Russia banned from the 2018 Winter Olympics in PyeongChang

[Tuskd]

Countries only care about the number of medals under their flag. For every individual athlete, this is so much more. In fact, this is the only thing in their lives. I believe many would have gone through the doping thinking that the state will provide them immunity. It is sad indeed.

[+Mirumir Subscriber¹]

 

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The Olympic champions in gymnastics, Simone Biles (USA) and Aliya Mustafina (RUS). In which country do you think they munch pills?

 

[techbeck]

Russia had a room setup next to the testing room where they secretly swapped out samples.  Lets not forget about the withholding of info and repeat offenses as well the number of "athletes" testing positive.

 

Here is a few drugs that were found in Russian testing....

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Metenolone, which animal studies suggest boosts muscle mass and allows for a bigger output of "maximum force." But it has been linked to serious health risks in people, from acne to infertility;

Trenbolone, which is used on livestock to ramp up muscle growth and boost appetite. It is classified as a Schedule III substance (a drug with the "potential for abuse") by the Drug Enforcement Administration;

Oxandrolone, which is currently used in hospital settings to help patients gain weight after an injury or illness but has been linked with severe liver and spleen damage.

http://www.businessinsider.com/drugs-used-in-russian-doping-scandal-2016-6

 

And if I remember correctly, Simone Biles and others got approval and did not try to cover up, hide, or switch samples.  So they went to the officials and were cleared to use them.  The drug methylphenidate is an ADHD medication and the rest are used to treat medical disorders.  Again, approved by the Olympic committee.

 

So, drugs that were approved to be used to treat disorders compared to drugs that were used, hidden, and designed to  build muscle and mass.  Sure does sound like the same thing to me and that the world is out to get Russia...../s   Besides, America is the most hated country so do not take that away from us. 

[+Mirumir Subscriber¹]

 

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An ideal Olympiad the American-style: arrived, lit the fire, waved the flags, handed gold medals to the Americans, bronze and silver to all the rest, put out the fire ... Next year, confiscated bronze and silver medals along with the prize money by a court decision and gave to the Americans.

I'd say this is a good prediction of the 2018 results.

[+Mirumir Subscriber¹]

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One reason is that state-sponsored doping systems -- or at least entire crooked sports federations or teams -- may well exist in other countries...

 

16 minutes ago, techbeck said:

Again, approved by the Olympic committee.

And you are fine with such a blatant example of double standards, aren't you?

[techbeck]

23 minutes ago, Mirumir said:

 

And you are fine with such a blatant example of double standards, aren't you?

No double standards here.  Double standards would be if the US was allowed to use Metenolone, Trenbolone, and Oxandrolone.  Which they would not be allowed to do since they are performance enhancing drugs.

 

US got approval and submitted the proper paperwork to take meds to treat medical conditions.  They went through the proper channels.   Russia lied, hid, and did not get approval, nor would they, to take performance enhancing drugs.  Also, there were lots of offenses on Russias part and cover ups.

 

But I don't want to get in the way of the West's conspiracy to screw over Russia.  

 

I understand how the Russian people are upset, and they have every right to be.  But they shot themselves in the foot here and no one's fault but their own.  Russians are good competitors so they will be missed from the Olympics not only by Russia, but many other countries who want/like the competition.

Edited December 6, 2017 by techbeck

[DocM]

4 hours ago, Mirumir said:

 

 

Aother view of Simone Biles, and please understand that these two women have completely different body types.

 

 

 

[techbeck]

9 minutes ago, DocM said:

 

Aother view of Simone Biles, and please understand that these two women have completely different body types.

Body type does not really matter since performance enhancing drugs were not found when Simone was tested.  If they were, she would have been stripped of her medal.

[Jim K Global Moderator]

4 hours ago, Mirumir said:

 

 

hmmm...wonder why they didn't use this (or similar) photo of Aliya Mustafina as a comparison.  

 

 

Besides, the thread you linked to has already been hashed.  It is already known that Simone Biles has ADHD (since she was a kid) and already had approval from WADA to continue her medication (i.e. therapeutic use exemption).

[FloatingFatMan]

Let us all not also forget Russia's loooong history with drug cheating in the Olympics. Anyone else remember the 80's and before, when Russian athletes, especially the women, all looked like tractors? Hell, some of them had longer beards than the men!

[+Mirumir Subscriber¹]

1 hour ago, FloatingFatMan said:

Let us all not also forget Russia's loooong history with drug cheating in the Olympics. Anyone else remember the 80's and before, when Russian athletes, especially the women, all looked like tractors? Hell, some of them had longer beards than the men!

We don't forget either, starting from Stella Walsh and going to Caster Semenya.

 

Oh and, 

 

Two British athletes born male set to compete as women in Olympics

 

 

Hypocrites.

[FloatingFatMan]

1 minute ago, Mirumir said:

We don't forget either, starting from Stella Walsh and going to Caster Semenya.

 

Oh and, 

 

Two British athletes born male set to compete as women in Olympics

 

 

Hypocrites.

Semenya IS a woman, no matter how much you might dislike that. As for the 2 Brit trans athletes. As long as their testosterone levels are reduced to female levels, it shouldn't be a problem.

 

If they're not, THEN it's a problem.. Do you have evidence that they're not?

 

Stella Walsh... Who? Never heard of her. All google finds is some Polish athlete from 1911, and I'm not going back over 100 years dude.  I doubt there were many drug regs back then.

[Daedroth]

If you get caught cheating, you get punished appropriately. It's not that difficult to understand.

[FloatingFatMan]

29 minutes ago, Mirumir said:

We don't forget either, starting from Stella Walsh and going to Caster Semenya.

 

Oh and, 

 

Two British athletes born male set to compete as women in Olympics

 

 

Hypocrites.

 

26 minutes ago, FloatingFatMan said:

Semenya IS a woman, no matter how much you might dislike that. As for the 2 Brit trans athletes. As long as their testosterone levels are reduced to female levels, it shouldn't be a problem.

 

If they're not, THEN it's a problem.. Do you have evidence that they're not?

 

Stella Walsh... Who? Never heard of her. All google finds is some Polish athlete from 1911, and I'm not going back over 100 years dude.  I doubt there were many drug regs back then.

After a bit more thought on this, and a little reading up, are you seriously comparing known and proven drug cheats to people with known medical conditions who were/are not taking any performance enhancing drugs?  Do you seriously want to go there, and end up looking even more ridiculous? 

 

The only hypocrisy here is your feeble attempts at excusing your country's consistent attempts at cheating whilst blaming others who are not.

[+Mirumir Subscriber¹]

Just now, FloatingFatMan said:

 

After a bit more thought on this, and a little reading up, are you seriously comparing known and proven drug cheats to people with known medical conditions who were/are not taking any performance enhancing drugs?  Do you seriously want to go there, and end up looking even more ridiculous? 

You brought up Soviet women with beards into the discussion.

 

I showed you that intersex and pumped on steroids women competed in Olympiad since the beginning.

 

 

[FloatingFatMan]

3 minutes ago, Mirumir said:

You brought up Soviet women with beards into the discussion.

 

I showed you that intersex and pumped on steroids women competed in Olympiad since the beginning.

 

 

Intersex is a recognised medical condition caused by a birth defect and is not an attempt at cheating. Taking performance enhancing steroids that can cause a masculanisation of a woman is a conscious choice to cheat at sports. There is no comparison here.

 

[+Mirumir Subscriber¹]

5 minutes ago, FloatingFatMan said:

Intersex is a recognised medical condition caused by a birth defect and is not an attempt at cheating. Taking performance enhancing steroids that can cause a masculanisation of a woman is a conscious choice to cheat at sports. There is no comparison here.

 

This is what you wrote last year.

 

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So, what Russia needs right now is for someone big, and by big I mean Putin himself, so ask the IOC why Russian's who've doped in the past are being banned, when other nationalities who've done the exact same thing, are not. This is blatantly unfair and NOT in the spirit of the Olympics at all.

 

It needs to be Putin who asks this, as publicly as possible, because otherwise the media will ignore it.

 

 

[coth]

10 hours ago, techbeck said:

Body type does not really matter since performance enhancing drugs were not found when Simone was tested.  If they were, she would have been stripped of her medal.

Mildronate is not a "performance enhancing drug" as well

[FloatingFatMan]

7 minutes ago, Mirumir said:

This is what you wrote last year.

 

 

None of the non-Russian people you've posted about are drug cheats. Nor were the countries they belong to directly involved in the cheating.  That post of mine was made before this came to light.

[+Nik Louch Subscriber²]

Look let's just face the facts here.  Russia is out.  Not America, Russia.  Lol, this amuses me so much because it absolutely craps all over any response Mirumir can post - any ridiculous body comparisons, any attempts at deflection, and pot shots at other countries - the fact just stands - bye Russia.  These pro-Russia propagandists can peddle their state-sponsored nonsense and it has absolutely zero benefit to them, how frustrated they must be right now.

[Jim K Global Moderator]

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Putin Says Russia Won’t Boycott Olympics, Admits Partial Blame

 

///

 

"Without a doubt, we will not announce any obstacles, we won’t stop our Olympians from taking part if someone wants to participate in a personal capacity,” Putin was cited as saying by the Interfax news agency.

 

Amid criticism that Russia’s leadership has failed to acknowledge any responsibility in the doping scandal, Putin appeared to make a half-apology before hinting that the sanctions are politically motivated. 

 

"First, it must be said outright, that we are in part to blame for this ourselves because we provided a reason for this,” he said. "And second, I believe that this reason was used in not an entirely honest way, to put it mildly," said Putin.

 

"Most of the accusations are based on facts that are not proven at all and are to a significant degree unfounded," Putin added.

 

/snip

The Moscow Times

[techbeck]

All you really need to know here is that others got approval and went through the proper channels to take drugs for medical reasons.  They were not performance enhancing.  Russia, lied, cheated, and hid what they are doing and took performance enhancing drugs.  Now, if anyone still things the West is out to get Russia, they need a vacation to clear their heads.

[techbeck]

3 hours ago, coth said:

Mildronate is not a "performance enhancing drug" as well

It increases blood flow and oxygen in to the system.  So it is argued that it is enhancing.  It But it is a banned substance by the WADA and not allowed.   Russia didnt try to go through channels to be able to use it.  They tried to hid it and when you normally try to hide something like that, you know it is wrong.  Mildronate also helps with hearth issues but again there is no info on whether or not the Russian athletes had a medical condition as they again, lied and cheated.

 

And here is a list of athletes who were banned or had medals stripped for doping.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doping_at_the_Olympic_Games

[techbeck]

Russia ban adds to South Korea's Winter Olympics woes

http://www.cnn.com/2017/12/06/sport/south-korea-olympics-russia-intl/index.html

 

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South Korean Olympic organizers have expressed shock after Russia was banned from taking part in the upcoming Pyeongchang Winter Games.

 

The absence of one of the world's major winter sports powers from the competition adds another stress for the hosts, who are already dealing with lackluster ticket sales in the shadow of the ongoing North Korea crisis.

 

Lee Hee-beom, President of the Pyeongchang Organizing Committee, said in a radio interview Tuesday he did not expect the International Olympic Committee (IOC) "to go this far."

 

 

While the Russian athletes brought this one themselves, and thinking about it a little more, they should have just banned the offenders and put Russia under watch during the Olympics.  Also, I think big part of the issue with ticket sales is NK and the issues there.  If you are a repeat offender, should be a lifetime ban.

[+Mirumir Subscriber¹]

7 hours ago, techbeck said:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doping_at_the_Olympic_Games

Thanks for proving that Russia's case isn't a unique one, but the country is being unfairly singled out.

 

Either implement a zero-tolerance policy or remain to be hypocrites.