[OFFICIAL] Windows 10 Insider Program

[+Zlip792 MVC]

My computer tried to download this today (TWS) fbl_impressive Enterprise 10066 ,so it must be out

 

 

From Windows 10 Build 10049 or Windows 10 Build 10056 [leaked]?

[Jim K Global Moderator]

Uh no. functions that are better designed and easier with mouse than touch is not subjective. if they where equally easy/hard but different, then, yes, it would be subjective. 

 

Once again, you made a subjective statement...what "several parts" are you referring to?

 

Subjectively, the start screen was a big error with regards to the mouse as it is geared more towards touch.

[MikeM97]

 

Is only gray . 

[Authentic X]

From Windows 10 Build 10049 or Windows 10 Build 10056 [leaked]?

from 10056

[freak180]

from 10056

then it does not matter. You wont get any build early for being on a leaked version 

[Authentic X]

then it does not matter. You wont get any build early for being on a leaked version 

I know that,I was just stating its gone past build 10064

[Dot Matrix]

I don't see much of a difference in the menus in those screenshots. They still don't match the modern menus.

[Ci7]

I know that,I was just stating its gone past build 10064

 

actually it is past build 10100

[HawkMan]

Windows 10 launches in July.

 

Way too early. It needs at least another year of development, then another 3 months as RC status. 

 

http://www.theverge.com/2015/4/20/8456049/windows-10-launch-late-july-claims-amd

 

Maybe if they had't switch to a rapid release cycle and rolling releases instead of the old monolithic releases. 

 

On the other hand, I'm pretty sure MS knows more about when the OS will be ready than random people on the internet. 

 

And seeing as they're moving to a combination of rapi relase cycles and rolling releases for smaller updates and changes on the live OS. they can now more easily give a release date and say that "these things aren't ready, so the small thing here we'll roll out as they're ready the other stuff will be added to the next 6 month rapid release"

actually it is past build 10100

 

Which is a resul of jumping branches and is thus actually older than 064.

[Studio384]

Which is a resul of jumping branches and is thus actually older than 064.

No it isn't. Build 10064 comes before 10100. Build 10065 was the final general build before 10100. The only branch moving on in the 100xx series is the fbl_impressive branch.

[Kyang]

I don't see much of a difference in the menus in those screenshots. They still don't match the modern menus.

 

It looks like they were aligned with the 8.1 Start screen menus, but not much else.

[PGHammer]

Dunno why you think I dont agree with you, i've always said that Windows needs 2 distinct operating systems. One for point and click, and one for touch. They tried it with Windows 8 and made and mess of it, but that was because it was 2 OS's melded together. They are doing the same with Windows 10, but after 3 years or so, it actually is 'somewhat' coming together. 92% of Windows users dont even have tablets or slates so thats why they are bringing focus back to the desktop, or as you put it, the desktop form-factor PC. Thats fine, thats where the focus SHOULD be. 

For those using touch devices, they should be using Windows 10 for phones. Which is a completely different OS all together. And before you begin 'oh its the exact same you get on desktops' - no, it isn't. 

If it was, you would be on 10049 on Windows Phones. Not 10056 or whatever you are on. and I dont see no desktop UI on phones either that are scaled. 

So with that in mind, Windows 10 should be separate. Windows 10 for desktops and Windows 10 for Touch. Thats all they need to do. One focuses on that 92% of users who use point and click, and the other team that focuses on that 8% that uses touch devices. THEN have the Metro apps that run on both which scale depending on the device it runs on. Desktop? You get the works. Nothing hidden. Touch? You get the most scaled back version of the app possible. Then for both OS's just have monthly updates like the Xbox that slowly introduces new features to both. 

It's the "two distinct operating systems" that I disagree with.

What the heck do you do with AIO desktops, notebooks, and even large-screen (nineteen inches or larger) desktop-replacement laptops?

Also, did I say that ANY of my hardware supports touch?  The issue with Modern isn't touch - it's screen-size - period.

 

The ONLY reason you (and a lot of those like you) are all het up about touch is that touch is "the new factor" - it is showing up everywhere.  Yes - it started on tablets (for the understandable reason that it is relatively easy to add there, and can actually help keep costs down by NOT having to include a keyboard or pointing device).  However, there is the problem that larger-screen touch devices (notebooks, laptops, and desktops) by and large STILL include keyboards and pointing devices.  However, does a device supporting touch mean that it can't/won't/shouldn't support keyboards and pointing devices?  Android and iOS certainly don't buy that - the devices that run Android are not JUST tablets and phones.  (Consider the ASUS Transformer Prime - runs Android as sole OS - but in addition to the touch-screen display, it includes a keyboard that doubles as a dock, and it has USB ports that support external pointing devices, while including a TrackPoint device built into the keyboard dock (the device itself is sourced from Lenovo, and is also supported by Android).  Touch (as much as you are saying you would prefer otherwise) isn't going to go away - not even on desktops - nor should it.  It won't obviate keyboards (or pointing devices) completely - anywhere it is supported - it hasn't done that even on Android or iOS.  Why would Windows be any different?

 

Touch (the "new kid") isn't a Gorgon.  Touch also isn't "the great obviator", either.  All touch is - when it gets down to cases - is another input method; nothing more,

[PGHammer]

Is it weird to think that HoloLens was in development while Ballmer was CEO?

 

Not in the least.

 

Microsoft Research is basically the equivalent of IBM Research - some of those research projects are LONG term - as in decades or more..  (It wouldn't surprise me to find that MR has ongoing projects that actually predate Ballmer's turn as CEO.)

[Ian S.]

Not in the least.

 

Microsoft Research is basically the equivalent of IBM Research - some of those research projects are LONG term - as in decades or more..  (It wouldn't surprise me to find that MR has ongoing projects that actually predate Ballmer's turn as CEO.)

Many people (sadly) don't realize that.

[PGHammer]

Once again, you made a subjective statement...what "several parts" are you referring to?

 

Subjectively, the start screen was a big error with regards to the mouse as it is geared more towards touch.

It's geared away from pointing devices (that much IS true) - however, how is it that the original StartScreen is navigable with a keyboard, then?

 

That's right - a keyboard.  (No mouse, and no touch support.)  I pointed this out back during the Developer Preview.

 

I even pointed out HOW I discovered that tidbit - a pointing-device jam, on my DESKTOP.

 

You can still use it with a pointing device (of any sort) - even a poorly-supported one like a trackpad or touchpad.  However, for the first time since Windows 3.x, a pointing device was not a requirement to maneuver around the GUI - even without touch support.  (Individual applications are, naturally, another story.)

 

I referred to the moving away from pointing devices as nothing less than the IT equivalent of what the Civil Rights Act of 1964 was supposed to be - input-support equality.

 

Naturally, the pointing-device centric (which had been favored with the Explorer-centric UI of 9x/NT4) were going to be rather upset.  (Was that not the case with the implementation of the original Civil Rights Act - even in such hotbeds of segregation as Boston, Massachusetts?)

Many people (sadly) don't realize that.

It's not any great secret - in fact, it's part of their charter.

http://research.microsoft.com

[PGHammer]

Well, if Windows 7 is modern now, how could it not be in 2016? That's less than a year away!!

 

I think they should call Windows 8 "Modern", and call Windows 10 "Contemporary". (The "Contemporary" interface).

 

But seriously, I know I'm going to have to buy a new machine (desktop/laptop) to move from Windows 7 to Windows 10 and am waiting to see what I get for my purchase. I just want to see what functionality it brings me and then I want to make sure it's stable. When I'm assured of those two things then I will upgrade.

Why would you?  My desktop (and one of my two notebooks) are ex-7 machines; the other notebook is even older - an ex-Vista machine.

 

Yet all three are running one SKU or another (the desktop runs both Pro and Enterprise SKUs) of 10.

 

The desktop has an Intel CPU - both notebooks have AMD CPUs of the pre-Fusion (in fact, pre-E) sort.

 

What exactly ARE the hardware specs of the problem machine in question?

[trag3dy]

 

It's geared away from pointing devices (that much IS true) - however, how is it that the original StartScreen is navigable with a keyboard, then?

 

That's right - a keyboard.  (No mouse, and no touch support.)  I pointed this out back during the Developer Preview.

 

I even pointed out HOW I discovered that tidbit - a pointing-device jam, on my DESKTOP.

 

You can still use it with a pointing device (of any sort) - even a poorly-supported one like a trackpad or touchpad.  However, for the first time since Windows 3.x, a pointing device was not a requirement to maneuver around the GUI - even without touch support.  (Individual applications are, naturally, another story.)

 

I referred to the moving away from pointing devices as nothing less than the IT equivalent of what the Civil Rights Act of 1964 was supposed to be - input-support equality.

 

Naturally, the pointing-device centric (which had been favored with the Explorer-centric UI of 9x/NT4) were going to be rather upset.  (Was that not the case with the implementation of the original Civil Rights Act - even in such hotbeds of segregation as Boston, Massachusetts?)

It's not any great secret - in fact, it's part of their charter.

http://research.microsoft.com

 

 

A pointing device hasn't been required to "use" windows since at least Windows 95. I'm not sure why you think that's a new thing with Windows 8.

 

And lets be real, the overwhelming large majority of people who use windows do not and will not ever know any of the keyboard commands required to navigate through menus and folders efficiently. It's such a weird argument to make.

[PGHammer]

 

 

 

 

A pointing device hasn't been required to "use" windows since at least Windows 95. I'm not sure why you think that's a new thing.

 

And lets be real, the overwhelming large majority of people who use windows do not and will not ever know any of the keyboard commands required to navigate through menus and folders efficiently. It's such a weird argument to make.

 

Maybe because Windows 9x would nag you if it failed to detect one? (Windows 95 - the original one - was quite infamous for this particular "nag screen".)

 

I'm not saying that it isn't a weird argument - however, the results certainly speak for themselves.

 

Microsoft certainly benefitted from the pointing-device-centricity - what was their rank in terms of pointing-device sales when Windows 95 launched?  In fact, what is their rank in terms of such sales today?

 

However, the same argument can be made about the "neighborhood school" meme (which was used to attempt to counter - unsuccessfully - court-ordered bussing of school children under the original Civil Rights Act - in Boston, MA and elsewhere).

[Ice_Blue]

Once again, you made a subjective statement...what "several parts" are you referring to?

 

Subjectively, the start screen was a big error with regards to the mouse as it is geared more towards touch.

You have difficulty using the Start Screen with a mouse?

[PGHammer]

You have difficulty using the Start Screen with a mouse?

I'm just as confused, Ice_Blue - and I used the StartScreen ONLY with a mouse on my desktop - and with a trackpad on the older of my two notebooks.

Hence my tackling - head-on - the issue of "complacency".

[Jim K Global Moderator]

It's geared away from pointing devices (that much IS true) - however, how is it that the original StartScreen is navigable with a keyboard, then?

 

That's right - a keyboard.  (No mouse, and no touch support.)  I pointed this out back during the Developer Preview.

 

I even pointed out HOW I discovered that tidbit - a pointing-device jam, on my DESKTOP.

 

You can still use it with a pointing device (of any sort) - even a poorly-supported one like a trackpad or touchpad.  However, for the first time since Windows 3.x, a pointing device was not a requirement to maneuver around the GUI - even without touch support.  (Individual applications are, naturally, another story.)

 

I referred to the moving away from pointing devices as nothing less than the IT equivalent of what the Civil Rights Act of 1964 was supposed to be - input-support equality.

 

Naturally, the pointing-device centric (which had been favored with the Explorer-centric UI of 9x/NT4) were going to be rather upset.  (Was that not the case with the implementation of the original Civil Rights Act - even in such hotbeds of segregation as Boston, Massachusetts?)

It's not any great secret - in fact, it's part of their charter.

http://research.microsoft.com

 

Why do I care about keyboard only navigation?  Rarely am I in a position to where I do not have either a trackpad or a mouse.  

 

The post your replied to was in response to Hawk saying something along the lines that certain parts (though he didn't specify) were easier to use with a mouse than touch.  I was curious at to which parts he was talking about.

 

You have difficulty using the Start Screen with a mouse?

 

Who said anything about difficult about using?  Aside from the excess mouse travel, side scrolling, big blocky boxes and in-your-face looks...it is easy to use.  Especially for the visually impaired or monkeys using a mouse.

[Dot Matrix]

Windows 10 will also run on phones and phablets. On tablets of all sizes. And on hybrid devices like 2-in-1 PCs that can transform between different form factors. And from what we

[Ian W]

Then you really don't understand the workflow people are losing.

Perhaps a topic dedicated to the missing features would help? There really are quite a few, even ones that can benefit desktop users,  such as application sorting, the option to display additional tiles in "All Apps," the option to display additional tiles on the Start screen on a sufficiently high resolution, semantic zoom, et cetera. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Features_new_to_Windows_8#Start_screen

[+Frank B. Subscriber²]

Javascript is not enabled or refresh the page to view.

Click here to view the Tweet

[Dot Matrix]

Perhaps a topic dedicated to the missing features would help? There really are quite a few, even ones that can benefit desktop users,  such as application sorting, the option to display additional tiles in "All Apps," the option to display additional tiles on the Start screen on a sufficiently high resolution, semantic zoom, et cetera. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Features_new_to_Windows_8#Start_screen

I feel a topic on Microsoft Feedback outlets would be better.