Does Neowin delete member accounts?

[adrynalyne]

46 minutes ago, Brandon H said:

physically "deleting" accounts also deletes their posts which can ruin threads for other users and people searching on google. there is a reason for the ruling.

That is a viable reason of sorts, maybe. The one I quoted, is nonsense. 
 

When I left Majorgeeks, I had admin rights. I deleted my account and left the posts. I’ve little doubt that it’s optional with the forum software here too. 

[Brandon H Supervisor]

7 minutes ago, adrynalyne said:

That is a viable reason of sorts, maybe. The one I quoted, is nonsense. 
 

When I left Majorgeeks, I had admin rights. I deleted my account and left the posts. I’ve little doubt that it’s optional with the forum software here too. 

there is and that is what we do for the GDPR requests.

 

The issue is half the time when a user requests their account deleted they demand their posts go with it; so it's lose lose no matter which option we choose.

We'd like to keep post association unless absolutely necessary.

 

edit: as you can see this rule has been in place since 2008 or possibly even longer and no one really complained about it until GDPR came into play ...

[adrynalyne]

3 minutes ago, Brandon H said:

there is and that is what we do for the GDPR requests.

 

The issue is half the time when a user requests their account deleted they demand their posts go with it; so it's lose lose no matter which option we choose.

We'd like to keep post association unless absolutely necessary.

 

edit: as you can see this rule has been in place since 2008 or possibly even longer and no one really complained about it until GDPR came into play ...

Of course nobody complained about it until GDPR. They had no legal recourse. Assuming it’s true that literally nobody complained. 

[Brandon H Supervisor]

1 minute ago, adrynalyne said:

Of course nobody complained about it until GDPR. They had no legal recourse. Assuming it’s true that literally nobody complained. 

except most of the recent complaints since GDPR have been from members not even in participating regions.

 

post 1 makes a perfectly viable solution; remove all your own association with the account and let it be; no mod/supervisor/owner involvement needed; why does physical database deletion even need to come into play? (at least that's how I see it in my mind)

[adrynalyne]

7 minutes ago, Brandon H said:

except most of the recent complaints since GDPR have been from members not even in participating regions.

 

post 1 makes a perfectly viable solution; remove all your own association with the account and let it be; no mod/supervisor/owner involvement needed; why does physical database deletion even need to come into play? (at least that's how I see it in my mind)

Before security compromises, everyone says the same thing. That’s why these folks want actual deletion. 
 

I get it that people not in GDPR regions are still trying to cash in, just because we don’t have the protections doesn’t mean we wouldn’t like them. 
 

This is a very adversarial approach to take when privacy is a big concern these days. 
 

As an aside, what you initially quoted me on is not really the same thing you and I are discussing now. 

[Brandon H Supervisor]

7 minutes ago, adrynalyne said:

Before security compromises, everyone says the same thing. That’s why these folks want actual deletion.

If you've removed all association with the account (changed name, changed to a dummy email address, removed account links, ect.) then why would a chance of security compromise worry you? just saying, things don't have to be taken to the extreme all the time.

 

edit: I understand the concern as most sites log previous settings and or don't allow dissociating the account but a forum software like IPB does; we don't log old email addresses or anything once changed. Heck I don't even think IPB logs previous user names like old versions used to.

[adrynalyne]

11 minutes ago, Brandon H said:

If you've removed all association with the account (changed name, changed to a dummy email address, removed account links, ect.) then why would a chance of security compromise worry you? just saying, things don't have to be taken to the extreme all the time.

 

edit: I understand the concern as most sites log previous settings and or don't allow dissociating the account but a forum software like IPB does; we don't log old email addresses or anything once changed. Heck I don't even think IPB logs previous user names like old versions used to.

You are asking people to trust that the administrators have done that. Rinse and repeat what I said. All too often in the past, security compromises have shown that doesn’t always happen. 
 

I get that it’s an inconvenience to you guys but privacy friendly sites go far in this day and age. Just sayin. 

[+BudMan MVC]

Once you post something to a public forum, it becomes property of that forum.. How F'd would threads be if they deleted some X thousand posts?  Answers to a question for example is now gone and the thread just a bunch of gibberish with all the actual good content missing.

 

The forum if you get ticked off or whatever, can remove a persons username from the content.. Asking for the content to be removed is nonsense..  Before account created there is info to read that goes over stuff.

 

Additionally you also agree that Neowin does not delete member content should you choose to leave.

And as always, we encourage you not to post personal identifiable information in topics.

 

Has that policy been changed, and before they stated they would delete content?  If so then might have some grounds to stand on, if when created account it was specifically stated in the use policy or privacy policy that all your content would be deleted.  Been here a lot of years, I do not recall such a policy ever.

 

In all the years I have been on forums, this has never been the case...  Is there some link to some forum that states that if person leaves all their content will be deleted?  I might head over there, answer a bunch of questions and then just to be a D___ have my account deleted

[shockz]

1 hour ago, Brandon H said:

Edit: as you can see this rule has been in place since 2008 or possibly even longer and no one really complained about it until GDPR came into play ...

Nonsense. People have always requested account deletions and have had plenty to say about it when no. It’s why this thread was created in the first place. 
 

There have also been several account deletions over the years. Keldyn for example. 

[+BudMan MVC]

There is a big difference between the owners of the forum making the call to delete user and or content.. And a user calling for it... Did this keldyn account call for deletion or was it a call made by neowin?

[shockz]

1 minute ago, BudMan said:

There is a big difference between the owners of the forum making the call to delete user and or content.. And a user calling for it... Did this keldyn account call for deletion or was it a call made by neowin?

Yes. 

[+BudMan MVC]

Yes to which.. User asked, or Neowin decided?

 

How much content?  Was it a year or years worth of good stuff that contributed to the flow of multiple threads... Or was it utter junk?

 

 

[shockz]

4 minutes ago, BudMan said:

Yes to which.. User asked, or Neowin decided?

 

How much content?  Was it a year or years worth of good stuff that contributed to the flow of multiple threads... Or was it utter junk?

 

 

He was a core member back in the day and also on staff. 
 

And I’ll let someone chime in on the reasons why as it’s not my place, but yes, it was requested from them and not by admins.

[eddman]

I don't know much about forum software, but would it be possible to configure it in a way that when an account is deleted, it'd change the username of the forum posts to, say, "anonymous", or simply "deleted"?

[+BudMan MVC]

Well that is their call, as stated its their site..  Nothing forcing you to post here, or actually use your real name or anything.. skockz, is that your real name?  If I google it other than info on this site will I find your home address your web site with your place of business, etc. etc..?

 

You posting personal info on a public forum is on you...  Not sure why anyone could ever think that once something is posted to the net that there is some right to removal of said info.. Read the GDPR policy - where does it state that?  I have read it multiple times, and I do not recall such a clause.. Lets say the site deleted your posts - who says they are not available on some archive site or wayback machine site, etc.

 

The only way anyone has any legs to stand on in a complaint of such is if their previous policy clearly stated that upon request any and all info and or posted content by you would be deleted.  Which I do not believe it ever did.. Do you have say a screenshot of this old policy, a wayback url that shows said info, etc. etc.

 

If you do not like such policy - pretty sure your free to leave.. Nothing forcing you to post content here...

 

edit: @eddman, yes if requested I am sure they can change the name of the poster of content... I have seen this on multiple other locations..

 

Not sure how anyone can think posting up their opinion on XYZ, or how to get ABC working is some sort of personal data or information.. Such content does not fall under GDPR no matter how you look at it...

 

To be honest, you could prob make a good argument in court that your choice of nickname is not your personal data either   Is shockz any sort of legal documentation of for your name?  Is that on your birth certificate... So while they can remove your email address that ties said posting to you in some way... So unless you used your real legal name as your nick - I don't even think they need to do anything but removal of personal info tied to that nick.. Like your real name or address, etc.

[adrynalyne]

30 minutes ago, BudMan said:

Once you post something to a public forum, it becomes property of that forum.. How F'd would threads be if they deleted your 20k some posts?  Your answer to a question for example is now gone and the thread just a bunch of gibberish with all the actual good content missing.

 

The forum if you get ticked off or whatever, can remove your username from the content.. Asking for the content to be removed is nonsense.. Did you read before you created an account and posted?

 

Additionally you also agree that Neowin does not delete member content should you choose to leave.

And as always, we encourage you not to post personal identifiable information in topics.

 

Are you saying that policy has been changed, and before they stated they would delete your content?  If so then you might have some grounds to stand on, if when you created your account it was specifically stated in the use policy or privacy policy that you wanted to leave all your content would be deleted.  Been here a lot of years, I do not recall such a policy ever.

 

In all the years I have been on forums, this has never been the case...  Do you have a link to some forum that states that if you leave all your content will be deleted?  I might head over there, answer a bunch of questions and then just to be a D___ have my account deleted

Who exactly are you talking to? I didn’t ask my content to be deleted. 

11 minutes ago, eddman said:

I don't know much about forum software, but would it be possible to configure it in a way that when an account is deleted, it'd change the username of the forum posts to, say, "anonymous", or simply "deleted"?

Depending on the software, yes. 

[+BudMan MVC]

The topic in general it was not meant to be specifically directed at you.  Did I give that impression?  Oh the # posts things - that is where it prob got the Impression - sorry that was just number that I saw while typing I can edit it sot reflect X thousands of post which is more generic.

 

I reworded a bit, after I reread it I could see how you might of thought that specifically directed at you - which was not my intent.

[Daniel F. Administrators]

19 hours ago, shockz said:

He was a core member back in the day and also on staff. 
 

And I’ll let someone chime in on the reasons why as it’s not my place, but yes, it was requested from them and not by admins.

That was an exceptional circumstance.

 

Neowin reserves the right to change or alter these [Forum] rules at any time and an Administrator's word is final - This has been a forum rule/ guideline since day 1.

 

we reserve the right to do what we think is in the best interests of Neowin LLC. As such we feel that unless required by law (which we always comply with) accounts/ posts should not be removed as it messes up forum threads and can be used maliciously.

[adrynalyne]

1 hour ago, Daniel F. said:

That was an exceptional circumstance.

 

Neowin reserves the right to change or alter these [Forum] rules at any time and an Administrator's word is final - This has been a forum rule/ guideline since day 1.

 

we reserve the right to do what we think is in the best interests of Neowin LLC. As such we feel that unless required by law (which we always comply with) accounts/ posts should not be removed as it messes up forum threads and can be used maliciously.

I’ll bite. How can it be used maliciously?

[+BudMan MVC]

Here is a scenario... I gain access to user X email address... I now request that some site remove all posts made by "me".. How does the site validate its you?  You have access to the email address - no other info was collected when account was created, etc.  So guess its the owner of said content

 

Oh that IP address thing from where I posted in the past - yeah I changed isp is why the IP changed

[Brandon H Supervisor]

37 minutes ago, adrynalyne said:

I’ll bite. How can it be used maliciously?

we've had a few cases where a highly contributing member had a change of attitude and suddenly wanted all their posts deleted along with their account; this would make many thready lose contributions and answers making the threads harder to follow if not completely broken for anyone else viewing them later.

 

that's just one possibility that Neowin has had to deal with in the past that I would consider malicious.

[adrynalyne]

25 minutes ago, BudMan said:

Here is a scenario... I gain access to user X email address... I now request that some site remove all posts made by "me".. How does the site validate its you?  You have access to the email address - no other info was collected when account was created, etc.  So guess its the owner of said content

 

Oh that IP address thing from where I posted in the past - yeah I changed isp is why the IP changed

Well if that’s a concern, everyone asking for an account delete should get their password automatically reset and randomized. 🙃 Just in case. 

[+BudMan MVC]

Not sure how that would help if someone has control of the email.

[shockz]

5 hours ago, adrynalyne said:

I’ll bite. How can it be used maliciously?

BOOGMasterSoftball used to be a mod and deleted all his posts and ruined threads/chains. Most were restored with a database backup, but that's where the malicious angle comes into play when people can just up and leave and ruin threads (Is a thread from 8 years ago really relevant though? If someone replies, they're closed immediately). Or a user registers with the same name on purpose and confusion ensues.

 

What happens when a facebook user deactivates or deletes their account? Most of that material becomes inaccessible, yet Facebook doesn't grind to a stop.

[adrynalyne]

2 hours ago, BudMan said:

Not sure how that would help if someone has control of the email.

Control of the forum account doesn’t automatically mean email too...