F1 World Championship 2010 Thread

[i11usive]

It's a sad part of my day, when the talking point of a race is something like this. Team orders were banned when they started getting in the way of good racing and we see it here again today.

- Massa get put on fuel saving and starts losing a half second a lap

- Alonso gains back track position

- Massa is given the message and told sorry

- The "pass" at the hairpin

- "Sorry", being told he's "magnanimous" and Alonso being told "he's fine.."

Honestly the press conference was so very telling.

Then we have the front wing row.

The new RBR wing is moving, check out the new design:

Courtesy of mike

As you can see the wing is forming up a few degrees less at high speed allowing for less downforce and coming back in for low speed corners.

After all is said and done we could end up with a mclaren 1-2.

(Y) I agree - but sadly that will never happen!

[Richard Hammond]

Oh dear, just watching the F1 Forum on BBC Red Button. They are interviewing the Ferrari Press Officer it reminds me so much of the Iraqi Information Minister saying there are no tanks in Iraq and you can see them driving around in the background. I hate being lied to dont treat the F1 fans and viewers with contempt, man up.

[san.W10]

Massa feels he deserved victory

Felipe Massa said he felt he deserved to win the German Grand Prix, having let team-mate Fernando Alonso take the lead after having led from the start.

Massa finished in second position after giving up the lead when Ferrari told him on the radio that Alonso was quicker than him.

"Fernando is faster than you. Can you confirm you understood that message?" Massa's race engineer Rob Smedley told the Brazilian on the radio.

Moments later, Massa slowed down and let Alonso through, the Spaniard having said earlier on the radio that "This is ridiculous" as he followed Massa closely but was unable to pass.

A less-than-happy-looking Massa said he felt he deserved victory.

"Well, I think so," said Massa when asked if he felt he deserved the win. "The start was just fantastic and also the pace on the soft tyres was really great and then I was struggling a little bit on the hard tyres but anyway a very good race for us."

When asked about Smedley's radio comment, Massa added: "Well, I don't think I need to say anything about that."

He added: "The only thing I feel is that we work for the team and doing a great job for the team and that is the most important thing."

Massa is currently 72 points behind championship leader Lewis Hamilton, with Alonso now 34 behind the Briton.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/85535

Asslonso

poor Massa

Horner: Ferrari move clear team orders

Red Bull Racing boss Christian Horner described Ferrari's exchange of positions in the German Grand Prix as 'the clearest team order' he had seen, after his driver Sebastian Vettel finished third behind Fernando Alonso and Felipe Massa at Hockenheim.

Massa led the majority of the German Grand Prix, before lifting off and allowing Alonso to pass him with 17 laps to go. Shortly beforehand, he had received a radio message from his engineer Rob Smedley informing him that Alonso was 'faster'. Smedley later added "good lad" and "sorry" after Massa had fallen to second.

Horner said there was no doubt in his mind that it was a team order, comparing it to Rubens Barrichello allowing Ferrari team-mate Michael Schumacher to pass him to win the 2002 Austrian Grand Prix - the incident that prompted the ban on such tactics.

"I have to say, that was probably the clearest team order I've ever seen, especially when you've got the team apologising to a driver," Horner told the BBC.

"It will be interesting to see what the stewards make of it, because it was as clear as 2002, which was why the regulation was brought in."

He added: "The regulations are pretty clear that team orders aren't allowed and it looked like a team order."

Horner was adamant that Red Bull would not have acted in the same manner.

"No, we let our drivers race," he said. "Massa's still in this championship, or maybe he's signed a contract that says he's a number two driver, but I think that it's wrong for the sport.

"The drivers should've been allowed to race. Massa did the better job. He was in the lead."

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/85534

that flexi-wing was spotted waaaaaay back, in autosport forums by some member.:p

[san.W10]

"Ferrari has been summoned to see the stewards following the German GP team orders controversy. More on autosport.com as it happens"

NobleF1's Twitter

[san.W10]

Ferrari bosses summoned by stewards

Ferrari team bosses have been summoned to see the German Grand Prix stewards following the team orders controversy at Hockenheim.

Fernando Alonso won the race from team-mate Felipe Massa, but only after the Brazilian let him pass following a conversation on the radio, Massa having led the race from the start.

Massa was told by his race engineer Rob Smedley: "Fernando is faster than you. Can you confirm you understood that message?"

Moments later Massa slowed down and let Alonso take the lead.

After the race, the FIA stewards summoned Ferrari's team manager and team principal.

Team orders are banned in the sport.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/85539

will Asslonso get 25sec penalty? :D

[enigma-penguin Veteran]

It will be more than a time penalty if they get one san.W10, by far.

[acnpt]

Massa's girlfriend unhappy as Ferrari order Massa to let Alonso go first in the bedroom with her tonight

:rofl:

[simonlang]

i expecet a heavy penalty as it was just so obvious and - even worse - scandalonso and ferrari bosses lying right after the race about the incident.

[.mcman]

i expecet a heavy penalty as it was just so obvious and - even worse - scandalonso and ferrari bosses lying right after the race about the incident.

I think they will just say that Felipe made that decision himself and instruct Massa to say the same.

I don't think they will get any kind of penalty.

[acnpt]

Is there a law of 'bringing the sport into disrepute'?

I don't believe there is, but it could be useful for situations like this. Although I guess the teams would prefer specific rules, so they can try and bend them.

[san.W10]

Joe Sawart:

'

There was not a hint of applause in the FIA Media Centre in Germany when Fernando Alonso crossed the finish line to ?win? the German Grand Prix. The race was given to him in lap 49 when his team-mate Felipe Massa slowed down and ostentatiously allowed the Spaniard to move ahead. It is not clear where there is any satisfaction in such a thing but Ferrari got a 1-2 and at least Alonso looked happy. It would have been a better story ? and more Ferraris would have been sold ? if Felipe had won on the anniversary of his accident last year in Hungary. Now that would have been a great story. Instead we have another negative story. When the Ferrari press officer arrived in the Media Centre he went straight on to the defensive, without anyone even suggesting that the whole thing was a farce. :rofl: That said it all. If Alonso was faster he could have proved it by overtaking Massa. Instead he whined on the radio (as usual) and in the end Massa was ?convinced? to let him move ahead.

Sebastian Vettel finished third, but Ferrari?s real enemy (apart from those with a sense of sport) is McLaren: Lewis Hamilton and Jenson Button finished fourth and fifth and added another 22 points to the total in the Constructors? Championship.

No doubt in the coming days there will much talk of team orders and all the rest of it. It would be so much better if we could be discussing sporting ideals and great races.

http://joesaward.wordpress.com/2010/07/25/a-hollow-victory-for-alonso/

[Richard Hammond]

I feel sorry for Felipe making him say that it was his decision, Ferrari are going to get let off with a slapped wrist and the circus will continue, i detest Alonso whining, man child, grade a plonker.

[Mike]

Ferrari has been fined $100,000 and referred to the World Motor Sport Council for team orders and bringing sport into disrepute

from NobleF1 (Autosport) on Twitter.

[MightyJordan]

(N) Not good enough. They should have given Alonso a time penalty as well, and given Massa the win.

[simonlang]

(N) Not good enough. They should have given Alonso a time penalty as well, and given Massa the win.

that might still happen. the fact that the motorsport council is to decide now hints that ferrari will face a heavy penalty. the council can also exclude the team for the rest of the year for example; race stewards cant!

[dfuk]

So the stewards have fined ferarri $100,000 fine

[acnpt]

I'd hate to see Ferrari exluded from the championship, now they have caught up with the Redbulls.

Hopefully we will see points deducted/time penalties for Alonso and Massa.

[PeteWhite]

Ferrari are treating us like idiots. $100,000 is nothing to them, the fine should have been a lot higher and they should be relegated to the back of the grid next race.

Pete

[i11usive]

I watched the forums after the race on BBC1 --- Ferrari had every statement sewn up ... it was disgraceful! If the FIA falls for those lies, they shouldn't be judging!! Massa went on record saying "I let him pass - he was quicker!" What the hell is going on ...... it's this sort of crap that ruins the sport. Imagine punters betting money on Massa taking the win - only to have a decision made by the team ruin it for you. Where is the "professionalism" in that?

[Nicholas-c Veteran]

AFAIK its not over yet. The stewards haven't signed off the final results yet.

[Lovell]

He blackmailed Mclaren got away with it, his team mate deliberately caused a crash to help him win, which Renault also got away with no fine nothing, and now this and he'll get away with this too, there is just WAY to much dodgy **** that happens around Alonso, could be a coincidence but I doubt it. Hopefully the WMSC will remove Alonsos position and give Massa 1st. The FIA really needs to sort their fines out if you steal information from another team you get a $100 million fine if you deliberately cause a crash you receive no punishment and if you fix the race you receive a 100k fine which when they spend 50million a year is nothing. :unsure:

"It's a shame, not for us because this is racing, but for all the fans who came here to watch a manipulated race,"

Alonso after Valencia

[Antaris Veteran]

$100,000 fine for what is essentially fixing the race. When you do something that guarantees the outcome of the event, its no more than cheating. Alonso thinks they've done nothing wrong, and that's very rich seeing as he's spent the better part of the last two months moaning about the integrity of the sport. Massa got himself into 1st place, he damn well deserved to stay there. If they let the race play out naturally, then maybe Alonso would have passed him while they were battling, but they didn't. It's disgusting. Because they essentially cheated to get Alonso 1st place, I think he should be handed an immediate grid or time penalty as well.

[ahmz]

I don't agree with it and I think it's disgusting. But other teams have done it in the past and it happens every year, they just disguise it better.

[Lingwo]

I agree with what Eddie Jordan was saying on the BBC, they cheated the fans out of a battle for first. That's the most annoying thing about it. Hopefully they'll both be docked positions, a bit unfair for Massa but he should have had the integrity to say no, i'm first for a reason. I'm sure if it was the other way round Alonso wouldn't have done it. He would have held Massa off.. remember a few races back where he ran Massa off the road in the pit lane!

[ahmz]

Every driver would have done what Massa did, it was a team order.