dc Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice (2016)

[monkeylove]

On 4/6/2016 at 7:34 PM, patseguin said:

Editing problems? Like what?

Lack of an intro for the start of the movie (which makes it difficult for viewers who are new to the story), dream sequences that are too long, subplots that don't look necessary, lack of transition (such as establishing shots) between various scenes, etc. Some examples are given in various reviews.

 

 

[Draconian Guppy]

19 hours ago, George P said:

We'll have to wait for the solo batman movie to get even more detective work for batman.  BvS is more of a superman sequel, it just takes the time to introduce batman more, as a central figure of the JL along with WW and all the setup for future movies.

But isn't this batman at his  best experience?

[Innervisions33]

4 hours ago, monkeylove said:

Lack of an intro for the start of the movie 

 

 

I'm extremely curious what type of an intro you think was needed to introduce this movie...

[George P Global Moderator]

4 hours ago, Draconian Guppy said:

But isn't this batman at his  best experience?

The point i'm making is that the movie had a bunch of other things it was doing that it didn't show us enough or try to show us enough of batman being a detective out of what was necessary, maybe the 3hr directors cut BD has more, I'm hearing It flushes out the story more overall but I'll have to wait and see.

 

The problem I think is that, for some reason, someone at WB, decided to cut the theatrical version of this movie too much, so parts are disjoined or don't flow well, it could all be in that extra 30minutes, don't know.

[DocM]

Overzealous edits for time is endemic these days, often driven by theater owners who want one more showing a day per screen worth of profits.

[George P Global Moderator]

Another 30 minutes is nothing to joke about either for a movie, there's quite a bit you can do plot, story wise in 30 mins.

[Innervisions33]

People seem to forget that both The Dark Knight and The Dark Knight Rises had some very strange edits and scene cuts/jumps as well.  There were multiple scenes in both where the scene sorta just ended and you're left sitting there scratching your head.  I'm pretty confident that TDK is actually a 3.5 hour movie.  I have no proof of that, of course, but it just feels that way.

[Draconian Guppy]

22 minutes ago, Innervisions33 said:

People seem to forget that both The Dark Knight and The Dark Knight Rises had some very strange edits and scene cuts/jumps as well.  There were multiple scenes in both where the scene sorta just ended and you're left sitting there scratching your head.  I'm pretty confident that TDK is actually a 3.5 hour movie.  I have no proof of that, of course, but it just feels that way.

IIRC Nolan did say he never intended to make a directors cut out of respect for ledger.

[George P Global Moderator]

Well, as far as BvS goes, just look at the scene WB released last week, it's something like 2mins iirc, and it's a pretty big one.

[Draconian Guppy]

2 minutes ago, George P said:

Well, as far as BvS goes, just look at the scene WB released last week, it's something like 2mins iirc, and it's a pretty big one.

Link?

[George P Global Moderator]

32 minutes ago, Draconian Guppy said:

Link?

Wow, it's way shorter than i remember it...

 

 

[monkeylove]

On 4/7/2016 at 0:54 AM, Innervisions33 said:

 

 

I'm extremely curious what type of an intro you think was needed to introduce this movie...

Something for those who did not see or can barely remember Man of Steel.

 

[George P Global Moderator]

Well, as of Saturday, BvS has passed MoS in the US box office, $784million worldwide so far.  Some have estimated that they need to make $800 million to break even, but i doubt it, one thing people are forgetting with all of these comic book movies are the loads of toys and other stuff being sold, sometimes 3 to 4 months before the movie, and after the movie, hell I bet WB has made at least another $100 million from BvS toys etc.

 

Anyways, it might not hit $1 billion at this point, which sucks for WB but it'll go over that estimated $800 million at the least, probably by monday.

 

They'll probably make more money off of suicide squad and with the news of WB posting up two new slots for DC movies, sounds like they're pushing ahead with even more DCEU films than before, people are guessing one of the two will be for a new solo batman film and the other could be a SS sequel.  As far as a solo superman movie, i don't expect one till after JL2.

[DConnell Member]

Worst. Superhero. Movie. Ever.

 

Spoiler

Bad pacing and writing, poor characterization, Batfleck was a total idiot. Wonder Waif was as ill-suited for the role as I'd expected. Even the previously good Henry Cavill put in a terrible performance as Superman - likely due to the terrible script. Lex was . . . I can't even describe how let down I was with that casting and performance. And they chose to reimagine Doomsday as a giant grey fetus? Not to mention the teasers of the rest of the League, which were poorly timed in the movie, also only served to illustrate how poorly cast they were. I hope the franchise dies so we don't have to see any more of Khal Drowno, Zippy the Wonder Kid and Legoman.

 

When you're more excited by the trailer for "Lego Batman" than the DC herofest you paid to see, there's something seriously wrong with the film. Or in this case, almost everything seriously wrong.

 

The only decent elements were Jeremy Irons as Alfred and Amy Adams as Lois. The only further movie I'd be interested in seeing from this franchise would be "Lois Lane: Investigative Reporter".

[Dashel]

Ever is a pretty strong statement, particularly since Superman III and IV were on Syfy over the weekend along with Batman Forever.

[Innervisions33]

And all three of those movies were better than Batman and Robin.  

 

I'll say it again... BvS is nowhere near as bad as it has been made out to be.  It has it's issues, and not nearly as epic as it should have been, but it's still decent.

[DConnell Member]

9 minutes ago, Dashel said:

Ever is a pretty strong statement, particularly since Superman III and IV were on Syfy over the weekend along with Batman Forever.

Pretty strong, and yet not out of place. I'd gladly take "Rebuild the Great Wall of China" vision over this trainwreck!

[DConnell Member]

1 minute ago, Innervisions33 said:

And all three of those movies were better than Batman and Robin.  

 

I'll say it again... BvS is nowhere near as bad as it has been made out to be.  It has it's issues, and not nearly as epic as it should have been, but it's still decent.

Batman and Robin is better if only because you could follow what passed for a plot. BvS was just incoherent.

[Hurmoth]

1 hour ago, DConnell said:

Batman and Robin is better if only because you could follow what passed for a plot. BvS was just incoherent.

Plus, Batman and Robin make a great drinking game movie. There is a category of bad films that are so bad, they're actually good fun to watch. Ice-related puns FTW 

[George P Global Moderator]

What's hard to follow about BvS exactly?  It's about fearing what's different and has more power than you leading to things getting worse and people making bad decisions.  For all those who say they can't figure out what Lex wanted, i say it's simple, he wanted superman dead, period, there's no silly land grab plot, no bigger motive to take over the world, it's pure old fashioned fear turning into blind hate. Alffered line to Bruce gives it all away, fear rage and crualty.  People need to stop trying to look for some deeper motive for Lex and Bruces actions where the fact is it's about fear taking over ones motives.  The whole thing is a play off of the events in MoS and a view into how people in real life react to these types of events, it's a superhero comic movie look at things like 9/11 and terrorists and so on.  We fear getting attacked at first, we then get angry and rage at tjose we feel responsible for our fears, then we take it to the next step and want payback.

 

After watching it 3 times, i think the motivations are clear cut, they're all based in basic human emotions and reactions to global events.  Lex hates superman because he has more power and is like a god above him, like his dad, there's a few lines in the movie that hint at deep daddy issues as the root problem. Bruce is raging because of the feeling of being powerless to do anything when MoS was going down, and fear of failing that's turned to rage.  Again that line in the movie is key, more people should've picked up on it.

[LOC Veteran]

Problem is, people were expecting one thing, but got something completely different (in tone as well). Like I said before, I don't care if a superhero movie is all dour or doesn't have a SINGLE smile at all. That's what they are going for in this world. The only problem I have is Superman himself. The guy is the big blue boy scout for a reason and here they just removed his testicles and said "Gloves are always on, sorry Supes!" I can deal with a Batman like we get here, in fact it is WAY more realistic of a portrayal then any other movie version of Batman so far. So, kudos on that. But I can't get over how Superman is. WHY MAKE HIM AN EMOTIONLESS NOTHING?

[George P Global Moderator]

8 minutes ago, LOC said:

Problem is, people were expecting one thing, but got something completely different (in tone as well). Like I said before, I don't care if a superhero movie is all dour or doesn't have a SINGLE smile at all. That's what they are going for in this world. The only problem I have is Superman himself. The guy is the big blue boy scout for a reason and here they just removed his testicles and said "Gloves are always on, sorry Supes!" I can deal with a Batman like we get here, in fact it is WAY more realistic of a portrayal then any other movie version of Batman so far. So, kudos on that. But I can't get over how Superman is. WHY MAKE HIM AN EMOTIONLESS NOTHING?

I don't think he's emotionless though,  he's seen as conflicted about his role in the world,  we also see him rage and get angry.  We also see him come to terms with what he had to do to stop doomsday.  I like this superman because he's not the perfect version we're used to,  at least not yet,  I think we'll get there though.  Remember he's just started out,  it's been 18 months since he started being superman,  he'll get there in my opinion. 

[Solid Knight]

Batman's dream sequences were rather pointless. His reasoning was good enough; the dreams were just overkill and kind of stupid.

[LOC Veteran]

1 hour ago, George P said:

I don't think he's emotionless though,  he's seen as conflicted about his role in the world,  we also see him rage and get angry.  We also see him come to terms with what he had to do to stop doomsday.  I like this superman because he's not the perfect version we're used to,  at least not yet,  I think we'll get there though.  Remember he's just started out,  it's been 18 months since he started being superman,  he'll get there in my opinion. 

Well I'm certainly awaiting his transformation into the Superman we all know and love as well. But with the world being set up the way it is, and the basic dynamics of the whole thing - I just don't see Superman ever becoming one we are all happy with. I mean, yeah I'm sure because of the backlash this go round that the JL movies will be lighter in tone (god I hope so) and Superman and Batman etc will obviously be more friends than anything. Which is great, since they don't have to spend 2 hours explaining why Batman hates Superman again

 

And don't get me wrong, I love the angle they are going with - that this is an untested Superman who is brand new to the game etc. But they are also dropping hints as to where they may go story wise (and if they do go there, I'm done with this universe real quick) and let's just say uh, no thanks Synder I have video games for that

[George P Global Moderator]

7 hours ago, LOC said:

Well I'm certainly awaiting his transformation into the Superman we all know and love as well. But with the world being set up the way it is, and the basic dynamics of the whole thing - I just don't see Superman ever becoming one we are all happy with. I mean, yeah I'm sure because of the backlash this go round that the JL movies will be lighter in tone (god I hope so) and Superman and Batman etc will obviously be more friends than anything. Which is great, since they don't have to spend 2 hours explaining why Batman hates Superman again

 

And don't get me wrong, I love the angle they are going with - that this is an untested Superman who is brand new to the game etc. But they are also dropping hints as to where they may go story wise (and if they do go there, I'm done with this universe real quick) and let's just say uh, no thanks Synder I have video games for that

Snyder and co already said the other movies will have a different tone, i figure they are going for a whole better tone as time moves on and the JL comes closer together.  JL aside, SS has a different tone and i'm pretty sure the WW movie does as well.  Just because they're part of the same DCEU doesn't mean we should expect them all to be like BvS.