Apple products are priced too high?

[chrisj1968]

Then why did you originally say that the XPS was better? Also, the new XPS came out around February. So, if it was a better deal it was so...for a month...

 

 

Actually, the popular myth is that Apple is charging 3-4x more. I don't know why people have to hyper inflate what Apple actually charges for things. Feeling insecure with your purchases, I don't know. Like, I know this thread is on its 8th page, and there's a bit to read, but there's enough material in here about what Apple is actually charging to show that someone needs to fast forward to this year if they want to join the conversation.

 

 

You keep saying that Apple hardware is outdated when you buy it, so I have to ask...When did Broadwell based systems with faster storage, faster RAM, and a better resolution screen compared to your laptop become outdated? Yeah, man. CPU and GPU, you've got a beast. Hands down. I mean, you bought a gaming laptop, so that's where Toshiba was focused, but you can clearly see where they made compromises to get that to you at the price point you bought it for. 

 

 

 

Yes, the prices would go down, and so would Apple's profits. Also, as it's been pointed out, Apple's prices are pretty competitive, so why would they want to further drive prices down, and lose out on profit? If Apple chased after marketshare, there wouldn't be an Apple.

 

look at the lesser expensive systems.... dual core i5's. more common purchases are quad cores. quad cores are old school. isn't surface 3-4 supposed to have a quad core CPU? point being at those prices they should offer quad core i7's. not necessarily gaming models if there is such a thing. but I feel like a PC you get a burger, fries and a drink while with apple all you get is a medium fry and small drink.

[T3X4S]

yes. but by appearances, and I may be wrong, if so I'm wrong but, Apple seems to give you what they wanna give you in terms of hardware whereas PC hardware allows for GPU and CPU/MOBO upgrades usually no problem.

 

there are only two GPU vendors now, AMD and Nvidia. before there was 3dfx and a slough of others I've forgotten and that's when the drivers issues were plenty. but with 2 vendors, sure simplifies things. lol. hey Ilike simple sometimes.

 

Granted, with my OEM laptop I am also somewhat limited but I believe I could upgrade the discrete Nvidia graphics card. (probably voiding my warranty however) and upgrade my memory from 16GB to 32GB.

 

I'm not aware of Apple systems allowing for upgrades of any kind.. but maybe.

Aside from upgrading RAM (with much higher prices) and special SSD - that is all you can do on a mac - you're right.

[Michael Scrip]

I see everyone talking about hardware, but with apple you get the OS X (each year) / Office (Notes...)  / Support (Apple Care). Can anyone tell me another brand maker that has this sort of service. Its not just the hardware you paying with Apple, your getting Software and Applecare imho worth every cent!. 

That's the difference between Apple and every other PC manufacturer.

 

Apple provides the entire platform... the hardware, the operating system, software, peripherals, etc. And they can provide support through their network of retail stores.

 

Everyone else can provide the hardware... but they get their OS from someone else (Microsoft) and their support is nowhere near as complete.

 

It's easy to compare HP to Dell... but it's rather difficult to compare HP to Apple.

 

Earlier someone said Apple is in a league of its own... and I kinda agree with that.

[blerk]

I think that apple products are priced reasonably. PC OEM products with the same quality tend to be priced roughly similarly to the apple products.

 

What I don't like is Apple's warranty prices/coverage. This is where (in my experience) Dell beats Apple every time. 

[adrynalyne]

Cool story... I guess then you don't care about warranty...

Personally I'd value a warranty, battery life, weight, and the backlit keyboard than extra RAM and CPU cycles that won't be utilized in 99% of applications out there.  You know, things that are actually useful...

 

New pricing on the MBP will be changing in about 2 weeks, so the story will be different.

That's cute. The W541 has a backlit keyboard too. Battery life is decent as well. But hey if you want to pay more for something less capable, its your call.

 

I for one will be using that ram and those CPU cycles.

[benthebear]

look at the lesser expensive systems.... dual core i5's. more common purchases are quad cores. quad cores are old school. 

 

Actually, at that price range, in that class of laptop, dual core i5s are the norm. "More common," to use your words. 

 

isn't surface 3-4 supposed to have a quad core CPU? 

 

 

Surface 3 has a quad core Atom. The Surface Pro 3 can be specced up to an i7, but it's dual core.

 

point being at those prices they should offer quad core i7's. 

 

 

I think Asus maybe the exception, but If they're near that price with a quad core i7, then they're skimping you on the storage and RAM. 

[chrisj1968]

Actually, at that price range, in that class of laptop, dual core i5s are the norm. "More common," to use your words. 

 

 

Surface 3 has a quad core Atom. The Surface Pro 3 can be specced up to an i7, but it's dual core.

 

 

I think Asus maybe the exception, but If they're near that price with a quad core i7, then they're skimping you on the storage and RAM. 

 

Ok, then I'm simply too "dug in" in the PC market to not see myself buying a macbook pro etc

[nosense]

 

No OS X, NO SALE. 

Not for me, after owning 4 mac laptop's im moving away from mac books because of OSX.

[star56565656]

Everything has its pros/cons

[123456789A]

Apple being overpriced is becoming a myth. People should do proper research on prices when buying any product and then include the warranty and customer service.

Toshiba and HP have by far the worst customer service IMO.

 

Apple's customer service is also becoming a myth. They sent me on my way after I showed them that my laptop was overheating. They said it was normal.

 

The laptop died just after it exited warranty.

 

And that's just one of many failings of my Apple products and their legendary quality.

[Defcon]

The point is the value of the turn-key user experience with Apple hardware RUNNING OS X, both designed around the other.

 

It's the entire package, including support of said product from cradle to grave. 

 

No OS X, NO SALE. 

 

Same idea (that is, reality) goes for iPhones, iPads, and now for the Apple Watch, etc. 

That's your opinion. For many people the user experience with OSX and iOS is actually worse.

[xWhiplash]

I am getting really sick of these comparisons.  When I got my Mac Pro system in 2010, a few people made a comment that they could build a BETTER.....BETTER system for $600 and I spent $4,000.  Yeah right.  The processor alone at the time was $1,000 on NEWEGG!

 

Please, learn how to compare products, otherwise it looks like you have no clue what you are talking about.

 

Comparing a laptop with a HDD and a Macbook Pro with a PCIe SSD is a fail comparison.  SSDs (PCIe ones too) DO cost more than HDDs you know right?  Go on check Newegg.  Where can I get a 1TB SSD on Newegg for $60?  Oh you can't?  So, keep that in mind when you compare things.

 

The engineering DOES cost money you know?  Do you think these products are just produced from trees?  It costs money to design and actually build the design.

 

Again, say what you want about it, but you get the Office suite for FREE.  Are you guys suggesting that it costs $0 to develop?  All of those programmers get NO money for their work?

 

Again, it comes with GarageBand for free, which costs money to develop.

 

You get a free one-on-one session for your system.  Do the employees at the Apple stores get paid $0 for their work?

 

NOTHING is free, you make up for it when you buy the product.

 

To top this all off, and for the millionth time, compare similar products.  This is like saying every All-In-One system is MASSIVELY overpriced.  Guess what?  Every single laptop is overpriced.  Every single one of them.  My comparison?  I can build a better desktop myself.

 

Do NOT compare the Macbook Pro lines with desktop replacement systems.  You DO know that it costs more money to manufacture and make a system smaller, lighter, better battery, and so on.  It is NOT a fair comparison and never will be.  A Macbook Pro is not a desktop replacement.  It is a fail to compare it to a 17" 8lb desktop replacement.

 

Do NOT compare the iMac to standard desktops.

 

I have both Macs and Windows systems.  I just got a new Surface Pro 3.  However, Macs are in no way over priced.  You get no bloat, free office, free audio software, free one-on-one session if you need it, and more.

 

And please, for the millionth time, do not bring "building" into this.  That argument can be applied to Dell, HP, Lenovo, Alienware, ...  Apple should not be singled out for some of these comparisons.  Like the RAM pricing mentioned in the first few posts.  Most companies charge A LOT for ram upgrades.

[adrynalyne]

I am getting really sick of these comparisons.  When I got my Mac Pro system in 2010, a few people made a comment that they could build a BETTER.....BETTER system for $600 and I spent $4,000.  Yeah right.  The processor alone at the time was $1,000 on NEWEGG!

 

Please, learn how to compare products, otherwise it looks like you have no clue what you are talking about.

 

Comparing a laptop with a HDD and a Macbook Pro with a PCIe SSD is a fail comparison.  SSDs (PCIe ones too) DO cost more than HDDs you know right?  Go on check Newegg.  Where can I get a 1TB SSD on Newegg for $60?  Oh you can't?  So, keep that in mind when you compare things.

 

The engineering DOES cost money you know?  Do you think these products are just produced from trees?  It costs money to design and actually build the design.

 

Again, say what you want about it, but you get the Office suite for FREE.  Are you guys suggesting that it costs $0 to develop?  All of those programmers get NO money for their work?

 

Again, it comes with GarageBand for free, which costs money to develop.

 

You get a free one-on-one session for your system.  Do the employees at the Apple stores get paid $0 for their work?

 

NOTHING is free, you make up for it when you buy the product.

 

To top this all off, and for the millionth time, compare similar products.  This is like saying every All-In-One system is MASSIVELY overpriced.  Guess what?  Every single laptop is overpriced.  Every single one of them.  My comparison?  I can build a better desktop myself.

 

Do NOT compare the Macbook Pro lines with desktop replacement systems.  You DO know that it costs more money to manufacture and make a system smaller, lighter, better battery, and so on.  It is NOT a fair comparison and never will be.  A Macbook Pro is not a desktop replacement.  It is a fail to compare it to a 17" 8lb desktop replacement.

 

Do NOT compare the iMac to standard desktops.

 

I have both Macs and Windows systems.  I just got a new Surface Pro 3.  However, Macs are in no way over priced.  You get no bloat, free office, free audio software, free one-on-one session if you need it, and more.

 

And please, for the millionth time, do not bring "building" into this.  That argument can be applied to Dell, HP, Lenovo, Alienware, ...  Apple should not be singled out for some of these comparisons.  Like the RAM pricing mentioned in the first few posts.  Most companies charge A LOT for ram upgrades.

 

Go back and look at my comparisons. No HDD was used.  Good rant though.

 

Also, please do not insult the intelligence of user's on Neowin and refer to iWork as an Office suite.  It is a pitiful excuse for one, and that is why its free.

 

"I bought my Mac because of the free iWork suite!" --said no one, ever.

 

Also, the engineering speech is old. If you look at Apple's profit margin, it is considerably higher than other companies. So apparently it doesn't cost as much as you think.  People compare MacBook Pros to workstation class laptops because they are both intended for the same task...theoretically. Unless you are coming out and saying that the MBP is not meant to be used int hat environment?

 

*cough*

 

Pretty sure it is. I don't see how a laptop needs to be as thin as an MBP or look like one to be a fair comparison.

[xWhiplash]

Go back and look at my comparisons. No HDD was used.  Good rant though.

 

Also, please do not insult the intelligence of user's on Neowin and refer to iWork as an Office suite.  It is a pitiful excuse for one, and that is why its free.

 

"I bought my Mac because of the free iWork suite!" --said no one, ever.

 

Also, the engineering speech is old. If you look at Apple's profit margin, it is considerably higher than other companies. So apparently it doesn't cost as much as you think.  People compare MacBook Pros to workstation class laptops because they are both intended for the same task...theoretically. Unless you are coming out and saying that the MBP is not meant to be used int hat environment?

 

*cough*

 

Pretty sure it is. I don't see how a laptop needs to be as thin as an MBP or look like one to be a fair comparison.

 

Where did I say "Get an apple product JUST because the office suite is free"?  WHERE?  

 

Yes, it includes a FREE office suite, which DOES.....DOES cost money for Apple to develop.  That is all I said.  All these little things count towards the price of the final product.

 

Also, I get by just fine with the office suite from Apple.  Do not insult the intelligence of those using Pages, Keynote, or Numbers saying it is not an office suite.  That is a very insulting comment to say Microsoft Office is for intelligent users.  iWork is an office suite.  "And that is why it is free"?  Really?  It is THHHHHHAAAAAAATTTTTT bad?  I do not think so.  In some ways I like it better than some of the office programs.  It is certainly better than Libre office IN MY OPINION.  YES, OMG opinions matter.

 

And really, iWork is a MASSIVE improvement over the horrible Microsoft Office for Mac.  I cannot STAND those programs.

 

Yeah that is great.  "I do not like Product X, that is why it is free".

 

This is like me saying GIMP is a horrible excuse for a photo editing software.  Yet I have some people do better work on GIMP than some have in Photoshop.  I do not like GIMP, but I would never say it is a horrible excuse for a product in its category.  That is insulting to GIMP users.  Like I was insulted for liking iWork.

[adrynalyne]

Where did I say "Get an apple product JUST because the office suite is free"?  WHERE?  

 

Yes, it includes a FREE office suite, which DOES.....DOES cost money for Apple to develop.  That is all I said.  All these little things count towards the price of the final product.

 

Also, I get by just fine with the office suite from Apple.  Do not insult the intelligence of those using Pages, Keynote, or Numbers saying it is not an office suite.  That is a very offensive comment to say Microsoft Office is for intelligent users.  iWork is an office suite.  "And that is why it is free"?  Really?  It is THHHHHHAAAAAAATTTTTT bad?  I do not think so.  In some ways I like it better than some of the office programs.  It is certainly better than Libre office IN MY OPINION.  YES, OMG opinions matter.

 

And really, iWork is a MASSIVE improvement over the horrible Microsoft Office for Mac.  I cannot STAND those programs.

 

Yeah that is great.  "I do not like Product X, that is why it is free".

I'd like to see a raise of hands of how many people use Pages, Keynote and Numbers full time...and can keep a straight face saying it.  Yes, it really is THAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAATTTTT bad and I've yet to find an OS X user who disagrees, except for maybe you.

 

Office 2016 in its preview stage is far more capable than anything iWork has in a release version. Oh, did you not know Microsoft has a new version coming out? I'm sure you didn't.

[xWhiplash]

I'd like to see a raise of hands of how many people use Pages, Keynote and Numbers full time...and can keep a straight face saying it.

 

We get it, you do not like that suite.  Can you please stop insulting those that use and like it?  I would never judge somebody that uses Libre office, even though I cannot stand that office suite.

[ctebah]

I'd like to see a raise of hands of how many people use Pages, Keynote and Numbers full time...and can keep a straight face saying it. Yes, it really is THAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAATTTTT bad and I've yet to find an OS X user who disagrees, except for maybe you.

Office 2016 in its preview stage is far more capable than anything iWork has in a release version. Oh, did you not know Microsoft has a new version coming out? I'm sure you didn't.

I use those full time on my iPhone and online on my windows pc. And I'm sure many others do.

Your opinion isn't a fact, you should know that by now.

[adrynalyne]

I use those full time on my iPhone and online on my windows pc. And I'm sure many others do.

Your opinion isn't a fact, you should know that by now.

My condolences. I underestimated the need for some to punish themselves.

We get it, you do not like that suite.  Can you please stop insulting those that use and like it?  I would never judge somebody that uses Libre office, even though I cannot stand that office suite.

I didn't insult anyone. Wanna stop building a strawman?  Thats a silly question, of course you don't.

[xWhiplash]

Explain to me why several businesses are moving from Microsoft Office to Google Docs?

 

So you are saying it is IMPOSSIBLE for me to write a paper in Pages?  IMPOSSIBLE, absolutely IMPOSSIBLE for me to create a presentation in Keynote?  Oh it is possible?  Then it is NOT THAT BAD.

 

People also need to stop saying Product X is bad when they really mean Product X does not have the features I need.

 

A product that is THHHHHHAAAAAAATTTTTT bad will never run, constantly crash, is IMPOSSIBLE to do anything with, and so on (massive memory leaks and the like).

[ctebah]

My condolences. I underestimated the need for some to punish themselves.

You show a lot of ignorance and as such loose all credibility. Being able to create/update my resume and do my budget spreadsheets for free is pretty much the majority of my iWork usage.

I can bet that a huge chunk of office users do very little and as such are punishing themselves by spending money. I presume you're one of them. Sour because it costs to make a simple spreadsheet.

[xWhiplash]

I didn't insult anyone. Wanna stop building a strawman?  Thats a silly question, of course you don't.

 

Yes you absolutely did.  You said this:

 

 

 

I'd like to see a raise of hands of how many people use Pages, Keynote and Numbers full time...and can keep a straight face saying it.

 

Which is insulting, suggesting those that use these products are fools and a joke.

[adrynalyne]

Explain to me why several businesses are moving from Microsoft Office to Google Docs?

 

So you are saying it is IMPOSSIBLE for me to write a paper in Pages?  IMPOSSIBLE, absolutely IMPOSSIBLE for me to create a presentation in Keynote?  Oh it is possible?  Then it is NOT THAT BAD.

 

People also need to stop saying Product X is bad when they really mean Product X does not have the features I need.

 

A product that is THHHHHHAAAAAAATTTTTT bad will never run, constantly crash, is IMPOSSIBLE to do anything with, and so on (massive memory leaks and the like).

Build another strawman. Did I mention anything about Google Docs?

 

Did I say anything was impossible in Pages?

 

Did I mention crashes?  Wow you sure like to invent things.

Yes you absolutely did.  You said this:

 

 

Which is insulting, suggesting those that use these products are fools and a joke.

Anyone who is offended by someone disrespecting their choice of software has bigger issues than using iWork, thats for sure.

You show a lot of ignorance and as such loose all credibility. Being able to create/update my resume and do my budget spreadsheets for free is pretty much the majority of my iWork usage.

I can bet that a huge chunk of office users do very little and as such are punishing themselves by spending money. I presume you're one of them. Sour because it costs to make a simple spreadsheet.

Ignorance eh?

 

I've built spreadsheets that hits web services to pull down data, compiles and organizes it, and presents it to the user.  I'm sure your complex resumes were more difficult, though. Can you do that in Numbers? Honest question. 

[xWhiplash]

Build another strawman. Did I mention anything about Google Docs?

 

Did I say anything was impossible in Pages?

 

Did I mention crashes?  Wow you sure like to invent things.

Anyone who is offended by someone disrespecting their choice of software has bigger issues than using iWork, thats for sure.

 

OMG it is like talking to a wall.  You said iWork was THHHHHAAAAAATTTTTT BAD.  Did you read what I said AT ALL?  A BAD product is one that crashes, has memory leaks, randomly deletes your files or does not save, ...  A BAD product does not do what it advertises.

 

Oh so it is possible to work on stuff with iWork?  Then again, it is NOT THAT BAD.  iWork just does not have the features you need.

 

A bad product means something different.  I need the features of Photoshop, but GIMP is NOT A BAD product.

 

Oh and great, you like telling people how to feel too.  Awesome.  You did more than just disrespect my software decision.

[adrynalyne]

OMG it is like talking to a wall.  You said iWork was THHHHHAAAAAATTTTTT BAD.  Did you read what I said AT ALL?  A BAD product is one that crashes, has memory leaks, randomly deletes your files or does not save, ...

 

Oh so it is possible to work on stuff with iWork?  Then again, it is NOT THAT BAD.  iWork just does not have the features you need.

 

A bad product means something different.  I need the features of Photoshop, but GIMP is NOT A BAD product.

 

Oh and great, you like telling people how to feel too.  Awesome.  You did more than just disrespect my software decision.

A bad program is one that hampers my productivity so clearly you and I have a difference of opinion.

 

I'm so sorry Mr. xWhiplash. I didn't mean to offend your sensitive nature. Will you forgive me?

[ctebah]

Ignorance eh?

I've built spreadsheets that hits web services to pull down data, compiles and organizes it, and presents it to the user. I'm sure your complex resumes were more difficult, though. Can you do that in Numbers? Honest question.

Why would I need to do that? Did I not tell you what I use the majority of iWork for? Wanna bet that more people will use Office for things that I described than for complex things that you described?

All you did is successfully describe ignorance. Thanks.