UK's WW2 debt to USA

[+Nik Louch Subscriber²]

Totally agree that the numbers game and the $$$ was the most useful.

Heck, I recall quite a lot of reports being that the "yankees were reckless" and more interested in trading and womanising with an attitude of "we're saving your sorry ass!".

Don't know how true any of that was - could have been pro-British propaganda to keep our boys morale up. Who knows!

[funkymunky]

To be fair without their numbers to bolster ours, I believe we would of lost.

But considering the size of our Great Island we did a dam fine job :)

So if any Americans who are on this forum were involved I thank you :)

We've returned the favour back to your Country many times now

[Hurmoth]

We've returned the favour back to your Country many times now

The UK has had our backs many times since. No doubt about it. And I for one appreciate how much the UK has helped us out and will most likely continue to do. We scratch your back, you scratch ours (and vice-versa) :)

[FloatingFatMan]

The UK has had our backs many times since. No doubt about it. And I for one appreciate how much the UK has helped us out and will most likely continue to do. We scratch your back, you scratch ours (and vice-versa) :)

Damned right! Some of your idea's come across to us as a bit "odd", and your choice of leadership was a bit... well, rubbish TBH; but given all that, I know that if we had to make a choice, I'd MUCH rather be a 51st state than a part of a federated europe. ;)

[Coldgunner]

Think of this, had the US not gotten involved then the UK would have fallen, eventually. The US would not have had a staging ground for european campaign and there would have been fighting on 4 fronts (soviet vs japan in the east, germany in the west, and the US with Japan on the west coast and germany on the east). japan and germany would have encircled the US and the US would have eventually fallen. Germany had some amazing technology in the pipeline, the US would not have been able to devote resources to the manhattan project. germany would have control of many british scientists. a fe wwould no doubt have fled to canada and the US. the windsors we're planning to extradite to canada should operation sealion been carried out. operation sealion never went ahead because of both english weather (yay) and the RAF's survival in the battle of britain.

the battle of britain and stalingrad we're the 2 key turning points in the first half of the war. pearl harbor, as yamamoto said, was the awakening of the sleeping giant. germany lost at stalingrad due to lmited supply lines that we're cut off.

edit: the war possibly changed when the lone german bomber decided to dump its payload over london when it was lost, causing a retailatory raid on germany. hitler ordered his bombers to bomb the cities rather than airfields, giving the airfields a well needed break. this mean't the RAF won the battle of britain and changed the war, had the germans won the battle fo britain operation sealion would have went ahead, causing the events as I described.

Edited May 6, 2008 by Coldgunner

[Coldgunner]

2) You (the UK) firstly relied in our military technpology and supplies: B-17 Bombers, P-51 Mustangs, Rifles, Ammo, Cannons, etc. Then, US Troops were sent to Europe.

--ScottKin

the B17 and the P51 did not turn up till late in the war. the spitfire and the hurricane were the real workhorses (hurricane had more kills than the spitfire), the early versions of the b17 had a major weakness, where the B17 had a gun blindspot dead ahead, so a fighter could attack head on without being shot at, the B17G fixed this with a nose cannon. the P51B was not particularly effective and it wasn't till the later P51D that it became effective (was modified for the rolls royce merlin engine, bubble canopy, improved fuel tanks and better armament)

in fact the avro lancaster could hold a greater payload than the B17, making it probably the only one capable of deploying the bouncing bomb.

[JohnMarsten]

ummm - is username is "yurithedragon"???

:blink:

--ScottKin

the irony, lol .. I didn't see that my bad

[FloatingFatMan]

the B17 and the P51 did not turn up till late in the war. the spitfire and the hurricane were the real workhorses (hurricane had more kills than the spitfire), the early versions of the b17 had a major weakness, where the B17 had a gun blindspot dead ahead, so a fighter could attack head on without being shot at, the B17G fixed this with a nose cannon. the P51B was not particularly effective and it wasn't till the later P51D that it became effective (was modified for the rolls royce merlin engine, bubble canopy, improved fuel tanks and better armament)

in fact the avro lancaster could hold a greater payload than the B17, making it probably the only one capable of deploying the bouncing bomb.

In fact, the main body of help the US provided was really with ground troops. We had the air battle pretty much sewn up already, and were holding our own in the sea battle. And when it came to war technology, nobody can deny that it was our superiority in that field that was a massive help in the war; namely our invention of radar, and our code breaking technologies.

[Coldgunner]

In fact, the main body of help the US provided was really with ground troops. We had the air battle pretty much sewn up already, and were holding our own in the sea battle. And when it came to war technology, nobody can deny that it was our superiority in that field that was a massive help in the war; namely our invention of radar, and our code breaking technologies.

UK = Brains

US = Brawn

we had the technology, navy and airforce like you said, but we just needed the sheer manpower the US could provide

looking back, the US does not get on too well when it enters a war alone, i.e. vietnam

[Fourjays Veteran]

It was a joint effort between all the allies, IMO. D-Day was really the start of taking back Europe, and that was only possible with help from America and Canada. I think Britain could have defended alone against the Nazis for some considerable time, but taking back Europe would have been impossible.

I'd rather be a 51st state, than part of Europe too. Many Europeans seem to conveniently forget that they'd all be German if it wasn't for the allies. President Sarkozy is the first Frenchman I've ever heard acknowledge and be grateful for it.

[Coldgunner]

forgot to add:

USSR = Sheer numbers

the USSR had very simple tank designs that were easy to mass produce, had both men and women in the services, conscription and the fear of being shot by their own commissars. The 1 gun between 2 soldiers is a bit of a myth, russia was able to mass produce rifles very easily and had plenty to go around.

I always love the line "Say what you like about Hitler, but at least the trains ran on time" :p

[funkymunky]

I forgot to thank Canada too :)

[Coldgunner]

I forgot to thank Canada too :)

to be honest, WWII was more than just USSR, Japan, USA and Europe. we also had

India

Australia (was bombed by the japanese, as well as having plenty of troops deployed under british sovereignty)

New Zealand

Burma

China (WWII technically started with the 1937 invasion by Japan)

North Africa

Middle East

technically WWII never ended as a peace treaty was never signed between the USSR and Japan (or germany, can someone correct me)

[leesmithg]

Have you noticed when some dumb Americans talk to British people, they like to throw in a jab like: ?we saved your ass in World War 2? - clearly an uneducated reference to the American involvement in WW2.

Lets just get some facts straight, AMERICA DID NOT SAVE OUR ARSES IN WW2! Ameronly got involved to make money. And Perl Harbour was allowed to get attacked to form a catalyst. The fact that America?s involvement appeared to ?save our asses? was merely a ?side effect?.

The fact is, after WW2, the UK was in debt to America and had to pay war repercussions and we didn?t finish off paying them back until 1996.

No doubt this debt had major influence with Tony Blair?s decision to allow our troops fighting in Bush?s war. I am sure Bush was willing to slash the debt somewhat if our soldiers died in Iraq and Afghanistan. While this may be an assumption, it?s not farfetched at all.

http://www.pair-annoyed.com:9090/CALMS-NEW...hp/t-22433.html

And the other fact, which is most startling, is that America did not save our arses in the war, they actually assisted the Nazis to kick it! Did you know that the Luftwaffe (that?s the Nazi air force, to the uneducated) required a special type of fuel that was only produced by America?

For the YouTube generation, you can learn more here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8OtmwmxWP4

This video will also teach you about the other crimes America had a hand in during WW2.

The debt was finally paid in 2006.

It was linked to index and high interest rates, they also loaned us money, the debt reached around a few hunded billion ?'s.

Yeah the Americans do think the sun shines out of their backsides; The real reason the Nazis lost the war was through their own stupidity, trying to own Russia.

The buttons the Nazis used on their uniforms were made of an allotrope of SN (Tin) which infact melted at low temperatures and fell apart. So the men also not only

froze to death or lost interest their pants fell down.

The Americans were just loan sharks, that took a very minute part in the war.

[MonatanFX]

:laugh: This thread in laughable. I would love to have seen what the UK would look like if America hadn't have gotten involved.

I would love to see the US without influence from the British Empire. You would all be speaking French.

But TBH I know the US helped us out, if a little later than expected. But tp try and make out you won the war for us, is arrogant and big headed. Think of all the British troops that lost thier lives. It sounds like you are saying they were lost in vain and they might as well of stayed at home.

A big part of winning the war was The British Intelligence Corp and how they managed to obtain information that was critical. Yes the US fire power was a help, but to brag and take credit for the whole war is very distasteful. You should be ashamed, even if it is a joke, its far from funny.

[Coldgunner]

I would love to see the US without influence from the British Empire. You would all be speaking French.

But TBH I know the US helped us out, if a little later than expected. But tp try and make out you won the war for us, is arrogant and big headed. Think of all the British troops that lost thier lives. It sounds like you are saying they were lost in vain and they might as well of stayed at home.

A big part of winning the war was The British Intelligence Corp and how they managed to obtain information that was critical. Yes the US fire power was a help, but to brag and take credit for the whole war is very distasteful. You should be ashamed, even if it is a joke, its far from funny.

agreed

We forget other aspects like the battle for france, Dunkirque etc. The real unsung heroes are the guys from the far corners of the former british empire. Also, the reality is that the USSR took the brunt of the ground assault, diverting troops from the western front and forcing hitler to fight 2 fronts instead of one or the other.

[leesmithg]

We also seem to forget all the Africans, West Indians, Indians, Pacificans, Australasians, Europeans, Members of the Empire (others I have not mentioned) that also stood up to the Nazis.

Edited May 7, 2008 by leesmithg

[Coldgunner]

and of course all the work the swiss didn't do :p

how they didn't get invaded I've no idea

[dead.cell]

Yeah the Americans do think the sun shines out of their backsides; The real reason the Nazis lost the war was through their own stupidity, trying to own Russia.

The buttons the Nazis used on their uniforms were made of an allotrope of SN (Tin) which infact melted at low temperatures and fell apart. So the men also not only

froze to death or lost interest their pants fell down.

The Americans were just loan sharks, that took a very minute part in the war.

Really? I thought I read about the Russians burning down their own cities leaving them absolutely nothing to survive on as they marched their way in through the brutal weather. Either way though, I doubt Germany would've lost simply due to that.

As for Americans simply being "loan sharks", the war did indeed help to boost our economy, but us fighting in it also helped to save Europe from a madman. If it were us, or God forbid we'd ever end up in a situation like that in the future, you bet your ass I'd be grateful to the country or countries that would help us keep our freedoms, even if they were not successful. Patriotism is having pride in your country. Preserving your country and the freedoms of your people is not something you can put a price on, especially when you take into account the number of people that died for it. The soldiers who died fought for what they thought was right. To take that away from them simply because you don't like the comments of a few arrogant people, and make their efforts out to be nothing is a damn shame. A real damn shame.

Honestly, if you're upset with the comments of a few arrogant jerks, you really need to get over it. Let me make you aware that I was actually caught in surprise by the comments in this thread here. Usually, I'm so used to the "only in America" comments that are posted, along with the general idea that we are stupid, greedy, fat, and ignorant pigs. However, I'm not going to crap on their country because of it. Doing something like that just might be... immature?

[theyarecomingforyou]

Really? I thought I read about the Russians burning down their own cities leaving them absolutely nothing to survive on as they marched their way in through the brutal weather. Either way though, I doubt Germany would've lost simply due to that.

Indeed. They torched all arable land as they withdrew, which resulted in the starvation of the progressing Nazi soldiers - this was important because the calorie intake in sub-zero temperatures can be as much as 5000 per day (double that of the average man). The Russians were also better suited to the colder conditions in terms of clothing, machinery and tactics. There were a lot of factors involved but the torching of arable land was the most significant.

[Hurmoth]

I would love to see the US without influence from the British Empire. You would all be speaking French.

That has nothing to do with this thread first of all. Secondly, I never stated that the US didn't owe other countries for their help, in fact I stated how much I appreciate what the UK has done for us, as they have helped us out greatly.

Let's keep it on topic though, this thread is about what the US did for the UK during WWII.

[leesmithg]

One thing I wrote was one of many factors which the Nazis did and made that big mistake.

Hitler had already sorted his housing in London, he had made dibs on some posh homes in Kensington London.

The Nazis were greedy, which also helped to their down fall.

[Coldgunner]

hitler was a politician, his tactical ability was heavily flawed.

[FloatingFatMan]

and of course all the work the swiss didn't do :p

how they didn't get invaded I've no idea

Hitler needed somewhere to stash all that Nazi gold. ;)

[dead.cell]

hitler was a politician, his tactical ability was heavily flawed.

As much as one would hate to admit, he was human and humans make mistakes.

Errare humanum est.