Jet fuel can't melt steel. (But it sure can weaken it)


 Share

Recommended Posts

HawkMan
7 hours ago, monkeylove said:

That makes absolutely no sense at all! How do you know "the ones that actually failed and collapsed" are the only pieces if the rest were not examined at all? Your second point is not only contradictory but disproves the first.

 

Your third point is countered by the second one as well. Why do you think the debris is carefully sorted and analyzed in air crashes and fires?

 

 

 

 

 

How do they know ? well perhaps because, they saw several videos that showed a couple of big office towers collapse at a very specific set of stories and as these collapsed, it cause a massive impact force followed by crushing force on the next floor, causing it to collapse, causing impact force on the next and so on. If you don't understand how the weight of the top of the building caused the floors below to collapse when they normally hold them up, you can experiment with impact force yourself, grab a hammer and a nail, try to push the nail in with the hammer, then you let the hammer fall on the nail. And there you have impact force and why the buildings pancaked. and why they know those specific floors are what they needed to investigate. you don't even need to be a scientists or have good understanding of physics to get it. 

 

And why do I(we) think that? well because it's stated in that very report you keep referring to, you know the one where you ignore everything that doesn't fit your idealized conspiracy theory based idea. 

Edited by HawkMan
  • Like 3
Link to post
Share on other sites

+Gary7

The guy in the OP's Video said it all. Get over it, it has been 15 years . I saw a plane go into the building.

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

monkeylove
On 3/25/2016 at 11:06 AM, jjkusaf said:

psst....ignore trollove and he might go away. :)

 

That will only happen if anyone can disprove my arguments, and that has not taken place.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

monkeylove
On 3/25/2016 at 11:14 AM, trag3dy said:

It's almost like we're both typing words in english yet only one of us actually understands what they mean.

 

And for the record I have in fact not made any claims or arguments at all other than you're a broken record. Worse you're a broken record of Milli Vanilli. 

 

Anyways, don't bother replying to me again. I'm done with this thread and as jjkusaf pointed out, this is a waste of time.

No, I understand what you are saying. The reason why I sound like a "broken record" is that you've failed to counter my arguments each time. You're still failing right now, which for me is the only reason why you are leaving.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

monkeylove
On 3/25/2016 at 6:21 PM, HawkMan said:

It doesn't come from the FEMA report, it comes from your twisted interpretation of it. whether that twiestedness is willful or due to ignorance, I don't know. but it sure has little relevance to what the report actually says, especially since you're ignoring the other half of the report that explains everything and says you're wrong and explains why. and that has been pointed out numerous times in this thread with further explanations, references to page numbers and explanations.  

 

That leads me to believe it has to be willful, and thus conspiracy, especially since you're playing their mantras on repeat. 

No, the points I raised come from the FEMA report, and the irony is that they come from the same half of the report that you claim to have read.

 

D.2 shows that only around 131 engineers were sent to search for evidence for 57 days. See also D3. Why didn't they move the evidence to enclosed yards and warehouses for sorting, further examination, and analysis, especially given the fact that the investigation of the matter spanned several years? Why not bring in more experts, especially from different organizations that were also investigating the crime scene?

 

D.3.1. refers to identifying pieces but they were NOT sorted.

 

D.4. states that only 156 pieces were selected, with an additional seven, and from that small number, even several were not considered relevant, and some were accidentally left at the yards.

 

D.5 shows that only 41 pieces were sent to NIST.

 

In addition, fire experts acknowledge that over 80 percent of the debris was not examined, and police reported that some were even stolen (see my previous posts).

 

In short, 80 percent of the total debris were not examined. Of what was examined, 156 pieces were selected from unsorted debris and documented (see spreadsheet). Out of that, only 41 were analyzed. Everything else was sold for scrap after only a few weeks.

 

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

monkeylove
On 3/25/2016 at 6:25 PM, HawkMan said:

How do they know ? well perhaps because, they saw several videos that showed a couple of big office towers collapse at a very specific set of stories and as these collapsed, it cause a massive impact force followed by crushing force on the next floor, causing it to collapse, causing impact force on the next and so on. If you don't understand how the weight of the top of the building caused the floors below to collapse when they normally hold them up, you can experiment with impact force yourself, grab a hammer and a nail, try to push the nail in with the hammer, then you let the hammer fall on the nail. And there you have impact force and why the buildings pancaked. and why they know those specific floors are what they needed to investigate. you don't even need to be a scientists or have good understanding of physics to get it. 

 

And why do I(we) think that? well because it's stated in that very report you keep referring to, you know the one where you ignore everything that doesn't fit your idealized conspiracy theory based idea. 

Prove your argument by referring to the report that states clearly that there was no need for FEMA to collect no more than 41 pieces for analysis because "several videos" could allow them to accomplish that. While you are at it, see if you can explain why the NIST FAQ gives another number of pieces analyzed.

 

BTW, a "good understanding of physics" involves more than just videos. That's why a lot of physical evidence is collected, documented, and examined, with some analyzed and none destroyed throughout the investigation for crime scenes, airplane crashes, and building fires and collapse. In this case, we have all four involved!

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Jim K
On 3/27/2016 at 5:31 PM, Gary7 said:

The guy in the OP's Video said it all. Get over it, it has been 15 years . I saw a plane go into the building.

Right.  Not only that but the reports...investigation...etc.  Someone just wants to continue going round in circles...haha.  Anyway...thought this would be appropriate for this particular thread..."Will it go round in circles?"  Catchy tune. :)

 

 

 

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

HawkMan
1 hour ago, monkeylove said:

Prove your argument by referring to the report that states clearly that there was no need for FEMA to collect no more than 41 pieces for analysis because "several videos" could allow them to accomplish that. While you are at it, see if you can explain why the NIST FAQ gives another number of pieces analyzed.

 

BTW, a "good understanding of physics" involves more than just videos. That's why a lot of physical evidence is collected, documented, and examined, with some analyzed and none destroyed throughout the investigation for crime scenes, airplane crashes, and building fires and collapse. In this case, we have all four involved!

 

sigh...

 :rolleyes:

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

T3X4S

The illuminati did it....  

The Reptilians, shape-shifters, Free Masons - they all got together at the annual NWO meeting with George W Bush and decided to kill 3000 americans so they could go to war.

The Reptilians also helped us fake the Apollo missions, are the ones who actually made all the cheese that created the moon, started religion, and built the pyramids with other ancient aliens.

MonkeyLove - I believe you, man.  Its all a conspiracy !  They are behind everything !  THEY KILLED TUPAC !!


:rolleyes:

 

 

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

monkeylove
On 3/29/2016 at 1:03 PM, HawkMan said:

sigh...

 :rolleyes:

I'm not surprised.

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

monkeylove
On 3/29/2016 at 1:14 PM, T3X4S said:

The illuminati did it....  

The Reptilians, shape-shifters, Free Masons - they all got together at the annual NWO meeting with George W Bush and decided to kill 3000 americans so they could go to war.

The Reptilians also helped us fake the Apollo missions, are the ones who actually made all the cheese that created the moon, started religion, and built the pyramids with other ancient aliens.

MonkeyLove - I believe you, man.  Its all a conspiracy !  They are behind everything !  THEY KILLED TUPAC !!


:rolleyes:

 

 

Reminds me of

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slippery_slope

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

HawkMan
18 hours ago, monkeylove said:

I'm not surprised.

 

 

Don't worry neither are we. the point is that you merely repeated what you already repeated 30 times in this thread, and that has already been answered and coutnered, startign with the very report you refer to, which you apparently can't read, or you can only read one third of it, so you don't see that it answers every one of your arguments. 

 

further argument with someone who refuses to even acknowledge he was wrong, or read and understand counter arguments that explains everything and disproves all your claims are rather unnecessary don't you think.

 

Come back after you ACTUALLY read and understand the report you're citing, then if that doesn't clear it up, read all the replies in this thread that actually explains to you how to report explains how you're wrong. 

 

it's been explained to you so many times, and your goto reply is "naha, you're wrong, they only analysed 40 pieces"  with the rest of us doing a collective banging head on desk move. because you obviously neither read the report or the reply you're answering to, and are not coming up with any ACTUAL arguments, just statements. Without arguments, you have no stance, no ground to stand on, nothing. 

  • Like 3
Link to post
Share on other sites

Astra.Xtreme
On 3/29/2016 at 9:59 PM, monkeylove said:

That will only happen if anyone can disprove my arguments, and that has not taken place.

 

Actually you've been disproven over and over and over.  Your blinders just won't let you get past your ignorance...

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

monkeylove
On 3/31/2016 at 3:30 AM, HawkMan said:

Don't worry neither are we. the point is that you merely repeated what you already repeated 30 times in this thread, and that has already been answered and coutnered, startign with the very report you refer to, which you apparently can't read, or you can only read one third of it, so you don't see that it answers every one of your arguments. 

 

further argument with someone who refuses to even acknowledge he was wrong, or read and understand counter arguments that explains everything and disproves all your claims are rather unnecessary don't you think.

 

Come back after you ACTUALLY read and understand the report you're citing, then if that doesn't clear it up, read all the replies in this thread that actually explains to you how to report explains how you're wrong. 

 

it's been explained to you so many times, and your goto reply is "naha, you're wrong, they only analysed 40 pieces"  with the rest of us doing a collective banging head on desk move. because you obviously neither read the report or the reply you're answering to, and are not coming up with any ACTUAL arguments, just statements. Without arguments, you have no stance, no ground to stand on, nothing. 

That's because you keep making the same mistakes each time. Not only did I present and read the report, I even had to explain it to you. Your response? "Sigh." As I said, I am not surprised.

 

To recap, they did not analyze 40 pieces. They went through unsorted pieces (which means they did not analyze them at all) and collected more than 150 pieces, documented them, and then sent around 40 to NIST for analysis. The rest were "accidentally" left at the yards or discarded. Read the report and see for yourself!

 

In order to show that more than 150 pieces were at least documented, we need to look at the spreadsheet that contains such. Can you present it?

 

Or perhaps you can refer to NIST, which according to the FAQ presented earlier analyzed 236 pieces (does that include the 40 sent by FEMA?) because NIST decided to go back to the yards and collect more pieces. (Does this mean that even the 40 pieces collected by FEMA were not sufficient?)

 

Thus, we're looking at a total of 236 pieces out of 350,000 tons of debris from several buildings and planes, with over 80 percent not analyzed at all (or at least not even documented or stored for further investigation but sold for scrap for no valid reason). The number of pieces is even small than the number of interviews and videos studied! Care to explain why more effort was made in studying videos than in analyzing physical evidence?

 

You know, that's it: I asked the same questions before and you ignored them. You kept insisting that I read the report wrongly but it turns out it's the other way round. I am clearly wasting my time responding to your posts. Now adding you to my ignore list.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

monkeylove
On 3/31/2016 at 3:42 AM, Astra.Xtreme said:

Actually you've been disproven over and over and over.  Your blinders just won't let you get past your ignorance...

Completely wrong! No evidence showing that FEMA analyzed more than 40 pieces (they sent that number to NIST), no proof showing that that was enough as NIST had to gather more pieces (it reached 236), nothing to show that most of the debris was documented (only around 150 pieces were according to the spreadsheet in the same report), and nothing to prove that most of the debris was not destroyed (the SAME report acknowledges such).

 

So much for me wearing blinders. You've proven nothing to counter my argument or to prove even yours.

 

Another one for my ignore list.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

HawkMan
24 minutes ago, monkeylove said:

That's because you keep making the same mistakes each time. Not only did I present and read the report, I even had to explain it to you. Your response? "Sigh." As I said, I am not surprised.

 

No, you didn't, everyone else has been explaining the report to you. but you ignore them. you haven't explained anything, you only point to parts of the report, without reading the next parts, or the previous parts, and say "hah, this proves what I say" when everything around it makes it mean the exact opposite. And this has been repeatedly explained to you. So no, you haven't explained or proven a thing, except ignorance and that you don't have nearly enough techncial competence to read a technical disaster report. or even a laymans disaster report.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

HawkMan
23 minutes ago, monkeylove said:

Completely wrong! No evidence showing that FEMA analyzed more than 40 pieces (they sent that number to NIST), no proof showing that that was enough as NIST had to gather more pieces (it reached 236), nothing to show that most of the debris was documented (only around 150 pieces were according to the spreadsheet in the same report), and nothing to prove that most of the debris was not destroyed (the SAME report acknowledges such).

 

So much for me wearing blinders. You've proven nothing to counter my argument or to prove even yours.

 

Another one for my ignore list.

 

 

That evidence is IN the report and has been linked to, quoted, referenced and explained to you about 50 times in this thread at least now. 

 

oh and look you're back to saying peopel are wrong, without any actual evidence except talkign about a report you didn't read and don't understand because you only cherry pick small pieces of it that doesn't mean anything on their own. 

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

T3X4S

OK - monkeylove - you are right, you have been right all along - its a huge conspiracy that goes all the way to the white house.

Time to stop posting in here.

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...
monkeylove
On 4/2/2016 at 3:07 PM, T3X4S said:

OK - monkeylove - you are right, you have been right all along - its a huge conspiracy that goes all the way to the white house.

Time to stop posting in here.

I never made that argument. Read my posts and see for yourself.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hum

WTC buildings 1 & 2 were disintegrated by a USA energy weapon from a satellite in space.

 

One, to test the weapon, and 2, to get rid of unwanted properties.

 

Common sense should tell you that there would have been a LOT more debris if a fire or controlled demo brought the buildings down.

 

Watch the videos and you can see the buildings turning to mostly dust as they fell.

 

The general public is so easy to fool, sadly.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Ian W
Just now, Hum said:

WTC buildings 1 & 2 were disintegrated by a USA energy weapon from a satellite in space.

 

One, to test the weapon, and 2, to get rid of unwanted properties.

 

Common sense should tell you that there would have been a LOT more debris if a fire or controlled demo brought the buildings down.

 

Watch the videos and you can see the buildings turning to mostly dust as they fell.

 

The general public is so easy to fool, sadly.

Judy Wood, is that you?

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

Jim K
16 minutes ago, Ian W said:

Judy Wood, is that you?

Well...Hum's theory is somewhat more believable than thermite, controlled demolition ... etc.  haha  (kidding of course on all accounts)

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

Draconian Guppy

tinfoil hat: who's to say documents available publicly aren't tampered with or full real information withheld. I mean, yeah we know the gov't is always 100 transparent :rolleyes: 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Ian W
3 minutes ago, jjkusaf said:

Well...more believable than thermite, controlled demolition ... etc.  haha

Perhaps Wood is correct and those who believe in (or promote the other theories) are part of the conspiracy?

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Jim K
1 minute ago, Ian W said:

Perhaps Wood is correct and those who believe in (or promote the other theories) are part of the conspiracy?

Could be...or maybe we are all part of the conspiracy.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

This topic is now closed to further replies.
 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Similar Content

    • By Usman Khan Lodhi
      Twitter cracks down on QAnon conspiracy group, bans 7,000 accounts
      by Usman Khan Lodhi



      Twitter announced that it would permanently ban accounts that violate the platform's policies while tweeting about QAnon, the conspiracy theory movement that asserts "deep state" actors are plotting against Donald Trump. In the last several weeks, about 7,000 accounts, which violated the firm's rules against spam, platform manipulation, and ban evasion, have been banned. In a suspension later rolled out this week, the circulation of roughly 150,000 additional accounts will be limited, as they'll stop appearing in recommendations, trends, and search.

      Per online conspiracies, the term "deep state" refers to a combination of elites from intelligence, political, business, and entertainment sectors, and QAnon's theories assert that the "deep state" is a secret war with Trump.

      Twitter stated that QAnon-related links will be blocked from being shared on the platform, and accounts associated with the conspiracy movement will no longer be promoted in search, conversations, or trending topics. The firm didn't elaborate on which forums or sites might be impacted.

      Last year, QAnon was designated as a potential domestic extremist threat by the FBI when it issued a warning about "conspiracy theory-driven domestic extremists."

      Source: Reuters

    • By Jonathan Nolan
      YouTube takes on conspiracy videos, offering fact-check links while watching
      by Jonathan Nolan

      YouTube announced this week that it is partnering with information site Wikipedia to offer users "additional information" when viewing videos that might be considered controversial or related to a conspiracy theory.

      The measure was revealed by the company's CEO Susan Wojcicki at the South by Southwest Festival in Austin, Texas. The festival is a major event for 'creating and discovering' for professionals in the video, music, and interactive industries. The plan is that in the near future, should you be watching a video that falls into such a category, a text box called an "information cue" will pop up below the video suggesting you to look further into the matter rather than taking what is said in the video as the full story.

      With respect to the viewing experience, Wojcicki said:

      Conspiracy theories have become an issue for the Google-owned company who previously made changes to search engine results to promote more "authoritative results". It's unclear how many videos may be labeled as such or exactly which ones, with an example mentioned during the presentation concerning the 1969 Moon landing. As it stands, the effectiveness of this change remains to be seen.

      Source: CNBC

    • By Hum
      If there is anything worse than losing a child, it is losing a child and having people taunt you over the loss.
       
      That is what happened to the family of Noah Pozner, a 6-year-old with tousled brown hair and lollipop-red lips, the youngest of the 26 children and staff members gunned down in 2012 at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Conn.
       
      In the years since the massacre that shook the country and opened new anxiety over gun violence, the family has received hate-filled calls and violent emails from people who say they know the shooting was a hoax. Photos of their son — some with pornographic and anti-Semitic content — have been distributed on websites.
       
      These outlandish theories, which hold that the Newtown school shooting was a staged mass murder engineered by gun control advocates, have lived until now in the dark corners of the Internet.
       
      But they have gained fresh momentum in the last several months, residents here say, at a time when conspiracy theorists across the country have attained the status of celebrities, and the nation as a whole is engaged in a contentious debate over the nature of truth.
       
      President Trump and his national security advisor, Michael T. Flynn, have been open enthusiasts of Alex Jones’ Infowars, a Web-based radio and video network that has relentlessly pushed the theory that Sandy Hook was staged by Democrats to advance a gun control agenda. 
       
      An unabashed Trump supporter during the campaign, Jones says he received a personal call of thanks from the president-elect days after the election.
       
      Although Trump has not spoken publicly about Sandy Hook, many residents here say he is nurturing the culture of exaggeration and paranoia on which conspiracy theorists thrive.
       
      Mark Fenster, a law professor at the University of Florida and author of a book about conspiracy theories in American politics, said the Sandy Hook hoax theory was a response to a Democratic-controlled White House of a kind that often shows up in political extremist circles.
       
      An unemployed waitress was arrested in December in Florida on charges of making death threats against Pozner, with repeated phone calls to his home in which she muttered ethnic and racial slurs and profanities. Another man is in Rikers Island prison in New York fighting transfer to Connecticut for a deluge of harassing phone calls to the home and office of the medical examiner who signed the coroner reports for Sandy Hook victims.
       
      Another man was convicted of stealing memorial signs erected in playgrounds to commemorate the dead children. He later called the children’s parents and said they shouldn’t mind because their children never existed.
       
      Most of the families associated with Sandy Hook have removed or protected their social media accounts and unlisted their telephone numbers; some have changed homes.
       
      Newtown residents are distrustful of outsiders. On the fourth anniversary of the massacre in December, there was a low-key prayer vigil in a Catholic Church. An unmarked police car was stationed outside the elementary school to keep an eye out for hoaxers who show up frequently, photographing children and confronting families.
       
      The “Sandy Hook truthers,’’ as they called themselves, tormented not only the grieving families, but teachers, police, photographers, first responders, neighbors, government officials and witnesses — they all were said to be part of the ever-expanding conspiracy to fake the massacre.
       
      The conspiracy theorists have shown unflagging energy. The most persistent, Wolfgang Halbig, a 70-year-old Florida man who describes himself as a retired school safety expert, said he had made 22 trips to Connecticut, wiped out his pension and spent more than $100,000, which he raised online.
       
      His theory is that between 500 to 700 people were involved in the “conspiracy” — including the schoolchildren, parents, teachers and police, all the way up to President Obama.

      full article
    • By Sszecret
      Here's a quote from one of the attendants of the Davos panel (can't be bothered to look up her name): "if  you look nationally, internationally at whether or not there are any human rights, if there's any constitutional protections for something like freedom of thought, or mental privacy or cognitive liberty, nothing like that exists yet."
       
      I am quite interested in neuroscience and this as a scientific advancement is worthy of thought. That said, I can't help but see the potential for massive amounts of nefarious use. Thoughts?