Opera: Microsoft's 'minor tweak' of Windows 7 not enough

[hjf288]

Operas been **** for awhile now, the older versions werent bad in their day but the latest definately is not as fast as the latest firefox, safari or chrome:

http://www.betanews.com/article/Is-Google-...ooks/1247847145

[dogmatix]

I look forward to Opera demanding the "right" to install their browser on MacOS alongside Safari...Apple won't take kindly to that!

[iamwhoiam]

hmmm but GJ, Apple don't own 80%! of THE SHARE!! XD

No, but they do own 100% of their own market.

[iamwhoiam]

I should have known actually reading the whole article would be too difficult for you. Why don't you scroll down to Opera's explanation of what they feel would be enough. Here it is in Arial black:

Too bad the powers that be around here doesn't give out warnings for your arrogant and condescending attitude towards others.

[cropcircles]

How about Opera stops bitching and actually makes a good product? that might help them more.

I have never SEEN Opera on a computer (other then Adobe including it in apps) and most people I know that bought cell phones that come with Opera Mobile have ripped it off of their phone.

Firefox has risen, Opera hasn't because it blows, not because of Microsoft.

I've used Opera Browser for years and for me allot more user friendly then Firefox, but each to his own. Not trying to stir up a browser war here but I'm not seeing Firefox for mobile devices anywhere like Opera Mini has developed

[powerade01]

You can flame Opera all you want, but in reality it doesn't matter one god damn bit what Opera's motives are. If Microsoft broke the law, they broke the law, and it will be up to the authorities to decide what course of action to take. I know only about three people on the entire forum will understand this, but whatever.

They did not break the law. Period. The justice system is ****ed up in the whole world. Microsoft is a easy target so they just go for them.

hmmm but GJ, Apple don't own 80%! of THE SHARE!! XD

Apple owns 100% of the market created by them and they do not allow anyone in their market.

[spike232]

I remember when you had to pay for Opera... now they cant even give it away!

[gameboy1977]

whoa! Opera is really crybaby, so EU breastfeeding her son Opera.

(I am sorry If I was joking of that one.)

I really hate Opera so much, because I can see that Opera always complain to his mom, EU. I will remove opera from my Nintendo Wii soon.

I agree with you that Opera should set up thier own Opera OS someday as Google is going to build new OS soon. I will not buy Opera or Google in the future.

Gameboy

[.Neo]

No, but they do own 100% of their own market.

Since 2006 is perfectly possible to go out and buy Mac and install Windows on it. So that's not entirely true.

[Joshie]

I've noticed in the past that people who support Opera's position in this battle will say that the average user doesn't even know other browsers exist beyond IE, and equate IE to the internet itself, and that this is the mindset they're trying to change.

I've also noticed that the average computer user doesn't CARE what their browser is, doesn't NOTICE the difference in page rendering, and doesn't care about initial launch speed. They also resent the idea that they should somehow learn more about it.

This idea that we have to bring IE down to make the average user happy is a load of crap, and it amazes me that people in the IT field--people who deal with this mindset every day--continue to believe it. Perhaps their own personal resentment toward the people they work with (and IT has always resented the client). All I can be sure of is, this magical Average Computer User doesn't give a crap what their web browser is. It's just a webbrowser to them. They'll use what's there from the beginning because it requires less effort. They don't want to look for something else to install. They don't want to figure out why this browser calls them Bookmarks and this one calls them Favorites and can't figure out why Firefox can't figure out how to import IE Favorites with the bloody folders sorted before the files.

Opera takes their web browser far too seriously. Maybe the real issue is that Microsoft isn't being anti-competitive: they took competition out of the equation entirely. Before MS came along with IE, web browsers actually WERE a market. Netscape cost. Opera cost. Internet Explorer destroyed that, and in so doing made the web a part of everyone's life. MS made the web what it is today. Mozilla adapted and is doing a phenomenal job of figuring out how to win market share.

Opera, the 92-year-old man of the bunch apparently, hates that rabbit and expects the world to change for it before it will change for the world.

[markwolfe Veteran]

No, but they do own 100% of their own market.

And Amiga owns 100% of the Amiga market!

:unsure:

What is the logic of sub-dividing the market to the point of absurdity?

[Denis W. Veteran]

Opera takes their web browser far too seriously. Maybe the real issue is that Microsoft isn't being anti-competitive: they took competition out of the equation entirely. Before MS came along with IE, web browsers actually WERE a market. Netscape cost. Opera cost. Internet Explorer destroyed that, and in so doing made the web a part of everyone's life. MS made the web what it is today. Mozilla adapted and is doing a phenomenal job of figuring out how to win market share.

Opera, the 92-year-old man of the bunch apparently, hates that rabbit and expects the world to change for it before it will change for the world.

Other than some versions of their mobile browser, how have they not adapted? Their current stream of revenue is pretty much similar to what Mozilla is doing right now, by funding through Google's searches.

And not to repeat this same point that has been previously mentioned, but Mozilla (and also Google) isn't exactly out of this current drama fest either. They're just not pursuing it that publicly, leaving everyone else to pick on the instigator - as you can see here.

[Simon Veteran]

Wouldn't adding a screen with a list of browser options only help the big 5 - Firefox, Safari, Internet Explorer, Chrome, and Opera?

That's not making the market competitive... that's picking a small portion of the choices and giving them all of the market. Opera are just in it for themselves, while making it look like they're there for the little guy.

[Chasethebase Veteran]

...

I'm fed up of this, really. I think Neowin as a collective group of members should do something to shut Opera up once and for all. Regardless of where we're from we all seem to have a similar opinion, they just need to stop complaining.

If we do this, I think numerous other tech communities might join us.

[Denis W. Veteran]

Wouldn't adding a screen with a list of browser options only help the big 5 - Firefox, Safari, Internet Explorer, Chrome, and Opera?

That's not making the market competitive... that's picking a small portion of the choices and giving them all of the market. Opera are just in it for themselves, while making it look like they're there for the little guy.

True, but to be honest, the rest of the market doesn't really amount to much. :p It's either freeware IE-based shells, a few Gecko-based browers (i.e. K-Meleon), browsers that don't run on Windows to begin with (Konqueror on Linux, iCab on Mac), and of course text based browsers which are out of the question.

But as I've said before, I don't agree with the browser options suggestion.

Edited July 19, 2009 by rm20010

[Lechio]

^

http://img154.imageshack.us/img154/1812/konqueroriv4.jpg

[Nagisan]

Operas been **** for awhile now, the older versions werent bad in their day but the latest definately is not as fast as the latest firefox, safari or chrome:

http://www.betanews.com/article/Is-Google-...ooks/1247847145

I personally have not used Chrome because it doesnt have a single feature that appeals to me that Opera doesnt have, but I have tried the latest Firefox and it still feels that Opera is faster. Remember, synthetic benchmarks are an OK comparison, but they are nothing like real-world applications.....for what I use it for, Opera is much faster than Firefox AND it includes all the main features I use right out of the box without having to go find them.

Obviously you do not agree but Opera is much more innovative than any other browser developer and they have IMO improved their browser immensely since the older version (pre-9 was crap IMHO, now its the best browser around). So please, stop passing around your opinion as fact, you may feel that way, but your not entirely correct.

[apreichner]

^

http://img154.imageshack.us/img154/1812/konqueroriv4.jpg

Powned

[PL_ Veteran]

Why doesn't Opera make their own damn operating system and then they can do what they want?

It's Microsoft's operating system. They can bundle w/e the hell they want in it.

Well actually, they have laws against this sort of thing.

[ObiWanToby]

If only Opera were compatible with everything I used. Outlook Live, Bing Maps, Google Maps....

Their product is not nearly compatible enough to be viable. It really is a shame, their ad blocking and smooth scrolling is wonderful and 2nd to none.

[Mike]

If only Opera were compatible with everything I used. Outlook Live, Bing Maps, Google Maps....

Their product is not nearly compatible enough to be viable. It really is a shame, their ad blocking and smooth scrolling is wonderful and 2nd to none.

Opera works fine on both Bing and Google maps, can't test Outlook live but i'd expect it's just not supported rather than not compatible.

[Denis W. Veteran]

^

http://img154.imageshack.us/img154/1812/konqueroriv4.jpg

Right... forgot some KDE apps run on Windows now. I stand corrected then. :p

[Eice]

I personally have not used Chrome because it doesnt have a single feature that appeals to me that Opera doesnt have, but I have tried the latest Firefox and it still feels that Opera is faster. Remember, synthetic benchmarks are an OK comparison, but they are nothing like real-world applications.....for what I use it for, Opera is much faster than Firefox AND it includes all the main features I use right out of the box without having to go find them.

I don't know about you, but this is how Opera fares on my machine. Vista SP1 32-bit, 512k wireless, IPv6 enabled. Page load times are in seconds and averaged over 5 runs.

[soonerproud]

This may come as a HUGE shock to you, but the US DOJ has no jurisdiction in Europe and does not make rulings for the whole world.

You're welcome.

Which is why as the previous poster explained to you that the former case has nothing to do with the current case. You are the one that seems to want it both ways for Opera.

The reason Opera has no market share is the browser just plain sucks. I've used it, including very recently and even tried out Beta 10. Opera has major rendering issues and is very unintuitive for even basic task. It is a horrible browser, bloated, to many useless features included like a email client and bittorrent. I just want a browser and not the Swiss army knives of browsers.

Opera should concentrate on their mobile browser which is one of the best in that space and quit trying to force people to use their crappy desktop browser.

[Growled Member]

I'm fed up of this, really. I think Neowin as a collective group of members should do something to shut Opera up once and for all. Regardless of where we're from we all seem to have a similar opinion, they just need to stop complaining.

If we do this, I think numerous other tech communities might join us.

What do you suggest we do? Ban Opera users? Ban talk of Opera? Start a petition of some sort?