Steve Jobs implicated in Pixar stock option dust-up

[ToneKnee]

I doubt Apple would collapse at all like it did in the 90's. The market is alot different and MS has in many ways peaked unlike the up hill engine it was durring the 90's. IT bust is gone ect ect, its a different world. I think Apple would get by just dandy without Jobs, all they would loose is a face but I dont think the consumers, the general users, that bought those millions of iPods will know or care about jobs if hes there or if hes not. Apple have plenty of talented engineers and its them who have built Apple into what it is now through the iPod and other products. Steves a face that pushes products to tech enthusiast that watch his presentations but beyond that the consumers would likely connect to the silhouette dancing in iPods ads more than they do their CEO.

Dont get me wrong he does a good job for apple but in the big scheme of things I can see Apple surviving without him. For the time being Apple does have a fair bit of momentum behind them but. In the long run if the company was mis managed they might collapse again into obscurity but not only do I think its unlikely I think it would be alot more of a drawn out decline than it was in the 90's.

Maybe so, but he was the person who drove Apple into this direction, let's hope they don't go back to their old ways and start making stupid crap products.

[MrCobra]

Throw his arrogant ass in prison. He's stealing and deserves it.

[FlibbyFlobby]

I wonder if they'll be able to use that clever Apple spin to turn this into the hippest new product on the market (iScandal or iEmbezzle perhaps?), hopefully not. But seriously Jobs needs to be held accountable for his actions, if that means jail, tough.

[.Neo]

I feel Apple will collapse if Steve goes to jail, not only will it look bad on him and Apple, but him leaving the company would make the company fall back to the way it was back in the 90's before they went bust. :\

Doubt it. He can always give advice from his detention center using iChat AV.

[Simon Veteran]

The real question though: will he come back after getting out of jail? Like I've said before, maybe he could be PR. He does speak well, no one here can deny that. He does flame too much, that's the issue most people have with him.

[Hurmoth]

The real question though: will he come back after getting out of jail? Like I've said before, maybe he could be PR. He does speak well, no one here can deny that. He does flame too much, that's the issue most people have with him.

Let's not jump the gun just yet. He hasn't been charged with anything and is still innocent until proven guilty.

But to answer your question, no he wouldn't come back. I have a feeling the shareholders would see to that. I wouldn't want him back after being found guilty of stealing money from the company that I own stock in. Would you?

[Jowood]

People care about the Ipod and Macs. They don't care about CEO's. Can you honestly say your average joe with a $60,000 income will actually give a crap about this when choosing whether to buy an ipod or not?

[Hurmoth]

People care about the Ipod and Macs. They don't care about CEO's. Can you honestly say your average joe with a $60,000 income will actually give a crap about this when choosing whether to buy an ipod or not?

Someone who makes $60,000 a year isn't an average Joe. And to answer your question, yes, a lot of people will see on the news if Jobs is charge and if he is convicted and they will make the decision not to go with the iPod.

Look at Enron, do you think most people have any respect for the executives at Enron? They were stealing money from the company and if it turns out that Jobs knew about the backdating stock options, then he is just as guilty as the Enron executives. Stealing money from the company you work for is illegal and Steve Jobs is the face of Apple. People will take notice and I believe, at least in the beginning, Apple will be hurt by it. Now that is not to say that Apple can't regain the customers' trust back, it will just take time.

Now if Apple were to ever bring Jobs back after a huge scandal like this, then they're asking for trouble with, no only their shareholders, but also the public. Apple would be smart right now to ask Jobs to step aside temporarily until Jobs is cleared by SEC.

[Jowood]

Someone who makes $60,000 a year isn't an average Joe. And to answer your question, yes, a lot of people will see on the news if Jobs is charge and if he is convicted and they will make the decision not to go with the iPod.

Look at Enron, do you think most people have any respect for the executives at Enron? They were stealing money from the company and if it turns out that Jobs knew about the backdating stock options, then he is just as guilty as the Enron executives. Stealing money from the company you work for is illegal and Steve Jobs is the face of Apple. People will take notice and I believe, at least in the beginning, Apple will be hurt by it. Now that is not to say that Apple can't regain the customers' trust back, it will just take time.

Now if Apple were to ever bring Jobs back after a huge scandal like this, then they're asking for trouble with, no only their shareholders, but also the public. Apple would be smart right now to ask Jobs to step aside temporarily until Jobs is cleared by SEC.

In NYC, the median salary is $60,000, according to Payscale.com. So the average joe can be a person that earns such an amount. You can't rule out what i've said just because you have a set predisposition on what an average person earns...the range varies greatly so a multiplitude of numbers can be correct, regardless of how high they seem.

And as for your example with Enron...yeah people were upset. And Enron also screwed over a whole bunch of people. This apple thing is going to impact a select few, and perhaps some others vicariously...but I still think it's absurd to believe that this might impact apple sales noticeably...

I have my opinion and you can have yours. The sheep will still follow and I dont think people give a crap about Ceo's when purchasing such highly praised items (ie ipods). Its not like they become uncool or unwanted...

Would you think twice about buying an Xbox 360 if MS did something like this, assuming the 360 dominated the market and was a real "gem"? Honestly?

[Chad]

You actually believe Jobs is humble enough to earn $1? He portrayed and still portrays that image to the public (maybe why he has so many loyal fanatics) and behind their back, he is embezzling millions of dollars worth of stock to his personal account.

Lets face it, if this were "Bill Gates implicated in Microsoft stock option dust-up", this thread would be at 56 pages with 55 pages full of anti-Bill Gates and anti-Microsoft slander. This is ridiculous and as much as everyone wants to defend Jobs, he is a corporate buffoon and he has stolen loads of money and has to be held accountable regardless of his status.

Ok, go back and read the article this time. I don't know what news story you are commenting on, but it certainly isn't this one.

[L3thal Veteran]

Ok, go back and read the article this time. I don't know what news story you are commenting on, but it certainly isn't this one.

I was obviously making a comment to the posts that were made in the first 2 pages, in case you failed to notice. That is why I brought up Jobs' $1 salary (mentioned in an earlier post) and the comment about Microsoft, since everyone seems to want to defend Jobs even though it is almost clear that he had at least known about the option pickup, which in the court of law, is considered conspiracy to commit embezzlement even if he didn't do it himself.

[betasp]

Basically Steve or someone else in the company has backdated stock options to make them favourable for people. So that they make a huge amount of money out of the stock options. This is illegal and if found guilty he or the people who did it will go to jail. Apple's stock price would then plummet.

No, backdating is not illegal. Not disclosing such information is....

[Hurmoth]

No, backdating is not illegal. Not disclosing such information is....

Technically backdating is not illegal as long as the shareholders and the government is notified properly. Backdating is illegal when both parties are not notified. If the government is not notified then the government could file charges, including the IRS because backdating and not notifying the government could be a way around paying taxes on a large sum of money, which is tax evasion, along with embezzling money from the company.

So technically backdating is illegal in a certain situation.

[xxdesmus]

You actually believe Jobs is humble enough to earn $1? He portrayed and still portrays that image to the public (maybe why he has so many loyal fanatics) and behind their back, he is embezzling millions of dollars worth of stock to his personal account.

Lets face it, if this were "Bill Gates implicated in Microsoft stock option dust-up", this thread would be at 56 pages with 55 pages full of anti-Bill Gates and anti-Microsoft slander. This is ridiculous and as much as everyone wants to defend Jobs, he is a corporate buffoon and he has stolen loads of money and has to be held accountable regardless of his status.

I don't care where he stole the money from. The point, which you apparently missed, is that the embezzling of stocks/money for personal gain and to the deceit of others is a crime and crimes have to be dealt with. I find it despicable that corporate moguls in general embezzle money and do so without any consequences. At the end, the people that suffer are the employees when they realize all they money they put in to their retirement fund is now gone and they are jobless.

This deserved to be quoted for emphasis. Well said. :yes:

Now, if we can just speed up this damn process and get this over with...

[Knight85]

Steve Jobs is a lying, pompous SOB.

[2xSilverKnight]

Technically backdating is not illegal as long as the shareholders and the government is notified properly. Backdating is illegal when both parties are not notified. If the government is not notified then the government could file charges, including the IRS because backdating and not notifying the government could be a way around paying taxes on a large sum of money, which is tax evasion, along with embezzling money from the company.

So technically backdating is illegal in a certain situation.

well, in the first place, taxes are illegal.

propaganda work during WW's succeeded in winning the public opinion about the idea of paying taxes to get more services, now it's out of control.

[null_]

2007: The year of bull****. If he is indeed guilty of all of this I hope he winds up in jail.

[L3thal Veteran]

Don't worry kids, Jobs will donate a few thousand MacBook Pro's to the IRS and government agencies and they will call it a day.

[bkellner]

It was bound to happen again one of these days. Gates will probably follow suit and steal the money from Jobs, rename it to Windows, and claim all the credit.

[libertas83]

well, in the first place, taxes are illegal.

propaganda work during WW's succeeded in winning the public opinion about the idea of paying taxes to get more services, now it's out of control.

In what country are taxes illegal? If you are refering to the US, it is legal and not only that, taxes are the foundation of government offices. How else do you expect government to function.

Anyway, back on topic, there are now two companies that Jobs have dealings with having a stock option scandel. That makes it more probable that he is involved, but I will hold out judging the man until he is put on trial and we review the evidence in a court of law.

[.Ark]

Gates will ... steal the money from Jobs, rename it to Windows, and claim all the credit.

That made no sense lol

[2xSilverKnight]

In what country are taxes illegal? If you are refering to the US, it is legal and not only that, taxes are the foundation of government offices. How else do you expect government to function.

Anyway, back on topic, there are now two companies that Jobs have dealings with having a stock option scandel. That makes it more probable that he is involved, but I will hold out judging the man until he is put on trial and we review the evidence in a court of law.

gov. foundation ? yeah right, it's said plain and simple in the US constitution (16th amendment) written by the founders of your country. Has been ruled unconstitutional many times in supreme court. Taxes are the foundation of the criminals. outvalued currency , credit card, national debt impossible to pay off (how can they continue to spend when they are way out of it) ... Federal Reserve etc ... also illegal

the intentions of taxes are good but they are not in reality, look hiow everything has lack of budget when looking at public services.

these simple facts are EASILY proved, btw

so look for yourself everything is there

you can start by watching America Freedom to Fascism. It's a really good start.

only a start, okay don't be lazy

[JrDZ13]

gov. foundation ? yeah right, it's said plain and simple in the US constitution (16th amendment) written by the founders of your country. Has been ruled unconstitutional many times in supreme court. Taxes are the foundation of the criminals. outvalued currency , credit card, national debt impossible to pay off (how can they continue to spend when they are way out of it) ... Federal Reserve etc ... also illegal

the intentions of taxes are good but they are not in reality, look hiow everything has lack of budget when looking at public services.

these simple facts are EASILY proved, btw

so look for yourself everything is there

you can start by watching America Freedom to Fascism. It's a really good start.

only a start, okay don't be lazy

I think my brain just melted.

[Smigit]

I think my brain just melted.

mine already had when I read the comment "Gates will ... steal the money from Jobs, rename it to Windows, and claim all the credit."

[Chad]

I was obviously making a comment to the posts that were made in the first 2 pages, in case you failed to notice. That is why I brought up Jobs' $1 salary (mentioned in an earlier post) and the comment about Microsoft, since everyone seems to want to defend Jobs even though it is almost clear that he had at least known about the option pickup, which in the court of law, is considered conspiracy to commit embezzlement even if he didn't do it himself.

Obviously. :rolleyes: Feel free to show me where he is being held responsible in either the Apple or Pixar cases. Apparently quite a few people think he's guilty, so I was just wondering where the info was coming from. Do you just assume every CEO out there knows everything about backdating shares or are you just being this way because it's Jobs? Embezzlement...what a load. Since you so quickly jumped on your Apple-hating soapbox I thought you may have something to stand on. I guess not. None of you do.

Who in this thread has defended Jobs? The majority is out to hang the guy before a guilty verdict. Quite the opposite from your Bill Gates example, hmm?

I honestly could care less which way it goes. If he did have something to do with any illegal activity, he should pay the price...jail time, fine, whatever. Stick it to him for all I care. However I'm not going to jump up and down like a child and say something stupid like 'he's guilty' or 'he deserves it' without knowing anything but a small bit of the whole story. Talk about buffoonery.