MW2: No Dedicated Servers, No Mods

[Vice]

Hence the "ban" on mods for MW2. If everyone plays the same game without any server tricks, server calculus is not needed. IMO they wouldn't release something that didn't work.

Just to be clear, I don't agree with them taking out dedicated server support. I just think people are overreacting a bit.

I've played CoD4 on XBox Live P2P without lag so it's perfectly possible to do it on the PC too.

Mods are great. Denying that really hurts the scope of the multiplayer aspect. Some games like UT99 and CS 1.6 are played even today due to their vibrant community of modders and without that this game will only last until the next MW3 is released. And I think that is actually their intention to kill a community from growing to large so that they will migrate to the next big release.

[Sethos]

Maybe. 67,000+ people seem to think otherwise though. That number went up by 2000 in just the last 30-45 minutes too.

Now the question is, how many of those are duplicates :p

I can't wait to see the sales numbers come November 10th

[protocol7]

I can't wait to see the sales numbers come November 10th

And the inevitable "reason" for them.

[Vice]

I reckon the game will sell well regardless. Most people buying the game wont understand what has happened before they get it or why its relevant to their enjoyment of the games multiplayer.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

I reckon the game will sell well regardless. Most people buying the game wont understand what has happened before they get it or why its relevant to their enjoyment of the games multiplayer.

I'm sure Larry posted a rough estimate for PC sales and it was only just under 400,000.

A lot of the people who buy PC games are a hardcore audience, they know what dedicated servers are, they know what mods are, they know what clans are.

Point being it's a large risk screwing with your potential sales figures on the PC where sales aren't that high as it is.

[Vice]

I'm sure Larry posted a rough estimate for PC sales and it was only just under 400,000.

A lot of the people who buy PC games are a hardcore audience, they know what dedicated servers are, they know what mods are, they know what clans are.

Point being it's a large risk screwing with your potential sales figures on the PC where sales aren't that high as it is.

Only 400,000 Sales of Call of Duty MW:1 for PC or Preorders for Call of Duty MW:2?

Cause I know that Call of Duty 4 sold 17 Million units combined (Consoles + PC)

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Only 400,000 Sales of Call of Duty MW:1 for PC or Preorders for Call of Duty MW:2?

Cause I know that Call of Duty 4 sold 17 Million units combined (Consoles + PC)

Sales for MW:1.

Ughhh 17 million? Last figure from Activision was 13 million in May this year, I doubt it's sold 4 million since then (most sales are front loaded).

[DirtyLarry Veteran]

Only 400,000 Sales of Call of Duty MW:1 for PC or Preorders for Call of Duty MW:2?

Cause I know that Call of Duty 4 sold 17 Million units combined (Consoles + PC)

I could not find a true total sales, but I did find this...

Of the 7 million copies, about 3.04 million sold were for the Xbox 360. According to the data, only 383,000 copies for the PC were purchased, but that does not take into consideration digital distribution sales via platforms like STEAM.

So STEAM is not taken into account either, but if you stick to that percentage of ths first 7 million copies sold, then it is still a pretty low number of the 17 million.

[Vice]

I could not find a true total sales, but I did find this...

So STEAM is not taken into account either, but if you stick to that percentage of ths first 7 million copies sold, then it is still a pretty low number of the 17 million.

That is pretty poor considering how many people pirated it from my post earlier in the thread. From just 3 separate torrents on a single site it was almost 1Million completed illegal downloads.

You can see why developers are focusing less and less on the PC. Harder to make your game support all that different hardware and the sales aren't that great and piracy. Whilst a console is well 1 system which makes it a lot easier to write the game for one piece of non-changing hardware, no piracy on the PS3 and very little on the 360.

As an avid PC gamer I feel kinda sad about the state of the industry. I may actually have to get an XBOX360 at this rate. I really wanna play Army of Two but without a PC port ..

[DirtyLarry Veteran]

If we can get an exact number on Final Sales, will be pretty easy to figure out how many PC copies were sold...

PS3 = 4.66m

360 = 7.83m

So both consoles = 12.49

All sales figures compliments http://www.vgchartz.com/

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

I posted a sales figure from Activision themselves above guys :p

13 million in May 2009. I seriously doubt the game has sold many copies since then with WaW out.

[Vice]

According to this page: http://www.unigamesity.com/call-of-duty-4-...online-players/

“I’m delighted that we just reached 11 million unique players on Xbox Live and we’ve got over 4 million on PSN,” Bowling said, according to Eurogamer sources.

The numbers are impressive, having in mind that there are 17 million Xbox Live users – probably this would make COD4 one of the most successful games ever. Which, to be honest, is not a huge surprise, after all…

That would make it 15 Million on Consoles alone. And I did read I think it was on Kotaku where a game designer of CoD4 said it had sold 17 Million total. It was recent.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

According to this page: http://www.unigamesity.com/call-of-duty-4-...online-players/

That would make it 16 Million on Consoles alone. And I did read I think it was on Kotaku where a game designer of CoD4 said it had sold 17 Million total. It was recent.

That's players, not sales.... Multiple PSN/Live accounts can play on the one console with the one disc, which in return logs as a unique play.

I'm not saying it again, I've already posted official sales from Activision on the last page, and reiterated them in the post above you. 13 million :p

[Vice]

That's players, not sales.... Multiple PSN/Live accounts can play on the one console.

I'm not saying it again, I've already posted official sales from Activision on the last page, and reiterated them in the post above you. 13 million :p

Did you even read my post? I clearly stated in your own quote that a game designer said to Kotaku recently that it has sold 17 Million copies to date. After ur numbers were posted.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Did you even read my post? I clearly stated in your own quote that a game designer said to Kotaku recently that it has sold 17 Million copies to date. After ur numbers were posted.

Well post a link then to this Kotaku article claiming 17 million sales.

I'd rather believe the CEO of the company stating 13 million in a financial report.

Even VGchartz which isn't the most reliable site, but does base estimates off tangible numbers says 12.5 million console sales, as Larry pointed out on the page before. You're trying to tell me 4 million sales on the PC? Yea right :p

[DirtyLarry Veteran]

Yeah for now I am going to go with the 13 million copies sold since it is something we can reference in a document online, so if you go according to that, that means approximately 510,000 copies were sold on the PC since the consoles were 12.49 million. While not really chump change in the grand scheme of things, it is indeed not enough for them to truly care about the PC version, which as I stated before I think they make that crystal clear that is the case with this move.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Yeah for now I am going to go with the 13 million copies sold since it is something we can reference in a document online, so if you go according to that, that means approximately 510,000 copies were sold on the PC since the consoles were 12.49 million. While not really chump change in the grand scheme of things, it is indeed not enough for them to truly care about the PC version, which as I stated before I think they make that crystal clear that is the case with this move.

The ironic thing though is you're saying they don't care about the PC version but will spend the time to develop this proprietary Battle Net system or whatever it's called, and implement a matchmaking system, something devs on consoles still have headaches with.... instead of allowing other companies to host dedicated servers day 1 and completely remove any chance of teething issues.

Something tells me more effort goes into doing what they're doing, so therefore the motive is money based out of locking down the game to sell DLC, or at least consider the potential to, as they have all the time in the world to think about it whilst pc owners can't make mods/maps.

It's all about completely closing the game down, something that goes against everything that is PC. Heck even console games this generation are starting to move forward into user generated content territory.... which makes this even funnier.

[Vice]

Well post a link then to this Kotaku article claiming 17 million sales.

I'd rather believe the CEO of the company stating 13 million in a financial report.

Even VGchartz which isn't the most reliable site, but does base estimates off tangible numbers says 12.5 million console sales, as Larry pointed out on the page before. You're trying to tell me 4 million sales on the PC? Yea right :p

The only thing I can find is the Account thing so I was mistaken. And 13 Million seems logical based on the time of the conference call to now. They only sold 3 million from June 2008 to May 2009 so they obviously aren't going to hit 17 Million in only a few months.

[DirtyLarry Veteran]

The ironic thing though is you're saying they don't care about the PC version but will spend the time to develop this proprietary Battle Net system or whatever it's called, and implement a matchmaking system, something devs on consoles still have headaches with.... instead of allowing other companies to host dedicated servers day 1 and completely remove any chance of teething issues.

Something tells me more effort goes into doing what they're doing, so therefore the motive is money based out of locking down the game to sell DLC, or at least consider the potential to, as they have all the time in the world to think about it whilst pc owners can't make mods/maps.

It's all about completely closing the game down, something that goes against everything that is PC. Heck even console games this generation are starting to move forward into user generated content territory.... which makes this even funnier.

Well where me and you are going to have to agree to disagree, and I could be totally wrong, but all IWNet (which I do think is the name but could be wrong) sounds like to me is a very, very similar way to how they they do it on the consoles right now. So I would imagine it is in fact the exact opposite, that it is going to cost them much less money to implement than it would to put a team dedicated towards helping on the creation of tools for modding and patching the PC version, etc. which would be needed if their were indeed dedicated servers in the mix.

So what I mean is while it may be it's own system, I believe it is going to be so based on the current system that it would not require much more, in fact if any more, resources than if they left it all open with dedicated servers. That is just my hunch, as I do believe all things such as this are considered in the meeting room when making such a decision. This is how I envision the conversation might have went down...

Guy In Suit 1 - So someone was talking about maybe making the PC MP just like the console MP, what does this mean for the bottom line?

Guy In Suit 2 - Well our team tells us that because the system is indeed so much like the one on the 360, it is not going to take that much time or resources to create it for the computer.

Guy In Suit 1 - Well that sounds great, but how much more is it going to cost as to maintain this service on the PC if we do implement it?

Guy In Suit 2 - Actually, we will save money in the long run since the same team can maintain the service across all 3 platforms, and getting rid of the old way on the PC means we will not have to dedicate team members and resources to mantaining that community.

Guy In Suit 1 - Sounds good. Do It.

Where we do definitely 110% agree though is I without a doubt also believe it is also about closing it all down so they control all content. No argument from there, so they can make even more potential money if possible, but I would not be surprised if DLC for PC still remains free TBH. I think they look at it as that much of a non factor at this point.

[+Audioboxer Subscriber²]

Well where me and you are going to have to agree to disagree, and I could be totally wrong, but all IWNet (which I do think is the name but could be wrong) sounds like to me is a very, very similar way to how they they do it on the consoles right now. So I would imagine it is in fact the exact opposite, that it is going to cost them much less money to implement than it would to put a team dedicated towards helping on the creation of tools for modding and patching the PC version, etc. which would be needed if their were indeed dedicated servers in the mix.

So what I mean is while it may be it's own system, I believe it is going to be so based on the current system that it would not require much more, in fact if any more, resources than if they left it all open with dedicated servers. That is just my hunch, as I do believe all things such as this are considered in the meeting room when making such a decision.

Where we do definitely 110% agree though is I without a doubt also believe it is also about closing it all down so they control all content. No argument from there, so they can make even more potential money if possible, but I would not be surprised if DLC for PC still remains free TBH. I think they look at it as that much of a non factor at this point.

But Larry you seem to be forgetting COD4 for the PC had mod tools and dedicated servers, instead of going through the effort of porting a console based system to the PC, they'd just be sending out the same tools from COD4. Both games are based on the engine IW 4.0 right? With MW2 having some upgrades obviously to the existing engine. I seriously doubt the tools though are all that different, and they already have the dedicated back end in place from COD4.

Where as now they're putting out this IWNet in a completely under par/basic form and saying in the future they may be able to work on it to include custom content (yeah right). If anything that shows it's underdeveloped for PC needs, where as just doing what they did with COD4 wouldn't be underdeveloped.

It's all conjecture though as we don't know financials, and at least I have no knowledge/experience with game making, so we'll just need to agree to disagree :p I just wanted to add the above as I truly think there wouldn't be much changed needed from the online system COD4 has in place to CODMW2 due to them being on the same engine, albeit it's upgraded/tweaked.

I really think it's just about locking the game down, not trying to make it cheaper, which is why I think it's even a possibility the new system has cost a bit more than just doing MW2 like COD4. Without dedicated servers it also locks out the potential for those "cracked" servers you see, therefore probably stopping pirates getting online completely - Not seen many people think of that yet.

Edited October 19, 2009 by Audioboxer

[WastedJoker]

I think it's all about trying to ensure all players, regardless of format, receive the same gaming experience.

[Malfunctional]

Yeah for now I am going to go with the 13 million copies sold since it is something we can reference in a document online, so if you go according to that, that means approximately 510,000 copies were sold on the PC since the consoles were 12.49 million. While not really chump change in the grand scheme of things, it is indeed not enough for them to truly care about the PC version, which as I stated before I think they make that crystal clear that is the case with this move.

Do any of those sales numbers include digital purchases? If not I bet you could at least double the number of PC sales.

[Draken]

that's enough! I'm canceling my pre-order ....... wait a sec, I didn't have one :laugh:

[Denis W. Veteran]

I was just at my local gamestop well one of the 10, but anyways the manager there told me in the system he looked up there is alredy over 100,000 canceled cod mw2 placed today so far company wide.

He even said they expect many more cancels on the pc version over the next week. He also said at this current rate it could reach over a million cancels company wide before this comming friday.

My gamestop manager being a pc gamer himself said he had no idea why IW would go away from dedicated servers and no mods since mods was the thing that made cod4 the big selling game it is to date.

figured i would just update you on that so if there is already that many canceled copies just thru gamestop, imagine worldwide and how many millions of dollars IW is going to lose.

IW FTL!

Game over, and I am very sad to see this with all the hype now going to console only gamers.

Regardless I will never play console games and I will not buy pc games from activision anymore personally

(from here)

:|

[svnO.o]

(from here)

:|

If true, this is epic pwnage by PC gamers!