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This fit 21-year-old ignored the flu. Then it killed him, mom says

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+Jimmy1    10,402
4 hours ago, oldtimefighter said:

What? That is wrong! Are you a medical professional? No? Don't tell people a flu shot is not really necessary. The flu shot is to prevent getting the flu which is enough. Thanks but when I have a crime issue I will ask you for advice.

this years flu shots here where i live where completely ineffective.  i got that info from a medical professional, who had the shot and then herself got very sick.  

 

when she asked around, she found out that the shot had an older strain, and not currently active one, so instead of preventing flu it make it worse (as your immune system gears up for strain in the shot)    

she is a doctor in Canada with 30 years experience and she said she will not be getting a shot again, unless she can be certain that the strain is the one currently going around.

 

As hawkman said, unless you are in a risk group, getting the shot is not needed.

 

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DocM    16,589

 

 

flu.png?w=748&h=403&crop=1

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oldtimefighter    3,070
3 hours ago, HawkMan said:

Well, firstly there's the thing that healthy normal (non risk group) people don't die from the flu, they get sick for a few days, and get better. drink fluids.

 

outside of that. before you go attacking people, maybe look up facts about recent research. you don't have to "fight" everyone that informs you about something you didn't know. 

 

http://www.bbc.com/news/health-3898898

Now it's Vitamin D? LOL I agree that getting proper nutrition can reduce disease and sickness. I will also point out we already fortify certain foods like mike, cereal, and other things with Vitamin D but the flu is still prevalent here in the US. What did your reply have to do with my comment? No reason not to get the flu shot. When you secure your box do you just run an AV and firewall then call it day? No, you deploy a multi-layer defense right? The same with preventing disease and sickness.

Edited by oldtimefighter
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+warwagon    13,188
6 hours ago, oldtimefighter said:

What? That is wrong! Are you a medical professional? No? Don't tell people a flu shot is not really necessary. The flu shot is to prevent getting the flu which is enough. Thanks but when I have a crime issue I will ask you for advice.

 

14 minutes ago, oldtimefighter said:

Now it's Vitamin D? LOL I agree that getting proper nutrition can reduce disease and sickness. I will also point out we already fortify certain foods like mike, cereal, and other things with Vitamin D but the flu is still prevalent here in the US. What did your reply have to do with my comment? No reason not to get the flu shot. When you secure your box do you just run an AV and firewall then call it day? No, you deploy a multi-layer defense right? The same with preventing disease and sickness.

 

I can't speak for a flu shot because i've never had one in my life, but I do believe vitamin D is very important. Most people are vitamin D deficient. I also take Vitamin D supplements along with C, Multi, Fish Oil, Garlic, and Calcium. I must be doing something right, I'm almost never sick. The last time I remember being really sick (double ended flu) was 2007.

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Circaflex    3,565

The flu bug going around here, Southern California, has been pretty severe. I had the common cold near Christmas, luckily I missed this years flu so far. I think the last time I did have the flu, was in high school. These days, I feel my immune system is fairly strong, I do work in a Children's Hospital where bugs/germs are everywhere and I now am required to get the yearly flu-shot.

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Joe User    491
1 hour ago, Jimmy #1 said:

when she asked around, she found out that the shot had an older strain, and not currently active one, so instead of preventing flu it make it worse (as your immune system gears up for strain in the shot)    

That's not how vaccines work.

 

1 hour ago, Jimmy #1 said:

As hawkman said, unless you are in a risk group, getting the shot is not needed.

Sorry, that's just wrong. 100% completely and totally wrong.

 

Unless you're in a higher risk group the chance of you contracting a fatal case is lower. That's it. 

 

 

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sidroc    1,201
2 hours ago, Jimmy #1 said:

this years flu shots here where i live where completely ineffective.  i got that info from a medical professional, who had the shot and then herself got very sick.  

 

when she asked around, she found out that the shot had an older strain, and not currently active one, so instead of preventing flu it make it worse (as your immune system gears up for strain in the shot)    

she is a doctor in Canada with 30 years experience and she said she will not be getting a shot again, unless she can be certain that the strain is the one currently going around.

 

As hawkman said, unless you are in a risk group, getting the shot is not needed.

 

The flu shot is not effective against all strains of flu because the viruses being spread commonly change from year to year and they cant give you a vaccination against every kind every year so they pick the most common and or more virulent strains to vaccinate against, Its always effective if they get the strain you get right and not effective or less effective otherwise. However, saying your better off not getting the flu shot is like making an argument that since airbags sometimes cut people wide open in accidents that we should remove them from vehicles. Fact: the flu shot does not kill and at worst a small number of people get a mild sickness from the body reacting to the killed virus. 2, The flu shot saves thousands of lives by both herd immunity and direct protection especially in the geriatric and vulnerable populations. The misinformation being spread needs to be countered at every turn as in the immediate, is more dangerous than any anti global warming conspiracy theories. Your appeal to authority by mentioning your Doctor friend means nothing to me at all. Dr Oz promotes BS all the time and hes a cardiologist. Your understanding of the immune system is completely flawed and your advice of not getting the flu shot flies in the face of herd immunity. You are a danger to the public for spreading information like that. The vaccine causes the production of antibodies and this is not "strain" it is strengthening and is a necessary part of immunity/herd immunity. Use Google Scholar and educated yourself on medicine and evidenced based practice before making ridiculous claims. I will cite anything I say on request to a respectable journal, You wont be able to do that. It is also important to point out that since the flu is effective against the strains it was designed against for that year, that you don't see all the infections from that particular flu strain. That alone prevents tens of thousands of flu cases and thousands of deaths because those ones they vaccinated against would otherwise be infecting people.

Edited by sidroc
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alpha2beta    397
11 minutes ago, sidroc said:

The flu shot is not effective against all strains of flu because the viruses being spread commonly change from year to year and they cant give you a vaccination against every kind every year so they pick the most common and or more virulent strains to vaccinate against, Its always effective if they get the strain you get right and not effective or less effective otherwise. However, saying your better off not getting the flu shot is like making an argument that since airbags sometimes cut people wide open in accidents that we should remove them from vehicles. Fact: the flu shot does not kill anyone and at worst a small number of people get a mild sickness from the body reacting to the killed virus. 2, The flu shot saves thousands of lives by both herd immunity and direct protection especially in the geriatric and vulnerable populations. The misinformation being spread needs to be countered at every turn as in the immediate, is more dangerous than any anti global warming conspiracy theories.

Sorry I would never willingly inject Formaldehyde directly into my bloodstream. Even the EPA says its a carcinogen which causes Lymphoma, leukemia which is the most common types of cancer found in children and children receive the most vaccines.

https://www.cancer.org/cancer/cancer-in-children/types-of-childhood-cancers.html

https://www.epa.gov/sites/production/files/2016-09/documents/formaldehyde.pdf

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Joe User    491
15 minutes ago, alpha2beta said:

More propaganda to push flu vaccines that don't work. They even admit they have only a 10% success rate.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/this-years-flu-vaccine-may-only-be-10-effective-experts-warn/ 

"Even 10 percent effective is better than nothing, and a lot of it has to do with herd immunity -- the more people are protected from it, the more other people will also be protected," she said. "In fact, in a year where it's low effectiveness, it's even more important that everybody get it so we can get as much resistance and we don't allow the virus to thrive and grow and keep changing."

 

If you're going to link to an article, you should use one that doesn't disprove your argument.

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sidroc    1,201
5 minutes ago, alpha2beta said:

Sorry I would never willingly inject Formaldehyde directly into my bloodstream. Even the EPA says its a carcinogen which causes Lymphoma, leukemia which is the most common types of cancer found in children.

https://www.cancer.org/cancer/cancer-in-children/types-of-childhood-cancers.html

https://www.epa.gov/sites/production/files/2016-09/documents/formaldehyde.pdf

If I get a warning for saying this so be it. You are a dangerous idiot. The science of dosing eludes you clearly. I will cite the FDA for this one https://www.fda.gov/BiologicsBloodVaccines/SafetyAvailability/VaccineSafety/ucm187810.htm.  The next time I have someone going Septic in my ED with the flu, I will wonder if someone like you could be responsible.

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alpha2beta    397
Just now, sidroc said:

If I get a warning for saying this so be it. You are an idiot. The science of dosing eludes you clearly. I will cite the FDA for this one https://www.fda.gov/BiologicsBloodVaccines/SafetyAvailability/VaccineSafety/ucm187810.htm.

Massive increase in childhood cancer over the last 20 years more vaccines then ever in the 20 years apparently have no connection.

And if they are so safe then why do we need a vaccine court?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaccine_court When the company that manufactures the vaccine is above the law.  

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mrau95    213

If kills ya, it kills ya

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Joe User    491
6 minutes ago, alpha2beta said:

Sorry I would never willingly inject Formaldehyde directly into my bloodstream. Even the EPA says its a carcinogen which causes Lymphoma, leukemia which is the most common types of cancer found in children.

https://www.cancer.org/cancer/cancer-in-children/types-of-childhood-cancers.html

https://www.epa.gov/sites/production/files/2016-09/documents/formaldehyde.pdf

The first document doesn't even contain the word formaldehyde and the second is about inhaling formaldehyde.

 

There are perfectly safe levels of things that you can ingest or inject but should never inhale. For example, water.

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alpha2beta    397
10 minutes ago, sidroc said:

If I get a warning for saying this so be it. You are a dangerous idiot. The science of dosing eludes you clearly. I will cite the FDA for this one https://www.fda.gov/BiologicsBloodVaccines/SafetyAvailability/VaccineSafety/ucm187810.htm.  The next time I have someone going Septic in my ED with the flu, I will wonder if someone like you could be responsible.

I use real nutrition to keep myself healthy, I work in public around lots of sick people and have not been sick in over 10 years. Not even a cold let alone the flu.

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Joe User    491
9 minutes ago, alpha2beta said:

And if they are so safe then why do we need a vaccine court?

The National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program (VICP) was established by the 1986 National Childhood Vaccine Injury Act (NCVIA), passed by the United States Congress in response to a threat to the vaccine supply due to a 1980s scare over the DPT vaccine. Despite the belief of most public health officials that claims of side effects were unfounded, large jury awards had been given to some plaintiffs, most DPT vaccine makers had ceased production, and officials feared the loss of herd immunity.

 

It's a specialized court. Like family court, traffic court, etc... 

 

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alpha2beta    397
10 minutes ago, Joe User said:

The first document doesn't even contain the word formaldehyde and the second is about inhaling formaldehyde.

 

There are perfectly safe levels of things that you can ingest or inject but should never inhale. For example, water.

https://www.cancer.gov/about-cancer/causes-prevention/risk/substances/formaldehyde/formaldehyde-fact-sheet

"NCI, looked at 25,619 workers in industries with the potential for occupational formaldehyde exposure and estimated each worker’s exposure to the chemical while at work (5). The results showed an increased risk of death due to leukemia, particularly myeloid leukemia, among workers exposed to formaldehyde."

 

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wakjak    18,766

Don't be anti-vax, don't be anti-smart.

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Joe User    491
4 minutes ago, alpha2beta said:

https://www.cancer.gov/about-cancer/causes-prevention/risk/substances/formaldehyde/formaldehyde-fact-sheet

"NCI, looked at 25,619 workers in industries with the potential for occupational formaldehyde exposure and estimated each worker’s exposure to the chemical while at work (5). The results showed an increased risk of death due to leukemia, particularly myeloid leukemia, among workers exposed to formaldehyde."

 

I'll repeat myself, since the link talks about inhalation and absorption.

 

There are perfectly safe levels of things that you can ingest or inject but should never inhale. For example, water. 

 

Second, there are safe levels of things you can put on your skin without adverse effects. For example, alcohol.

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Jim K    13,664
39 minutes ago, alpha2beta said:

Sorry I would never willingly inject Formaldehyde directly into my bloodstream. Even the EPA says its a carcinogen which causes Lymphoma, leukemia which is the most common types of cancer found in children and children receive the most vaccines.

https://www.cancer.org/cancer/cancer-in-children/types-of-childhood-cancers.html

https://www.epa.gov/sites/production/files/2016-09/documents/formaldehyde.pdf

 

23 minutes ago, alpha2beta said:

I use real nutrition to keep myself healthy, I work in public around lots of sick people and have not been sick in over 10 years. Not even a cold let alone the flu.

 

15 minutes ago, alpha2beta said:

Oh boy ... 

 

Anyway, with respect to your postings of Formaldehyde.  A flu vaccine has between 5 and 25ug of Formaldehyde.  1 apple, for comparison, has 6.3-22.3 mg/kg of naturally occurring Formaldehyde. 

 

Oh, but you eat apples and therefore aren't getting Formaldehyde injected directly in your bloodstream (which doesn't happen with flu shots anyway)...right?  Well, that apple gets digested and guess where some of that Formaldehyde ends up (hint:  bloodstream).  Also, that is just an apple ... there is naturally occurring Formaldehyde in just about everything you eat (especially fruits and vegetables). 

 

....stay away from pears (upwards of 60mg/kg)  :) 

Source

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Circaflex    3,565
39 minutes ago, alpha2beta said:

Sorry I would never willingly inject Formaldehyde directly into my bloodstream. Even the EPA says its a carcinogen which causes Lymphoma, leukemia which is the most common types of cancer found in children and children receive the most vaccines.

https://www.cancer.org/cancer/cancer-in-children/types-of-childhood-cancers.html

https://www.epa.gov/sites/production/files/2016-09/documents/formaldehyde.pdf

Take your Facebook nonsense out of here. You're the problem with society today. Quit spreading this bullcrap.

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alpha2beta    397
8 minutes ago, Jim K said:

 

 

Oh boy ... 

 

Anyway, with respect to your postings of Formaldehyde.  A flu vaccine has between 5 and 25ug of Formaldehyde.  1 apple, for comparison, has 6.3-22.3 mg/kg of naturally occurring Formaldehyde. 

 

Oh, but you eat apples and therefore aren't getting Formaldehyde injected directly in your bloodstream...right?  Well, that apple gets digested and guess where some of that Formaldehyde ends up (hint:  bloodstream).  Also, that is just an apple ... there is naturally occurring Formaldehyde in just about everything you eat (especially fruits and vegetables). 

 

....stay away from Pears (upwards of 60mg/kg)  :) 

Source

Naturally occurring and synthetic are molecularity not the same. Plus no one has any reason for why caner is at such a high more then ever, no reason it just happens deal with it. That's most anti science thing someone could say.

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firey    3,964

Had the flu about a year ago. Bed ridden for 4 days and cough and runny nose for a month afterwards. Took no medication aside from 2 advil to relieve the headache after 4 days of it pounding. I let my body do what it was designed to do and I came out the other end perfectly okay. I am by no means fit nor do I live a super healthy active lifestyle. It was complete hell (fever, cough with bloody flem (google said could have been pneumonia like symptoms due to the flu), full body aches, pounding headache. I trusted my body to heal itself and it did.

 

Regardless of what people say on here, I don't feel the flu shot is effective at all. They make educated guesses and hope for the best. I've seen more people get sick due to a reaction with the flu shot than people it has protected 100%. I am sure most of the success of the flu shot isn't even caused by the shot.

 

I have never taken it, and in the past 15 years I've had the flu once. That's just my own experience and two cents.

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alpha2beta    397
3 minutes ago, Circaflex said:

Take your Facebook nonsense out of here. You're the problem with society today. Quit spreading this bullcrap.

Facebook? Really? Don't use Facebook wouldn't know what you are talking about.

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alpha2beta    397
1 hour ago, Circaflex said:

The flu bug going around here, Southern California, has been pretty severe. I had the common cold near Christmas, luckily I missed this years flu so far. I think the last time I did have the flu, was in high school. These days, I feel my immune system is fairly strong, I do work in a Children's Hospital where bugs/germs are everywhere and I now am required to get the yearly flu-shot.

So since you work at a Children's Hospital you never thought about why so many children get Cancer and the causes for it. Or are one of those people that blame it on genetics even tho family history shows no one had it prior.

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