iPod vs Zen Micro, iPod mini vs Muvo2


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Find me the most expensive audio player on the market.  :pc:  Either put up, or shut up.

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In Japan, a country far far away, the iPod is a mere Dodge Neon. And yes, you can import them with english configurations.

Also, a lot of audio players in availble in North America are much more "exclusive" than the iPod.

http://www.audiocubes.com/category/Portabl...P3+Players.html

Sigh, we should criticize Apple's ub3r marketing department, not the poor, manipulated fanboys :/

i would like to take a poll to see how many of u anti iPod people have actually used one before. there might be better players out there, but the iPod isnt a bad product, i dont understand what everyones deal is. and forgive apple for trying to sell a quality product monkeh its not their fault they are trying to like make money.

I bought a ipod 20 gig.. and really wish I had got a silver ipod mini.. I only really use my ipod at the gym, and it feel fragile.. most people at the gym have mini's.. and they come with a belt clip.. and dont get scratched up..

mine is so scrached and ive only had it 1 month..

bah :(

if i was buying a an mp3 player today i would consider creative. but when i bought my ipod mini a while back creative didnt have anything that could compete (i really didnt care for the muvo2). apple had the best player in its class. that being said my mini is far from perfect, i hate having to recharge it every other day and i hate itunes. but otherwise it does everything i could want from it. the sound quality isnt that great but all of these mp3 players have bad sound no matter what all the "audiophiles" will tell you. If i were buying an mp3 player today id just head to a store and try them all and pick which ever i liked the best.

When I get home Im going all the way for the new Creative model. Those things are smooth, tiny, durable, and have Creative's quality sound. Ive used an iPod before. They are nice, yes, if you like carrying around a harddrive. The only thing I dont like about them is that #1: I dont really need anything bigger than 1gb to take out with me and #2: The iPod sound quality is sub-par at best. I'm an obsessed audiophile, so sound quality trumps quantity and fashionability every time.

Hold on a sec... my Nomad Jukebox does not use icons. It's exactly the same as the iPod... you search by artists, album, genre, etc. You must be talking about a different kind of Jukebox.

Like what Xtreme $niper said... all the ipod changed from the nomad jukebox was the 'swooshing' action. :yes:

All right... a strong iPod supporter is in the thread. Finally.

Find me the most expensive audio player on the market.  :pc:  Either put up, or shut up.

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You're confusing willingness to pay and availabilty of competitive products. Of course the iPod is going to be more expensive because it was the first product of its genre to be released, giving Apple the ability to also set the price standard. New competitive products are not going to come out more expensive because they would not gain any ground in an already Apple-dominated area.

Higher price does not justify better quality either. A fool and his money part quickly, and he is often disappointed afterwards. It pays to not be a fanboy, as you so elegantly put yourself, and read about products before jumping to the conclusion that if it is more expensive it must be better.

Shortages are based on Apple's part too. You think they are going to put more iPods out than they need to, especially now that some real competition has arrived? They'll advertise more, but they won't lose their ass on overproducing if they aren't selling as much.

Man, arguing with iPod fanatics is like arguing with a psychotic wife. From what I have seen/heard/read, most of them are arrogant, foolish and easily manipulated people. The iPod is by far not the best mp3 player available and it is over-priced as well. The UI was copied from Creative's original Nomad Jukebox design(s) and even if it wasn't, it is a very simple interface which would not be difficult to think of whatsoever. I mean some free website templates you find on the Internet have similar, simplistic, minimal menus or UI's. It's good, but nothing special, and not originally created by Apple. From various tests I have performed (4 pairs of headphones, ranging from average to very good), the iPod has a sub-par sound quality and was beat by the Creative Zen Micro and iRiver. However, if you have a quality music file, the iPod does not sound THAT bad, just OK. The battery life, well I think from the many negative stories about the iPod and the easily seen hour differentials (not in favour of the iPod players), I do not need to say anything...

In the end, this is how I look at iPods and their place in North American society.

-- A person who is likely to buy an iPod is also likely to buy a hassle-free HP, Compaq, etc. computer system (and not care whether they have Windows XP Home Edition or Professional Edition).

-- A person who is likely to buy an iRiver or Creative MP3 player is most likely going to research their computer configuration at first and either: build it themselves, buy a less commercialized or marketted, yet higher quality computer system (falcon nw, voodoo etc.) or customize their own computer at a good computer store (choosing good hardware pieces).

iPod's are ok, but you should definitely consider another MP3 player if you really care...

Amen! Like I said... creative are for hardcore people! :yes:

Boy, would I like to get an Alienware PC! I customize me own PC, too. And yes, I do research like crazy before I buy. I guess that's why I end up deciding going for creative products. My girl and sis don't know or care about PCs much... same goes for all those techie stuff and SNR crap... so I guess they just went for the 'coolness' of having an iPod. And it fits them perfectly. No complaints. iPods maintain the balance of the mp3 players universe... they are for the masses. And Creatives are for the hardcore. :yes:

Hold on a sec... my Nomad Jukebox does not use icons. It's exactly the same as the iPod... you search by artists, album, genre, etc. You must be talking about a different kind of Jukebox.

Like what Xtreme $niper said... all the ipod changed from the nomad jukebox was the 'swooshing' action.  :yes:

All right... a strong iPod supporter is in the thread. Finally.

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A new firmware released for the Jukebox last year actually gives you an option for the menu style in the Jukebox. Its either the classic style OR tabbed style with big icons and nice graphics. Nothing special since its only the main menu that gets changed, but whatever. Relate it to the iRiver menu I guess in a way.

Here's the Nomad Jukebox UI/menu, dear sir.

http://www.nomadworld.com/flash/Jukebox_Interactive.asp

And yes, I have a Nomad Jukebox 6gb. My sis has an iPod Mini. My gf has an iPod 4th generation. And if I get enough money, I'll get me a Zen Micro!  :yes:

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OWNED! :woot:

omg u people are the ones that are so arrogant and pompus here. i own an iPod, and i own 5 pc all of which i built with parts i get from either ebay or newegg.com, and i also beta test for MS. so dont u foolish lil SOBs tell me that just because i like a certain product means that i an imbusle to technology. most ipod users i have encountered arent arrogant and pompus and have a superiority complex its just the select few that do. you people especially xtreme, YOHAN, and illz55 are the ones with this lil complex and atittude that has im a foolish idiot written all over it. i really wish a mod would get in here and lock this cause u people always seem to come in to a thread and just bash teh ipod. u guys are nothing but ignorant pompus fools, and i really feel bad for all 3 of u cause it seems that u guys have nothing better to do with your life than to bash and flame over a ****ing mp3 player. Ill pray for u guys in hope that u will find something usefull to do with your lives. Hows bout since u are all knowing about mp3 players, why dont u like use them instead of coming on here with your heads up your asses and listen to some music :D Have a nice day ;)

I dont really see any iPod BASHING going on, just a few stubborn people who fail to admit that there ARE other players, that are cheaper and often more/better features.

Besides - it's a topic comparing the iPod, let us have our petty squabbles. Just leave the thread if you can't handle a bit of criticism.

i can handle critisizm but i cant handle ignorance. i have stated over and over again that there are cheaper mp3 players out there some with more and better features. the person that started the thread asked for an opinion and i gave it to him, but then people like illz55 with his very insightful and helpful post let me quote said that people who use ipods are ignorant with technology and simply purchase one for the sake of having a fasion article. i could care less if they bash the ipod its just a mp3 player, its the basing of users that bothers me then the statement that people that use them are arrogant and pompus. Its hipocracy.

Oh and not owned cause i have a life and the player i was refering to the Nomad 2 which was available at the time of the first iPod released used a system of icons for its UI. I was refering to real mp3 players not mp3 disc players so i was under the impression that he was refering to this Nomad, or perhaps the Zen. That was a misunderstanding on my part.

The whole argument is trivial since it is a matter of personal opinion, i say to the user just go out and try out what u like, and get that. i could care less what the final decision is.

I agree with you that saying iPod users are ignorant with technology is a load of bull****, it's just not true.

I tend to bash the iPod a little, but that's because users like Azadre who ignore PURE fact laid out in front of them really **** me off. I can't help that can I :huh:

:)

I dont see why i'm included in that list of yours? I'm not bashing anyone. If you bothered to actually read each of my posts (which i highly doubt you did) in all these ipod topics, you'd see that I myself have considered a ipod, but turned away from it after experiencing it for myself. I'm not bashing ipod, I just stated the facts based on what I experienced for myself. Got a problem? Too bad, I can express my opinions all I want. I've stated the pros and cons of the ipods, and in the end I got a iRiver. Go cry me a river. Or better yet, an iRiver. ;)

im sorry sniper i didnt mean to include u in that line up, i was rather angry with illz55 and YOHAN and your post was there and i just included u which was a mistake on my part. That im honost about and i dont have a problem with your opinion cause u are intitled to it and i respect that. I dont on the other hand have any respect for illz55 and YOHAN which seem to simply post for the sake of ****ing people off. And i did read your posts and you are one of the only sensible people posting on here, and i am really sorry for including u in that post. Just got caught up in the moment, heh.

Timmah, i know u cant help that and i jsut want u to remember that the majority of users arent stupid like Azadre and saying stuff like that. i know the player has flaws, a couple of major flaws but i like it the best out of all the models and thats just that. Again sorry to sniper, it was a honost mistake on my part.

@MonkeyClaw: AFAIK, you're the one that has done the most flaming (at least in the latter part of the thread), yet you're calling them hypocrites?

Tell us why you like it the most out of all the mp3 players, instead of telling people to get a life just because they stated their opinions.

im am refering to those bashing the iPod users. they were attacking me with insults simply because i use the iPod and i was responding. i have stated on many occasions why i prefer the iPod over other players but i have been responded to with flames from other users. i have only flamed twice in this thread and that was in response to ignorant comments from people who didnt respect my opinion. i am not mad at u monkeh, i am only mad at those that dont have any sense and that dont respect the opinions of others.

A blatent comment implying a vast stereotype is not an opinion, but a flame. I am speaking of the comments made that all iPod users are hardheaded, technological fools who dont know the first thing about anything and simply care about owning the thing as a fasion statement so they can be cool. Thats insulting to me since i own and use an iPod but in no way use it as a fasion item or am in the least bit non hardcore as a pc user would go. These are the people i am mad at that think, believe, and enforce this ignorant stereotype and use it as ammo to disrespect other users.

I have complete respect for well developed thought and opinions, but not for stupid accusations made by those who have their heads up their asses (oops 3rd flame, heh) When i said they were being hypocrites, i was refering to the comment made that ipod users are arrogant and pompus, and rather full of themselves, while the people making these accusations are acting the same way when refering to this product. Again this is a damn mp3 player, we arent trying to elect the next president (which is a totally different matter that i got into many arguments with people over) but again the only people i am really mad at as of now is YOHAN and illz55, especially the latter in this case.

As for why i like the iPod, i will say again is because i enjoy the simplicity of the device. It is easy to use and that makes it enjoyable. Does this mean that i am ignorant in the ways of technology, no, it means that i like listening to my music with ease. This isnt to say that other players are easy to use as well, but imo, the ipod is one of the easiest and i have no idea why, but its fun to use. Thats why i like it, but if someone were to make a decission about purchacing a player, i would simply say try them all and choose which ever they prefer.

im am refering to those bashing the iPod users.? they were attacking me with insults simply because i use the iPod and i was responding.? i have stated on many occasions why i prefer the iPod over other players but i have been responded to with flames from other users.? i have only flamed twice in this thread and that was in response to ignorant comments from people who didnt respect my opinion.? i am not mad at u monkeh, i am only mad at those that dont have any sense and that dont respect the opinions of others.?

A blatent comment implying a vast stereotype is not an opinion, but a flame.? I am speaking of the comments made that all iPod users are hardheaded, technological fools who dont know the first thing about anything and simply care about owning the thing as a fasion statement so they can be cool.? Thats insulting to me since i own and use an iPod but in no way use it as a fasion item or am in the least bit non hardcore as a pc user would go.? These are the people i am mad at that think, believe, and enforce this ignorant stereotype and use it as ammo to disrespect other users.?

I have complete respect for well developed thought and opinions, but not for stupid accusations made by those who have their heads up their asses (oops 3rd flame, heh)? When i said they were being hypocrites, i was refering to the comment made that ipod users are arrogant and pompus, and rather full of themselves, while the people making these accusations are acting the same way when refering to this product.? Again this is a damn mp3 player, we arent trying to elect the next president (which is a totally different matter that i got into many arguments with people over)? but again the only people i am really mad at as of now is YOHAN and illz55, especially the latter in this case.

As for why i like the iPod, i will say again is because i enjoy the simplicity of the device.? It is easy to use and that makes it enjoyable.? Does this mean that i am ignorant in the ways of technology, no, it means that i like listening to my music with ease.? This isnt to say that other players are easy to use as well, but imo, the ipod is one of the easiest and i have no idea why, but its fun to use.? Thats why i like it, but if someone were to make a decission about purchacing a player, i would simply say try them all and choose which ever they prefer.

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Wow, you are quite the egoistical person aren't you! I was not referring to you whatsoever in my post, so please don't assume it was directed at you or any one in particular for that matter. I had actually dismissed reading some of your earlier posts because I read one and it smelled of incoherence and lazy language. Ultimately, if I am ever directing a post at anybody specific, I would just state that.

What I said about ignorance and foolishness in iPod fans/users mostd at most of the "iPod population" that from my own experience had those neagtive personality traits. Also, my analogy of computer buyers and iPod buyers was simply an example. Okay, you build your own computers and beta test for Microsoft, yet you own an iPod and love it. So what? That does not mean I am ignorant and pompous for stating that from my own experience, mostnot like younot like you, but are ignorant, foolish and somewhat careless! Anyways, I've spent more time and energy on you than you (will) ever deserve(d)... Goodbye.

Note: From what I can derive about the meaning of "bashing", I do not believe I ever "bashed" iPod users, but simply stated my opinions which are in turn based on my experiences and knowledge. Finally, could you please point out some stupid accusations or some badly thought out arguments/points that either I or someone else who does not consider the iPod to be as good as the rest of the world does, have brought up? From what I've read in this thread, those who are defending the iPod with all the they can are the ones who have written some incoherent, badly thought out arguments/points and are the ones who should be receiving the least respect.

Edited by illz55

How on earth does my analyzation of a ignorant stereotype make me egotistical?well we can agree on that i have too spent way to much time on such a useless topic which consists of a simple matter of opinion. i am done as well, goodbye.

If anyone has any comments to make concerning me, do it by PM.

Timmah, i know u cant help that and i jsut want u to remember that the majority of users arent stupid like Azadre and saying stuff like that.  i know the player has flaws, a couple of major flaws but i like it the best out of all the models and thats just that.  Again sorry to sniper, it was a honost mistake on my part.

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:) Its ok, I'm sure he understands.

Personally I agree saying all iPod users are ignorant is a big fat lie.

Though there is a higher chance due to the market share going mainly to iPod ;)

Just kidding.

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I was surprised by how well-designed the web portal is. It is fast, pretty, and properly categorized. Well done! Once you have your books loaded, you can highlight or underline text, add annotations, bookmark pages, check the table of contents, and ask AI about the selected text. Unfortunately, the Krono has no built-in vocabulary, but again, that is something a third-party reader could fix. Overall, the built-in reader is light and snappy, with just the minimum amount of features for a regular user to enjoy reading books. The Krono has no built-in reading tracking, so stat nerds will have to look for third-party reading apps. However, you can set a daily reading goal, and the reader will notify you when you reach it (for example, one hour). You can also set a reminder to read at a certain time, and when the time comes, the Krono will light up its back LEDs and unlock itself to nudge you. Other than that, the rear LEDs do nothing, not even showing charging progress, which is an unfortunate misopportunity if you ask me. Quirks aside, Krono's Android runs quite snappily and bug-free. Early reviews of the Krono criticized its Android 13-based software quite a lot, but now, the reader runs Android 15, and its software has fixed plenty of initial complaints. I never experienced any issues with built-in apps. AI attempts The DuRoBo Krono comes with a built-in AI chatbot. There is no information on what model powers this thing, but the system says it was "trained by Google." You can launch the bot from the app list or by double-pressing the dial. It works just like any other chatbot, and you can ask it anything by typing or using voice input. The AI saves your chats, and you can rename, export, or delete them. DuRoBo AI requires an active internet connection, and it does not work offline. Its reach and capabilities are also limited. You can only chat in the app and use it in the reader app as a makeshift vocabulary. However, the implementation is kinda awkward. You can only send a selected portion of text to AI without giving it any requests or instructions. I highlighted the word "dumb," and it apologized to me for not being useful. You also cannot ask follow-up questions or send the generated response to a separate chat. The chatbot is also slow, even with fast Wi-Fi, making the overall experience quite frustrating, which makes me again wish for the ability to remap the double press to something else. Spark, the standard voice recording app, also uses AI for note summarization and transcribing. Neither feature works offline, unfortunately. Spark records notes up to 30 minutes using Krono's dual microphones, and you can rename or export notes. Transcription quality is decent, and the speed is alright, but you can find much better solutions in the Google Play Store. What I like about Spark is that transcribed notes are not locked, and you can always type more to elaborate on your ideas, which is handy. Overall, I like that the Krono is not shoving AI down my throat, but to be honest, there is really not that much to shove. AI features here feel raw and need improvements to be more useful. Battery Life Like most E-Ink readers, the Krono has fantastic battery life. Even with a clock as a screensaver, its standby power consumption is incredibly low. And when in use, you can get weeks of reading on a single charge. Without the front light, my unit never sipped more than one or two percent of battery during a one-hour reading session. It was nice to see plenty of battery-related settings. You can limit charging at 80% to protect battery health long-term, check the number of charging cycles, manufacturing/first-time use date, battery health, and the maximum capacity. Additionally, the Krono lets you select what hardware remains enabled when sleeping. This lets you keep Wi-Fi and Bluetooth on (say, if you want to receive notifications, for some reason) and keep audio playing when locked. Turning these features off effectively eliminates any standby battery drain. I left my Krono sitting for 24 hours with a clock screensaver on, and it did not drop a single percent. The pretty big 3,950 mAh battery justifies the device's thickness and ensures you do not have to charge it for long periods. Speaking of charging, it is capped at only 10W, which is a bit disappointing, as getting such a big battery to 100% takes a notably long time in the era of super-fast charging smartphones. DuRoBo Moodi The Moodi is a standalone, optional accessory for your Krono. It is a wireless remote with two customizable buttons that you can use to flip pages, control media, or scroll webpages. The accessory connects via Bluetooth. Despite having a built-in rechargeable battery, it is extremely light. While the Moodi's shape and form factor is not what I would call particularly ergonomic, it is not uncomfortable to hold and use. The Moodi comes with six removable magnetic buttons with various smiley faces. Buttons sit securely, and they have nice-feeling, albeit a little loud, clicks. It is a cute touch that adds a little more fun and character to the device. There is also an accented power button and a single status LED. The latter displays charging status and connection mode. The Moodi supports three modes: Reading: Buttons work as volume buttons, allowing you to flip pages in the built-in reader or other apps that support page turning with volume buttons. Media: Buttons work as skip forward/backward, which is useful when listening to audiobooks, podcasts, or music. Scroll: The third mode lets you scroll pages in the web browser or any other application The Krono properly detects the Moodi and presents you with an on-screen guide when you connect it for the first time (it also displays the battery level). However, you can only change modes by holding both buttons for a few seconds. It is also worth noting that the Moodi works with other devices. I connected it to my iPhone and it let me adjust volume or control media playback. Sadly, the scroll did not work, so you cannot use it to waste time scrolling TikToks. Overall, the Moodi is a cute little accessory, which I can recommend for those who read a lot. It is very useful for remote page flipping when you do not want to burden your hands by holding the Krono all the time. I only wish DuRoBo included a lanyard for the built-in loop. As for the battery life, after using the Moodi for a few days, I only managed to drop several percent of its 90 mAh battery. Despite the small size, it is rated for weeks of use, which is pretty impressive. At $35.99, I cannot say the Moodi is a must-have accessory, but I see the appeal. I prefer using the Krono with its Smart Dial, as I rarely read for more than 40-60 minutes in one sitting. However, if you have a stand and like reading for long periods, the Moodi is the right thing to have. It is a bit more expensive than regular page flippers on Amazon, but it is on par with similar products from Kobo or BOOX. Plus, it has a little more fun to it with removable buttons and better integration into the Krono. Conclusion At the end of the day, DuRoBo Krono is a nice pocket-sized e-reader. Its software focuses on the main things without trying to be everything at once. The smart dial idea is unique and great, and I wish more manufacturers had something similar in their devices. The display is also good, with an even frontlight and "always-on" support. I did not notice any deal-breaking issues with the Krono. However, you can feel that the idea needs some improvements, such as a slightly stiffer dial in a more ergonomic location, perhaps a little more premium materials, and better software customization. I hope the company won't give up on the idea and improve the dial and ergonomics in the second generation. Buy DuRoBo Krono Black - $279.99 on Amazon Buy DuRoBo Krono White - $279.99 on Amazon Buy DuRoBo Moodi - $35.99 on Amazon As an Amazon Associate, we earn from qualifying purchases.
    • In what way is any of what I said incorrect? To install an update you need to close all browser instances, upping it from once a month to once a fortnight is an inconvenience for users. Particularly when updates don't offer functionality that users want (notably copilot). Security updates should come as they are needed, not on a release schedule
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