official World of Warcraft

[Dark Ride]

Played around with my existing UI...

AFK:

Fishin':

Pwning:

[the evn show]

Based on completion rates: Sinestra 10m was the hardest encounter of Tier 11 on any difficulty (of all the guilds capable of pulling her, fewer succeeded than on any other including 25m heroic al'akir). At current gear levels it's harder than 6/7 heroic 10m T12 and 7/7 normal T12 25 (i haven't done heroic T12 25, but I'm guessing it's harder than that too - because T12 is a joke compared to T11).

We went back last night bringing our small collection of heroic T12 gear (ilevel 380-385) to bare on her because we need Shards of Woe and her tanking ring: they're best in slot even if you have access to every piece of loot in Firelands.

It's such a joke now it's kinda sad, our first kill back in may (2 healers, 6 DPS, 2 tanks) I topped the damage meter going "all out" at 32k DPS: pretty respectable for the time, it was a top-100 shadow priest parse, but probably only because there were so few kills of her. Last night I was half-assing it and pulled 45k DPS. Realistically I could probably squeeze out an extra 5-7k if we went back to 2-healing it, actually used potions and shadow word death, tunneled AOE a little harder, and got luckier with orbs. A 50% DPS increase is pretty substantial on that encounter.

If you're wearing a full set of T12 normal mode gear then you can bring 3 healers and still laugh at the Phase 3 soft enrage. Everyone has enough HP to take an extra tick of wrack during flame breath so your healers can suck a little more, and if you wanted to, you could just use your BH trinket to trivialize that part. I know "old content in new gear" is supposed to be easy, but if you're in a guild grinding through Firelands, you might want to consider killing heroic chogall and saving the lockout on an alt so you can kill her each week.

Shard of Woe is a huge DPS boost for your arcane mages, but giving it to healers means cutting one back for heroic rag is less punishing: they'll have the extra mana they need to heal through the seed damage (assuming you're not using Paragons "just aoe it all down" strategy) and you'll gain a DPS for phase 2.5-3 where you really need it. Seed phase is still really rough for us but we're getting closer to the P2-3 transition. We're spending 1 day a week on it right now and probably won't "really try" for another couple of weeks. We know there's a hard DPS check coming and that we probably don't have enough gear to do it yet so there's no point in grinding out 500 attempts right now.

[Ionium]

I had to quit today because I don't enjoy getting stunlocked and feared again and again.

[dead.cell]

I had to quit today because I don't enjoy getting stunlocked and feared again and again.

lol there are better reasons to quit imo. But yeah, the game has grown quite stale. This thread alone seems to be updated much much less often than it used to. :(

Not that I play anymore either, but it's still saddening.

[CUBBYJR2005]

I quit wow too it to dang grinding and its always the same stuff even if it different bosses or recycle bosses or recycle instances.The only thing that is new is mostly new gear just different stats and looks.

[Tharp Daddy]

I'm not surprised WoW is beginning to show signs of slowing down. The game has been out 6 years, and it's running on an old modified version of the WC3 engine. I would not say it's really Blizzard's fault, as they are in quite a pickle. If they change the game too much, in order to get a "shot in the arm", they could lose a lot of subscribers as a big change would be a big gamble. Thus they are forced to mostly stick to the game and formula they've used for the past 6 years which does not leave much room in the way of innovation or the such; Not to mention they are limited by their engine all the while. Thankfully, I believe we will be hearing some about Blizzard's new MMO here in the future, but I wonder if it will be like WoW, or will we see a radical new direction?

[Lucas]

I'm not surprised WoW is beginning to show signs of slowing down. The game has been out 6 years, and it's running on an old modified version of the WC3 engine. I would not say it's really Blizzard's fault, as they are in quite a pickle. If they change the game too much, in order to get a "shot in the arm", they could lose a lot of subscribers as a big change would be a big gamble. Thus they are forced to mostly stick to the game and formula they've used for the past 6 years which does not leave much room in the way of innovation or the such; Not to mention they are limited by their engine all the while. Thankfully, I believe we will be hearing some about Blizzard's new MMO here in the future, but I wonder if it will be like WoW, or will we see a radical new direction?

From what I've been reading it seems like it'll be quiet a radical new direction. Plus SWTOR is looking pretty good IMO, so it might be the next big MMO.

[SimplySchizo]

weren't there rumors a while back on wow going f2p?

I mean they make sht-tons on selling mounts alone. let alone realm xfers and sex-changes or whatever the hell they're doing these days. (i quit 3 yrs ago)

[CUBBYJR2005]

From what I've been reading it seems like it'll be quiet a radical new direction. Plus SWTOR is looking pretty good IMO, so it might be the next big MMO.

Lets be honest when it does come out SWTOR. World of warcraft fans will get in the beta or the 30 days free and ditch SWTOR saying how bad it is by saying no end game pvp bad etc.Well World of warcraft was not perfect nor did it have all its end game or zero bugs when it launch.It will happen and wont be suprise if they come on the forums on different websites saying SWTOR is bad and world of warcraft is number one and nothing cna replace it etc etc.World of warcraft fans did this to other mmos. One mmo company had to stop the world of warcraft fans on there forums to stop making customers leave the game.

[Blackhearted]

From what I've been reading it seems like it'll be quiet a radical new direction. Plus SWTOR is looking pretty good IMO, so it might be the next big MMO.

I doubt it. TOR doesn't look like it's even close to being wow-killer material.

[Joseph B]

From what I've been reading it seems like it'll be quiet a radical new direction. Plus SWTOR is looking pretty good IMO, so it might be the next big MMO.

Every new MMO is the next big MMO.

Every MMO that has released since WoW has come out is pretty much dead playerbase wise. The only ones that aren't, are the "free" ones.

I'm kind of hoping Blizzard releases a decent patch / expansion soon, i'm bored ****less playing these other crappy MMOs. Rift is completely mind numbing now. FFXIV is beyond... Well, it's FFXIV we all know the story there, XIV is only fun every 2 months when new things are released to mess around with for a day or two then log out again for 2 months.

[dead.cell]

weren't there rumors a while back on wow going f2p?

Nope, they made a mention about the F2P model but it had no bearing on their goals. Remember, Blizzard nearly dropped a bomb on the community by bringing up talks of another subscription on TOP of their current subscription model for Real ID grouping. And they've already got the Remote WoW subscription too, though I think that's more fair given that it exists outside the game.

They're making money still no doubt, but the game's growing old, and while I'm not a Star Wars fan, I do recognize ToR as being a big deal. Guild Wars 2 is also going to be a really big deal. I'm actually interested to see how Blizzard is going to combat these two behemoths, in terms of enticing old players back as well as new. Maybe actually drop the prices of those expansions for a change? Or a new battlechest? Or maybe some new sort of promotion? They can't be keeping their prices up for too much longer...

[CUBBYJR2005]

weren't there rumors a while back on wow going f2p?

I mean they make sht-tons on selling mounts alone. let alone realm xfers and sex-changes or whatever the hell they're doing these days. (i quit 3 yrs ago)

yes right now wow is doing free up to level 20 but is the game free to play model all the way to 85 no but they will it just a matter of when.Alos people like I said will ditch SWTOR no matter what because they are die hard fans of world of warcraft get this through guys no one ever said swtor was going to out beat wow so stop comparing the two.SWTIOR is only going to win in one part and that is STORY LORE that part they win over blizzard.

[the evn show]

World of warcraft was not perfect nor did it have all its end game or zero bugs when it launch.

The thing is: nobody is competing with warcraft of 7 years ago. It's like saying "cars in the 60s only get 15 miles per gallon so it's okay the new Honda does" or "It's okay if you release a cellphone without the ability to applications, copy/paste, tether, or stream music" because 7 years ago there was no iPhone to do all that with.

Warcraft might have been absolute crap 5 years ago, but it's pretty damn good by MMO standards these days. If you want to draw blizzard customers from Blizzard you're going to need something competitive with Warcraft as it exists today.

One mmo company had to stop the world of warcraft fans on there forums to stop making customers leave the game.

It's not like warcraft fans are mind-controlling super villans. I think a far better explanation is that people try <new game x> and either decide the whole genre isn't fun, or they realize that warcraft (or some other game) is better.

It's not like banning all the Gears of War fans from the Duke Nukem Forever fan sites would have made that game suck any less.

Alos people like I said will ditch SWTOR no matter what because they are die hard fans of world of warcraft get this through guys no one ever said swtor was going to out beat wow so stop comparing the two.SWTIOR is only going to win in one part and that is STORY LORE that part they win over blizzard.

I thought that was the case with Lord of The Rings Online. and Anarchy Online, and Warhammer online, or DC Universe, or Age of Conan, or ?

Hello Kitty Online has about as much lore as any of these games and it executes it roughly as well (given the different audiences). The issue isn't "have a cool story to tell" but "it's damn hard (expensive) to tell a good story in a game"

It's sad, but I really don't were going to get a jump like Quake -> Halflife from MMOs until blizzard releases whatever they've been working on since TBC. I think blizzard is using Warcraft as a test bed for their next mmo. They're getting things like allowing millions of players to play together on a single realm sorted, load balancing, streaming content patches, security, "real money stuffs", etc. sorted. They're experimenting with group sizes, different methods of story telling (phasing, cinematics, etc). They might be spotty in warcraft, but the lessons are going to pay off in a big way for their next MMO. That puts the industry in a bad place: they're all chasing World of Warcraft now - not "World of Starcraft" (or whatever it ends up being).

Blizzard has an automatic 5-million subscribers for their next mmo and I expect it to lack many of the faults Warcraft has. The rest of the industry is starting several steps back. The only group that seems to be doing anything interesting is guild wars 2 (killing the 'holy trinity') and if that works: blizzard will just bite that wholesale. It's sort of like Apple and the iPod: the Ipod is hard to beat, if you come up with something novel, Apple will steal it and then do it better because Apple is bloody good at consumer electronics. No matter what Apple releases they can count on about half a million sales right out of the gate becuase they've got wealthy fans and a reputation for excellent products. Samsung might make a good phone, but they don't get that same initial launch day sales rush and that puts them behind the curve the entire fight.

[Tharp Daddy]

The thing is: nobody is competing with warcraft of 7 years ago. It's like saying "cars in the 60s only get 15 miles per gallon so it's okay the new Honda does" or "It's okay if you release a cellphone without the ability to applications, copy/paste, tether, or stream music" because 7 years ago there was no iPhone to do all that with.

Warcraft might have been absolute crap 5 years ago, but it's pretty damn good by MMO standards these days. If you want to draw blizzard customers from Blizzard you're going to need something competitive with Warcraft as it exists today.

It's not like warcraft fans are mind-controlling super villans. I think a far better explanation is that people try <new game x> and either decide the whole genre isn't fun, or they realize that warcraft (or some other game) is better.

It's not like banning all the Gears of War fans from the Duke Nukem Forever fan sites would have made that game suck any less.

I thought that was the case with Lord of The Rings Online. and Anarchy Online, and Warhammer online, or DC Universe, or Age of Conan, or ?

Hello Kitty Online has about as much lore as any of these games and it executes it roughly as well (given the different audiences). The issue isn't "have a cool story to tell" but "it's damn hard (expensive) to tell a good story in a game"

It's sad, but I really don't were going to get a jump like Quake -> Halflife from MMOs until blizzard releases whatever they've been working on since TBC. I think blizzard is using Warcraft as a test bed for their next mmo. They're getting things like allowing millions of players to play together on a single realm sorted, load balancing, streaming content patches, security, "real money stuffs", etc. sorted. They're experimenting with group sizes, different methods of story telling (phasing, cinematics, etc). They might be spotty in warcraft, but the lessons are going to pay off in a big way for their next MMO. That puts the industry in a bad place: they're all chasing World of Warcraft now - not "World of Starcraft" (or whatever it ends up being).

Blizzard has an automatic 5-million subscribers for their next mmo and I expect it to lack many of the faults Warcraft has. The rest of the industry is starting several steps back. The only group that seems to be doing anything interesting is guild wars 2 (killing the 'holy trinity') and if that works: blizzard will just bite that wholesale. It's sort of like Apple and the iPod: the Ipod is hard to beat, if you come up with something novel, Apple will steal it and then do it better because Apple is bloody good at consumer electronics. No matter what Apple releases they can count on about half a million sales right out of the gate becuase they've got wealthy fans and a reputation for excellent products. Samsung might make a good phone, but they don't get that same initial launch day sales rush and that puts them behind the curve the entire fight.

Great post. I think another issue is that, unlike toppling a very popular FPS, MMOs are constantly evolving. When individuals pick up an MMO they are going to compare it to WoW, it's just how the consumer mind works. World of Warcraft is the defining concept of an MMO for many individuals. So when something like AoC, Rift, _____ comes out, they are going to do a mental comparison. They expect this new MMO to have an equal amount of features, a ton of content, polish, etc. The problem is that while they are designing their game they are competing with what WoW was at the time, and Blizzard is constantly adding new features that are now being considered the standard. It's very difficult to compete with an ever evolving industry leading product, because you will likely not start on even ground, and even if you do it will remain very difficult to stay ahead/toe-to-toe.

[Alladaskill17]

Evn.'s post is true! I for one have not played WoW for many months but I really do (sadly) think about it sometimes (rarely, but still admittedly) and want to play but refuse to re-activate my account. I quit right before Cataclysm. I was content with my "omg full 25man heroic gear" all the achievements and maxed skills etc when I left. But I do miss it and WoW does a great job in MANY aspects of an MMO that are mimicked in the newer MMOs (from what I have seen/heard etc).

[the evn show]

Ultranerf inc. MMO champion is posting details about 4.3 and the eventual end of expansion.

I'm kinda hoping the "piecewise" nerf firelands over the next 7 weeks. Week 1 is Shannox, Week 2 is Rhyolith, Week 3 is Alysrazor, etc. until finally in Week 7 we get Ragnaros. The first 6 bosses are already cleared in a few hours so I really don't care how easy they make them now. We're into Rag phase 4 but haven't managed to scrape out a kill. I'll be disappointed if they take away the option tonight. We might not be Paragon, but I think being tied for US #30 isn't all together horrible and losing the chance to do something difficult (even after the HP nerf) feels really crappy.

While the HP nerf made the fight easier it mostly just hit with the little soft enrages. You could get through P1 without a third trap, P2 in 3 seeds instead of 4, P3 was a bit more relaxed. We were able to hit the marks pre-nerf reasonably well (about 50% of the time) but it was a lot more stressful. Eventually we'd have just farmed enough best-in-slot gear to make it feel like it does now. If they go through and nerf mechanics like slowing down world in flames, making molten elementals lose the stacking buff, slowing down meteors, making dreadflame lazy about spreading, then the encounter just won't feel the same.

Looks like casual ICC style easy raiding is making a comeback but if you're interested in 'zomg heroic raids', we're looking for moonkin/elemental shaman, maybe a healer, and a prot paladin wouldn't be bad

[Hell-In-A-Handbasket]

Id like to be able to see that stuff, unfortunatly alot of guild would have trouble on a 2phase fight involving a paperbag. So far we can usually down shannox, and rarely ryolith because of it. Have to sometimes take random guildies/under geared because of it.

Im 370 DK Tank, sometimes bringing in people under 359...... Not alot of places i can go as people usally only want a shield tank. Although i have been called by alot of guilds to be one of the best tanks on server

[Shaun N.]

Although i have been called by alot of guilds to be one of the best tanks on server

Not really a compliment if most of the tanks on your server are ****.

[AbandonedTrolley]

We made steady progress before the nerfs hit and thankfully took down Domo beforehand. We did have a couple tries at Raggy but were found wanting quite a bit. We have now managed to get in to phase 3 so hoping that this weekend we should be looking to finish him off.

Draba - Azjol-Nerub (EU)

[Lord Nite]

Just curious as to how many people will be jumping on the PTR to try the new 4.3 changes before they go live. My subscription has expired, for the moment, and the PTR will be the only way I can play for now. I am interested in the new dungeons and the end-game raid they have proposed, as well as the raid finder implementation.

[the evn show]

I'll be on PTR to test the new raid content but otherwise it's all RP nonsense as far as I'm concerned.

I might let my subscription lapse until 4.3 as there's no content right now (we made a raid of bank Alts wearing cata blues and icc epics and still cleared Firelands).

You can literally grab any 10 idiots and clear Firelands (we might try 10-manning 25m normal mode soon, it's that trivial)

[Mystic Mungis]

I played a while back but then started to play less and less because I was too busy, on Saturday night I went to my friends and he was playing so I got him to recruit me back. I deleted all my chars and started again since it's changed so much and now I have a level 48 Human Hunter and I'm loving it, always used to play Horde but thought I'd play Alliance for a change :p

[Hell-In-A-Handbasket]

You can literally grab any 10 idiots and clear Firelands (we might try 10-manning 25m normal mode soon, it's that trivial)

wish i could say that, guild is stil reliably 1/7 normal ( even After FL Nerfs ), been that way since begining of last month. guild still has problems with chogal and nef.

[S00N3R FR3AK]

so my laptop fried pre nerfs and I missed my guilds kills of the stupid bird and domo. Had no idea about the nerfs till after an hour and half we were 6/7 last night. It just doesn't even feel good to get kills and gear like that. I might keep my sub till SWTOR or I might just drop after I kill rag.