither of which gets as much use as my Windows tablet, by far.) The apps I personally use are available for both, I honestly don't care who has more of the random crap apps. My WP gets significantly better battery life, much more hassle/trouble free, and has a higher "it just works" factor for what I need it to do. I also personally like having something that's a bit different from everybody else, I'm not one for following the herd, I could give a rat's behind about market share, and I don't have an agenda to drive.. if it works, I keep it, and WP works very well. Both of my phones are getting a bit dated, very likely to just switch to a WP One M8 and be done with it.

Different, yes. But it sounds like the "reviewer" couldn't be bothered to figure out the differences, never mind some complete misinformation.

[pallentx]

Everyone keeps saying WP is severely lacking, but no one lists what? I get the apps are lacking. That's a real and serious problem for WP. But what about the OS is lacking? Is it lacking anything anyone actually cares about? If you have all the apps you personally want, is it "lacking"?

 

I know I'm a minority, but I prefer WP to the others. I use it because I like it most. The UI is super clean, easy to use, but powerful enough to customize to my own workflow. Its the goldilocks between the iPhone and Android. Like many users, I'm not really interested in Snapchat or Yo, or whatever the latest app we all install this week. I use my phone to communicate with people, SMS, calls, social stuff, twitter, FB, etc, banking and a few select apps. For the sake of the platform, yes, they need LOTS more developer support and something may come along at some point that I may wish I could have, but for now, I have what I need and I like that I can chose the phone UI I like best.

 

I have seen numerous articles lately where reviewers express that they love the UI of WP and its a real pleasure to use, but they cant recommend it, or cant use it themselves because its missing apps. That tells me there is something compelling about WP, but its just missing that one thing - apps. That may or may not be an issue for everyone. Its not for me, its not for my parents, its not for my inlaws, who got Android phones and haven't installed one single app in the six months since they got them.

[neo158]

Everyone keeps saying WP is severely lacking, but no one lists what? I get the apps are lacking. That's a real and serious problem for WP. But what about the OS is lacking? Is it lacking anything anyone actually cares about? If you have all the apps you personally want, is it "lacking"?

 

I know I'm a minority, but I prefer WP to the others. I use it because I like it most. The UI is super clean, easy to use, but powerful enough to customize to my own workflow. Its the goldilocks between the iPhone and Android. Like many users, I'm not really interested in Snapchat or Yo, or whatever the latest app we all install this week. I use my phone to communicate with people, SMS, calls, social stuff, twitter, FB, etc, banking and a few select apps. For the sake of the platform, yes, they need LOTS more developer support and something may come along at some point that I may wish I could have, but for now, I have what I need and I like that I can chose the phone UI I like best.

 

I have seen numerous articles lately where reviewers express that they love the UI of WP and its a real pleasure to use, but they cant recommend it, or cant use it themselves because its missing apps. That tells me there is something compelling about WP, but its just missing that one thing - apps. That may or may not be an issue for everyone. Its not for me, its not for my parents, its not for my inlaws, who got Android phones and haven't installed one single app in the six months since they got them.

Exactly. People are spreading FUD but I would like to see, from those people, exactly what apps are missing from the platform as well as what features are missing. That won't happen though because they are happy to cling to the FUD that makes people hate WP.