F1 World Championship 2009 Thread

[Subject Delta]

+1 on the sour grapes.

And I personally feel that Kimi needs to get real about his salary, especially in the middle of a global recession with all the teams looking to make cutbacks. He is undoubtedly a good driver but I don't personally feel he has done enough in the last 2 years to prove he is still worth a top line salary.

Also, nice to see 2 awesome British drivers at my favourite team, McLaren are in a really strong position as long as they continue winning the development race into next year, I feel with Button and Hamilton behind the wheel, if they maintain their end of season form they will dominate 2010.

[Antaris Veteran]

^ Yeah, they're my favourite team too, but you go to admit with Alonso AND Massa at the big F, Vettel and Webber at Red Bull, then its gonna be one wicked season!

[Subject Delta]

^ Yeah, they're my favourite team too, but you go to admit with Alonso AND Massa at the big F, Vettel and Webber at Red Bull, then its gonna be one wicked season!

Yep, if RBR stay competitive then it's gonna be really exciting. In a sense, I feel Ferrari may have it a bit easier, because their 2 drivers style's aren't actually that dissimilar whereas Button's and Hamilton's are pretty much opposite so it will be interesting to see how McLaren react to the challenge of the wildly different setup challenges posed here.

Of course at the moment Ferrari are a bit of an unknown quantity seeing as they stopped 2009 development so early, a decision I think is questionable considering that in aero and mechanical terms there are no changes next season.

Will be interesting to see what Ferrari have came up with when the winter testing ban is over.

[san.W10]

i'd like to see 4 way battle to WDC/WCC.

ferrari, mcL, RBR, Merc GP :D

Brawn did point out that their slump in second half was because they were also developing 2010 car.

if kimi ends up at merc, then it'd be a 4 way WDC :D

kimi vs FA vs ham. vs vettle :p

[+Frank B. Subscriber²]

Michael Schumacher 'will drive for Mercedes F1 in 2010'

Michael Schumacher is poised for a sensational return to Formula 1 with the new Mercedes team, according to BBC Sport pundit Eddie Jordan.

Mercedes want the seven-time champion as their lead driver after taking over title-winning Brawn, Jordan says.

"The possibility is being actively pursued and I believe it is going to happen," said Jordan.

Schumacher's spokeswoman Sabine Kehm told BBC Sport a return was "highly unlikely - but never say never".

The plan is for Schumacher to be a stop-gap before Mercedes can prise German rising star Sebastian Vettel out of Red Bull.

The move would reunite Schumacher with Mercedes GP team boss Ross Brawn, who masterminded all his seven titles at Benetton and Ferrari.

The German, who will be 41 in January, had to pull out of a temporary comeback to F1 last year as a replacement for the injured Ferrari driver Felipe Massa because of a neck injury.

But Kehm said that while Schumacher had not had any new tests on his neck, it was expected to be healed by the end of the year.

Jordan said: "It started with a meeting between Michael, Ross Brawn and Daimler chief executive officer Dieter Zetsche at the Abu Dhabi Grand Prix.

"At the moment, it is not possible for Michael to drive for Mercedes because he has a consultancy contract with Ferrari.

"But I understand he was due to meet Ferrari president Luca di Montezemolo with a view to him being released - and that it will be approved because it is in the interests of F1.

"I believe that is being planned at the moment.

"I also believe Ross and Michael have spoken in recent times and that Michael likes the idea of driving a Mercedes run by Ross. It's a mouth-watering idea.

"Schumacher was bitterly disappointed he didn't get to come back to replace Massa - he's keen to race again. And this is a dream for both parties.

"Michael and Mercedes have go way back - he drove for their sportscar team before he raced in F1, and they were responsible for getting him in to F1. They paid the then Jordan team to give him his debut in 1991.

"He has won all these titles but never driven in F1 for Mercedes."

The Brawn team rose out of the ashes of Honda, which quit F1 in December 2008, and won the drivers' world championship with Jenson Button in 2009, as well as the constructors' title.

Mercedes's takeover was announced on Monday, but the team are looking for a lead driver following Button's decision to move to McLaren for 2010.

Signing Schumacher would be an ideal way for Mercedes to head off the negative publicity that has arisen from letting the world champion slip through their fingers.

A source close to Ferrari says the Italian team have yet to be asked to release Schumacher.

Schumacher's contract with the company was changed recently to remove him from any links with the F1 team, for which he was a consultant.

He is now an ambassador, consultant and test driver for the company's road car arm.

It is understood that during the summer Schumacher explored the idea of driving a third car for Ferrari on an occasional basis, but this is forbidden by F1's rules.

Kehm said Schumacher had given her no indication that he wanted to make a full-time return.

Vettel, 22, is contracted to drive for Red Bull until the end of 2011 and, while contracts are often broken in F1, Mercedes may not find it easy to buy him out.

Red Bull is owned by the soft drinks company's founder Dietrich Mateschitz who, as a billionaire, does not exactly need the money.

If the Schumacher deal does not come off, fellow German Nick Heidfeld is considered most likely to get the second Mercedes seat alongside Nico Rosberg, another German, whose contract has been signed but not officially announced.

But another possibility for Mercedes might be the highly rated Polish driver Robert Kubica.

He has signed for Renault, but the French company is deciding whether to continue in F1, with a decision due before the end of the year.

If Renault pulled out, Kubica would be on the market, and he might be an attractive option for Mercedes, who have moved to dismiss widespread claims that they are determined to sign two German drivers by describing their new F1 team as "global".

Source: BBC News

I really don't see it happening for various reasons. As cool as it would be.

[san.W10]

i was just about to post that article :D

BBC's Source : Eddie Jordan :rofl:

[Subject Delta]

I hope he is wrong, Schumacher quitting F1 was the best thing to ever happen to it.

[+Frank B. Subscriber²]

I hope he is wrong, Schumacher quitting F1 was the best thing to ever happen to it.

Was it really?

Michael Schumacher was without a doubt the best F1 driver of his time. A 'last hooray' season in a Mercedes for him would at the very least spice the 2010 season up.

[Subject Delta]

Yes it was. Whether he was a good or bad driver is irrelevant, I don't want to see Formula 1 gravitate back to what it used to be like in his era, with 2 cars miles in front of everyone else, with the rest of the pack half way the circuit making noise after 30 laps. I wouldn't expect you, or any of his other German or Italian fans to really understand it from our point of view, but not everybody enjoyed watching him drive, or the way the sport was when he drove.

[+Frank B. Subscriber²]

Yes it was. Whether he was a good or bad driver is irrelevant, I don't want to see Formula 1 gravitate back to what it used to be like in his era, with 2 cars miles in front of everyone else, with the rest of the pack half way the circuit making noise after 30 laps. I wouldn't expect you, or any of his other German or Italian fans to really understand it from our point of view, but not everybody enjoyed watching him drive, or the way the sport was when he drove.

I'm not one of the rabid German Schumacher fans. I know about his flaws, and have been following F1 since long before he entered F1. BUT: You cannot deny that he was (still is) a bloody good driver, right up there with Senna, Prost and the like.

[Subject Delta]

And like I said, I have never made any comments against his ability, in fact I agree with you he was a great driver, I was just never a fan of his on track antics or the way the sport got really boring with Ferrari dominance

[+Frank B. Subscriber²]

And like I said, I have never made any comments against his ability, in fact I agree with you he was a great driver, I was just never a fan of his on track antics or the way the sport got really boring with Ferrari dominance

Michael Schumacher was an ass on track - sure. As were all great F1 drivers to be honest. Ayrton Senna was even worse for example...

Lastly, you can't blame him for the other teams failing to build a car as good as the Ferrari the early 2000s.

[Subject Delta]

Technically he is to blame for it, because he basically galvanised the Ferrari team into designing the perfect car, fitting the whole team around him. Not that that is a bad thing, it is a great skill and I have the utmost respect for his achievements, it just didn't make for overly entertaining viewing :p

And yep, I agree a lot of the other greats have been asses on track and I don't have a problem with that, its things like Jerez '97 and Monaco '06 that I really hold against him. As for the famous Senna / Prost collision, personally I feel that was revenge more than anything else for Prost doing it to him previously, however I do see your point as Hamilton and Massa drive like it as well to a lesser extent.

[deuz]

what frank is trying to say is finally englishman are winning at a sport and he doesn't want it to go back to the way it was;should be :p

i can feel that this is going to be one heck of a crazy year..

[san.W10]

hmm, it'd be so weird MS going to merc. after ending his career at Ferrari.

but i'd like to see him race again, coz ferrari forced him out to retirement. he & brawn reuniting will mean merc dominance in next decade :laugh: , even if he doesnt drive.

[Billus]

I just think Schumi was just a lil' immature during his racing years. I think since him leaving F1 he has really matured and still is one of the best drivers in the world as we have seen during ROC where he beat both Button and Coulthard. I think he's always brought something to F1 and without him, safety levels that they have today for the drivers wouldn't exist such as the neck brace.

I think that some people misjudge Schumi and it's funny to see that these are the same people who support Hamilton accuse Schumi for cheating when just at the start of the 09 season during the Australian GP. He blatantly lied and mislead the stewards about overtaking Trulli just to gain one measly place. Oh and there are some other controversial issues from 2008 like the Canadian GP where he crashed into Kimi in the pit lane at a red light which pretty much ruined any chance of him winning and staying in contention for the Championship. For those to complain about how Schumacher was always the fastest a 2 miles ahead, it seriously shows how good he was/is. Sure he had a few scandals on track but no-ones perfect. In some ways, it could be due to the fact he was at Ferrari which has always been an ambitious team. Hopefully he gets a ride at Mercedes and is competitive.

[Subject Delta]

Hamilton lied at the Australian GP because a high ranking team official instructed him to, the fact that McLaren fired the team official tells me where the blame really lies ;) As unfortunate as it is, drivers are under a lot of pressure these days to do whatever the team tell them, even if they don't like it. Not that I liked that incident of course it was a pretty bad case of attempted cheating, it just highlights how much pressure the teams put the drivers under in the modern era. As for the 2008 Canadian GP, tell me what you think he gained from taking himself out of the race, when he was more than fast enough to win it and gain points over all his competitors. Seems to me you are confusing a driver error with an attempt to cheat.

And as much as I despise Ferrari, they can't be blamed for his 3 worst incidences of cheating, Adelaide '94, Jerez '97, and Monaco '06

what frank is trying to say is finally englishman are winning at a sport and he doesn't want it to go back to the way it was;should be :p

i can feel that this is going to be one heck of a crazy year..

Nope, nothing to do with that I just really dislike him. I would also feel sorry for anyone who shares a team with him, because they would have no chance of equal treatment, as he has never raced on an even level with any of his team mates.

[san.W10]

maybe MS is a little over selfish, & thats why his team mate doesnt get same speed in same car.

MS is best known for his car set-up, a reason why Ferrari went for FA.

MS sets up a car & when his team mate is given same setup (w/o any work done), obviously he'll get ****ed. its not like RB never won in a ferrari.

what if Lewis was not instructed to lie? we'll never know. stupid politics.

the guy McLaren, fired was not as important as Lewis.

dont forget, FA lost 2007 title because of Lewis. McLaren giving more support to LH. :p

I would also feel sorry for anyone who shares a team with Lewis, because they would have no chance of equal treatment, as he has never raced on an even level with any of his team mates (2008 & 2009).

lewis is this gen's MS :p

now dont say Heikki is mediocre, coz he was in McLaren before Jenson :p

i dont think McLaren hire mediocre drivers , or do they? :p

[Subject Delta]

Total nonsense, nobody ever proved that Hamilton was treated preferentially over Kovalinen or Alonso, and yes Kovalinen is mediocre, McLaren took a gamble hiring him when he was largely unproven and their gamble obviously failed. Looking at his terrible race performances tells you all you need to know about Kovalinen's mediocrity.

[san.W10]

yeah, but who got the updates regularly?

Heikki performed good in Q1 & then in Q2/Q3 McLaren overload him with fuel & he is left somewhere behind Lewis.

you're saying McLaren didnt give preference to LH?

then why did Alonso leave?

that too when Renault was not at all competitive.

[Subject Delta]

I think Alonso left because he tried to bribe the team, you may find this a bit hard to comprehend but team principals don't respond to well by attempts at bribery from their team personnel :laugh:

The best example I can think of is the 2008 Hungarian GP, before Massa and Hamilton had their issues Kovalinen was almost 30 seconds behind them, despite starting with just a lap more fuel than Hamilton. The reason McLaren gave most of the new parts to Hamilton first is that they obviously believed that they would get more benefit by giving them to him first, bear in mind that some of the parts where so cutting edge that they didn't even have time to fabricate 2 sets.

Typical ferrari fan diversionary tactics though, whenever someone criticises Schumacher or Ferrari try and turn on McLaren :rofl:

[san.W10]

well, now you see, MS was just better, his team mates were not fast enough. :p

he got updates coz, he could give the team better feedback on it. i think same goes for LH.

FA gave bonus to his mechanics, i think the deal was, if FA was ahead of LH, his mechanics would get 750 pounds or whatever it was.

i'm a fan but not fanboi :p

atleast FA, MS never call their Team Boss a swinger on radio :rofl:

[san.W10]

did you guys read this - Massa: Button weakest champion

Scuderia Ferrari F1 driver Felipe Massa, speaking to ESPN Brazil (espn.com.br) threw shot at current Formula 1 champion Jenson Button stating that all other World Champions are better than Jenson.

“Hamilton and Alonso are great drivers. Kimi is excellent, I really didn’t understand all the critiques that people were throwing at him. When he was on….. all of them are better than Button” said the Brazilian.

Massa has just recently recovered from an accident he suffered during the Brazilian Grand Prix and is now looking to re-establish himself at the Scuderia after a prolonged Grand Prix absence.

http://ferrarif1forum.com/2009/11/19/massa...akest-champion/

i think that spring which hit him on head shifted his brain to his ass :rofl:

[Subject Delta]

well, now you see, MS was just better, his team mates were not fast enough. :p

I think Barrichello was fast enough to win the 2002 Austrian GP, and the 2005 US GP

FA gave bonus to his mechanics, i think the deal was, if FA was ahead of LH, his mechanics would get 750 pounds or whatever it was.

Got any proof of that, it sounds a bit unlikely to me

did you guys read this - Massa: Button weakest champion

http://ferrarif1forum.com/2009/11/19/massa...akest-champion/

i think that spring which hit him on head shifted his brain to his ass :rofl:

Massa is an idiot, he has been a bit too full of himself lately. Hell at least Button is a champion, just a case of Jealousy because Massa knows he has blown the only shot he is realistically likely to have.

[san.W10]

i read that FA bribing thing in AutoCar India Mag.

i found a link - http://www.typicallyspanish.com/news/publi...cle_12555.shtml

Spanish newspaper AS has today denied the claims published in the British Press and in El Pa?s yesterday, that Formula One World Champion,Fernando Alonso, had bribed the mechanics of the McLaren Mercedes team, giving them 1,000 € each when he finished ahead of team mate Lewis Hamilton>.