[OFFICIAL] Windows 10 Insider Program

[PGHammer]

Just as I'm skeptical that a lot of people used the Menu as often as they claimed. Many just use desktop links or pinned items. I've seen far too many desktops with literally every inch of the screen covered in icons. Personally I'd rather use the organization tools in the Screen, or even the Menu , over just dumping everything on the desktop, but a lot of people seem to like that.

 

Me, I use the main part of the Screen for my most frequent items, and All Apps for the rest I do use All Apps at least a couple times a day, and would really prefer the 8.x layout.

What makes it even sillier is that pinning went nowhere with 8, 8.1, or even 10.  In the absence of the Start menu, you could pin from the StartScreen, etc.

 

Due to the migration from Control Panel to Settings being incomplete, you can add a shortcut for Control Panel to the desktop. (Added in 10130)

Same applies to This PC.

 

Is it workflow, or complacency?

[PGHammer]

Imho seeing how effortless Windows 10 is to use in comparison (even though far from perfect at this point) despite remnants of the Metro/Win32 dichotomy illustrates in retrospect just how annoying Windows 8 was to use. They're now years into (and far from finished) into fixing Windows 8 which should probably never have gotten into customers' hands.

So tell the OEMs that - they are the ones that (according to you and the other critics) put computers that support touch into user hands with Windows 7 - which didn't support it.

 

If Windows didn't support features OEMs out into their hardware you would (rightly) call Windows a hardware laggard.  Guess what?  Windows 7 was, indeed, a hardware laggard by NOT supporting touch - which was included in a fair-to-decent amount of customer hardware.

 

YOU may not have noticed OR cared (because you didn't move) - however, the OEMs won't stand still just because users do - they can't sell new hardware if they stay put.

 

So how much choice did Microsoft really have with 8 other than going the way they did?  Surprisingly, practically none - despite user recalcitrance.

 

When I evaluated the Developer Preview, I knew about the touch support (and my hardware's lack of it) - however, I didn't evaluate it as a touch-optimized OS.  I evaluated it as a straight upgrade from what I was running at the time (7 Ultimate x64, for those picking nits).  I evaluated newer software (including ModernUI software) compared to existing software (Win32 software for the most part). If it was usable, and beat the existing Win32 software out there, it stayed - isn't that the usual measuring stick?  I didn't use any Start menu bringbacks/alternatives, either - that was an acid-test for ME; could I actually use the OS as-is?

 

Here's what I discovered:

 

Windows 8 (even as a Developer Preview) was just as usable (if not more so) than 7 Ultimate.  (Surprise #1.)

ModernUI software was quite usable despite no touch support in the hardware - while it could use it, it largely didn't need touch to be useful.  (Surprise #2 AND Wrong Assumption #1.)

The Modern UX/StartScreen likewise was usable without touch - even more surprising, it was usable without either touch OR a pointing device; it was actually - yeeks - KEYBOARD-driven.  (Surprise #3.)

Upshot - Windows 8 is less biased hardware-wise than 7. (Necessary going forward, as pointing-device bias was going away in newer hardware.)  However, folks without touch could not only still use the OS, but can use software designed to take better advantage of new feature support (touch, for example) - even if they DON'T have touch support. (Surprise #4 and Wrong Assumption #2.)

 

That led DIRECTLY to my mea culpa with the Consumer Preview.  I was skeptical - I took what Microsoft said with a saltmine, not a mere grain of salt.  However, I was wrong - and was I ever.  And I owned up to BEING wrong.

[+Warwagon MVC]

Trying to use Windows 10 as a daily driver, but just can't. It's in many ways still inferior to Windows 8.1.

 

I still don't understand Microsoft's rational for destroying the superior (user configurable) Win8.1 All Apps UX - 

Screenshot (302).png

 

 

Why not just search for the app you want to use?

 

I never liked the all app screen. it was an overwhelming cluster

[Jackaluichi]

Why not just search for the app you want to use?

I never liked the all app screen. it was an overwhelming cluster

That's something I'll never understand. Even though I like the approach of Windows 8.1 and its Start Screen full app list, I don't have to browse using the narrower counterpart on Windows 10 because of the built-in search.

The only annoyance for me is not being able to configure it for just searching my computer and get rid of the Bing thing.

I'm sure, however, that in the future it will be possible - either officially or not.

[patseguin Global Moderator]

I have no idea where but I don't think it will be stored in HDD but I think it will be in somewhere on your system.  I think BIOS or something...

 

I am sure the key is stored on HDD for system info lookups. ... Right now, you have a preview key...

That doesn't sound right to me. Software won't write to the BIOS and I doubt it would store they key on the hard drive. My guess is that insiders will be emailed product keys. I hope it's that way, otherwise I'll just use the regular 8.1 to 10 upgrade and get a key.

[PsYcHoKiLLa]

Anyone having problems with the Store beta today? Won't install anything for me and it's not showing any updates/downloads.

[Darrian]

Why not just search for the app you want to use?

 

I never liked the all app screen. it was an overwhelming cluster

 I agree, but I shouldn't have been forced to do a search to find a program quickly. That it was necessary proves the UI was not optimal.

[joddie191]

 I agree, but I shouldn't have been forced to do a search to find a program quickly. That it was necessary proves the UI was not optimal.

 

If you know you want to open the Calculator, why go into all apps and scroll down to Calculator when you can just hit the start button, type calc, confirm that the first hit was the calculator and hit enter? 

 

This has been the way it works since Windows 7. You can even hit enter before you see the result visually, and it starts the application right up. Your computer won't run out of resources doing this little task for you. Personally I never went into the start menu in Windows 7 unless I only vaguely remember the application I was looking for (say, if I was looking for on of the utilities included with Visual Studio). In Windows 8/8.1 and now Windows 10 it's the same thing.

 

All that aside, I would have no problem allowing the all apps to be wider for those rare moments when you venture into it to try and remember what that desktop recorder program was called again.

[Darrian]

That was a poor example, because I have a calc key on my keyboard I would simply press to launch the calculator.  However, to address your question: With Windows 7/Start8/Start10 I pin frequently used apps on the left, and I manually edit the contents  of my start menu folders by pulling the programs out of subfolders and into the root folder, deleting the folders created by programs I install after Windows and getting rid of links to readmes, websites, uninstallers, etc.  This creates a less cluttered all programs menu that makes it very easy to find my programs.  I will type to find a program if I am already using the keyboard, but when using a mouse I find it inconvenient to have to relinquish it so that I can type to find a program.  The whole point of the start menu was that it was designed for mouse navigation.

[Ian W]

If you know you want to open the Calculator, why go into all apps and scroll down to Calculator when you can just hit the start button, type calc, confirm that the first hit was the calculator and hit enter? 

 

This has been the way it works since Windows 7. You can even hit enter before you see the result visually, and it starts the application right up. Your computer won't run out of resources doing this little task for you. Personally I never went into the start menu in Windows 7 unless I only vaguely remember the application I was looking for (say, if I was looking for on of the utilities included with Visual Studio). In Windows 8/8.1 and now Windows 10 it's the same thing.

 

All that aside, I would have no problem allowing the all apps to be wider for those rare moments when you venture into it to try and remember what that desktop recorder program was called again.

No, since Windows Vista.

[joddie191]

No, since Windows Vista.

 

Snap, you are right, but it's the same idea.

 

 

That was a poor example, because I have a calc key on my keyboard I would simply press to launch the calculator.  However, to address your question: With Windows 7/Start8/Start10 I pin frequently used apps on the left, and I manually edit the contents  of my start menu folders by pulling the programs out of subfolders and into the root folder, deleting the folders created by programs I install after Windows and getting rid of links to readmes, websites, uninstallers, etc.  This creates a less cluttered all programs menu that makes it very easy to find my programs.  I will type to find a program if I am already using the keyboard, but when using a mouse I find it inconvenient to have to relinquish it so that I can type to find a program.  The whole point of the start menu was that it was designed for mouse navigation.

 

I can see that point, same with touch really then.

[TAZMINATOR]

That doesn't sound right to me. Software won't write to the BIOS and I doubt it would store they key on the hard drive. My guess is that insiders will be emailed product keys. I hope it's that way, otherwise I'll just use the regular 8.1 to 10 upgrade and get a key.

I said I have no idea... The post I made is my guess.

Gabe Aul knows more to tell us soon before release.

[Quillz]

Is there a disc image yet for 10130?

[Draggendrop Veteran]

Is there a disc image yet for 10130?

Not sure, but...If you upgraded to Build 10130, the ESD file should be there..., you will be able to convert to ISO

[TAZMINATOR]

Is there a disc image yet for 10130?

 

Yes, it's out there .. Both ISO and ESD.   If you get ESD, you will have to convert it into ISO. 

[Boo Berry]

Yeah, I just grab the ESD from the Windows Update servers and convert it to an ISO and install cleanly.

[TAZMINATOR]

If you know you want to open the Calculator, why go into all apps and scroll down to Calculator when you can just hit the start button, type calc, confirm that the first hit was the calculator and hit enter? 

 

This has been the way it works since Windows 7. You can even hit enter before you see the result visually, and it starts the application right up. Your computer won't run out of resources doing this little task for you. Personally I never went into the start menu in Windows 7 unless I only vaguely remember the application I was looking for (say, if I was looking for on of the utilities included with Visual Studio). In Windows 8/8.1 and now Windows 10 it's the same thing.

 

All that aside, I would have no problem allowing the all apps to be wider for those rare moments when you venture into it to try and remember what that desktop recorder program was called again.

 

Keep this in mind... not many people know more than you do about getting more out of Windows....  they could look up on book or videos....  not smart like you are... 

 

I know more than my family do... 

 

I usually use hotkeys most of  time instead of clicking clicking clicking...

[vcfan]

Hmm interesting. I wonder how it "stores" they key? If I wipe my hard drive and do a clean install, where is it getting my key from? Insiders don't get a special installer with the key embedded do they? I imagine that would be pirated beyond belief.

 

only logical explanation is that its tied to your Microsoft account, and you have to sign in to activate. like you said, it cant store it on disk, because you're going to format. its not going in TPM or UEFI because not all devices have that, and they certainly aren't going to flash legacy bios either.

[WinMunkee]

*hits windows key, types "calc", hits enter*

 

Welp. It seems to work the same way in Windows 8 / 8.1 / 10. What's the big deal?

[Darrian]

Nothing? AFAIK nobody said it wouldn't work.

[Quillz]

Yeah, I just grab the ESD from the Windows Update servers and convert it to an ISO and install cleanly.

How do I do both of these things? I'm thinking of putting Win10 on my ThinkPad, which still has 8.1 on it. I've got a DVD of Build 10074, IIRC, so I'd rather not have to install another whole build on top of that.

[George P Global Moderator]

You know, the ability to pin apps you use the most is still there in the new start menu, it's just on the right side, as a tile, and not on the left in a list.  There's no missing functionality at this point, specially now that you can add more things like music, downloads and so on at the bottom, which used to be on the right side and so on.   Now that jump lists are back in I don't see what else is missing from the new menu that was in the old one.

 

I do agree that there should be a more "full screen" all apps option, for those that want it, but that's about it, feature wise, that comes to mind.

[patseguin Global Moderator]

I said I have no idea... The post I made is my guess.

Gabe Aul knows more to tell us soon before release.

Ah OK gotcha.

[BeerFan]

Yeah, I just grab the ESD from the Windows Update servers and convert it to an ISO and install cleanly.

 

Sorry for having to ask, but how exactly do you grab the ESD file from Windows Update?

[briangw]

Ugh. They need to fix the OS sucking down the battery life on the SP3. You'd think this would have been done by now.