[OFFICIAL] Windows 10 Insider Program

[trag3dy]

jjk - are you, as a user, primarily pointing-device driven (as opposed to keyboard-driven)?

 

If so, then I very much understand your issues - for the pointing-device-driven, 8 was certainly a major shake-up.  (It was, in fact, why I warned way back with the Consumer Preview, that such users had a massive learning curve ahead of them.)

 

The third-parties saw this as an opportunity - and jumped in with both feet.  (Hats off to the third parties - they did what they SHOULD do.)

 

However, that wasn't enough for some - they wanted a Start menu from Microsoft - despite their own grudging admissions that most of the third-party alternatives worked better than the Start menu from Windows 7 - arguably the best iteration pre-8.

 

However, even this mix of new-and-old isn't even satisfying all of you - so back to the third parties (that you attempted to have Microsoft throw under the bus) you have gone running.

 

What do you REALLY want - a reversion all the way back to 7?

 

Are you really implying that Microsoft shouldn't re-add a wanted feature to their OS just because some third party software makers have alternatives?

[Dot Matrix]

since when you spoke for all the people?

If you haven't noticed, numerous testers are calling Windows 10 on tablets a real ****ty experience.

[+Anarkii Subscriber²]

Windows tablets only make up something like 8% of the total Windows experience. 
92% of Windows users are normal people who use desktops, laptops and notebooks. 

Source: http://winsupersite.com/windows-8/report-windows-8-secures-75-percent-tablet-market

[Dot Matrix]

Windows tablets only make up something like 8% of the total Windows experience.

92% of Windows users are normal people who use desktops, laptops and notebooks.

Source: http://winsupersite.com/windows-8/report-windows-8-secures-75-percent-tablet-market

And? Windows 10 is still supposed to be a universal OS

[+Anarkii Subscriber²]

And? Windows 10 is still supposed to be a universal OS

"Supposed to be"

It's not though is it? Will it be? Who knows, maybe in good time, but clearly Windows 10's focus is the desktop (where it should be) and Windows Phones, which are selling just as bad as the Surface tablets. 

[PGHammer]

Are you really implying that Microsoft shouldn't re-add a wanted feature to their OS just because some third party software makers have alternatives?

Basically, yes.

 

After all, that is exactly the sort of thinking that got Microsoft in hot water - was or was not the inclusion of Internet Explorer considered "illegal tying"?

 

Even more telling, not even those calling for it faulted ANY of the third parties for their various implementations (even though some implementations were favored more than others).

 

The final reason is what some of those same users are doing with Windows 10 - they are throwing those SAME third-party bringbacks back onto the OS - INSTEAD of Start Menu 2.0.

 

 

That is why I am asking what do they REALLY want.

[PGHammer]

"Supposed to be"

It's not though is it? Will it be? Who knows, maybe in good time, but clearly Windows 10's focus is the desktop (where it should be) and Windows Phones, which are selling just as bad as the Surface tablets. 

Anarkii - do you mean the desktop - or the desktop form-factor?

 

And it is indeed a fair question - after all, the only feature that tablets have that legacy laptops and notebooks don't is touch support; by and large, all too many desktop applications don't scale DOWN to the screen sizes that tablets, slates, and those very same notebooks and laptops have in common with each other.

 

In other words, laptops and notebooks - like tablets and slates - have the mirror image of the "Modern problem"; except that it's desktop applications, by and large, that fail to downscale.

 

All too often, when folks are referring to "the desktop", what they really mean is the desktop-formfactor PC - with the large screen and inability to move.  Except for pointing-device-centricity, what did they give up with Windows 8?  (I'm asking as someone that uses a pointing device and keyboard with my tri-boot of 8.1 ProWMC, 10 Pro, and 10 Enterprise.  On my two notebooks - both of which are running 10 Pro 10056 - I use a trackpad, which works way better than it did in 8.1 or earlier, by the way.)

 

I'm not saying that Modern applications scale up all that well - if anything, I'm agreeing with you there.  That is, in fact, why I use very few of them on my desktop-formfactor PC.

 

On my notebooks, on the other hand, all too often, Modern apps - where they exist - are a better fit than standard applications for the desktop are.  I'm not looking into a porthole on my notebook (which, all too often, I WOULD be with a desktop application that didn't scale down far enough).

 

For once, I can use applications that fit my formfactor - and without compromise - and that is without touch.  Modern apps for smaller screens, and desktop applications for larger screens - like my desktop-formfactor PC.

 

Why is that such a bad thing?

[trag3dy]

Basically, yes.

 

After all, that is exactly the sort of thinking that got Microsoft in hot water - was or was not the inclusion of Internet Explorer considered "illegal tying"?

 

Even more telling, not even those calling for it faulted ANY of the third parties for their various implementations (even though some implementations were favored more than others).

 

The final reason is what some of those same users are doing with Windows 10 - they are throwing those SAME third-party bringbacks back onto the OS - INSTEAD of Start Menu 2.0.

 

 

That is why I am asking what do they REALLY want.

 

I'm don't know if I should be taking you seriously or not. 

[+Anarkii Subscriber²]

Anarkii - do you mean the desktop - or the desktop form-factor?

 

And it is indeed a fair question - after all, the only feature that tablets have that legacy laptops and notebooks don't is touch support; by and large, all too many desktop applications don't scale DOWN to the screen sizes that tablets, slates, and those very same notebooks and laptops have in common with each other.

 

In other words, laptops and notebooks - like tablets and slates - have the mirror image of the "Modern problem"; except that it's desktop applications, by and large, that fail to downscale.

 

All too often, when folks are referring to "the desktop", what they really mean is the desktop-formfactor PC - with the large screen and inability to move.  Except for pointing-device-centricity, what did they give up with Windows 8?  (I'm asking as someone that uses a pointing device and keyboard with my tri-boot of 8.1 ProWMC, 10 Pro, and 10 Enterprise.  On my two notebooks - both of which are running 10 Pro 10056 - I use a trackpad, which works way better than it did in 8.1 or earlier, by the way.)

 

I'm not saying that Modern applications scale up all that well - if anything, I'm agreeing with you there.  That is, in fact, why I use very few of them on my desktop-formfactor PC.

 

On my notebooks, on the other hand, all too often, Modern apps - where they exist - are a better fit than standard applications for the desktop are.  I'm not looking into a porthole on my notebook (which, all too often, I WOULD be with a desktop application that didn't scale down far enough).

 

For once, I can use applications that fit my formfactor - and without compromise - and that is without touch.  Modern apps for smaller screens, and desktop applications for larger screens - like my desktop-formfactor PC.

 

Why is that such a bad thing?

Dunno why you think I dont agree with you, i've always said that Windows needs 2 distinct operating systems. One for point and click, and one for touch. They tried it with Windows 8 and made and mess of it, but that was because it was 2 OS's melded together. They are doing the same with Windows 10, but after 3 years or so, it actually is 'somewhat' coming together. 92% of Windows users dont even have tablets or slates so thats why they are bringing focus back to the desktop, or as you put it, the desktop form-factor PC. Thats fine, thats where the focus SHOULD be. 

For those using touch devices, they should be using Windows 10 for phones. Which is a completely different OS all together. And before you begin 'oh its the exact same you get on desktops' - no, it isn't. 

If it was, you would be on 10049 on Windows Phones. Not 10056 or whatever you are on. and I dont see no desktop UI on phones either that are scaled. 

So with that in mind, Windows 10 should be separate. Windows 10 for desktops and Windows 10 for Touch. Thats all they need to do. One focuses on that 92% of users who use point and click, and the other team that focuses on that 8% that uses touch devices. THEN have the Metro apps that run on both which scale depending on the device it runs on. Desktop? You get the works. Nothing hidden. Touch? You get the most scaled back version of the app possible. Then for both OS's just have monthly updates like the Xbox that slowly introduces new features to both. 

[+Zagadka Subscriber²]

Kinda funny, I have been running Win10 on an old laptop. I haven't really done anything with it, haven't installed apps etc... and Spartan launches with malware tabs first run.

[+Anarkii Subscriber²]

Yeah without Ad-Block, malware turns up on Spartan after a good 20 minutes of use. Stopped using it until 3rd party extensions are included.

[HawkMan]

A pure desktop based OS with the under the hood library/kernel/hardware/driver support from the newer versions of windows would be awesome.

 

It would also be a major waste of money into a dead end OS.

 

also windows 8 and 10 for that matters, works just as well as 7 and XP with a mouse and keyboard. in fact several parts of the start screen and metro works better with Mouse than with touch. 

[HawkMan]

Yeah without Ad-Block, malware turns up on Spartan after a good 20 minutes of use. Stopped using it until 3rd party extensions are included.

 

Wow, what sites do you browse? not a single sign of malware on either of my computers with windows 10 since I installed it after the release of the latest TP. 

[Dot Matrix]

Kinda funny, I have been running Win10 on an old laptop. I haven't really done anything with it, haven't installed apps etc... and Spartan launches with malware tabs first run.

What? How? It has it's own launch page

[+Zagadka Subscriber²]

It popped up with another tab for a "PC cleaning" service

[NightmarE D]

You '' judge '' it too well , counting on a beta release planned OS as W10 is ...

Free for 1 year ... Then I have to pay for this ?

Nevermind .

 

You haven't made a single post in anything related to Windows 10 that makes sense.

 

It's not a beta and has never been called one. If you're one to be able to get that free upgrade, you'll have that free for life of the device. You won't suddenly have to pay for that version after a year. Now if you needed a copy for a brand new system you just built, then yeah, you would have to buy a copy.

 

You have no idea what you're talking about and are slowly going back into that "troll-ish" mode you were in a while back here. Constantly making up crap from nothing and getting angry if people don't hate the same thing you do. It's not all about you, buddy.

 

I call BS on people saying that Spartan is bringing up malware tabs when they haven't even used it. That makes zero sense. You cleary did something if you managed to make that happen. Oh it just magically did it? Right

[Ian S.]

If you haven't noticed, numerous testers are calling Windows 10 on tablets a real ****ty experience.

I didn't install it on my Surface Pro 3 because it is so touch unfriendly.

[Ian S.]

Is it weird to think that HoloLens was in development while Ballmer was CEO?

 

[Jim K Global Moderator]

I'm don't know if I should be taking you seriously or not. 

 

Especially when he says that it is what got "Microsoft in hot water - was or was not the inclusion of Internet Explorer considered "illegal tying".  One of those things really hard to argue because it is such a preposterous comment....might as well just throw hands up in the air.  

 

 

What next?  Is including calculator throwing third party software companies under the bus?  Character map?  DirectX?  The clock?

 

I find it laughable that he is making the absurd statement that Microsoft including the Start Menu constitutes "illegal tying".

 

...but whatever.

 

It would also be a major waste of money into a dead end OS.

 

also windows 8 and 10 for that matters, works just as well as 7 and XP with a mouse and keyboard. in fact several parts of the start screen and metro works better with Mouse than with touch. 

 

Subjective at best.

[sinetheo]

If you haven't noticed, numerous testers are calling Windows 10 on tablets a real ****ty experience.

 

You can always join the XP and Windows 7 holdouts. There is room for you too! I have a coworker who plans to hold out as long as he can for his surface and keep 8 :-)

 

Now you see the value of changing things for the sake of it when what you had was perfectly fine. 8 will still be modern just like Windows 7 is still considered modern (but do admit by 2016 I do not know if that statement will be true anymore after 10 is out ...)

[tompkin]

You can always join the XP and Windows 7 holdouts. There is room for you too! I have a coworker who plans to hold out as long as he can for his surface and keep 8 :-)

 

Now you see the value of changing things for the sake of it when what you had was perfectly fine. 8 will still be modern just like Windows 7 is still considered modern (but do admit by 2016 I do not know if that statement will be true anymore after 10 is out ...)

Well, if Windows 7 is modern now, how could it not be in 2016? That's less than a year away!!

 

I think they should call Windows 8 "Modern", and call Windows 10 "Contemporary". (The "Contemporary" interface).

 

But seriously, I know I'm going to have to buy a new machine (desktop/laptop) to move from Windows 7 to Windows 10 and am waiting to see what I get for my purchase. I just want to see what functionality it brings me and then I want to make sure it's stable. When I'm assured of those two things then I will upgrade.

[HawkMan]

 

 

 

Subjective at best.

 

Uh no. functions that are better designed and easier with mouse than touch is not subjective. if they where equally easy/hard but different, then, yes, it would be subjective. 

[DeusProto]

Windows 10 launches in July.

 

Way too early. It needs at least another year of development, then another 3 months as RC status. 

 

http://www.theverge.com/2015/4/20/8456049/windows-10-launch-late-july-claims-amd

[Dot Matrix]

Windows 10 launches in July.

 

Way too early. It needs at least another year of development, then another 3 months as RC status. 

 

http://www.theverge.com/2015/4/20/8456049/windows-10-launch-late-july-claims-amd

No, it doesn't. Another half a year of development, tops. Another 3 months RC? Is this 2006 again?

[Authentic X]

My computer tried to download this today (TWS) fbl_impressive Enterprise 10066 ,so it must be out