Fast-food workers threaten global strikes

[Nashy]

The problem is that this is the only job a lot of these people have access to.  Around here you either work for the coal industry or fast food, and Obama is doing a number on the coal industry so even those jobs are becoming harder to find.  There are VERY few other jobs around.  So even IF you get full time hours (99% of fast food employees are kept under 30 hours a week to avoid having to pay for health insurance), you're only making like $500 every two weeks after taxes.  A person can't live off that.  That barely keeps gas in the car, let alone car insurance, groceries, rent, electricity, water, vehicle maintenance...

 

Having worked for these companies and others in various positions, I know how much money these companies make.  If they can rake in $10,000+(conservative estimate based on business we did when I worked at McD's) in a single 8 hour shift off one store in a low income, low population hick town, then they can afford to pay their workers more than $500 every two weeks.

 

 

It's all very well saying you know how much money they bring in, but employees don't see the outlay.  They don't pay the lease on the building, the massive amounts of power, the water, the stock, the wages, delivery costs etc.

You also need to remember that wages are the biggest consumer of money for them, so they're going to pay as little as they can, because it helps them make more money.  They're not a charity, so thinking they should pay more just because they have the ability to isn't a valid argument.

The Government needs to change the minimum wage, not hope that one day the biggest corporations in the world decide to grow a heart.

[blerk]

The problem is that this is the only job a lot of these people have access to.  Around here you either work for the coal industry or fast food, and Obama is doing a number on the coal industry so even those jobs are becoming harder to find.  There are VERY few other jobs around.  So even IF you get full time hours (99% of fast food employees are kept under 30 hours a week to avoid having to pay for health insurance), you're only making like $500 every two weeks after taxes.  A person can't live off that.  That barely keeps gas in the car, let alone car insurance, groceries, rent, electricity, water, vehicle maintenance...

 

Having worked for these companies and others in various positions, I know how much money these companies make.  If they can rake in $10,000+(conservative estimate based on business we did when I worked at McD's) in a single 8 hour shift off one store in a low income, low population hick town, then they can afford to pay their workers more than $500 every two weeks.

 

Not knowing anything about McDonalds' and the money they make, would it be correct for me to assume that from what you say, $10,000 profit is quite good relative to the population size that the McDonalds serves?

[PGHammer]

 

Food service workers are paid what the business owner can afford. Perhaps there needs to be some work done in some businesses, but it's not at all an across the board thing. I know quite a number of people (perhaps it's different in Canada, the whole "I'm not going to pay you because of tips thing" is ########) who make $13 an hour to start, in GOOD restaurants that see a lot of business. The ones that don't work for owners that CAN'T afford to increase wages because they would have NO profit, which means NO business and NO jobs.

 

 

 

From your article:

 

"Because the average customer spends $1,200 per year, that would amount to about $12 annually. "

 

$100 a month? I'm sorry what? Who exactly cooks most nights, and only spends $100 a month on groceries and other things, if they shop at Walmart exclusively? That's an average btw, so 50% spend less per month. And if they are only spending $100 a month on groceries/other stuff, then why can't they live? What are they doing with the rest of their salary?

I can't live on $100 worth of food a month, more like $100 a week. And I'm living perfectly sound. Then again, I have an education, and actually put in some effort to bettering myself, not just waiting for handouts.

 

And for those of you who say "they can't afford to cook so they go out to McDonalds" you're wrong. It costs significantly less to buy food from the store and cook, than it does to go out every night.

 

 

I hold the same view as the Walmart spokesperson from your article

 

"A Wal-Mart spokesperson said that anyone who thought price increases would be small had "limited understanding of how a business operates."

 

 

Also, most fast-food operations are franchised - NOT corporate.  In other words, they are small businesses for the most part.  This isn't hidden by the companies - McDonald's, Wendy's, Burger King, et. alia. - each one of them breaks out a list of how many of each, corporate or franchised, are alive and breathing on a per-country basis.  While Starbucks and Dunkin Donuts have the fewest franchisees, even they do have them.  While even franchisees can get rather large - Wendy's largest franchisee has more locations than Wendy's does corporate locations, for example - that is the exception, not the rule.  I know of a mere two fast-food corporations that don't franchise at all - White Castle and Waffle House; in both cases it HAS kept their growth below that of operations that franchise - which they are aware of.  (Deliberate choice by both companies.)

 

Another case where the assumption that every location is "corporate" is often wrong.

[FloatingFatMan]

Hmm... If every fast food worker in the world went on strike for 1 month, I wonder how much weight, collectively, would be lost!? :p

[Anibal P]

It's all very well saying you know how much money they bring in, but employees don't see the outlay.  They don't pay the lease on the building, the massive amounts of power, the water, the stock, the wages, delivery costs etc.

You also need to remember that wages are the biggest consumer of money for them, so they're going to pay as little as they can, because it helps them make more money.  They're not a charity, so thinking they should pay more just because they have the ability to isn't a valid argument.

The Government needs to change the minimum wage, not hope that one day the biggest corporations in the world decide to grow a heart.

 

 

But these people are already getting paid what the market says they efforts are worth, raising their salary just means less jobs because they will not be getting paid a realistic pay for their work, basic economic principles, and all I took was a semester of microeconomics and I can easily grasp this concept  

 

There's a reason it went from raising minimum wage, which in all reality very few actually make, to the "Living Wage" farce, when faced with facts they had to change their tune to keep their anti-business campaign going

[xrobwx71]

 

 

 

All 38+ hour legal jobs should pay a living wage. Theres no point in a job where one person cannot live off of their earnings.

No one forced them to work at McDonalds.

Get a government student loan, (they are readily available in the US to low income folks) get a better paying job. Why is it Mcdonald's responsibility to pay high wages for simple labor? If you choose Mcdonald's, do a good job, earn your way up the ladder and become a manager, district manager, ect. Thus increasing your income by hard work and merit. In the early 90's my wife barely made minimum wage at a department store and she made the decision to go to school. She obtained a student grant she did not have to pay back, went to law enforcement school for 14 months, made good grades, got her diploma/certs. In two months she had a job as a Police Officer. In roughly 16 months she went from $12,000 annually to $42,000 annually. 

[FloatingFatMan]

^ This is worldwide, not just the US.  Not everyone lives where you can get free money to study and better yourself.

[DeltaXray]

The problem is that they want a lot of money for a job which you need no experience for and all the tasks can be taught on-the-job very quickly.

 

For higher paying jobs employers are paying for the time you have spent learning and subsequently working, getting experience, and enhancing your skills. It is the value of what they bring to the business they are paying for, and for burger flippers there simply is no intrinsic value.  I don't mean to sound harsh but if they can replace you with a spotty teenager they pulled off the street and gave half a days training you can not expect them to pay you top dollar.  It is down to the government to decide what the minimum wage should be.

 

Conditions are a whole different ball game. Everyone is entitled to decent working conditions.

[SierraSonic]

Put your money where your mouth is?

 

Here is what would happen if you raised 15% 

 

People are all in favor of helping the little guy ... until it comes out of their own paycheck. Not a single customer was willing to contribute 15% of their purchases to the Walmart employees who made $8/hr. The value of their service was not worth the premium price. People think CEO's can afford ALL OF IT. Reality check is employee costs eat up much much more than the CEO makes. Ultimately the rest of us who have worked hard and went to school and studied and went into debt for many many years to prevent ourselves from $8/hr would be screwed to make just a tiny fraction above15 due to higher prices. 

 

It took years and $40,000 of student loan debt for me to make $17 an hour and I am about to make more soon. How is that fair?

 

I speak not about cruelty because life is not fair and harsh for those who are irresponsible! I do not deny that. But it is an economic reality that not all labor is valuable even if you need the cash.

 

People make poor choices in life and there are consequences. Ultimately yes someone does need to stock shelves and run the cash register. However, it maybe physically daunting, but it is not hard therefore it should not pay a lot as we do not value the labor. If you raise the price too high no one will do the work. People are begging for jobs and would be happy to take them if these losers do not want their $8/hr job. Go move back in with your parents and finish your degree? Go join the armed services and learn a skill? Go learn a trade like plumbing? Plumbers 

 

There is a shift. I am in my mid to late 30s. When I was teenager the majority of teens took McDonalds and grocery store jobs. Those that did were hired first after college as it showed employers a work ethic and basics that HR didn't have to worry about training.

Today parents do not let their kids work at a burger place. They look down at the work and feel it would be humiliating if my daughter/son worked there! These kids then graduate with no work experience and face a harsh reality. 

 

Life is hard! I wish we all could have more vacations, nicer work, nice homes and cars, and more time. But that is fantasy land. Those who are workaholics get ahead. Before you get married it is something you need to do. If not you will be left behind. Once in your 40s it is then good to cut your work back after you have proven yourself to spend time with the wife but still it is very very easy to get caught in an 8/hr hour.

 

FYI I took a job at taco bell a few years ago. :-( Out of a job and my wife was too. I was embarased and I worked 2 part time jobs for a little bit. I made $600 extra dollars last month I was there briefly and we had a surprise $600 bill!! It saved my ass and taught me a valuable lesson. 

 

I did not complain and thankfully worked my way out as the great recession started to die down. But I acknowledged I took it because I worked less and made mistakes which meant the value of my labor declined. I am worth more than 15/hr through my hard work. Not by whining and crying. 

The thing both of you are missing is that these people aren't asking for a raise to earn more than a living wage, these people are asking to be paid what minimum wage was worth 30 years ago! Their jump to $15 right away is unrealistic and counter productive to their cause, the goal should be to equal the rate of minimum wage when it was enacted, but the economy cant support doubling the miniwage in one burst. Since minimum wage hasn't truly been raise to match the cost of living and inflation in the last 30 years, it needs to be slowly but much rapidly reintroduced to the proper value.

 

Also asking people for more money than they just we asked for at a register is unlikely to happen, people want to pay the price listed, not be asked by some guy walking around outside to help out.

 

I've written several posts and none of them can describe how much this entitled little brat syndrome pisses me off. Get a proper job and tell you parents to stop being ball-less push-overs. The world is hard, it's harder if you're lazy. Get off your ass and get a job worth having.

 

50% of the time they screw up my order anyways. You have a job, do it right. If you feel you're better than that Job and it's not meeting your expectations? Good. That's life. Work harder and get something better. All you do when you successfully raise the wage of unskilled jobs is raise the cost of everything for everyone else (including YOU).

 

If It's not clear enough yet, this is not a solution, this is the damn problem. I swear if they put as much effort into trying to get money for nothing as they did into their jobs, they'd get better jobs and make more money.

 

/rant

One, they have proper jobs, two, these are mainly adults in this area of work. The world may be hard, but it doesn't need to be 8 times harder than it was 30 years ago for the minimum wage worker. They screw up your order because the employees do not stay around at these jobs, the turnover rate is averaging a month! a month is not enough time to train a competent worker, but people wont stay at a place where the work isn't worth it. These jobs have changed over the years, less employees, more work per employee, and a wage that is 8 times less valuable than it was 30 years ago. That makes a great endorsement to do a proper job. /s Quit reinforcing the completely wrong stereotype that this only affects teenagers, if you truly want to prevent teenagers from working at a livable wage, push for change to the laws that allow a lower wage for people under 18. What we need to focus on is the adults who are struggling pointlessly compared to 30 years ago.

 

I hear the term Livable Wage and I wonder what this is, and who determines what a livable wage is?

A livable wage is what the minimum wage was designed for, to give, FOR ALL TYPES OF JOBS, a wage that is just above the cost of living, right above the poverty line. Minimum wage workers are currently the working poor, they make less money than they need to survive with one job. Mainly because the value of money has fallen and the amount of money wasn't raised to compensate for that lost value. People look at the number of dollars, not that the dollar is worth 40+ cents less compared to what it was worth 30 years ago.

[Anibal P]

"Living Wage" is the new term for a minimum wage increase, it's not a realistic goal, and nowhere is it mandated or should be mandated, you should get paid for the work you do based on skill, experience and longevity. There's a reason anti business and anti capitalists are spouting this living wage nonsense, it's to hide their real intentions which is going be worse for the already bad economy they have already fostered here due to their horrible policies and illegal intervention 

[ATLien_0]

The other problem about livable wage is that its always going to vary depending on city. $15 / hr as a min I could see for places like New York/Boston/LA/San Francisco, however for other cities not so much.

[rr_dRock]

Also, most fast-food operations are franchised - NOT corporate.  In other words, they are small businesses for the most part.  This isn't hidden by the companies - McDonald's, Wendy's, Burger King, et. alia. - each one of them breaks out a list of how many of each, corporate or franchised, are alive and breathing on a per-country basis.  While Starbucks and Dunkin Donuts have the fewest franchisees, even they do have them.  While even franchisees can get rather large - Wendy's largest franchisee has more locations than Wendy's does corporate locations, for example - that is the exception, not the rule.  I know of a mere two fast-food corporations that don't franchise at all - White Castle and Waffle House; in both cases it HAS kept their growth below that of operations that franchise - which they are aware of.  (Deliberate choice by both companies.)

 

Another case where the assumption that every location is "corporate" is often wrong.

THANK YOU

 

I didn't assume they were corporate, but they have the backing of a corporation... If they begin to fail, the corporation will help them or remove the franchisee, they don't close down the store, except in extreme cases, where the location is absolutely abysmal. This doesn't mean their prices are impervious to wage increases though. The franchise owner has a right to his profits, more than the staff do. Look at how much McDonalds prices have gone up (except the US). In Canada, it's $8 to get a 2 mcdoubles, fries and a drink. Because wages have gone up, therefore the prices go up. In the states, I could snag that for half that cost, if that. Because wages are low, and the market is HUGE.

 

If Family Florist starts to fail, because they can't afford to pay wages, they go out of business very quickly. Which means less choice, more autonomous crapshops, horrid products, worse customer service (because they can get away with it, they're the only players now), and an all around ###### experience shopping.

 

 

 

 

 

A livable wage is what the minimum wage was designed for, to give, FOR ALL TYPES OF JOBS, a wage that is just above the cost of living, right above the poverty line. Minimum wage workers are currently the working poor, they make less money than they need to survive with one job. Mainly because the value of money has fallen and the amount of money wasn't raised to compensate for that lost value. People look at the number of dollars, not that the dollar is worth 40+ cents less compared to what it was worth 30 years ago.

 

I'm just wondering. If they can't survive, how are there so many of them still alive?

 

 

Hmm... If every fast food worker in the world went on strike for 1 month, I wonder how much weight, collectively, would be lost!? :p

 You may have to change your sn. :p

[+primortal Subscriber²]

"Living Wage" is the new term for a minimum wage increase, it's not a realistic goal, and nowhere is it mandated or should be mandated, you should get paid for the work you do based on skill, experience and longevity. There's a reason anti business and anti capitalists are spouting this living wage nonsense, it's to hide their real intentions which is going be worse for the already bad economy they have already fostered here due to their horrible policies and illegal intervention 

 

If minimum wage was abolished and left of the to employer to set wages as they feel fit and started paying $1 an hour for your work because that what they feel was an acceptable amount for your skill.  Would you sing a different tune?

 

If pay was left up to employers we would all be screwed and living in cardboard boxes.

[rr_dRock]

If minimum wage was abolished and left of the to employer to set wages as they feel fit and started paying $1 an hour for your work because that what they feel was an acceptable amount for your skill.  Would you sing a different tune?

 

If pay was left up to employers we would all be screwed and living in cardboard boxes.

 

No. You'd get a different job. Why are people so keen to think there is only one place they can work?

 

While it's difficult to find work for some, there are jobs everywhere that are vacant. You're not forced to stay where you are. Move, find better employment and stop being a drain on everyone else.

 

And no. In a lot of cases pay IS left up to employers, that's why there's people who make more than minimum wage. Do you not see how ludicrous your assertion is?

[Anibal P]

No. You'd get a different job. Why are people so keen to think there is only one place they can work?

 

While it's difficult to find work for some, there are jobs everywhere that are vacant. You're not forced to stay where you are. Move, find better employment and stop being a drain on everyone else.

 

And no. In a lot of cases pay IS left up to employers, that's why there's people who make more than minimum wage. Do you not see how ludicrous your assertion is?

 

 

Most of the people spouting this "living wage" nonsense are clueless to reality, see the whole occupy crowd, or like most of the talking heads, openly anti business, so this makes complete sense to them 

 

don't worry tho, once the "living wage" mantra fails they will resort to calling us all racists, it's usually the next step with these people 

[rr_dRock]

Most of the people spouting this "living wage" nonsense are clueless to reality, see the whole occupy crowd, or like most of the talking heads, openly anti business, so this makes complete sense to them 

 

don't worry tho, once the "living wage" mantra fails they will resort to calling us all racists, it's usually the next step with these people 

 

The people who start these causes have no idea how business works, how the economy works. All they want is free money, for no work. It was proven, as you say, with OWS.

 

I don't care if 30 years ago the pay was higher. You're not FORCED to work at McDonalds, if you don't like it, there ARE other jobs, you just actually would have to put effort into it, and that's asking too much.

[+primortal Subscriber²]

No. You'd get a different job. Why are people so keen to think there is only one place they can work?

 

While it's difficult to find work for some, there are jobs everywhere that are vacant. You're not forced to stay where you are. Move, find better employment and stop being a drain on everyone else.

 

And no. In a lot of cases pay IS left up to employers, that's why there's people who make more than minimum wage. Do you not see how ludicrous your assertion is?

What make you so sure other jobs won't pay you the same if they have complete control on how they feel fit to pay you?

 

It's not ludicrous because right we are protected by the Fair Labor Standards Act of 1938.  If that was repealed what do think employers are going to do, keep you at the same salary or increase their profits by reducing your salary?

[techbeck]

It's only being doubled as minimum wage hasn't risen to properly cover cost of living, inflation, etc. WE ARE NOT ONLY TALKING ABOUT PEOPLE WHO WORK IN THE FAST FOOD INDUSTRY, THIS IS EVERY PERSON MAKING BELOW A LIVING WAGE. The article may be directly dealing with a strike a certain group of minimum wage workers are planning, but the problem is not just about their positions. Also personal stories are pointless, as where you most likely were earning minimum wages the cost of living was lower than the national average, try doing that in new york or where millions of people are affected by this, the result won't be the same for the majority of people.

 

First off, thanks for your need to post things in all caps and bold letters.  it is appreciated....

 

Personal stories are not pointless.  Yes, cost of living was less at the time but so was minimum wage when I was dealing with it.

 

Retail, fast food, who cares.  Point is, minimum wage is for non skilled workers and not supposed to be used to support a while family.  Lots of Americans are lazy asses wanting others to bail them out. (not everyone, but lots)  America was founded by people wanting something better and wanted to work for it. Now, people want something better but dont want to work for it.  I mean, how much skill do you need to flip burgers or check out a customer at Kohls.

[Anibal P]

What make you so sure other jobs won't pay you the same if they have complete control on how they feel fit to pay you?

 

It's not ludicrous because right we are protected by the Fair Labor Standards Act of 1938.  If that was repealed what do think employers are going to do, keep you at the same salary or increase their profits by reducing your salary?

 

Here in reality we get paid based on skill and other factors, I'm making roughly middle of the range for my skillset, business have vested interest in paying a reasonable pay to their employees to maintain the profits, that you and your cohorts feel otherwise shows how out of touch you really are, trust me those burger flippers are getting paid exactly what their worth in the market already

 

 

I'll catch up later, gotta go to my well paying job that I earned 

[+primortal Subscriber²]

Here in reality we get paid based on skill and other factors, I'm making roughly middle of the range for my skillset, business have vested interest in paying a reasonable pay to their employees to maintain the profits, that you and your cohorts feel otherwise shows how out of touch you really are, trust me those burger flippers are getting paid exactly what their worth in the market already

What comes around goes around...

 

I hope you enjoy paying that burger flippers welfare via your taxes....

[rr_dRock]

What make you so sure other jobs won't pay you the same if they have complete control on how they feel fit to pay you?

 

It's not ludicrous because right we are protected by the Fair Labor Standards Act of 1938.  If that was repealed what do think employers are going to do, keep you at the same salary or increase their profits by reducing your salary?

 

my employer isn't a total dolt, and wants good talented people working here, therefore he'll pay me as much as is fit for my experience and position. Just like the any tiered healthcare system. Teir 2 gets better doctors because they're willing to pay.

 

But thanks for labelling all business owners as ########, and tyrants.

 

I don't care if you get paid $3 an hour to flip burgers. IMO it's not even worth that much.

 

 

As for your welfare comment, we could cut a lot of that back by drug testing, and refusing to pay people to have kids. There's a start.

 

How about taking the money away from the people that didn't earn it, and give it back to those who actually produce! What a revolutionary thought. 

[+primortal Subscriber²]

How about taking the money away from the people that didn't earn it, and give it back to those who actually produce! What a revolutionary thought. 

 

Like CEOs that collect millions of dollars in pay and bonuses; which by the way no one seems to scream about job losses there when big bonuses are given to these CEOs.

[rr_dRock]

Like CEOs that collect millions of dollars in pay and bonuses; which by the way no one seems to scream about job losses there when big bonuses are given to these CEOs.

 

Those CEOs manage HUGE corporations, and deserve every penny for making the business profitable.

 

Have you ever chaired a large corporation? No? That's pretty obvious, because you (and everyone else who complains about that issue) have no concept of the amount of effort and time it takes to get to that point, and the amount of work they put in on the daily. Not to mention the amount of money they put into education, professional development, etc.

 

Don't be jealous just because you can't make that much. It should be an incentive for you to better yourself. But of course, you just think they sit around and do nothing all day. And were just handed that position without working for years to get to that point?

 

Again, they are paid based on their experience, ability, and the amount of work they put in. Just like everyone else.

 

All these complaints are, are just jealousy, and selfishness.

[Sandor]

snip

I could spend a lot of effort telling you why you're a numpty but the statement in itself will suffice for me. Your posts are lots of hilarious Alberta style nonsense that read like they written by a kid, probably just out of school, who had to read a few textbooks for some assignments.

[+primortal Subscriber²]

Those CEOs manage HUGE corporations, and deserve every penny for making the business profitable.

 

Have you ever chaired a large corporation? No? That's pretty obvious, because you have no concept of the amount of effort and time it takes to get to that point, and the amount of work they put in on the daily.

 

Don't be jealous just because you can't make that much. It should be an incentive for you to better yourself. But of course, you just think they sit around and do nothing all day. And were just handed that position without working for years to get to that point?

 

Again, they are paid based on their experience, ability, and the amount of work they put in. Just like everyone else.

 

All these complaints are, are just jealousy, and selfishness.

 

Please they manage the underlings which mange more underlings...  They set a vision for the company and everyone else does the hard work to bring the CEO vision to fruition.  Still doesn't warrant the amount of money they get paid.  The people that actually bring the vision to actuality should be paid more.

 

I make more than enough to be comfortable so I'm not jealous at all.

 

And your complaints about bugger flippers shouldn't make more than minimum wage is bigotry and narrow mindedness...  There people in these jobs that might not have the intellectual means to do anything above these tasks and need to make a wage in this society so that they can have some place decent to live, eat decent meals and have clothing on their back. 

 

Just because you might be well off doesn't give you the right to condemn the lessor because they don't fit your views.