Isn't Windows 8 the start of something great?

[MorganX]

What's it doing and which version? It looks from Telltale's forum that users have been having problems with the game on multiple platforms.

I see reports that running it XP SP3 compatibility mode and unplugging any Xbox controllers works.

Just wanted to let you know, turning off the XBOX Wireless Controller allowed the game to run. That sucks ... I'm not into mouse gaming, but we'll see. Runs well though.

[Wyn6]

Why? So you can try to tell us how we're doing it wrong? The reasons why people don't like the metro start screen have been listed many many times and you guys constantly gloss them over into "metro sucks".

I don't think anyone has glossed over someone's reasoning. Most of the time that reasoning lacks a certain clarity. Even when clear, I think the people that use Windows 8 easily, wonder what's so difficult about using it. There are certain folks here that are quite productive with the new OS, myself among them, without the Start Screen being intrusive and in most cases functioning much better than previous iterations. I think it perplexes us how people who are, presumably, quite computer literate seem to run into various snafus in their use of 8.

The complaints range from "It sucks" to "It interferes with my workflow". I don't think it's a matter of those who like it saying like it or else. Although, some are saying that. I think it's very hard to wrap our heads around this whole, "It interferes with my workflow" thing. For example, I can't think of a single adverse change in my day-to-day operations of the OS. Other than using the Start Screen as an information depot and partaking of various convenience features, I continue to use Windows 8 as I have always used Windows.

If I want to watch a movie or television show, I do that. If I want to listen to music, I do that. If I need to edit a film, I do that. If I need to write a script, I do that. If I need to crack open Visual Studio to check something on my brother's apps, I do that. I have yet to run into anything that has posed an obstacle to how I use my computer. Obviously, others' mileage may vary, but I don't see it stopping you down. Because, I know if something was interfering with my workflow at the rate that some people are saying, and evidently some of these workflows are urgent business, I'd stop using Windows 8 post-haste and hop back to 7, Vista, or XP.

Seriously, if it's killing your productivity it doesn't make sense to continue to use it, especially if it involves any kind of income. To all you guys who berate Windows 8 as killing your workflow, does it make sense to continue using it when it's clearly counterproductive for you?

[Colin McGregor]

And this vocal group are the die hard techies. Introduce Windows 8 to the average user (girlfriend, mom, uncle Fred) show them the new ways of navigating, present Windows 8 neutrally as the new OS and see the reaction. For me average folk love it. Average people will only hate Windows 8 without trying it because their "techy" friend tells them to. Much like what happened to Vista.

Im a die hard techie and i love windows 8. Being that i am a die hard techie i didn't even use the start menu in win7 or most of my vista using days so its nothing new to me. I installed windows 8 on my moms pc and she doesn't know much about computers other then banking or facebook and she loves metro and didn't once ask me where the start button went. Most of my "tech nerdy" friends installed windows 8 and also didn't use the start menu in previous windows so either people need the start menu cause they dont know how to use windows or just like to see themselves hate.

[trag3dy]

I don't think anyone has glossed over someone's reasoning. Most of the time that reasoning lacks a certain clarity. Even when clear, I think the people that use Windows 8 easily, wonder what's so difficult about using it. There are certain folks here that are quite productive with the new OS, myself among them, without the Start Screen being intrusive and in most cases functioning much better than previous iterations. I think it perplexes us how people who are, presumably, quite computer literate seem to run into various snafus in their use of 8.

The complaints range from "It sucks" to "It interferes with my workflow". I don't think it's a matter of those who like it saying like it or else. Although, some are saying that. I think it's very hard to wrap our heads around this whole, "It interferes with my workflow" thing. For example, I can't think of a single adverse change in my day-to-day operations of the OS. Other than using the Start Screen as an information depot and partaking of various convenience features, I continue to use Windows 8 as I have always used Windows.

If I want to watch a movie or television show, I do that. If I want to listen to music, I do that. If I need to edit a film, I do that. If I need to write a script, I do that. If I need to crack open Visual Studio to check something on my brother's apps, I do that. I have yet to run into anything that has posed an obstacle to how I use my computer. Obviously, others' mileage may vary, but I don't see it stopping you down. Because, I know if something was interfering with my workflow at the rate that some people are saying, and evidently some of these workflows are urgent business, I'd stop using Windows 8 post-haste and hop back to 7, Vista, or XP.

Seriously, if it's killing your productivity it doesn't make sense to continue to use it, especially if it involves any kind of income. To all you guys who berate Windows 8 as killing your workflow, does it make sense to continue using it when it's clearly counterproductive for you?

And someone else trying to tell us how we're doing it wrong. Good job on entirely missing my point.

[BajiRav]

And someone else trying to tell us how we're doing it wrong. Good job on entirely missing my point.

Good job on missing his point by a mile...

[trag3dy]

Good job on missing his point by a mile...

I didn't miss his point because I didn't read his post. It looked to be the same nonsense that you guys have been repeating in your nice big muti-paragraph sales pitches for the last 23 pages in this thread.

[MorganX]

People use iPads as laptop replacements, and Android looks to want to take on the desktop space with some tablets of its own. It?s a dynamic UI that adapts to the way we work.

In general people use iPads and tablets instead of a laptop. The masses don't need a laptop but enjoy consuming on a closed limited device. Those who need a laptop and have a table aren't necessarily using it as a replacement as they are not replacements. The Microsoft Surface can be both tablet and laptop replacement. But I'd call it a better laptop and not a replacement since it will cost as much as a laptop for the Pro version. I'm on Windows 8 and can't enter <returns> on Neowin. Give me an example of how the Metro UI adapts to how you work?

[Dashel]

Wyn has a particular knack for that trag3dy. Since by his own admission he doesn't understand why more technical users 'discover' the snafus he is oblivious of.

Remember when techies used to love updates? To get into the new software, so they could see how things worked. Remember the excitement? Now everyone bitches about the littlest stupid things. :(

I still love updates. I get into new software and see how they work. I'm excited. The more asute members will discover the variations between the old and new and find there are areas that are good and that are bad. Some people lack this critical faculty.

Microsoft wants to move away from the dull, static Windows 95 look. This is Microsoft making a clean break from their old "business oriented" image, to something forward thinking. But, one way or another, Microsoft had to act. Windows is loosing out BIG TIME to other platforms and operating systems. The old, tired, Windows 9x UX isn't working out anymore.

Had Microsoft continued with the current Windows 7 UX, eventually Android or even Apple would have overtaken them when they adapt to the new technologies appearing on the market.

Ah, Dot. Yea, unless MS gets an image makeover they can't possibly compete with the minor ecosystem of Android and virtually non-existent one from Apple. MS is an infrastructure company, its survival has never been predicated on the consumer market. You remind me of someone who gets a boner off of futuristic vehicles in the movies. Except they always make the same fundamental mistake and add some kind of crazy steering contraption because 'round' is obviously stale and old fashioned.

That 'old and tired' UI still provides, hands down, the best computing experience currently available anywhere. You say they must unify to make it easier, so why not W8 on phone? Why WP8 at all? So we still have a split system, its just that the devices that are 'touchy' will get worse experience than WP8 and desktop users will get the shaft compared to Win7. Talk about your win, win.

What is a "tablet OS?" So iOS is a tablet OS?

So as a MS guy, you can't delineate the two (which you surely can, so why are you blurring the lines)? MS failure in the tablet space has always been a matter of trying to smash far too much in a small package. Apple's one crowning achievement was growing 'up' the simplistic iPod. MS doesn't seem to understand either group of users. Slate users (consumers) want low cost and 'apps' which so far Surface won't address. The 'needs' of the rest are really quite different. There are tons of things we've wanted for years but not once did I think kill the desktop metaphor and unify all control schemes as being one of them. Business must adopt Surface for it to succeed, not consumers. Of course if you keep on starting a ****ing with the people who actually buy and implement your software we might just pass on Surface (since I can make an iPad do almost the same things with the new server products anyway). I hate Apple, why are you giving me more reasons to grudgingly recommend the?

In fact, Office 2013 again shows that some teams at MS can take the right road and develop an adaptive UI that (necessarily) is optimized for the detected control schemes.

And Microsoft has hit upon the innovative strategy of destroying itself before its competitors can.

If they listen to the echo chamber they certainly run that risk.

[xWhiplash]

Say what you want about Windows 8 (love it, hate it, whatever). But the fact that Blizzard and Valve have released some bad press about it will not help the operating system. This will probably be another Vista if the word of mouth continues to be bad.

Mom, look at the lower left of your keyboard. Do you see Ctrl? Look to the right of that. Do you see a symbol that looks like a flag or four little squares together? Press that. OR... Mom... move the mouse so that the pointer is in the lower left corner of your screen. What do you see? Okay. Click that.

Er... um... I was asking Fehu a question. I'm not sure how your response relates to MY response.

Does not always work. I have a keyboard that only has the windows key on the right side.

[Subhadip]

Say what you want about Windows 8 (love it, hate it, whatever). But the fact that Blizzard and Valve have released some bad press about it will not help the operating system. This will probably be another Vista if the word of mouth continues to be bad.

Blizzard and Valve are not commenting on the OS itself, but rather the new Windows Store and Xbox Live integration which clearly threatens their Steam and Battle.net businesses.

[BajiRav]

I didn't miss his point because I didn't read his post. It looked to be the same nonsense that you guys have been repeating in your nice big muti-paragraph sales pitches for the last 23 pages in this thread.

I must have forgotten that I wrote a multi-paragraph sales pitch for Windows 8. Thanks for reminding me.

So as a MS guy, you can't delineate the two (which you surely can, so why are you blurring the lines)? MS failure in the tablet space has always been a matter of trying to smash far too much in a small package. Apple's one crowning achievement was growing 'up' the simplistic iPod. MS doesn't seem to understand either group of users. Slate users (consumers) want low cost and 'apps' which so far Surface won't address. The 'needs' of the rest are really quite different. There are tons of things we've wanted for years but not once did I think kill the desktop metaphor and unify all control schemes as being one of them. Business must adopt Surface for it to succeed, not consumers. Of course if you keep on starting a ****ing with the people who actually buy and implement your software we might just pass on Surface (since I can make an iPad do almost the same things with the new server products anyway). I hate Apple, why are you giving me more reasons to grudgingly recommend the?

In fact, Office 2013 again shows that some teams at MS can take the right road and develop an adaptive UI that (necessarily) is optimized for the detected control schemes.

care to elaborate on the highlighted part of your post?

Say what you want about Windows 8 (love it, hate it, whatever). But the fact that Blizzard and Valve have released some bad press about it will not help the operating system. This will probably be another Vista if the word of mouth continues to be bad.

Does not always work. I have a keyboard that only has the windows key on the right side.

Since when did Blizzard or Valve are an authority on anything but their games especially when it comes to an OS that can pose competition their online store model? This is obviously my guess because both have them haven't said anything beyond "Windows 8 is a catastrophe".

[Noir Angel]

So iOS is a tablet OS?

It functions well on smartphones and tablets. But Apple have the sense not to force it upon their desktop users, why do you think that is?

[x-byte]

Enough with that BS already plz :/ MS added tons of improvement for the Desktop inside Windows 8, they have said many times that they'll continue to support it for a while and they even included the full Desktop for Windows RT.

Yes, that is what I meant... The Desktop isn't going anywhere.

[Dashel]

Slate users (consumers) want low cost and 'apps' which so far Surface won't address.

Care to elaborate on the highlighted part of your post?

Netbooks, smartphones, and slates (the 'new' market) developed out of a need for basic users to buy a low powered, cheap device to do basic simple computing tasks (with a little GPS magic thrown in). Surface so far fails (projectedly - made up numbers or not - I agree with the guesses so far) on the price point and on the app availability (just like WP7). Conversely, I still think the 'app' market itself is silly to begin with. I don't buy $0.99 apps and probably never will, so the people most hyped on Surface won't be doing it for apps or price, but for interconnectivity with a superior cloud (Windows Services/Sharepoint) that neither Apple or Google can touch.

[BajiRav]

Netbooks, smartphones, and slates (the 'new' market) developed out of a need for basic users to buy a low powered, cheap device to do basic simple computing tasks (with a little GPS magic thrown in). Surface so far fails (projectedly - made up numbers or not - I agree with the guesses so far) on the price point and on the app availability (just like WP7). Conversely, I still think the 'app' market itself is silly to begin with. I don't buy $0.99 apps and probably never will, so the people most hyped on Surface won't be doing it for apps or price, but for interconnectivity with a superior cloud (Windows Services/Sharepoint) that neither Apple or Google can touch.

Oh ok. I think we should wait and watch on the price point. It would be really foolish for Microsoft to price Surface RT a penny more than iPad in fact they should price it comparable to iPad2 (399?).

As far as apps are considered, we will see. I don't think they are much of problem on tablets. I personally don't care much about apps on my iPad but I am probably a minority going by Apple's numbers.

[Windows Nashville]

Good job on missing his point by a mile...

Got to love the way Baji's sole response in every case is some variation on "No, I didn't miss the point, you missed the point." Have you ever actually replied with actual content to anybody, ever?

[Stoffel]

I don't think anyone has glossed over someone's reasoning. Most of the time that reasoning lacks a certain clarity. Even when clear, I think the people that use Windows 8 easily, wonder what's so difficult about using it. There are certain folks here that are quite productive with the new OS, myself among them, without the Start Screen being intrusive and in most cases functioning much better than previous iterations. I think it perplexes us how people who are, presumably, quite computer literate seem to run into various snafus in their use of 8.

The complaints range from "It sucks" to "It interferes with my workflow". I don't think it's a matter of those who like it saying like it or else. Although, some are saying that. I think it's very hard to wrap our heads around this whole, "It interferes with my workflow" thing. For example, I can't think of a single adverse change in my day-to-day operations of the OS. Other than using the Start Screen as an information depot and partaking of various convenience features, I continue to use Windows 8 as I have always used Windows.

If I want to watch a movie or television show, I do that. If I want to listen to music, I do that. If I need to edit a film, I do that. If I need to write a script, I do that. If I need to crack open Visual Studio to check something on my brother's apps, I do that. I have yet to run into anything that has posed an obstacle to how I use my computer. Obviously, others' mileage may vary, but I don't see it stopping you down. Because, I know if something was interfering with my workflow at the rate that some people are saying, and evidently some of these workflows are urgent business, I'd stop using Windows 8 post-haste and hop back to 7, Vista, or XP.

Seriously, if it's killing your productivity it doesn't make sense to continue to use it, especially if it involves any kind of income. To all you guys who berate Windows 8 as killing your workflow, does it make sense to continue using it when it's clearly counterproductive for you?

This!!! You wrote exactly how I feel. Don't mind people who don't like Win 8, but I really can't understand how it interferes with your workflow so much.

And someone else trying to tell us how we're doing it wrong. Good job on entirely missing my point.

Great job at not reading his post at all and just firing back. He actually explained in a very polite way why some of us who love Metro have a hard time understanding the Metro hatred. We use it daily and not really use it that much differently then we did Win7.

[MorganX]

Netbooks, smartphones, and slates (the 'new' market) developed out of a need for basic users to buy a low powered, cheap device to do basic simple computing tasks (with a little GPS magic thrown in). Surface so far fails (projectedly - made up numbers or not - I agree with the guesses so far) on the price point and on the app availability (just like WP7). Conversely, I still think the 'app' market itself is silly to begin with. I don't buy $0.99 apps and probably never will, so the people most hyped on Surface won't be doing it for apps or price, but for interconnectivity with a superior cloud (Windows Services/Sharepoint) that neither Apple or Google can touch.

I don't have a problem with what you said but Surface Pro is not cheap, and it's far more than a consumer tablet. I believe a lot of people want it. Cheap is always better, but if it's reasonable it will do well. I'll be doing it because of the form factor, most of the time with a laptop I only need to consume (tablet/Phone). All of the time I hate lugging any laptop around. The Surface is the form factor I've been waiting for Clark Kent most of the day (tablet), Superman when need be. Won't be buying the surface for the apps except 1 health app I know is coming, but if the apps get better, and with the power of the x86 platform and full blown apps along with RT and the tablet like apps, yeah. I think corporate connectivity and security will be a bigger selling point than cloud storage. But for sure it will take off with Windows 8 on tablets.

[BajiRav]

Got to love the way Baji's sole response in every case is some variation on "No, I didn't miss the point, you missed the point." Have you ever actually replied with actual content to anybody, ever?

Your complete lack of any civility around here is mind boggling but if you really cared (I highly doubt at this point), just read Stoffel's reply below your post.

[trag3dy]

This!!! You wrote exactly how I feel. Don't mind people who don't like Win 8, but I really can't understand how it interferes with your workflow so much.

Great job at not reading his post at all and just firing back. He actually explained in a very polite way why some of us who love Metro have a hard time understanding the Metro hatred. We use it daily and not really use it that much differently then we did Win7.

No he just completely dismissed any reason why someone might not like it as insignificant. And you're right, I didn't read his post because I've seen it before.

I think I've explained my side of things many times (nicely) and I continue to see people say "I don't understand why you guys don't like metro!!!!" while you water our posts down to "metro sucks". Go back and read the threads if you don't get it. Read slowly if you have to, then you might get where we are coming from.

[Wyn6]

No he just completely dismissed any reason why someone might not like it as insignificant. And you're right, I didn't read his post because I've seen it before.

I think I've explained my side of things many times (nicely) and I continue to see people say "I don't understand why you guys don't like metro!!!!" while you water our posts down to "metro sucks". Go back and read the threads if you don't get it. Read slowly if you have to, then you might get where we are coming from.

If you didn't read the post, you can't really make a presumption on its contents. I tried to explain why those who like Metro aren't quite sure why others say it interferes with their productivity as it doesn't seem to affect ours. I'm not saying that it DOES NOT affect it, just trying to get a clear breakdown of how it does. My post wasn't a, you guys have no basis from which to complain, post. It was a help me/us understand followed up by what I believed to be a fair question.

I'm rather indifferent to personal preferences. My curiosity was about those who state it kills their productivity. You are, of course under no obligation to read any of my posts. But, at the same time, is it fair to assume what that post may contain? Because, in this instance, you're off base.

I also understand that it may be frustrating for you and others to feel as though you've expressed your reasons as clearly and precisely as you possibly can only to have people continue asking you why. My contention was that, if the OS kills your productivity in the ways that you and/or others say it does, why continue to use it? Isn't using something that adversely affects productivity, by its very nature, counterproductive?

[trag3dy]

If you didn't read the post, you can't really make a presumption on its contents. I tried to explain why those who like Metro aren't quite sure why others say it interferes with their productivity as it doesn't seem to affect ours. I'm not saying that it DOES NOT affect it, just trying to get a clear breakdown of how it does. My post wasn't a, you guys have no basis from which to complain, post. It was a help me/us understand followed up by what I believed to be a fair question.

I'm rather indifferent to personal preferences. My curiosity was about those who state it kills their productivity. You are, of course under no obligation to read any of my posts. But, at the same time, is it fair to assume what that post may contain? Because, in this instance, you're off base.

I also understand that it may be frustrating for you and others to feel as though you've expressed your reasons as clearly and precisely as you possibly can only to have people continue asking you why. My contention was that, if the OS kills your productivity in the ways that you and/or others say it does, why continue to use it? Isn't using something that adversely affects productivity, not by its very nature, counterproductive?

:rofl:

If you can't understand it then go back and reread the threads. It's pretty damn clear why people don't like it at this point and if you don't get it I can only assume you have reading comprehension issues. Your opinion and your experience say that it's fine for you. Not everyone shares your experience with it or your opinions.

This is what I mean by you trying to tell us how we're doing it wrong. The problem we are having is that what works fine for you does not work fine for everyone else. You just assume your way is the only and right way, sort of like Microsoft. To be perfectly honest it's getting fairly condescending and irritating so the tone of my posts has changed accordingly.

[Wyn6]

Wyn has a particular knack for that trag3dy. Since by his own admission he doesn't understand why more technical users 'discover' the snafus he is oblivious of.

Ah. My short time nemesis. The game is afoot, Mr. Watson.

And, if it's not too much trouble, could you provide the less tech savvy of us with a list of those snafus? Ya know. Just to help us comprehend this gravely wounded beast that is Windows 8.

[PyX]

I will stay away, far far away from Windows 8. It?s not for me.

[Wyn6]

:rofl:

If you can't understand it then go back and reread the threads. It's pretty damn clear why people don't like it at this point and if you don't get it I can only assume you have reading comprehension issues. Your opinion and your experience say that it's fine for you. Not everyone shares your experience with it or your opinions.

This is what I mean by you trying to tell us how we're doing it wrong. The problem we are having is that what works fine for you does not work fine for everyone else. You just assume your way is the only and right way, sort of like Microsoft.

Ah. And, there's the rub. Had you read my previous post that you explicitly stated you did not read, then you would've read that I said, "Obviously, others' mileage may vary..."

I acknowledged that other people's experience may not mirror my own. And, at no point did I attempt to tell someone they were using it wrong. I simply stated that if it WAS that big of a productivity killer, I would stop using it really quick. Again, that's just me.

And, even you must admit that many are just saying that Metro is ugly, or I won't be updating, or MS has lost me as a customer, or it murders productivity/gets in my way and not really explaining. Not that any explanation is owed. But, expect subsequent questions asking why if the explanation isn't abundantly clear.