Notch reacts to a Neowin article: 'Don't be a goat rapist'

By +Frank B.
in Gamers' Hangout

 Share

Recommended Posts

Proficient

paulheu

Posted
Posted

I agree with everything he said. However there's another thing that threatens the 'Open PC', and that's Microsoft's demands that OEM's use a secure boot bios/UEFI. I want to be able to run any OS I choose on a PC. I don't want to be locked down.

You are free to not use Windows 8. No-one is putting a gun to your head demanding that you do.
Mentor

thomastmc

Posted
Posted

Most often when someone has a position that is irrational, hypocritical, and based on emotion rather than facts as John's article pointed out in reference to "Notch" (Johnson? Son of the Beach? Anyone?) politely and without any personal attack, it does no good to try and reason with them.

If they used such means to arrive at their position in the first place, they will often simply use the same means to interpret and respond to the argument you present to them. It's not a conscious decision on their part, but as evidenced in their initial position, it's just the result of the methodology of their process of thought.

Still, it's a noble effort to try. Good try John.

Grand Master

farmeunit

Posted
Posted

it does when it's so bad people are afraid to install it.

Every piece of software gets holes in it. How many has Microsoft had in theirs and no one is complaining? I'll admit, they have gotten better, but everyone is always talking up MSE, and I've seen many infected machines with it.

If you follow the right steps to protect yourself, the risks are minimal.

Grand Master

spaceelf

Posted
Posted

Every piece of software gets holes in it. How many has Microsoft had in theirs and no one is complaining? I'll admit, they have gotten better, but everyone is always talking up MSE, and I've seen many infected machines with it.

If you follow the right steps to protect yourself, the risks are minimal.

No antivirus replaces common sense, which is sadly lacking on most users of infected machines.

Grand Master

ichi

Posted
Posted

Oracle decides which platforms to support and for how long.

You see, building an application using Java is a cross-platform advantage, but in a way you depend on them supporting your PC OS for how long you need the applications to run that use Java.

So in a way, they kind of decide the fate of your apps, too.

Fortunately you are not entirely dependant on Oracle. There are other Java runtime environments that are not controlled by them, like openjre.

Grand Master

Matthew S.

Posted
Posted

Java itself is pretty damn good, [...]

Yea cause thats why Google has finally started to smarten up and move away from a Java based SDK for Android... :rolleyes:

Java (or rather the JVM) is highly insecure, slow and a bloody resource hog...

  • Glassed Silver, remixedcat and Brandon H
  • Like 3
Veteran

LingeringSoul

Posted
Posted

I still can't figure out how Notch misconstrued John's post as a "personal attack". I would count my blessings if every "personal attack" directed at me was that articulate and pre-apologetic.

Grand Master

LaP

Posted
Posted

Pure arrogance and disrespect of the fans.... I have said this many times on the OA and I will repeat here for those that didn't:

Notch is being arrogant and putting his ego first and not the players of minecraft..... if the fans want it then he should do what the fans want.... regardless of what platform it's on.... regardless of whether he likes the store idea or not... that's one part of being a developer, sometimes you have to put your own interests aside to make your users happy.... and this is where he epically fails.... my hubby doesn't care about windows 8, yet he knew about this and thought notch was being a douchenozzle about the whole thing... he is... he's arrogant and he needs to get his head out of his buttox.

Can't Windows 7 version of Minecraft be used on Windows 8?

If it can be used then where's the problem ?

If it can't be uised then maybe the problem is the OS and not him.

Grand Master

HawkMan

Posted
Posted

Fortunately you are not entirely dependant on Oracle. There are other Java runtime environments that are not controlled by them, like openjre.

Unless it's a enterprise versions, not officially sanctioned by Oracle.

Grand Master

HawkMan

Posted
Posted

No. Just...no.

And your actual argument and experiences with Java ? oh that's right, standard regurgitated anti java crap from peopel who don't know what Java even is.

Yea cause thats why Google has finally started to smarten up and move away from a Java based SDK for Android... :rolleyes:

Java (or rather the JVM) is highly insecure, slow and a bloody resource hog...

Relevance, to the issue at hand is ? you don't think that has more to do with the Oracle/Java vs Google ware going... no, couldn't possibly be.

And how is it a resource hog ? I the JVM takes it's resources but those are the same whether you run 1 or 50 apps. and Java apps themselves are no worse than other apps. in fact there was a test way back in the mid 2000 and Java on certain apps did in fact outperform native code.

Face it, it's no longer 1998. The only valid complaint is security, but then Java was the first to incorporate modern security features. and while holes have been detected, yes. but holes are detected in everything else as well. it just so happens that Java holes affect a whole lot more people than most other security holes.

Grand Master

LaP

Posted
Posted

Don't lose your time HawkMan. Trying to remotely say Java is not totally crap on Neowin will get you nowhere.

Java as its flaws. And imo all Java Applets should be killed if there's still remaining out there.

But java as a whole is okay. It's a nice language and is often the best option out there when portability is required in a small amount of time.

I've been asked once to write server app that needed to be run on linux server and windows server. I had 2 days at most to write it. It was done in Java cause it was the only real option out there to acheive this.

Wow. Never thought that I'd ever see a Java fanboy. :|

Java is one of the greatest threats to Internet security (Adobe Reader is why up the list too).

You do realise Java is not only for web app right ?

Grand Master

Brandon H Supervisor

Posted
  • Supervisor
Posted

I personally think the Neowin article was rather childish (mind you I don't play MineCraft)

I could say the same thing about Notch too especially when what he keeps talking about is false
Grand Master

HawkMan

Posted
Posted

Wow. Never thought that I'd ever see a Java fanboy. :|

Java is one of the greatest threats to Internet security (Adobe Reader is why up the list too).

I'm not a fanboy, I don't have irrational hate. and how is it one of the rgeatest threats... everythign else including html 5 has similar security holes, known and fixed and unknown.

Don't lose your time HawkMan. Trying to remotely say Java is not totally crap on Neowin will get you nowhere.

Java as its flaws. And imo all Java Applets should be killed if there's still remaining out there.

But java as a whole is okay. It's a nice language and is often the best option out there when portability is required in a small amount of time.

I've been asked once to write server app that needed to be run on linux server and windows server. I had 2 days at most to write it. It was done in Java cause it was the only real option out there to acheive this.

You do realise Java is not only for web app right ?

Well most of them never even heard of enteprise is, much less any concept of what it is and what enterprise programming is.

personally (by using yoru same irrational logic) I'd say firefox is the rgeatest threat to internet security, it's used a lot more than java by a large part of the internet public. and not only does it have several security holes that haven't been found yet. it has had uncountable security holes fixed over the years, in fact more security holes than java. and even worse than that, it can be used to trick users using phishing attacks... :|

Grand Master

spaceelf

Posted
Posted

I'm not a fanboy, I don't have irrational hate. and how is it one of the rgeatest threats... everythign else including html 5 has similar security holes, known and fixed and unknown.

HTML5 is a software package? Can I install it now? ;)

I fully admit a lot of my distaste for Java is based on their long history rather than current issues, but I will not install it on any machine I own.

Grand Master

Brandon H Supervisor

Posted
  • Supervisor
Posted

HTML5 is a software package? Can I install it now? ;)

I fully admit a lot of my distaste for Java is based on their long history rather than current issues, but I will not install it on any machine I own.

where can you download html5?

It's not quite available yet, but it should be soon http://html5.net/ :p
Veteran

DDStriker

Posted
Posted

Notch had a good idea.

That is all. Period.

Minecraft is one of the worst examples of Java programming ever conceived. Notch sucks at programming - badly.

Java applications must be brilliant if that's the worse example of one ever conceived.

Sure there were some performance issues and few bugs here and there but please don't talk garbage also to your claim of him sucking at programming please back that up with some substance on what exactly he has done wrong so we can all avoid these pitfalls oh wise one.

Grand Master

HawkMan

Posted
Posted

HTML5 is a software package? Can I install it now? ;)

I fully admit a lot of my distaste for Java is based on their long history rather than current issues, but I will not install it on any machine I own.

When did I say it was?

This topic is now closed to further replies.
 Share
Go to topic listing

  • Posts

    • Nearly 70% of Steam users now run Windows 11

      By grunger106 · Posted

      The very fact that a TPM (v2.0 specifically which is part of the issue I suspect) is now a baseline for any supported Windows installation will naturally mean other vendors will start to leverage it as they know it'll be there. It's called progress, and it's always been the way. A TPM isn't a windows thing, it's just a module designed to securely store keys. Secure boot isn't a Windows thing (although MS are the TCA as I recall hence the upheaval this year as the 2011 certs expire), it's just a way to verify a bootloader is signed. Windows simply leverages them.
    • Unofficial script lets you install unreleased Windows 11 features without Microsoft Account

      By grunger106 · Posted

      It's a local account with the ability to reset a password at a very base level. I really don't get the issue that gets whipped up around it But you do you
    • Ladybird Browser is no longer accepting outside contributions thanks to AI

      By tcris · Posted

      "thanks" to AI ))
    • Save 74% on this Complete 2026 CompTIA Certification Training Bundle

      By News Staff · Posted

      Save 74% on this Complete 2026 CompTIA Certification Training Bundle by Steven Parker Today on offer via our Online Courses section of the Neowin Deals store, you can save 74% on the Complete 2026 CompTIA Certification Training Bundle. This comprehensive 2026 CompTIA training bundle is created for aspiring IT professionals who want a faster, clearer way to earn multiple industry-recognized certifications while building practical, job-ready skills. Designed around real-world expectations, the curriculum guides you from foundational IT concepts to hands-on technical mastery across A+, Network+, Security+, Cloud+, Server+, and Pentest+ domains. You'll develop the confidence to troubleshoot systems, secure networks, manage cloud and on-prem environments, and tackle complex technical challenges with a methodical approach that employers value. By focusing on practical application and exam-aligned content, this bundle helps you stand out in the job market, prove your capabilities, and prepare for roles such as IT technician, network specialist, cybersecurity analyst, and system administrator with clarity and confidence. Certificate of Completion only. You will not receive official CompTIA certificates upon completion of each course. It's only designed to help you prepare for the covered certification exams. You need to take and pass the exams to get certified. Courses included in this bundle A Plus Certification - CompTIA A+ 220-1202 Training Master hardware, software, networking, and security essentials Covers the full Core 1 & Core 2 scope with inclusive materials that reflect real-world IT work CompTIA Cloud+ (CV0-004) Comprehensive pathway to mastering essential cloud concepts & acing the certification exam Practical skills in cloud architecture, security, and DevOps CompTIA Network+ (N10-009) Training Course Design, configure, manage & secure modern networks Covers OSI & DoD models, IP addressing, subnetting, routing technologies, VLANs, wireless networking, structured cabling, and robust disaster recovery planning CompTIA Server+ (SK0-005) Master server management, administration, and security Practical skills for server hardware installation, disaster recovery & enhancing data security CompTIA Pentest+ Course (PT0-003) Gain demonstrable capabilities in penetration testing, security testing & risk assessment Hands-on pentest labs online and real-world deliverables CompTIA Security+ Certification Course (SY0-071) Essential skills in security concepts, threats & risk management Compliance considerations & authentication mechanisms, with a practical lens to implement them in real-world networks CompTIA Cybersecurity Analyst CySA+ (CS0-004) Hands-on experience in threat modeling, vulnerability assessment & incident response Effective security measures that protect networks & data Tangible outcomes you'll achieve Validated hands-on skills across operating systems, networks, cloud, and security Confidence to pass multiple certification exams on or before your target dates A versatile toolkit for diagnosing, securing, and optimizing IT environments Ability to communicate technical concepts clearly to both technical and non-technical stakeholders Who is this course for Aspiring IT technicians and support professionals who want a clear, practical pathway to multiple industry‑recognized CompTIA certifications IT learners looking to build real‑world skills in hardware, networking, cloud, security, servers, and penetration testing Those aiming to qualify for roles like help desk technician, junior network engineer, system administrator, security analyst, or cloud administrator by earning key certificates efficiently About Vision Training Systems Since 2012 and more than 100,000 students, Vision Training Systems has been delivering expertly crafted online IT training courses to help you earn industry-recognized certifications like CompTIA A+, Network+, Security+, Cisco CCNA, Project Management, CEH V13, Microsoft Azure, AWS, and more. Plus dive into the world of AI, IT Leadership, and core soft skills needed to excel in an IT Career. Whether you’re launching your IT career or looking to grow into a senior role, our flexible, on-demand platform empowers you with the skills and certifications employers demand. Good to know Length of access: lifetime Redemption deadline: redeem your code within 30 days of purchase Access options: desktop or mobile Maximum number of device(s): 1 Available to BOTH new and existing users Certificate of Completion ONLY Experience level required: all levels Closed captioning NOT available NOT downloadable for offline viewing Here's the deal The Complete 2026 CompTIA Certification Training Bundle normally costs $199, but you can pick it up for just $40, that's a saving of $159. For terms, specs and license info, click the link below. Deal Price $40.00 with code SAVE20 (was $199) Although priced in U.S. dollars, this deal is available for digital purchase worldwide. Support queries If you have queries or need support for any of the Neowin Deals, please use the contact form here. Neowin Deals are managed and sold by StackCommerce who represent Neowin on an affiliate basis. Why we post these deals We post these because we earn commission on each sale so as not to rely solely on advertising, which many of our readers block. It all helps toward paying staff reporters, servers and hosting costs. So for those that keep moaning and complaining, be thankful we're still online for you to even do that. Other ways to support Neowin Whitelist Neowin by not blocking our ads Create a free member account to see fewer ads Make a donation to support our day to day running costs Subscribe to Neowin - for $14 a year, or $28 a year for an ad-free experience Disclosure: Neowin benefits from revenue of each sale made through our branded deals site powered by StackCommerce.
    • AMD RX 9070 GRE AI, Blender benchmarks vs 9070 XT, 7800XT, Nvidia RTX 5070, 4070

      By hellowalkman · Posted

      AMD RX 9070 GRE AI, Blender benchmarks vs 9070 XT, 7800XT, Nvidia RTX 5070, 4070 by Sayan Sen Earlier this week, we shared the first part of our review of AMD's new RX 9070 GRE. It was about the gaming performance of the GPU, and we gave it an 8 out of 10. As a follow-up, similar to how we did with the 9070 XT and non-XT, we are doing a dedicated productivity review for the RX 9070 GRE as well, where we compare it against the 9070 XT, 9070, 7800 XT, as well as Nvidia's 5070 and 4070. This will include AI, rendering, compute, and more benchmarks. AI performance, especially, is a very important metric in today's world, and AMD also promised big improvements thanks to its underlying architectural improvements. We will be pitching it against the data we already have for the RX 9070, and RX 9070 XT, but also the Nvidia 5070 FE, MSI GeForce RTX 4070 VENTUS 2X 12G, and Gigabyte Radeon RX 7800 XT GAMING OC 16G as they are in a similar price class, but also because we do not have a comparable 5060 Ti card lying around here that we can compare it against. Before we get underway, this is a collaboration between Sayan Sen and Steven Parker, who lent me his test bed. Also, there was no editorial input from AMD. First up, the specs of the RX 9070, 9070 XT, and 9070 GRE, which were given to us by AMD: Radeon RX 9070 GRE Radeon RX 9070 Radeon RX 9070 XT Boost Clock: Game Clock: up to 2.79GHz up to 2.20GHz up to 2.52GHz up to 2.07GHz up to 2.97GHz up to 2.40GHz Stream Processors 3,072 (48 CU) 3,584 (56 CU) 4,096 (64 CU) Ray Accelerator 48 56 64 AI Accelerator 96 112 128 ROPs 96 128 Texture Mapping Units 192 224 256 Memory 12 GB GDDR6, 18Gbps Clock, 192-bit Bus 432 GB/s 16 GB GDDR6, 20Gbps Clock, 256-bit Bus Effective Memory Bandwidth: 640 GB/s Infinity Cache 48 MB (3rd Gen) 64 MB (3rd Gen) Card Bus PCI-E 5.0 X16 Output 2x HDMI 2.1b 2x DisplayPort 2.1a Power consumption 220W 304W Recommended PSU 650W 750W Slot width 2x 3x Price (SEP) $549 $599 As you can see from the specs above, it is less than the standard RX 9070 in every way that counts, except for slightly higher Boost and Game clock speed. Design Moving on, the RX 9070 GRE we were given is an XFX Swift triple-fan, dual-slot design with two 8-pin connectors. At 30cm (self-measured), it will fit in most systems easily. There is no RGB either. The AMD Radeon RX 9070 GRE by XFX from all angles. Test system Our test system consists of the following: Lian Li O11 Dynamic Mini V2 Flow (Amazon|Newegg) ASUS Z890 ProArt Creator WiFi (Amazon|Newegg) Intel Core Ultra 7 270K Plus (Amazon|Newegg) Thermal Grizzly KryoSheet - 44x37 (Amazon|Newegg) 2x 16GB G.Skill Trident Z5 RGB (7200 MT/s in XMP) (Amazon|Newegg) Sabrent Rocket4 Plus 2TB SSD (Amazon) Windows 11 25H2 (Build 26200.8246) AMD shared a press driver based on the recently released Adrenaline 26.5.2 that we were required to use. We now move on to our benchmarks. First up, we have Geekbench AI running on ONNX. For some reason, the 9070 GRE does exceptionally well here in both half-precision (FP16) and single-precision (FP32). It manages to beat the RTX 5070 and RX 9070 non-XT, and is only behind the 9070 XT. Since Geekbench runs in short bursts instead of continuously hammering the graphics card, it seems the GRE's faster boost clocks are helping here. Next up, we move to the UL Procyon AI test suite, starting with the image generation benchmark. We chose the Stable Diffusion XL FP16 test since it is the most intense workload available on Procyon. The Nvidia cards do very well here, as even the 4070 out-muscles AMD's best fairy easily. The positive thing about the GRE is that it gets quite close to the 9070 non-XT in this test; this indicates that the VRAM does not play a very big role here, as SD XL relies on float16 (FP16). So this is something to keep in mind again. If you wish to work with float32 AI workloads, graphics cards with larger than 12 GB buffers would likely emerge as victors. Regardless, the gains are still massive on AMD's 9000 series compared to the 7000 series. Following image generation, we move to the text generation benchmark. This is one test where the 9070 GRE struggled, quite a lot. It seems that the 12 GB VRAM and lower memory bandwidth of the new Radeon 9070 GRE are hurting it quite a bit; the split is massive, especially in a test like Llama2, which packs 13 billion parameters. As such, in all the tests, the 9070 GRE is the slowest of the lot. Next, we tried Blender, and here the AMD GPUs were beaten by Nvidia. Rendering is something the Green team has always had a lead over the Red side, and it has not changed so far. On the positive side, though, the 9070 GRE shows significantly better results than the 7800 XT, which means AMD is on the right path. Catching up to Nvidia, though, will require a lot more effort. And we hope HIP and ROCm can keep improving. Wrapping up AI testing, we measured OpenCL throughput in the Geekbench compute benchmark. The RX 9070 GRE alongside the 9070 did not fare well here at all, even falling behind the 7800 XT. Interestingly, even the RTX 5070 could not beat the 4070 on OpenCL, so perhaps this suggests that OpenCL optimization may not have been a priority for either AMD or Nvidia in the modern era. Conclusion We reached the end of our productivity performance review of the 9070 GRE, and we have to say it's a mixed bag. Unlike the 9070 and 9070 XT, the GRE excels in some areas while losing ground fairly easily in others. Similar to how it happened in gaming, any time the card's memory subsystem gets hammered, it tends to fall behind the others. This was the case with text generation, wherein we saw the VRAM sometimes hit its maximum available 12 GB of usage with larger model sizes. So what do we make of the RX 9070 as a productivity hardware? It can certainly be used, but you have to know it has its limitations. For those looking for a GPU that can deal with more, AMD recently unveiled the Radeon AI PRO R9700, which is essentially a 32 GB refresh of the 9070 XT with some additional workstation-based optimizations. On a similar note, the new Ryzen AI Halo platform is something you can consider if you want to set up a local AI processing station. Considering everything, we rate AMD's Radeon RX 9070 GRE a 7.5 out of 10 for its productivity performance. Price is less of a factor for those looking at productivity cases compared to those considering the GPU for gaming, and as such, we felt it did quite decently on many occasions and can be handy if you need a 12 GB GPU and, for some reason, don't want to get Nvidia. Purchase links: RX 9070 / XT / GRE (Amazon US) As an Amazon Associate, we earn from qualifying purchases.

  • Recent Achievements

    • Proficient
      Eric Biran went up a rank
      Proficient
    • Dedicated
      Conjor earned a badge
      Dedicated
    • Week One Done
      Windows Guy earned a badge
      Week One Done
    • Dedicated
      Mark Spruce earned a badge
      Dedicated
    • Collaborator
      conkir earned a badge
      Collaborator

  • Popular Contributors

    1. 1
      +primortal
      479
    2. 2
      PsYcHoKiLLa
      244
    3. 3
      Steven P.
      72
    4. 4
      +Edouard
      66
    5. 5
      Skyfrog
      65
    Show More

  • Tell a friend

    Love Neowin? Tell a friend!