Would you ever go back?


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Windows is an excellent OS. Unfortunately it is also very boring. There isn't much that goes wrong with it, you can't get into the guts of it to tweak it the way you want - and it isn't very challenging.

Even after 4 years I still find Linux challenging. Things don't always work - but with sweat and effort and perserverance and intelligence you can often get them to work - eventually. The buzz is when you finally do something you have been trying to do for weeks.

GJ

I love my Linux box. I'll never go back to Windows.

Had to change the password on a PC at work before I sold it off. And I had to get assistance on how to do it :s

We've got a POS Windows machine in the other room. It's there so that mum can play Spider Solitaire.

It's also a good thing when I screw my iPod up too much in Linux and need to starta fresh

Just because we "keep" Window$ to play games that dont run in Linux, or with Cedega, or winex, means we don't like Linux? Man, it's a judgemental jungle out there...

I never said you don't like Linux. I said you tote Linux to be the greatest thing since sliced bread and yet, when you need to, you jump right back into to Windows. Wether it's for playing games,programming or whatever. I'm not being judegmental, I'm seeing it as it is. A bunch of wannabe Ms haters that can't live without Windows...'tis too funny

As soon as someone sides with windows, someone bashes them?? Anyway I have a dual boot with SuSe and XP. I dont think i will ever fully switch over to linux, its just too much trouble to do some of the simplest things, such as install my ATI drivers, that was just rediculous. I love the way linux looks and feels, and will always keep it around, but for me it just dosent quite cut it.

I wouldn't willingly go back to a Windows-only environment. I have Windows sitting on a second harddrive so I can play certain games that aren't supported by Cedega and don't have native Linux ports, but I use Linux for everything else.

That said, playing games is not a big part of my life. So why on earth would I run Windows and Linux when I'm such a "wannabe Microsoft-hater"? Because I can.

Mieky242: That's the thing. Nobody was asking for sides. This wasn't meant to be a Windows vs Linux "discussion" (they very rarely are), but scooby has just gatecrashed this thread and provoked the Linux users with his anti-Linux mockery.

I never said you don't like Linux. I said you tote Linux to be the greatest thing since sliced bread and yet, when you need to, you jump right back into to Windows. Wether it's for playing games,programming or whatever. I'm not being judegmental, I'm seeing it as it is. A bunch of wannabe Ms haters that can't live without Windows...'tis too funny

we arent being microsoft haters, we havent said once in this post that we hate windows or ms. Us that are saying we wouldnt or would never go back to windows, are just fed up with the constant viruses, defragging and spyware, not the OS. I personally dont have a problem with windows, just some of the idiots that use it. Ive also honestly learned alot more with linux than i ever did with windows (used it since 3.1 and dos prompt days) in the past few weeks. Linux just seems more open ended to me then windows did. and remember to plz keep this a flame free thread, i know thats asking alot, but try at least, plz.

I've used Mandrake 10 and Fedora Core 3 with a slew of problems. Debian Unstable has been pretty good to me for the most part. I got no sound but none in Windows either so I think it's something with the piece of shiite onboard card. One other thing i've had problems with is webcams. It seems since I upgraded my kernel, no programs will detect my webcam anymore (Gnomemeeting, Qnext, etc). I haven't been bothered to get it sorted out right away as webcam isn't too important but I will look into it. Anyways, no I would probably not turn back. I'm quite happy with my Debian setup.

I think scoobydoobie misunderstands what this question was supposed to be about. Apparently, he chose not to read the first post where it clearly asks

would you ever go back to only windows?

This question is about using Linux as a primary (or even as a dual-boot) OS. The fact that some Linux users keep a Windows install to play games in is really no more significant than if they had an XBox to play games (OMG! Teh Windoze suxxors! :rolleyes: ). Those people use Linux for their day-to-day computing, and play some games on what amounts to little more than a PC used as a gaming console.

There are some Linux users here (like myself) that use Linux 100% at home. The fact that I use Windows at work doesn't mean anything more significant than my employer uses 100% Windows. There are some just learning and enjoying what they have seen so far. These people may also never go back to Windows only. There are some that try it and just find that they don't like it. In cases where it is a hardware compatibility issue, they my decide to re-visit Linux in another year or so.

I don't hate Windows, nor do I make obnoxious comments about what OS people choose to use.

I also highly recommend that no one try to start a flame-fest in my sections of Neowin. :crazy:

I'm seeing it as it is. A bunch of wannabe Ms haters that can't live without Windows...'tis too funny

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uhm... no :sleep: If it wasn't for windows i wouldn't be with the knowledge of computers and software i have now. I have the upmost respect for Bill, MS, and Windows. Reason i went to Linux is because i wanna learn more, and don't wanna limit my knowledge to just one OS. When LH ships i will be building me a budget/gaming rig for the ability to LEARN that OS too. If it was up to me i'd have Mac for OSX, PC for XP/LH, and my Linux box.

I think scoobydoobie misunderstands what this question was supposed to be about.  Apparently, he chose not to read the first post where it clearly asks

This question is about using Linux as a primary (or even as a dual-boot) OS.  The fact that some Linux users keep a Windows install to play games in is really no more significant than if they had an XBox to play games (OMG! Teh Windoze suxxors! :rolleyes: ).  Those people use Linux for their day-to-day computing, and play some games on what amounts to little more than a PC used as a gaming console.

There are some Linux users here (like myself) that use Linux 100% at home.  The fact that I use Windows at work doesn't mean anything more significant than my employer uses 100% Windows.  There are some just learning and enjoying what they have seen so far.  These people may also never go back to Windows only.  There are some that try it and just find that they don't like it.  In cases where it is a hardware compatibility issue, they my decide to re-visit Linux in another year or so.

I don't hate Windows, nor do I make obnoxious comments about what OS people choose to use.

I also highly recommend that no one try to start a flame-fest in my sections of Neowin. :crazy:

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word, lol.

I never said you don't like Linux. I said you tote Linux to be the greatest thing since sliced bread and yet, when you need to, you jump right back into to Windows. Wether it's for playing games,programming or whatever. I'm not being judegmental, I'm seeing it as it is. A bunch of wannabe Ms haters that can't live without Windows...'tis too funny

The fact that MS controls some markets is not grounds to ridicule those people trapped in those markets. I do not use Windows unless I'm being paid to do so OR the rare occasion comes up that I do need access to OS specific games (actually 99.9% of the time that would be ONE game of which there is no alternative equivalent). I indeed dislike MS, no "wannabe" here I can assure you. Make no mistake about it, any and every moment I spend in Window is done grudgingly.. so much so in fact I have been giving serious consideration to starting a project to bring a client for that game to linux.

And to answer the original question, there would have to be massive changes in the way MS is run for me to ever consider going back to Windows. Massive, sweeping, world shaking changes.

Get over yourself.  :rolleyes:

There's no flame war going on so don't make something into more than what it is.

585780901[/snapback]

Methinks... young, childish, immature......... :no:

Barney

People keep it around because they have to. Unless they're playing Doom 3 or UT2004 (or some other games), they need windows in order to play those games. I'm sure that most of these people would get rid of windows completely given the oppurtunity.

That's true with me. If it wasn't for gaming, I'd be using nothing but Linux. Not that I think Windows deeply s**cks, but it's simply not as smooth as Linux is + Linux can be way more tuned and looks so much better than Windows. Sure, it's a lot of hassle when configuring a fresh installed Linux system, but once everything is in it's place, it's like a dream.

It's truly a pitty I have to use my Windows box daily (next to Linux, of course).

I have to say I'm a noob to linux and succesfully installed Ubuntu 5.04. I have always been a windows user, (Forced by the leading industry), for some number of years now. I also have a G4 laptop running OS X. "Sweet"

I wanted to get out of using the mainstream Windows for a number of reasons, too many to spell out here. Mainly because I like to tinker with the systems and Apple desktops are too pricie for me. Yeah I know I can get a Mac Mini, before anyone chimes in, but theres not much you can do but add memory. No PCI slots or adding a video cards, etc. Let me say that I like the interface in Ubuntu and it seems to be the stable choice as of now. I even got the gdesklets installed. I have tried Mandrake, Mepis, recently Suse 9.3 live. I have been tring these disto's for some time over the past 6 months, I have come to the conclusion that it's just too freakin hard to get use too.

For the normal user it is hard to install software in general. Yeah you can use the apt-get and install software that way and hope that everything works out. For instance,you want to play video's, well just install Mplayer! Right! This may work on 2% of the formats out there. For instance it will not play avi's, wmv's, divx's, xvid's without going through 4 days of searhing user groups to see what codec is causing the problem and try and correct. It took me 2 days to figure out how to play DVD's in XINE. People it should not be this freakin hard.

The file system is another thing that one has to get used to. Nothing like OS X or Windows. For instance try and copy a file to a directory. "You do not have permisison to this directory. I just want to add a freakin file! Yeah I know just use the terminal to do this, BUt what are we back 20 years using DOS again! Apt-Get this, SUDO do that .Install that.

Bottom line: Until Linux gets it in their heads to build a system that one can use on a daily basis without too much trouble, they will stay in the background for a very long time,

Hiya all,

I've just started to understand that different Operating Systems have their different uses and styles. So I'm out of I hate Macs stage (although they're not my preference). But what really gets to me is the ammount of people who absolutely hate Microsoft (read: Micro$oft). I mean, did Linux ever bring out the PDA, Tablet PC, or a Compact Edition that can be installed on devices? Did Apple do the same? The answer is; no. These are things that make peoples lives so much easier. Just look at some of the comments in this very post: "I've just learned out to install nVidia drivers" (paraphrased). I mean, wow. Microsoft made your lives easier, and all most people can do is sl*g them off (read: call them names). Some people need to show some damn respect! Microsoft bought computing to the masses. If it weren't for Microsoft the computing industry would not be what it is today.

I'm not talking about everyone here - I'm not trying to start a flame war.

Edit: Oh yeah, just to add; feel free to delete this post if it sturs up too much trouble; I'm not trying to raise peoples blood pressure here. :)

- Brent

For the normal user it is hard to install software in general. Yeah you can use the apt-get and install software that way and hope that everything works out. For instance,you want to play video's, well just install Mplayer! Right! This may work on 2% of the formats out there. For instance it will not play avi's, wmv's, divx's, xvid's without going through 4 days of searhing user groups to see what codec is causing the problem  and try and correct. It took me 2 days to figure out how to play DVD's in XINE. People it should not be this freakin hard.

The file system is another thing that one has to get used to. Nothing like OS X or Windows. For instance try and copy a file to a directory. "You do not have permisison to this directory. I just want to add a freakin file! Yeah I know just use the terminal to do this, BUt what are we back 20 years using DOS again!  Apt-Get this, SUDO do that .Install that.

Bottom line: Until Linux gets it in their heads to build a system that one can use on a daily basis without too much trouble, they will stay in  the background for a very long time,

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I disagree with everything you post. For the new user it might be hard to install software, if you don't read your distro's FAQ, but once you understand the package management system, it is usually much easier to install software than in windows.

The command line is the best part of linux, and its strongest. It is way more powerful than point and click. I personally HATE the new point and click direction that linux seems to be going, if it gets to where the CLI is as unimportant as Windows, then it basically has become windows. Linux is for the user who wants to understand, not for ignorant spectators.

I hate seeing posts like, I use the network configuration tool and it didn't work, or I used SWAT and samba doesn't work, or my soundcard wasn't autodetected, what do I do? I understand everyone starts somewhere, but I learned on my own, using google, and most importantly the command line.

I use Linux on my desktops and have to say I don't have any trouble. If you want to understand how things work, use Linux or unix, if you don't care, use OSX or Windows.

Well for digital image editing ( ;) ) Theres always Gimpshop

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Thats not even close. The key for designs its not to have a bunch of tools to make pretty things. Its all about color managament. The Gimp do an horrible job in real world color management.

That goes the same way about, for example, color calibrators (none on Linux as far as I know), etc.

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I made a second Storage Pool using TRAID on two 4TB MP44Q SSDs (which, in this instance, is similar to RAID 5), and finally, I added the 250GB 970 Evo Plus drive as Hyper Cache on Storage Pool 1 in Balanced mode. Registering If you decide not to lock down the F4-425 Pro in Security Isolation Mode (blocking all external connections), then you could set up a TNAS device ID through the Remote Access setting in the Control Panel (which must be unique). This works in combination with an online TerraMaster account. TOS 7 TNAS Online Creating a TerraMaster account and linking the device online activates the warranty when you provide proof of purchase and the serial number, but it also gives you access through the TNAS mobile app, which allows you to complete certain operationsб including powering off and restarting the NAS remotely. A TNAS mobile update is required to gain access through TOS 7, and this is provided on the TerraMaster website, as it is not yet on Google Play. The app is evolving all the time and has made leaps and bounds since I first started reviewing TerraMaster devices almost three years ago. It is not quite there yet if you are comparing the likes of Synology, which, sadly, a lot of users online do all the time. OpenClaw setup One of the main selling points of the new F4-425 Pro is the inclusion of OpenClaw, with TerraMaster claiming that it is "powered by the world's first AI-native TOS 7 OS, supporting local-first smart workflows and independent data control." However, I immediately ran into problems trying to enable OpenClaw. After waiting 20 minutes at the "Enabling" message of the OpenClaw app following installation, I decided to do some searching online and discovered that it couldn't complete the installation process due to SPC being enabled, which is something TOS 7 immediately recommends to be enabled on first boot. SPC for NAS (TOS 7) is basically the same principle as UAC in Windows; it blocks executables from being launched by non-Super Users. After reaching out to my contact about these issues, I received the following response: Anyway, this only became clear when I closed the OpenClaw app screen and clicked on the OpenClaw icon in the taskbar; that is when I saw the message about disabling SPC. I think, due to the fact that this is a requirement, this should be a prompt during the installation process, not when closing the App Market and then trying to launch OpenClaw. There's also no 'Getting started' guide for people like me who have never used OpenClaw. I tried to add an LLM and discovered the tutorial led nowhere. That's when I started looking around the official TerraMaster forums, and I found a guide that helpfully explains that you won't get anywhere with OpenClaw unless you have a paid plan, which is disappointing because I imagined there would be an option to use a local LLM as I do in SubtitleEdit with Whisper-XXL. In addition, with the marketing imagery on the official site, it says that the OpenClaw feature is "all processed 100% locally for absolute privacy." which led me to believe that I could install a local LLM, not one that required paid tokens. In any case, TerraMaster does not provide guidance for this new feature, which was also a selling point of the F4-425 Pro! My contact also provided clarification about the above points I raised with TerraMaster Since it is not in the scope of the review to add paid services, I'll leave that to the people who are more qualified with OpenClaw. F4-425 Pro Surveillance App TOS also comes with a Surveillance app, which is not installed by default; it can be found in the App Market recommended section. In addition, after installing, it doesn't drop a shortcut on the Desktop or top taskbar, but you can "Send to Desktop" from the App Market listing for the app for a quick way to open it. Adding my Reolink POE doorbell camera was painless. TerraMaster doesn't appear to have a repository of preconfigured cameras; instead, the camera must be added using ONVIF or RTSP. No mobile Surveillance app TerraMaster still doesn't have a dedicated Surveillance app, although from searching online, Surveillance can be used and managed through the TNAS mobile app. I tried this with the updated TNAS mobile app beta in combination with TOS 7 and got a message that Surveillance was "Only accessible through web browser," so I reckon this must be limited to the stable versions of TOS 6 and the mobile app. More quirks In addition, whenever I minimized the Live View window in the browser Surveillance app, the feed appeared to switch to the Low-bandwidth stream, and there was no way to get the High-quality stream back. To get the High-quality stream back, I had to close Live View and then reopen it. Benchmarking A pretty cool feature of the TOS 7 is that it allows you to install directly to the NVMe M.2 SSD. In order to do that, you would have to leave out any HDDs during initialization, and even then, the system partitions are always written to two HDDs when they are eventually added. With three NVMe slots, this also gives an interesting scenario where you could build a TRAID storage Pool for installing all your apps and Docker on, and keep the third for SSD cache on the HDD pool. Limitless options! SATA PCIe 3.0 X1 A CrystalDiskMark test on a mapped network drive from within a Windows 11 25H2 PC (image above) connected over a 5 GbE hub was well within acceptable ranges. Although the read result on SATA was a little less than with the F4-425 Plus, for some reason, while writes were generally better. SATA PCIe 3.0 X1 I also ran the NAS Performance tester, which tests the link speed performance. As you can see, it pretty much maxes out the 5GbE connection. Of course, you can also opt to bond the two 5 GbE connections for a bit more umph, but I didn't do that. TOS 7, which, as of testing, is still in Beta, comes with an App Center that has a bunch of handy programs you can install right off the bat, such as Emby, Plex, Docker, as well as in-house Backup and Surveillance solutions. As you can imagine, any media streaming services you would want to host off the F4-425 Pro will work great, thanks to the Intel Core N350 CPU and its 16 GB of DDR5 memory. Accessing from mobile is only possible if Security Isolation Mode is disabled, which can put your NAS at risk from external sources, so there was no way to access it from the TNAS Mobile app. It's also quiet. I had this sat next to my computer on my work desk for the past week, and I did wonder if the noise I was accustomed to with NAS devices would annoy me, but all I could hear was a soft whirring of the rear fan (which was a little annoying) when the disks were not actively copying or reading data. Conclusion So what have I learned? Unfortunately, this release raises a few important questions and concerns that I feel haven't been adequately addressed. What I didn't like Our variant shipped with TOS 7 beta, and it's advised not to use it in a production environment. I feel that's a bit limiting on an $800 device. The mobile app is also still in beta and does not support some of the first-party apps, like Surveillance, and it still has quite a few bugs. I am a bit confused about the OpenClaw marketing along with the F4-425 Pro. I feel like that if it's going to be a main selling point, then offer official guidance on how to get started with it. TerraMaster recommends enabling SPC, but then markets the NAS for use with OpenClaw, which requires disabling SPC to be able to use it, opening up genuine security concerns for the NAS; and that's before you get into the security concerns of OpenClaw itself. Of course, the above issues won't be a problem if you decide to install something else on it, or even go back to the stable TOS 6. I wish TerraMaster had just given TOS 7 as opt-in rather than shipping with it. TOS 7 has been available as a preview since December 2025 (so well before my last TerraMaster review), and according to a thread on Reddit where a user shared a screenshot from the TerraMaster Facebook page, it is scheduled to launch today, June 23, but there's nothing about that in the TerraMaster news blog. My contact confirmed over email that TOS 7 exits beta today. The rubber feet also deserve a mention as they continue to be a problem, with them coming unstuck the moment you shift the F4-425 Pro anywhere on your desk. What I liked What it comes down to, though, aside from what I already mentioned, you are still getting a quality, affordable device here, so recommending it will depend on the individual's use case. If you're just looking for a relatively small NAS device to manage virtual machines on, backup your files, and take care of your home theater streaming, then it is a great device that will certainly futureproof you for some time. It provides good performance, takes up little space, and is, on the whole, very quiet. Four bays afford proper redundancy using TRAID or RAID 5, and you can even expand on storage capacity by adding the 2-bay D5, or 4-bay D8 Hybrid DAS over a USB 3.2 (10Gbps) link. Considering the 2024 releases were more about power, with the likes of an Intel Core i5-1235U high-end laptop CPU under the hood, I asked my contact last time if we could expect more of the same in higher-end models and was told: It makes a lot of sense to use Intel's N350 chip inside a NAS; it is more than capable of doing what the F4-425 Pro is intended for, media streaming and backup. The only downside is still the clear lack of community and even staff support on the official forums. In the past, I have had topics go unanswered for days, or there would be generic-type "we've noted this and passed it onto our developer team" type responses. Along with the other things I mentioned, it all ends up costing it a couple of points. If you are comfortable with the command line, Docker, and setting up TrueNAS or Unraid, you'll be fine. You can do great things with this hardware. In TOS, the apps are a bit lacking, and things don't always work as expected.\ AI NAS?! What has become clear to me this year is that we are going to start seeing all kinds of "AI NAS" come to market, and while that might be good for us consumers, be diligent and research these claims. Although the F4-425 Pro technically comes with AI, it is really using a cloud service that is externally sourced off-device through the third party OpenClaw app. My colleague did review a newcomer to the NAS space earlier this year, and it includes a local AI assistant inside the Zettlab D4 NAS, and they do not even use AI in the product name, check out Chris' review here. Where to buy and a discount coupon However, it does not change the fact that this is truly a great entry-level home media-class NAS that you can buy right now. TerraMaster is having a 20% off launch discount, plus you can also still apply our unique 10% off coupon on checkout, which only works on the official website. So here is a breakdown of the pricing that is only valid on the official TerraMaster website. TerraMaster F4-425 Pro (N350) + 20% discount + 10% coupon = $575.99 TerraMaster F4-425 Pro (N305) + 20% discount + 10% coupon = $503.99 TerraMaster F4-425 Pro (N350) + 20% discount + 10% coupon = £525.59 TerraMaster F4-425 Pro (N305) + 20% discount + 10% coupon = £460.79 Use NEOWIN coupon code during checkout for 10% discount Over on Amazon US and UK, the F4-425 Pro also gets a 20% launch discount, but here, the above 10% coupon cannot be applied. TerraMaster F4-425 Pro (N350) for $639.99 at Amazon US (was $799.99) TerraMaster F4-425 Pro (N305) for $559.99 at Amazon US (was $699.99) TerraMaster F4-425 Pro (N350) for £583.99 at Amazon UK (was £729.99) TerraMaster F4-425 Pro (N305) for £511.99 at Amazon UK (was £639.99) As an Amazon Associate, when you purchase through links on our site, we earn from qualifying purchases.
    • well you can add a GPU for around $500, that's still around the price of Steam Machine but overall significantly better in performance.
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