FireFox or Opera ?

[megamanXplosion]

Are you gonna compare programs by their size? Seriously, what's the damn logic behind this except for the god bless shorter download time?

You forgot my comment about USB drives earlier.

[Nebuchadnezzar]

I see we're going nowhere, just nevermind. :sleep:

[ZZOOzzoo]

I see we're going nowhere, just nevermind.  :sleep:

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They're just reponding to the zealots who keep claiming Opera is 'bloated'.

[vcv]

I see we're going nowhere, just nevermind.  :sleep:

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The point is that firefox is a BAREBONES BROWSER and is 4.5MB, and opera is a FEATURE-RICH INTERNET SUITE (browser,chat,irc) and is 3.5MB. Both are compressed. Both are cross-platform.

This does not mean that Opera is better, or firefox sucks. But it does show that Opera has more tightly integrated code and less crust.

If you still don't believe that, then I'm sorry. As a programmer, I can assure you it means a lot.

[davegod75]

firefox = free. end of decision

[fanboynz]

Opera might be smaller in filesize, but bloat in the overall interface opera losses there, take a look at default Opera install vs a default firefox install, the default firefox interface is simple, no nonsense, easier to understand for a new user.

I'm targeting the newusers because they'd be the majority of ex-IE users, so If these new users tempted fate and tried a different browser, firefox is quiet an easy conversion from IE. Firefox/Mozilla has additional IE friendly rendering (its not perfect, but works well most of the time) , so any unusual IE quirks is found in the webpage, its displayed properly. I've seen numerious webpages not displaying correctly in opera, but looks fine in IE and Firefox, compatibility reigns still.

[mz_]

firefox = free. end of decision

Linux or Windows XP? "Linux is free, end of decision." Get a brain, please.

[mufdvr3669]

opera IS free, actually.

no wonder firefox is becoming more and more hated all over the place, with all the newbies shouting about things they haven't a clue about.

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You forgot to put with an annoying a@# adbar. God no wonder opera is becoming more and more hated all over the place with the noobs shouting out false claims they haven't a clue about. (calling someone a noob on the internet = good diss) ;)

And who the hell cares about which one uses 1mb more of memory than the other. Go buy some more dang ram for $20 and quit complaining.

[vcv]

firefox = free.  end of decision

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IE = free. end of decision.

Opera might be smaller in filesize, but bloat in the overall interface opera losses there, take a look at default Opera install vs a default firefox install, the default firefox interface is simple, no nonsense, easier to understand for a new user.

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http://weakmind.org/opera/startup.png

Hm.. Opera looks smaller for me. That's the default interface I got when I installed it. No modifications.

You forgot to put with an annoying a@# adbar.  God no wonder opera is becoming more and more hated all over the place with the noobs shouting out false claims they haven't a clue about.  (calling someone a noob on the internet = good diss)  ;)

And who the hell cares about which one uses 1mb more of memory than the other.  Go buy some more dang ram for $20 and quit complaining.

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1mb more of memory? It's 1mb more of the installer's download size. Good thing you paid attention.

[speed3okie]

not another one of these topics

[fanboynz]

http://weakmind.org/opera/startup.png

Hm.. Opera looks smaller for me. That's the default interface I got when I installed it. No modifications.

the default install has no adverts? and that strange popdown menu in address bar? that can't be right. theres only one "default" install. not only that people would get confused with an extra set of forward/backward buttons. I'm refering to the absolute default for a new user, who hasnt paid for the product trying Opera, too many buttons confuses the user.

[AcdShdw]

IE = free. end of decision.

no thats not the end of discussion, ie IS NOT free, u have ti buy a computer or a copy of windows in order to get IE.... ie is integrated into windows so thus IE is nt free...

[Michael_C]

opera IS free, actually.

and we don't all agree that paying for opera is not worth it.

oh well, i don't expect you brainwashed firefox fanboy newbies to understand, or to even read the discussion. this has been discussed several times in this very thread, but you just had to jump your 133t open-source fanboy butt in here and start the whole thing all over again.

no wonder firefox is becoming more and more hated all over the place, with all the newbies shouting about things they haven't a clue about.

585303342[/snapback]

I think your signature speaks for your maturity, 'nuff said.

Opera might be smaller in filesize, but bloat in the overall interface opera losses there, take a look at default Opera install vs a default firefox install, the default firefox interface is simple, no nonsense, easier to understand for a new user.

I'm targeting the newusers because they'd be the majority of ex-IE users, so If these new users tempted fate and tried a different browser, firefox is quiet an easy conversion from IE. Firefox/Mozilla has additional IE friendly rendering (its not perfect, but works well most of the time) , so any unusual IE quirks is found in the webpage, its displayed properly. I've seen numerious webpages not displaying correctly in opera, but looks fine in IE and Firefox, compatibility reigns still.

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Exactly, if Opera included any features I needed that Firefox didn't include I would consider it but there aren't any, with Firefox I can choose exactly what I want on top of the basic browser.

[lav-chan]

You forgot to put with an annoying a@# adbar.  God no wonder opera is becoming more and more hated all over the place with the noobs shouting out false claims they haven't a clue about.

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Uh, what's false about saying that Opera is free? It costs nothing, therefore it's free. Whether it comes with an advertisement or not makes no difference at all. It doesn't inhibit your use of the product, there's no trial period, it's just an ad banner. That's like if i said that listening to the radio is free and you said NUH-UH IT HAS COMMERCIALS GOD STOP LYING AND SHOUTING FALSE CLAIMS U NOOB.

The advertisements are extremely annoying, and i don't really know why anybody would want to use Opera while they were enabled. But saying that people are 'shouting out false claims they haven't a clue about' is just completely fallacious. It is free. Comes with a really really annoying ad banner, but it is free. So, uh, noobs should probably stop shouting false claims they haven't a clue about when they bitch at people for calling Opera free.

Also i really wish they'd hurry up with Opera 8. :/

[Elliott]

Uh, what's false about saying that Opera is free? It costs nothing, therefore it's free. Whether it comes with an advertisement or not makes no difference at all. It doesn't inhibit your use of the product, there's no trial period, it's just an ad banner. That's like if i said that listening to the radio is free and you said NUH-UH IT HAS COMMERCIALS GOD STOP LYING AND SHOUTING FALSE CLAIMS U NOOB.

The advertisements are extremely annoying, and i don't really know why anybody would want to use Opera while they were enabled. But saying that people are 'shouting out false claims they haven't a clue about' is just completely fallacious. It is free. Comes with a really really annoying ad banner, but it is free. So, uh, noobs should probably stop shouting false claims they haven't a clue about when they bitch at people for calling Opera free.

Also i really wish they'd hurry up with Opera 8. :/

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But if they're annoying, they do hinder your ability to use Opera. I don't think radio stations with commercials are free, since commercials are extremely annoying on radio. I don't think Opera is free either. Any diehard Opera user will probably spit out Opera is free by using the explanation you just said, but it really isn't. Stop fooling yourselves.

http://weakmind.org/opera/startup.png

Hm.. Opera looks smaller for me. That's the default interface I got when I installed it. No modifications.

Forgot the ad bar. Oh, and Firefox defaults with the link bar turned on, because IE users are accustomed to it. Does Opera even have a link bar?

[vcv]

the default install has no adverts? and that strange popdown menu in address bar? that can't be right. theres only one "default" install. not only that people would get confused with an extra set of forward/backward buttons. I'm refering to the absolute default for a new user, who hasnt paid for the product trying Opera, too many buttons confuses the user.

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The "strange popdown menu in the address bar" is only visible when the address bar is in focus.

I think the point you're trying to make is that Firefox is more friendly to IE users. And it is, because most IE users are idiots that get confused by change.

But to say that Firefox's default interface is better is ludicrious.

no thats not the end of discussion, ie IS NOT free, u have ti buy a computer or a copy of windows in order to get IE.... ie is integrated into windows so thus IE is nt free...

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Free is free. You can get IE for free whether or not you pay for windows.

But if they're annoying, they do hinder your ability to use Opera. I don't think radio stations with commercials are free, since commercials are extremely annoying on radio. I don't think Opera is free either. Any diehard Opera user will probably spit out Opera is free by using the explanation you just said, but it really isn't. Stop fooling yourselves.

Forgot the ad bar. Oh, and Firefox defaults with the link bar turned on, because IE users are accustomed to it. Does Opera even have a link bar?

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Yes, it has a link bar.

Firefox caters to the newbies, but that's not always a good thing. Opera is a more advanced product, not a more confusing product. There is a big difference. Some of the best things in the world are the hardest to learn.

[Elliott]

Firefox caters to the newbies, but that's not always a good thing.  Opera is a more advanced product, not a more confusing product.  There is a big difference.  Some of the best things in the world are the hardest to learn.

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In my opinion (and I really don't want to start a flame war; I'm just using this as a comparison), OS X is much better than Windows, and the learning curve a lot less. I've seen people do things with their Macs that they could only dream of doing on their PCs as easily. Same goes for Firefox. The ease of use and safety in browsing makes people really want to browse more. Firefox's ease of use caters to the newbies, but it has its powerful backend of XUL and Gecko to give it a punch that delivers an awesome experience for both advanced users and newbies alike.

[gigapixels Veteran]

Firefox caters to the newbies, but that's not always a good thing.  Opera is a more advanced product, not a more confusing product.  There is a big difference.  Some of the best things in the world are the hardest to learn.

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I laugh in the face of your ignorance HA HA HA HA HA

I'm no newbie, buddy, and I love Firefox. Is it because it's less "advanced"? NO. I find Firefox to be a lot faster and better for my uses than Opera is. Opera just seems to be very mediocre to me.

[AZKABAZ]

I tried both Opera and Firefox to see what worked for me. I run on 800x600 and no matter how much i tried to customize the Opera GUI i just did not like it and it always felt clutterd. Also, it did not feel right to use not to mention that first day of trying Opera, I got a trojan in my Temp file...... so that was that, no Opera for me.

Firefox does what i want which is to browse the internet and be ad free (ad block)... minimal GUI works nicely on 800x600 never had a virus or Spyware problem with it and it feels right for me. Only complaints would be to have a nicer skins available and mabey a better download manager because mine always breaks.

Firefox is the go for me :)

[d_ralphie]

Are you gonna compare programs by their size? Seriously, what's the damn logic behind this except for the god bless shorter download time? They're 2 different programs coded in completly different ways. For me that's simple fanboyishm.

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are you even paying attention? you claimed that

Opera uses a more advanced compression method for the installer and the exe which eliminates any real comparision

i just showed you that you are wrong, and that the smaller size is not just due to compression.

[d_ralphie]

firefox = free.  end of decision

585305911[/snapback]

opera = free. end of discussion.

Opera might be smaller in filesize, but bloat in the overall interface opera losses there, take a look at default Opera install vs a default firefox install, the default firefox interface is simple, no nonsense, easier to understand for a new user.

typical firefox fanboii. the default opera doesn't open a blank page, and the start bar only appears if you focus the url field.

the 'opera's ui is bloated' crap is only used by firefox fanbooiiis when firefox's real bloat is mentioned. opera 8 has a far better ui than firebloat.

[gigapixels Veteran]

opera = free. end of discussion.

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Then what's the $39 price tag attached to it? Sorry, but I don't want ads in my browser, and, if so, I would have to pay for it.

Oh, and if you mean by cracking it, then you have absolutely no right to sit up and defend it like the Opera fanboy you are.

[worbd]

Opera might be smaller in filesize, but bloat in the overall interface opera losses there, take a look at default Opera install vs a default firefox install, the default firefox interface is simple, no nonsense, easier to understand for a new user.

I fail to see the bloat in Opera's default user interface. In fact, if you remove the ads, Opera's user interface is a lot more compact than Firefox by default.

Opera doesn't lose on "bloat", because Opera isn't bloated.

I've seen numerious webpages not displaying correctly in opera, but looks fine in IE and Firefox, compatibility reigns still.

I've seen numerous web pages not displaying correctly in Firefox, and Opera handles them perfectly. Slashdot, for example, is not handled very well by Firefox. And Slashdot is one of the major sites pushing Firefox. I'm sure you can see the irony...

Then what's the $39 price tag attached to it?

That's what you pay if you don't use Opera for free. Saying that Opera is not free because it displays ads is riciculous. Are there no free sites on the web? Almost all of them carry ads, remember.

Opera is free because you can download and use it for free. Free is free.

I'm no newbie, buddy, and I love Firefox. Is it because it's less "advanced"? NO. I find Firefox to be a lot faster and better for my uses than Opera is. Opera just seems to be very mediocre to me.

Opera is smaller yet more functional than Firefox. It also fits on mobile phones, which Firefox does not (and Minimo still doesn't fit - they need to strip it down. Opera does not need to be stripped down for mobiles). How you can make something smaller, faster and more efficient out to be "mediocre" is a bit of a puzzle to me.

[worbd]

I tried both Opera and Firefox to see what worked for me. I run on 800x600 and no matter how much i tried to customize the Opera GUI i just did not like it and it always felt clutterd.

Sorry, could you run that by me again? Even if you customize the UI not to be cluttered, it still feels cluttered? So even if you disable all toolbars and menus, or press F11 to go to fullscreen mode, it still feels cluttered?

How, pray tell, is that possible? Something tells me that you are just making things up as you go along here.

Also, it did not feel right to use not to mention that first day of trying Opera, I got a trojan in my Temp file...... so that was that, no Opera for me.

Now this is just uninformed nonsense. Opera is not vulnerable to trojans, and "a trojan in my temp file" probably means that Opera cached a page containing a JS exploit for MSIE, but that doesn't mean that you are infected. By writing what you just wrote, you are proving that you are nothing but an uninformed Firefox fan of the kind that scares people away from Firefox. You are not helping Firefox by spreading FUD about other browsers.

And unlike Firefox, Opera does not have an API which lets trojans and viruses easily hook themselves into the program. So Firefox is actually more vulnerable in that regard.

"So... By the way, I was browsing around with Firefox the other day, and I got a virus! So now I stopped using it. Sad."

[gigapixels Veteran]

Opera is smaller yet more functional than Firefox. It also fits on mobile phones, which Firefox does not (and Minimo still doesn't fit - they need to strip it down. Opera does not need to be stripped down for mobiles). How you can make something smaller, faster and more efficient out to be "mediocre" is a bit of a puzzle to me.

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It's just IMO... The way it feels to me... I don't know, and I'm not saying it IS mediocre. I just don't like the way it works.

But, as I've probably said many times in this thread, to each his own.