windows 8 Microsoft Drops Aero from Windows 8

[Order_66]

2. he's faking it, he's the son of a tech journalist who's been told to act ignorant, since the journalist in question is fairly anti MS.

You can tell the guy isn't faking it at all, in fact he is acting exactly like so many other "average" users that I have seen who tried to use 8.

[efjay]

You can tell the guy isn't faking it at all, in fact he is acting exactly like so many other "average" users that I have seen who tried to use 8.

That guy should win an oscar for his performance.

[Dot Matrix]

I think it's funny that each of those anti-Windows 8 videos shows older users. Where are the younger kids that don't give a ****? THOSE are your true users.

[HoochieMamma]

I think it's funny that each of those anti-Windows 8 videos shows older users. Where are the younger kids that don't give a ****? THOSE are your true users.

No, businesses with a variety of people ranging from all sorts of ages, most often completely PC illiterate are your TRUE users. So throwing a full screen start menu and removing the start button is a game changer for almost everyone. You don't want to have to re-teach all your staff if you don't have to. I can't believe Microsoft is doing what they are doing with W8 when when businesses are their true cash cow.

Leave Metro where it belongs, on a tablet with your hands. On a desktop is should be disabled by default, but have the option for whoever wants it can enable it.

[contextfree]

Listen to what he's saying, I happen to agree: 'When it would be MUCH easier for me just to click an "x" TBH...'

This issue will go away if/when MS allows Metro apps to run windowed in the desktop environment.

They don't want to put a prominent "x" on the screen because they're worried it will confuse people by encouraging them to think they're supposed to manually close/manage Metro style apps. In the Developer Preview there wasn't even a gesture to close apps at all, they added one in the CP but the basic answer to "how do I close Metro style apps?" is still meant to be "you don't" for most people - the option to close them is there as an "advanced" option for power users.

On the iPad IIRC the way to close an app involves double-tapping on the home button, finding the app on the strip on the bottom, pressing-and-holding until the apps start to wiggle, and only then hitting the "X" that appears. The Win8 way is more convenient than that at least.

[contextfree]

"I can't believe Microsoft is doing what they are doing with W8 when when businesses are their true cash cow."

Because after just upgrading to 7 those businesses weren't going to upgrade again right away anyway.

[HoochieMamma]

"I can't believe Microsoft is doing what they are doing with W8 when when businesses are their true cash cow." Because after just upgrading to 7 those businesses weren't going to upgrade again right away anyway.

Yeah true, but what about those still on XP? Not really going to give them much incentive to go to W8 because of its radical changes.

[Order_66]

I think it's funny that each of those anti-Windows 8 videos shows older users. Where are the younger kids that don't give a ****? THOSE are your true users.

Yes everyone who is going to use 8 will be young kids. /s

[MorganX]

They don't want to put a prominent "x" on the screen because they're worried it will confuse people by encouraging them to think they're supposed to manually close/manage Metro style apps.

I'm sure they have a good reason. The point the dude was making though, was that some things in Metro are less efficient. There is potential for it to be worth it. I say again, great apps can make everything A-OK! But that will take a while.

[Dot Matrix]

Yes everyone who is going to use 8 will be young kids. /s

Not everyone, but where are the younger users? They're users too. Ohhh, wait, they're going to ruin the FUD, sorry.

[Order_66]

Not everyone, but where are the younger users? They're users too. Ohhh, wait, they're going to ruin the FUD, sorry.

FUD, what FUD? everything is pretty much cut and dry, metro is horrible, it's a huge step backwards on the desktop but looks promising for tablets, yes we have "doubt" but where is the "fear" and the "uncertainty"?

[theyarecomingforyou]

They don't want to put a prominent "x" on the screen because they're worried it will confuse people by encouraging them to think they're supposed to manually close/manage Metro style apps. In the Developer Preview there wasn't even a gesture to close apps at all, they added one in the CP but the basic answer to "how do I close Metro style apps?" is still meant to be "you don't" for most people - the option to close them is there as an "advanced" option for power users.

That's missing the point though. If dragging a Metro app from top to bottom "closes" it then why not simply have a traditional close button when using a mouse? Let's not get distracted by pointless semantics. More importantly, task switching for Metro apps in Windows 8 is clumsy and inefficient, in part because the top-left task switcher doesn't recognise non-Metro apps and confusingly recognises the desktop as an "app". All desktop apps get bundled together, while Metro apps are individually identified. I've used Windows 8 for months but I still don't find app-switching to be natural, unlike most of the other changes.

The discussion here has got way out of hand now. Microsoft will be including a tutorial for the new interface in Windows 8 so that silly viral video isn't relevant. I don't believe it's fake - as I can certainly picture many relatives behaving the same way - but it's not at all representative of the average Windows user. As for the Microsoft Dynamics screenshot being discussed it's certainly visually clean and has a strong visual design but like with most Metro apps it's horribly inefficient for screen space - about a third of the screen is wasted space.

That said, I am quite happy with the direction that Windows 8 is going overall. Metro is certainly a work in progress but the new start screen is certainly a lot more productive than the old start menu. The desktop is virtually the same as previous versions, with the addition of the hot-corners and a slightly different visual theme. And there are many very worthwhile improvements, like the Task Manager, file-copying dialogue, Storage Spaces and the redesigned Explorer. I'm not convinced about the benefits of Metro apps on the desktop, though I've already found some to be useful (XE.com, News Republic, etc) and it's early days yet. Windows 8 is very much a transitionary OS and is in no way the pinnacle of computing but I'll be upgrading at launch.

PS - I always find it bizarre how averse people are to change and the excuses they'll come up with. We go through this with every new version of Windows - even the beloved XP - and had the same with Office and the ribbon. People even moaned about the Vista/Win7 start menu, yet now apparently people are defending it and even saying they "love it". People complain, then they get used to it, then they don't want it to change. Just adapt. It's a lot more productive than moaning incessantly about things that simply aren't going to change. Life has enough problems without manufacturing new ones.

[Dot Matrix]

FUD, what FUD? everything is pretty much cut and dry, metro is horrible, it's a huge step backwards on the desktop but looks promising for tablets, yes we have "doubt" but where is the "fear" and the "uncertainty"?

Huge step backwards? It's been working for me across my devices, and I'm finding the new Start Screen better than the old menu.... There's more space, I can fit more items to the screen, and I can get updates all without the need to click all over the OS. If you're so against Metro apps, then don't use them. No one is forcing you to. Pin your desktop shortcuts to the Start Screen and be on your way.

[Order_66]

Huge step backwards? It's been working for me across my devices

Working for YOU, not everyone shares in your happiness with metro, obviously, so where is the "fear" and where is the "uncertainty" that you spoke about earlier?

[George P Global Moderator]

Listen to what he's saying, I happen to agree: 'When it would be MUCH easier for me just to click an "x" TBH...'

This issue will go away if/when MS allows Metro apps to run windowed in the desktop environment.

I understand what he's saying, and I'm giving you the reasoning behind it, at least for now. WinRT apps are different in that regard and while clicking an X instead of dragging the whole window down to close it is indeed quicker, at this point they're trying to get the message out that you don't really need to micromanage apps like you had to. Also, and I did bring this up, Win8 should have mouse gesture support coming, Once you can simply do a quick swipe for closing and switching apps with gestures then I think that'd be better.

[Dot Matrix]

Working for YOU, not everyone shares in your happiness with metro, obviously, so where is the "fear" and where is the "uncertainty" that you spoke about earlier?

Take a look around you. People like you are ****ed, and continue to spread FUD... look at the person who posted the YouTube video again a few posts back.... That's FUD. We've known for a while now there will be a tutorial, which nulls those videos.

[dr_crabman]

Working for YOU, not everyone shares in your happiness with metro

Look at what you wrote: "everything is pretty much cut and dry, metro is horrible" So you're making general statements as if there is nothing more to discuss, everyone will suffer and then act offended if someone calls you out.

Also, and I did bring this up, Win8 should have mouse gesture support coming, Once you can simply do a quick swipe for closing and switching apps with gestures then I think that'd be better.

As a fan of Opera and it's great gesture-integration I have to agree and don't quite understand why this wasn't done years ago but especially W8 would have been the perfect oppurtunity.

[BajiRav]

I believe the desktop environment is more effecient than a full screen Metro environment. But, this is slick as heck. If Metro apps come in like this, it may be worth the extra effort. If Metro apps like this ever run in the desktop environment, MS will have a super hit on their hands. Is this just a mock-up? This is just the consumption end, but very nice. The creation end needs to be in the desktop environment IMO though.

If my health and fitness apps give me data back like this, while taking input from all my digital devices, Metro will be a hit. As I said, less effecient or not, Apps are what will really make the difference.

I think that was from actual working Dynamics app that MS demoed somewhere.

[BajiRav]

Working for YOU, not everyone shares in your happiness with metro, obviously, so where is the "fear" and where is the "uncertainty" that you spoke about earlier?

Here is a question for you, if a few of you don't like metro but can work around it simply by pinning* applications to taskbar (and boot directly into desktop) - then why should MS also not cater to a few of us who like metro (and/or new shiny stuff) who can enjoy using both?

*On my workstation, I have 18 pinned icons - which is a good mix of IDEs (Eclipse, VS), IM (OfficeC, WLM), browsers (IE, FF), Office(Excel, Onenote, Outlook), vnc, RDC, putty, one pinned site (skydrive). I think this is sufficient to 200% of "power users" (whatever that terms means today but recently that probably means "I hate change") to go about their routine "workflow".

[nigelwright7557]

Just downloaded Windows 8 consumer preview and Visual Studio 2011.

The preview is a bit of a mess with shutdown and START buttons missing. But I guess it is early days yet.

I was looking forward to updating some of my own CAD software to work under Windows 8 with the Metro tiles as a launch pad.

The CAD software has 13 sub modules that need to be called from a launch screen.

I couldn't quite believe it but Metro fell at the first hurdle as you cant launch other modules as the process command for launching them has been removed from Metro !

So I skipped the launcher and started with a Metro style sub module which simply creates a [arts list of components on the hard drive.

I was stunned to find you cant read or write to the hard disc under Metro.

It seems Metro is a very cut down version of Windows probably more aimed at smart phones than a full blown PC.

It all seems a bit of a mess really and I was disappointed with Windows8 and Metro.

[Brandon Live Veteran]

Just downloaded Windows 8 consumer preview and Visual Studio 2011.

The preview is a bit of a mess with shutdown and START buttons missing. But I guess it is early days yet.

I was looking forward to updating some of my own CAD software to work under Windows 8 with the Metro tiles as a launch pad.

The CAD software has 13 sub modules that need to be called from a launch screen.

I couldn't quite believe it but Metro fell at the first hurdle as you cant launch other modules as the process command for launching them has been removed from Metro !

I'm not quite sure I follow. What exactly have you found to be missing?

So I skipped the launcher and started with a Metro style sub module which simply creates a [arts list of components on the hard drive.

I was stunned to find you cant read or write to the hard disc under Metro.

Metro style apps can absolutely read from and write to the hard disk (and other media!). It would be kind of hard to write any kind of app without that capability :-)

Now, where the app can read or write is far more restricted than in traditional desktop apps. You can always read from you app's install directory, and read+write to your AppData location. You can also read+write to the user's libraries, but this must be declared in your app's manifest and will be visible to the user at install time. Arbitrary files or folders can be accessed via the FilePicker. If the user grants your app access to a folder via the picker, you can then read/write from that location as needed.

What was your app trying to access?

[Rickkins]

Take a look around you. People like you are ****ed, and continue to spread FUD... look at the person who posted the YouTube video again a few posts back.... That's FUD. We've known for a while now there will be a tutorial, which nulls those videos.

Ya may want to take a break there mate, you're beginning to sound kinda shrill....

And, furthermore, no amount of tutorials from ms nullify the fact that metro has no place on the desktop.

[.Neo]

But 1. Who uses them, and 2. point me to high quality gadgets that people have made. I don't recall there ever being a Twitter or Facebook gadget, the weather app is basic at best, and doesn't come near the functionality of the weather metro app.

If such solutions aren't being used it's maybe an indication that people don't want an overload of information on their computer screen.

[Guest]

So does anyone have any screenshots from the new Chinese leak with anything new? I'm surprised there haven't already been any unless nothing has changed compared to what we've already seen.

[George P Global Moderator]

And, furthermore, no amount of tutorials from ms nullify the fact that metro has no place on the desktop.

That's not a fact, it's an opinion of yours. Not everyone shares the same views and the last thing we need is people thinking opinions are facts.