Direct3D WARP10: The backwards-compatible solution for DX10-only apps

[Denis W. Veteran]

Direct3D backwards compatibility has always been ?you get what your graphics cards run?. For example, Crysis may be a Direct3D 10 game, but if you only have a Direct3D 9-level graphics card, it might only make your jaws open instead of hitting the floor. But that?s all going to change comes Windows 7.

Simply put, in Windows 7, you will experience the same graphics fidelity and detail whether you have a Direct3D 9-level graphics card or even no graphics card. The magic fairy dust which makes this possible is called Direct3D 10Level9 and Direct3D WARP10 respectively.

Direct3D 10Level9 is exactly what the name describes, it allows you to run Direct3D 10 applications on Direct3D 9 hardware with the same visual output but at the cost of performance penalties compared to running on native Direct3D 10 hardware. On the other hand, if your graphics functionality or partially or wholly non-existent either by design (I?m looking at you Intel) or due to anomalies (graphics driver), that?s where WARP10 comes inWARP which stands for Windows Advanced Rasterization Platform is a complete implementation of Direct3D 10 in software form - that is using only the CPU. It?s even capable of anti-aliasing up to 8xMSAA and anisotropic filtering. What?s amazing is that it is parity with the output of a native Direct3D 10 device. 0 device. The MSDN article describes ?the majority of the images appear almost identical between hardware and WARP10, where small differences sometimes occur we find they are within the tolerances defined by the Direct3D 10 specification.?

[...]

If you’re gamer, obviously this is not plausible and the developers agree. “We don’t see WARP10 as a replacement for graphics hardware, particularly as reasonably performing low end Direct3D 10 discrete hardware is now available foThe goal of WARP10 was to allow applications to target Direct3D 10 level hardware without having significantly different code paths or testing requirements when running on hardware or when running in software.g in software.”

Continued here. http://www.istartedsomething.com/20081126/...-albeit-slowly/

You'll also find some benchmarks of Crysis done in so:laugh:only mode. :laugh:

I must say thi(Y)s a good move. (Y) Obviously this won't help anyone trying to play most post-2006 games on old hardware or PCs with integrated graphics, but this takes some work off (game) developers who will no longer need to code in a software or DX8/9 compatible rendering path.

Edited November 26, 2008 by rm20010

[t_r_nelson]

It's nice to be able to do this, but the framerates are unacceptable for playing anything.

[StealMySoda]

I have DX10 but always prefer to use DX9 for the performance increase I get.

[Denis W. Veteran]

Another commenter brought up this point:

Does having DX10 done entirely in software allow older hardware with non-WDDM compliant drivers to run Aero? Although everything would be in software, that's better than staring at an ugly Basic theme.

[HawkMan]

Another commenter brought up this point:

Does having DX10 done entirely in software allow older hardware with non-WDDM compliant drivers to run Aero? Although everything would be in software, that's better than staring at an ugly Basic theme.

Aero is DX9 not 10.

And running ro in all software mode would be pointless. The whle idea behind areo was to speed the GUI up. runnign aero in software would be like running semi transparent apps in XP. sloooooooooooooooooow

[Glowstick]

They gave the software reference renderer a fancy name and now everyone's jizzing? Christ.

[notuptome2004]

in windows 7 Aero will be driven by DX10 this time and the new 1.1 graphics model

[ToneKnee]

in windows 7 Aero will be driven by DX10 this time and the new 1.1 graphics model

What? No it won't. I'm using Windows 7 (Build 6801) now and I run a X1650. There is no need for it to use 'DirectX 10'. Anyways, the WDDM 1.1 driver model is only for DirectX 10 as far as I'm aware which halves DWM memory usage.

[HawkMan]

it cann use dx10 is what he should have said. it'll use the best available

[notuptome2004]

What? No it won't. I'm using Windows 7 (Build 6801) now and I run a X1650. There is no need for it to use 'DirectX 10'. Anyways, the WDDM 1.1 driver model is only for DirectX 10 as far as I'm aware which halves DWM memory usage.

right there Aero/DWM will be using the direct 3D 10

http://www.istartedsomething.com/20081029/...sumption-by-50/

[jjrambo]

The most useless feature. What's next? It seems that Microsoft doesn't come up with anything useful and smart.

I want to see an idiot who is going to run Crysis using this and having 5 FPS.

Microsoft -> :cry:

[Eric Veteran]

DirectX 10 is not a full suite rewrite. It is a poorly-named extension to DirectX 9.

[Mikee99]

The most useless feature. What's next? It seems that Microsoft doesn't come up with anything useful and smart.

I want to see an idiot who is going to run Crysis using this and having 5 FPS.

Microsoft -> :cry:

In what way is this useless and not smart? If systems that can't run Aero before now can, why is that a problem? Microsoft is improving the performance of Windows and you have a problem with that? First people complain that Windows requires new hardware, then when MS makes their software more compatible for more older hardware, people complain. WTF?

[jjrambo]

In what way is this useless and not smart? If systems that can't run Aero before now can, why is that a problem? Microsoft is improving the performance of Windows and you have a problem with that? First people complain that Windows requires new hardware, then when MS makes their software more compatible for more older hardware, people complain. WTF?

Microsoft does it wrong as they do everything. Radeon 8500 and Geforce 3 can run Aero Fine. That's what Microsoft had to do it, to enable video cards capable of supporting 1.1 Pixel Shader and up to run Aero, not this way.

Microsoft sells wrong idea and the tries to fix with another wrong idea...

[Unknown_97784568745]

This may be used for the larrabee.

Radeon 8500 and Geforce 3 can run Aero Fine.

Where did you get that from?

[crazlunatic]

will they have some kind of a hybrid option?

[HawkMan]

Microsoft does it wrong as they do everything. Radeon 8500 and Geforce 3 can run Aero Fine. That's what Microsoft had to do it, to enable video cards capable of supporting 1.1 Pixel Shader and up to run Aero, not this way.

Microsoft sells wrong idea and the tries to fix with another wrong idea...

1: this has nothign to do with Aero.

2: Have you tried running aero on the lowest end gaphics card supporting it ? And you want MS to support running Aero on lowerend graphics cards ?

Aero is fast and neat, but unless you have a card powerfull enough to support it, it's better to not suport it and avoid the complaints.

And dont try to bring linux and compiz into it. Compiz is basically a toybox, and it you can run it on crap graphics ards because you can turn off FSAA and AF and other effects, wich is probably great for the geeks or whatever, but runnign a 3D interface without high quality filtering is rather pointless since, yeah... it can run on old hardware and be reaonsabley fast, but i's also ugly and unreadable. Aero is aimed at the aervage user, and to allways look the same and not be pielated crap, thus it will allways run with high AF and FSAA and if your hardware can't run aero at a reasonable speed with those on, it won't be supported.

[jjrambo]

1: this has nothign to do with Aero.

2: Have you tried running aero on the lowest end gaphics card supporting it ? And you want MS to support running Aero on lowerend graphics cards ?

Aero is fast and neat, but unless you have a card powerfull enough to support it, it's better to not suport it and avoid the complaints.

And dont try to bring linux and compiz into it. Compiz is basically a toybox, and it you can run it on crap graphics ards because you can turn off FSAA and AF and other effects, wich is probably great for the geeks or whatever, but runnign a 3D interface without high quality filtering is rather pointless since, yeah... it can run on old hardware and be reaonsabley fast, but i's also ugly and unreadable. Aero is aimed at the aervage user, and to allways look the same and not be pielated crap, thus it will allways run with high AF and FSAA and if your hardware can't run aero at a reasonable speed with those on, it won't be supported.

It's not running cause it's not propertly done. So, now magically MS will able to run AERO fast on X86 CPU which is still slower compared to Geforce 3 capability...Are you ****ing kidding me?

Just to illustrate how inefficient they are. Html code generated by MS Office has 1000+ lines of crap. Same code in standard (correct) HTML has 60+ lines.

That tells you enough.

[Mikee99]

Microsoft does it wrong as they do everything. Radeon 8500 and Geforce 3 can run Aero Fine. That's what Microsoft had to do it, to enable video cards capable of supporting 1.1 Pixel Shader and up to run Aero, not this way.

Microsoft sells wrong idea and the tries to fix with another wrong idea...

You clearly hate Microsoft, and there is obviously no way they can amuse you. Even if they cured cancer you would still be here finding a way to insult them. For that reason, it is pointless for you to post in this thread, and the other thread regarding this similar topic, since all your posts about Windows 7 revolves around the notion that "Microsoft does everything wrong". :rolleyes:

[HawkMan]

It's not running cause it's not propertly done. So, now magically MS will able to run AERO fast on X86 CPU which is still slower compared to Geforce 3 capability...Are you ****ing kidding me?

Just to illustrate how inefficient they are. Html code generated by MS Office has 1000+ lines of crap. Same code in standard (correct) HTML has 60+ lines.

That tells you enough.

Wow.. correct html... Since when was office a html web page editor anyway, oh yeah, that right it's not, try the express web thingie, not Word. you know the actual web editor that belongs to the office suite, not the WORD editor....

and did you READ POINT 1?

you know, sometimes it's best to keep your mouth shut, especially when you don't have a clue what you're talking about.

[jjrambo]

Wow.. correct html... Since when was office a html web page editor anyway, oh yeah, that right it's not, try the express web thingie, not Word. you know the actual web editor that belongs to the office suite, not the WORD editor....

and did you READ POINT 1?

you know, sometimes it's best to keep your mouth shut, especially when you don't have a clue what you're talking about.

Apparently you have no clue what i'm talking about, cause you're either stupid or ignorant. When you send email through outlook 2007 it gets sent in HTML format. HTML format MS creates has 1400+ let's' say lines of crap and same email in correct HTML format shouldn't have more then 60+ lines. If you still don't understand, go do something else for living...IT is not for you.

Here is the crap MS generates for simple text in color.

<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml"

xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office"

xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word"

xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml"

xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40">

<head>

<meta http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=windows-1252">

<meta name=ProgId content=Word.Document>

<meta name=Generator content="Microsoft Word 12">

<meta name=Originator content="Microsoft Word 12">

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<link rel=Edit-Time-Data href="Untitled_files/editdata.mso">

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<o:DocumentProperties>

<o:Template>NormalEmail.dotm</o:Template>

<o:Revision>1</o:Revision>

<o:TotalTime>0</o:TotalTime>

<o:Created>2008-12-02T15:31:00Z</o:Created>

<o:Pages>1</o:Pages>

<o:Words>6</o:Words>

<o:Characters>37</o:Characters>

<o:Company>Information Technology Department</o:Company>

<o:Lines>1</o:Lines>

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Edited December 2, 2008 by jjrambo

[majortom1981]

This is to fix their vista + aero lawsuit problems.

This is a lazy way to get around their problems.

Anybody who has a laptop with a 915 chipset in it that was sold as vista capable will now what I am talking about.

If you have a laptop with 915 chipset you cant run aero. Also on vista without aero you cant run programs liek Movie maker. On the same laptop with xp you can pretty decently also.

This is being done because they are too lazy to reprogram all their stuff right so they came up with some convoluted way to get around the problem.

So basically this will make aero and windows 7 have all its features running on any laptop.

[jjrambo]

You clearly hate Microsoft, and there is obviously no way they can amuse you. Even if they cured cancer you would still be here finding a way to insult them. For that reason, it is pointless for you to post in this thread, and the other thread regarding this similar topic, since all your posts about Windows 7 revolves around the notion that "Microsoft does everything wrong". :rolleyes:

I don't hate Microsoft and they don't do everything wrong. Windows 2000 was right direction for Microsoft. Visual Studio 2008 i work on as Programmer is great tool. Office is crap. I wish Microsoft focuses on one thing per app, and have one app do one thing the best.

I'm not questioning MS ability to make and write things. I'm not questioning their expertise, but i do criticize their ideas which are not well thought.

[y_notm]

This is to fix their vista + aero lawsuit problems.

This is a lazy way to get around their problems.

Anybody who has a laptop with a 915 chipset in it that was sold as vista capable will now what I am talking about.

If you have a laptop with 915 chipset you cant run aero. Also on vista without aero you cant run programs liek Movie maker. On the same laptop with xp you can pretty decently also.

This is being done because they are too lazy to reprogram all their stuff right so they came up with some convoluted way to get around the problem.

So basically this will make aero and windows 7 have all its features running on any laptop.

Right, instead of just removing the check for aero they are developing a complex, completely new software rendering system which has implications far outside of just aero. Yeah, sounds like MIcrosoft is being reaaaaal lazy. :rolleyes:

[Mikee99]

I don't hate Microsoft and they don't do everything wrong.

Uh huh. Is that why you said the following:

The most useless feature. What's next? It seems that Microsoft doesn't come up with anything useful and smart.

Microsoft does it wrong as they do everything.

And in this thread regarding the same topic: https://www.neowin.net/forum/index.php?show...#entry590209830

There is no point. Another waste of time and money by MS.

Microsoft got it all wrong again which is natural for them.

Weeeeeeeee Woooooooooooo Weeeeeeeeeeeee Woooooooooooooooo

The contradiction police have come to take you away!

Thus far, you have yet to prove why a feature that allows Microsoft to advance the platform, and yet retain compatibility with older hardware is a poorly thought out and useless feature.