Why didn't MS segregate the tablet UI from the desktop UI?

[Brandon H Supervisor]

Well, as a gamer, I'm stuck on Windows. If I didn't game, I probably would have moved to a Mac a while ago. Heck, my "desktop" PC might simply be a MacBook Air chained to a keyboard, monitor, mouse, and speakers.

why not just go ahead and move over to mac? I have my macbookpro dual-booted with windows for gaming and love it

[Dot Matrix]

MS seriously need more competition in the OS market - competitors would be so happy right now if they were launching a new PC OS at the same time as Win 8 and it might make MS appreciate the desktop market.

What situation? Having to learn new things? Things changing?

[@Leo]

why not just go ahead and move over to mac? I have my macbookpro dual-booted with windows for gaming and love it

MacBook Pro for gaming? What nonsense is that? (Or any laptop for that matter.) Apple machines are just not strong enough or robust enough for gaming, even their desktop ranges. Now, I am an owner for MacBook Air, so let's not brand ourselves as this fanboy or that. I am telling it as it is. You are probably a casual gamer who is probably better off with a console.

I have to say though, I see no future in Windows. Anyone who knows me, know this is a very strange thing coming from me. But watching Microsoft attempt this rape upon users makes me furious. And when I look at OS X and how elegant it is (while incrementally including touch features where they make sense), and I am losing my faith. I mean, Windows 8 is not elegant as a desktop alone. The new Aero is horrible, the task bar is a mess (how hard is it to make a Process Explorer Light? :rolleyes:) and the rest of the UI changes are bad and go against the design philosophy of Windows Vista/7's elegance. Metro, on the other hand, is also horrific from UI aesthetics. Boxes boxes boxes. If it comes down between iOS & Android vs. Windows Metro on a tablet, I'd go with the former any day. You can have live information on an elegant design.

[HawkMan]

Oh, and now we go down to petty insults and gross overgeneralizations now. I don't like Windows 8, so I must be an Apple fanboy! It makes so much sense now!

The interface is bad. It gets in the way. It took me forever to figure out how to close a Metro app or shut down the computer. When an OS gets in the way like that, it's bad.

Not too say that Metro is bad per se - just needs a lot of refinement. And with the Consumer Preview, Microsoft is still far away from making Metro usable on the desktop.

You're not supposed to shut down metro apps. When tombstones they use a few Kb of memory if that. It's one of the main points of the metro apps, they practically don't use any resources. And will kill themselves if left alone.

[xWhiplash]

MacBook Pro for gaming? What nonsense is that? (Or any laptop for that matter.) Apple machines are just not strong enough or robust enough for gaming, even their desktop ranges. Now, I am an owner for MacBook Air, so let's not brand ourselves as this fanboy or that. I am telling it as it is. You are probably a casual gamer who is probably better off with a console.

You have got to be kidding. My Mac Pro would like a word with you. I can max out anything on that computer. My iMac performs very well too.

[techguy77]

Metro interface comes from world of limited better say crippled devices compared to PC. As such Metro is very limited and basic that simply does not belong to Desktop computers.

[HawkMan]

Metro interface comes from world of limited better say crippled devices compared to PC. As such Metro is very limited and basic that simply does not belong to Desktop computers.

yet it still does everything the start menu does just as good and some things better, like access to 46+ pinned items right away instead of ~8

[BajiRav]

Oh, and now we go down to petty insults and gross overgeneralizations now. I don't like Windows 8, so I must be an Apple fanboy! It makes so much sense now!

The interface is bad. It gets in the way. It took me forever to figure out how to close a Metro app or shut down the computer. When an OS gets in the way like that, it's bad.

Not too say that Metro is bad per se - just needs a lot of refinement. And with the Consumer Preview, Microsoft is still far away from making Metro usable on the desktop.

1. You don't really need to close metro apps

2. Even then, is right click really that difficult to figure out?

[Ryster]

It took me forever to figure out how to close a Metro app or shut down the computer.

Proof right there that you don't understand Windows 8 and are dismissing it out of ignorance. Not necessarily your fault, perhaps Microsoft's for not explaining it all sufficiently, but still a lack of understanding on your part nonetheless. You're not supposed to close Metro apps. Why would you want to?. When not in the foreground they get suspended and use next to no resources.

And for the record, all of these things will be explained in detail by Microsoft in the form of tutorial videos, welcome guides and edu-adverts.

You get no argument from me that Metro needs a bit of refinement though (isn't that what beta's are for??), things like the power options really shouldn't be buried away inside a settings menu. That said though, your computer already has a single key to shut down... it's called the power button. Using that is quicker to shutdown even than Windows 7. But no doubt you'll now tell me that your computer is hard to reach or something. But if having to press a button on the front of your PC instead of clicking a couple of times with the mouse is your only complaint, then we're onto a winner ;-)

No it doesn't. I can have as many apps inside start menu all nice arranged inside folder. I can right click on each thing in start menu and send to, copy, paste, create. Can you do it in metro, Beep you cannot. Can you open two windows next to each other in Metro? Beep you cannot.

And yet Microsoft's own telemetry from hundreds of thousands (if not millions) of computers around the world has shown that the vast majority of people do not use the All Programs folder within the start menu any more, and the majority of people migrated to use the new search feature for launching apps that was introduced in 2005 (Vista) and refined in 2009 (7). The fact you continue to use the old Windows 95 method of using the start menu speaks volumes about your unwillingness to change and adapt to new ways of doing things.

[fobban]

Metro is not hard to use, but every single thing you are used to do in Windows 7 is harder in Windows 8.

Consistency anybody? Clicking the network icon brings in some huge ugly blue thing from the right. Clicking the volume control doesn't.

If you want to remote desktop somewhere, your first choice would be the Metro app. The native remote desktop application is quite hard to find. But why would I want to be forced to remote in full screen on my 24" monitor? I'm not using some ****ty 7" tabled.

Nah, Windows 8 feels snappy and all, but the Metro interface isn't (currently at least) made for us desktop users.

[BajiRav]

Metro is not hard to use, but every single thing you are used to do in Windows 7 is harder in Windows 8.

Consistency anybody? Clicking the network icon brings in some huge ugly blue thing from the right. Clicking the volume control doesn't.

If you want to remote desktop somewhere, your first choice would be the Metro app. The native remote desktop application is quite hard to find. But why would I want to be forced to remote in full screen on my 24" monitor? I'm not using some ****ty 7" tabled.

Nah, Windows 8 feels snappy and all, but the Metro interface isn't (currently at least) made for us desktop users.

May be, just may be..it's because you need to do more than just control volume level with network icon?

[Ci7]

Metro is not hard to use, but every single thing you are used to do in Windows 7 is harder in Windows 8.

Consistency anybody? Clicking the network icon brings in some huge ugly blue thing from the right. Clicking the volume control doesn't.

If you want to remote desktop somewhere, your first choice would be the Metro app. The native remote desktop application is quite hard to find. But why would I want to be forced to remote in full screen on my 24" monitor? I'm not using some ****ty 7" tabled.

Nah, Windows 8 feels snappy and all, but the Metro interface isn't (currently at least) made for us desktop users.

how is it hard? just search it then pin it into start screen/superbar

holy crap :|

[SkyDX]

A simple fix would be to... Make start orb reappear, click for start menu, long click for start screen.

Agreed!

[Ryster]

To be fair though, the remote desktop icon was never particularly well exposed in Windows 7 either.

Start > All Programs > Accessories > Remote Desktop Connection

or

Win+R > Type "mstsc" > Enter

or

Start > Type "remote" > Enter (if Remote desktop is top result, otherwise click On Remote Desktop)

The middle of which still works in Windows 8, while also adding...

Start > Type "mstsc" > Enter

[TehShopko]

On a multi-monitor setup, the "hot spots" are difficult to hit to bring up the charms bar and the settings menu. It's because the "hot spot" is designed to be at the lower right corner of the primary monitor.

Windows 8 was designed, implemented, and optimized to work via touch on a single-screen system. I.e. a tablet interface. Yes, they tossed in some after-thought methods of working with the system using a mouse and keyboard, but it is most certainly not OPTIMIZED to work with a mouse and keyboard. If you don't believe me, please go get a second monitor and then demonstrate to me how "easy" it is to bring up the charms bar with the mouse.

After using Windows 8 as my primary desktop for close to 4 months, I can confidently state that Metro is crap for running multiple apps at once. I must be in the 0.00000001% of the population that actually *uses* more than two windows on the desktop at once in Windows 7. I like being able to see what's going on in multiple apps at once without needing to "swap" each one out all the time just to keep an eye on them. For example, I have Outlook set up next to a PDF book I'm reading right now. When I get an e-mail, I can see the full text of the e-mail without touching anything. If it's not important, I shift my eyes back to the PDF and continue reading. My browser is running on the other side of the screen so I can keep tabs on the haps at Neowin. :) So again, Metro is not a "Windows" interface; it's a consumer-focused interface designed for stripped-down portable devices. Trying to argue against this point is like trying to argue that a carrier pigeon is a more efficient communication medium than a telephone. :)

[Dot Matrix]

On a multi-monitor setup, the "hot spots" are difficult to hit to bring up the charms bar and the settings menu. It's because the "hot spot" is designed to be at the lower right corner of the primary monitor.

Windows 8 was designed, implemented, and optimized to work via touch on a single-screen system. I.e. a tablet interface. Yes, they tossed in some after-thought methods of working with the system using a mouse and keyboard, but it is most certainly not OPTIMIZED to work with a mouse and keyboard. If you don't believe me, please go get a second monitor and then demonstrate to me how "easy" it is to bring up the charms bar with the mouse.

I'm wondering if this isn't a bug yet. But those working on a multi-monitor setup are usually the more techy crowd. The easiest way for me to bring up the menu is to hit Win+C. But I do agree that the Charms bar should travel to the rightmost edge of the right monitor.

[HawkMan]

On a multi-monitor setup, the "hot spots" are difficult to hit to bring up the charms bar and the settings menu. It's because the "hot spot" is designed to be at the lower right corner of the primary monitor.

Windows 8 was designed, implemented, and optimized to work via touch on a single-screen system. I.e. a tablet interface. Yes, they tossed in some after-thought methods of working with the system using a mouse and keyboard, but it is most certainly not OPTIMIZED to work with a mouse and keyboard. If you don't believe me, please go get a second monitor and then demonstrate to me how "easy" it is to bring up the charms bar with the mouse.

After using Windows 8 as my primary desktop for close to 4 months, I can confidently state that Metro is crap for running multiple apps at once. I must be in the 0.00000001% of the population that actually *uses* more than two windows on the desktop at once in Windows 7. I like being able to see what's going on in multiple apps at once without needing to "swap" each one out all the time just to keep an eye on them. For example, I have Outlook set up next to a PDF book I'm reading right now. When I get an e-mail, I can see the full text of the e-mail without touching anything. If it's not important, I shift my eyes back to the PDF and continue reading. My browser is running on the other side of the screen so I can keep tabs on the haps at Neowin. :) So again, Metro is not a "Windows" interface; it's a consumer-focused interface designed for stripped-down portable devices. Trying to argue against this point is like trying to argue that a carrier pigeon is a more efficient communication medium than a telephone. :)

I'm able to multi task just fine with metro, it also works just fine on my dual monitors, the hits spots have enough space to work just fine, and you can move what monitor the metro start screen shows on as well.

And again, the start screen works very well for power users as it gives instant access to far more pinned "favorites" than the start menu.