Mac OS X Lion Discussion

[Vice]

For those who have been playing with dev preview: Have you people found any major bug that makes system unusable?

I've found a few related to External Monitors. Some of my 3rd party apps don't work (I found a few fixes for some but others just don't work right). Overall the UI feels sluggish when performing transitions and things, I believe this to be due to not much optimisation on my specific hardware. (2009 MacBook Pro)

To be honest if Lion is going in this direction then when it's released I might not buy it and just stick with Snow Leopard. Which is a first for me as I've always been excited to jump on the latest version of OS X. This update to me just doesn't feel great. I don't like Launchpad at all, I don't like the new gestures and the way they have removed Expose in favour of Launch Pad. The new Finder in my opinion is a step back from the one we have in Snow Leopard which is really sad.

I'm sure I'm alone in some of my opinions about the new OS but I'm just not feeling it. I like the idea of iOS I own an iPhone buy for a big boy OS Lion feels like a step back functionality wise. I'm sure they will continue to work on it right up until release but if it stays mostly like it is now then I'll stick with Snow.

[.Neo]

the way they have removed Expose in favour of Launch Pad. The new Finder in my opinion is a step back from the one we have in Snow Leopard which is really sad.

Mission Control you mean? Just wondering, how is the new Finder a step back in your opinion? Beyond a slightly different look its pretty much identical to the Finder found in Mac OS X Snow Leopard. I haven't seen any removal of features. At this point I have it setup EXACTLY the same as had before on Mac OS X Snow Leopard.

[Vice]

Mission Control you mean? Just wondering, how is the new Finder a step back in your opinion? Beyond a slightly different look its pretty much identical to the Finder found in Mac OS X Snow Leopard. I haven't seen any removal of features.

Yeah mission control my bad.

Well they removed the bottom border which was nice to have as it said how much space was available in the drive I was looking at and how many files were in the selected folder. And its icon view listed things properly instead of groups based on filetype.

Also I liked how the Shared drives were at the top left instead of right at the bottom left now as I use that stuff quite a lot. Overall the Finder is less useful for me now not just ergonomically from placement perspective but also it now shows me less information than it used to. Also having mounted DMG's listed at the bottom left of the finder is also something I don't like. In-fact why did they remove the ability to have Icon Colours in the Finder? - Those helped me quickly identify things and with icons this small it takes a longer period of recognition to identify which list item it is I want.

Similar with Mail I'm not really a fan of the iPad look for the mail. I turned it off and went back to the old style which I'm thankful Apple didn't remove. As it is right now I can't see myself spending money on an OS when I don't like any of the new features over what we already have in Snow Leopard. I mean would you buy an OS only to deactivate all the new stuff and use the old styles?

[.Neo]

No offense, but I really feel people should take the time to look around a bit more when installing a new OS version before immediately dismissing something as being worse than before just because the default settings have been reshuffled a bit.

The Path Bar and Status Bar can be reenabled through the View menu. Grouping can be disabled through the toolbar button. And there you have it the Finder as you know it from Mac OS X Snow Leopard:

The rest of your complaints regarding the Finder I see as being a fairly trivial. People always complain when things change a bit.

[PL_ Veteran]

the way they have removed Expose

Surely Mission Control is just an upgraded Exposé? Application-specific Exposé is still around (swipe down) and it would be hard to have everything spread out like before with the new extras.

[protocol7]

It would be nice if you could move the devices back up to the top of the sidebar though. They're a little out-of-the-way down there at the bottom.

[Jan Veteran]

[snipped]

Dribbles...

[Vice]

No offense, but I really feel people should take the time to look around a bit more when installing a new OS version before immediately dismissing something as being worse than before just because the default settings have been reshuffled a bit.

The Path Bar and Status Bar can be reenabled through the View menu. Grouping can be disabled through the toolbar button.

http://img834.imageshack.us/img834/5322/screenshot20110227at141.png

No offence to Apple but they need to stop hiding things. I looked for ages for settings to bring back those features and I looked in Finder -> Preferences which is where I would expect such PREFERENCES to be stuck.

And again if I'm just going to deactivate all the new stuff no point buying it.

And yeah the Finder was only one of my complaints I don't like the new gestures. Doing a 4 finger Spock Come in Peace is just ridiculous and they removed the ability to swipe down to view all open windows which is an excellent feature. Instead they replaced it with a swipe up for Mission Control which only shows groups of apps and not windows. Even if I could deactivate that and bring it back to Expose that would just be me taking everything back to Snow Leopard.

For me this upgrade is not so good, but yeah this is my personal preference Apple can't please everyone.

[.Neo]

No offence to Apple but they need to stop hiding things. I looked for ages for settings to bring back those features and I looked in Finder -> Preferences which is where I would expect such PREFERENCES to be stuck.

It is a view option. As such stuff like that has ALWAYS been located under the View menu: Be it on Mac OS X Cheetah, Mac OS X Snow Leopard or Mac OS X Lion. That's a problem with you, not Apple and things certainly didn't change in this department with their latest release.

[Vice]

It is a view option. As such stuff like that has ALWAYS been located under the View menu: Be it on Mac OS X Cheetah, Mac OS X Snow Leopard or Mac OS X Lion. That's a problem with you, not Apple and things certainly didn't change in this department with their latest release.

Well the thing is Neo that Apple doesn't conform to their own rules. To bring back the old looks in Mail you go to Mail -> Preferences. Not Mail -> View. And in the Finder they have some UI settings in Preferences (like hiding and showing of left side panel options) but other options are not there? - Makes no sense. And that is really my opinion and I'm entitled to it.

[.Neo]

Well the thing is Neo that Apple doesn't conform to their own rules. To bring back the old looks in Mail you go to Mail -> Preferences. Not Mail -> View. And in the Finder they have some UI settings in Preferences (like hiding and showing of left side panel options) but other options are not there? - Makes no sense. And that is really my opinion and I'm entitled to it.

The toggling of additional bars are normally always located under View. Be it in the Finder, Mail, Safari, Preview etc. This hasn't changed. The specific Mail preference you're talking about is a fairly "advanced" one and I can understand why Apple hasn't included that in the View menu. It has been placed in another logical spot. Do you want to toggle the Favorites Bar in Mail? Again, it's right there in the View menu.

You're always entitled to your opinion, however quite a few of those opinions regarding the Mac OS X Lion Finder are based on a lack of knowledge and hold little ground. You can have it setup almost identically to what you're used to on Mac OS X Snow Leopard with minimum effort.

[Vice]

The toggling of additional bars are normally always located under View. Be it in the Finder, Mail, Safari, Preview etc. This hasn't changed.

You're always entitled to your opinion, however quite a few of those opinions regarding the Mac OS X Lion Finder are based on a lack of knowledge and hold little ground.

Well I said quite a few things about the Finder. You only brought up the two issues you could resolve. There is also the placement of the icons on the left, the lack of colour in the icons to indicate at a glance what icon is for what.

And beyond the Finder I'd never use Mission Control. In-fact what is the purpose of Mission Control if I don't use Full Screen applications or Widgets? (Which I never will). In my case it just shows me Apps I have running when what I really want to see is my open windows. I use Expose every day for Window management not App management.

The new Gestures are also kind of difficult to perform on the trackpad like the 4 finger pinch (Are we crabs or something?).

Like I said this upgrade just not for me. I'll be sticking with Snow Leopard most likely.

You can have it setup almost identically to what you're used to on Mac OS X Snow Leopard with minimum effort.

How can I turn Mission Control off and go back to Expose? -- How can I get the old Trackpad Gestures back?

[.Neo]

How can I turn Mission Control off and go back to Expose? -- How can I get the old Trackpad Gestures back?

I wasn't talking about Mission Control nor gestures. In my original post I only addressed your concerns regarding the Finder and continued to do so. I only corrected you when you talked about Launchpad when you meant Mission Control to avoid further confusion. Your other issues regarding the Finder (the slightly tweaked Slidebar layout and grey icons) I see as being pretty trivial. Yes it's different. Is it a disaster or a limitation in functionality? Personally I don't think so.

Beyond that, I don't like Mission Control that much either compared to Exposé. Apple turned that one into a carnival ride (Dutch expression literally translated to English :laugh: ): It's flashy, has way too much going on and I hate the fact windows of applications are overlapping making it harder to see what you're looking for.

[Vice]

I wasn't talking about Mission Control nor gestures. In my original post I only addressed your concerns regarding the Finder and continued to do so. I only corrected you when you talked about Launchpad when you meant Mission Control to avoid further confusion. Your other issues regarding the Finder (the slightly tweaked Slidebar layout and grey icons) I see as being pretty trivial. Yes it's different. Is it a disaster or a limitation in functionality? Personally I don't think so.

Beyond that, I don't like Mission Control that much either compared to Exposé.

So let me put this to you. You altered the Finder to go back to the classic look. And you don't really like Mission Control compared to Expose. When Lion launches will you be buying it?

And I say this because if I were to buy Lion only to revert all its new features back to the old ones I don't see why I would then part with £89 of my hard earned cash just to keep what I already got now.

Also I wouldn't use Launchpad myself because I already have an Applications stack that does the same thing.. lol

[.Neo]

So let me put this to you. You altered the Finder to go back to the classic look. And you don't really like Mission Control compared to Expose. When Lion launches will you be buying it?

I would never a buy an OS purely based on those two things. A removal of the Status Bar isn't exactly something that makes me want run to the stores in the first place. Beyond that the question of upgrading to another OS is always a hard one, because in the end nothing really changes. Mac OS X Snow Leopard hasn't made me fundamentally more productive compared to Panther, has it made you?

And yeah, I will upgrade because I'll probably end up getting a legal copy for free anyway. :)

[Vice]

I would never a buy an OS purely based on those two things. A removal of the Status Bar isn't exactly something that makes me want run to the stores in the first place. Beyond that the question of upgrading to another OS is always a hard one, because in the end nothing really changes. Mac OS X Snow Leopard hasn't made me fundamentally more productive compared to Panther, has it made you?

And yeah, I will upgrade because I'll probably end up getting a legal copy for free anyway. :)

You won't miss Expose?

Like personally I use Expose every day it's been the foundation of my OS X experience ever since Panther. I really can't imagine using anything else to manage my windows. It just works and it's intuitive and quick. I mean realistically right now the Mission Control UI shows apps by their icons then stacks their windows. If I wanted to pick a running app I'd just click its icon in the dock. What I want is window management.

And no Snow Leopard hasn't really made me more productive than Panther. But I know losing Expose would make me less productive due to how much I rely on it.

Some of the big features that made me upgrade:

Panther - Expose

Tiger - Spotlight

Leopard - Time Machine & Stacks

Snow Leopard - Refinement of the UI and many small niceties

Lion - .... nothing so far.

[DeadEndAccount]

Two feature that I people will get excited about; cut and paste, and the ability to merge directories rather than the current situation of replacement :) I'm running the developer preview right now and believe me, if Apple continues on the right track it'll be a worthy upgrade.

Btw, Safari 5.1 includes hardware acceleration so the point that the performance on many of the IE tests are really good; the FishTank performance tester on 20 fish I'm getting 60fps on a 9400M MacBook Pro 2.53Ghz. Are there things I don't like? sure but Apple has provided ways through 'System Preferences' to change such settings.

[Guest]

True, Safari 5.1 is definitely hw accelerated. I've tried psychedelic browsing ect and they're FAST, Firefox 4 even thought it was based on Open GL couldn't do it. What is Safari using in order to hardware accelerate like this, an updated version of Core Animation or what?

[Timan Veteran]

Springloading is gimped as f'ck in expose now :(

Try dragging files over expose'd windows, it doesn't automatically over em.

[Priceless90]

For folks who don't like the new gesture on Mac OS X Lion..you must have magic mouse or magic trackpad in order to have the feel of comfort when using it or else you will find it unnatural way of using it...the reason is crucial because mission control,LaunchPad,switching desktop or dashboard will require many gesture in mouse or trackpad for ease of use..

especially switching different desktop it feel very natural on the mouse by swiping through all the pages or spaces,you won't find it on windows 7.Hopefully,more stuff will be coming since it's just DP Preview!

[celticpride678]

Any new icons in Lion?

New, no. Redesigned, yes.

[iuerg87yerg879e0rg9erugjer]

New, no. Redesigned, yes.

airdrop, cabinet are new?

[lunarworks]

I really hope someone releases a good customization tool for Lion. Just looking at that sidebar is depressing.

[what]

I really hope someone releases a good customization tool for Lion. Just looking at that sidebar is depressing.

You know it's possible to customise it anyway? And always has been.

[lunarworks]

You know it's possible to customise it anyway? And always has been.

The icons are easy to change. I'm just getting sick of that neutral blue. I'd like to make it a bit warmer.

It's like after 5 months of winter you're sick of looking at grey.