Upgrade version: bad news

By Andy1369
in The Fast Ring (Insider Previews)

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Experienced

Andy1369

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Since I obviously have to prove I'm a beta tester, and that I'm running a legit copy, see the picture - I know it doesn't have my name... but I swear I am a beta tester.

Also, here's a screenshot of the final RTM's help file.

Look, I don't really know how I can prove that I'm a tester without giving out my personal information, but I SWEAR I AM A BETA TESTER. Some of you may have seen me in the newsgroups.

post-126842-1163987794_thumb.jpg

post-126842-1163987805_thumb.jpg

Experienced

McoreD

Posted
Posted
Bad news, guys. =/ You know how, when you purchased an upgrade version of XP, you could still do a clean install, and XP Setup would detect older versions of Windows, or you insert a disk and Windows would accept the older product and allow you to still do a clean install?

Was it really so, with a upgrade XP disk? I didn't know that. I am assuming the Upgrade XP CD still can't be used in a brand new HDD where no previous OS is installed?

Thats how I would have expected an upgrade version to act.....

Me too.

Grand Master

Denis W. Veteran

Posted
  • Veteran
Posted
Andy13 said:

Since I obviously have to prove I'm a beta tester, and that I'm running a legit copy, see the picture - I know it doesn't have my name... but I swear I am a beta tester.

Also, here's a screenshot of the final RTM's help file.

Look, I don't really know how I can prove that I'm a tester without giving out my personal information, but I SWEAR I AM A BETA TESTER. Some of you may have seen me in the newsgroups. 

OK then. Bummer.

On the bright side, at least you have a free copy of Vista. :yes:

Enthusiast

pikablu0530

Posted
Posted

I disagree. The Vista Upgrade disc will be bootable. Look at the following page:

http://www.microsoft.com/windowsvista/getr...pgradeinfo.mspx

It says there in the Notes:

If you are currently using Windows 2000 Professional or Windows XP Professional x64, you are eligible for an upgrade copy to a corresponding or better edition of Windows Vista, but a clean install is required.

It specifically says that an upgrade copy is possible and with that upgrade dvd, you will have to perform a clean install. This already shows that the upgrade DVD will allow you to do a clean install, provided you have an eligible copy of a previous version of Windows.

Experienced

Andy1369

Posted
  • Author
Posted
I disagree. The Vista Upgrade disc will be bootable. Look at the following page:

http://www.microsoft.com/windowsvista/getr...pgradeinfo.mspx

It says there in the Notes:

If you are currently using Windows 2000 Professional or Windows XP Professional x64, you are eligible for an upgrade copy to a corresponding or better edition of Windows Vista, but a clean install is required.

It specifically says that an upgrade copy is possible and with that upgrade dvd, you will have to perform a clean install. This already shows that the upgrade DVD will allow you to do a clean install, provided you have an eligible copy of a previous version of Windows.

Then why does the Help say that, then?

Think MS just overlooked it...aha yet another result of rushing Vista???

Grand Master

+InsaneNutter MVC

Posted
  • MVC
Posted

There is one Vista DVD for every version, Corp, OEM, Upgrade and so on.. which version is installed is determined by the cd key you use.

I would imagine if you buy the upgrade version once you enter your vista cd key it will ask you to enter your xp cd key as well so it can check you actually own xp, that would make perfect sense to me.

I don?t believe for one minute that you won?t be able to boot of the CD if you buy the upgrade.

Grand Master

FloatingFatMan

Posted
Posted

I would imagine if you buy the upgrade version once you enter your vista cd key it will ask you to enter your xp cd key as well so it can check you actually own xp, that would make perfect sense to me.

It's always puzzled my why they haven't ALWAYS done this, at least since XP anyway... Afterall, copies of the discs themselves are easy to come by, it's legitimate keys that are less easy to find.

Rising Star

Jazket

Posted
Posted

Past upgrades, such as XP, would simply ask you to insert the previous versions disk, I believe and then proceed to do a clean XP install.

I don't remember where, but I read elsewhere you could do "exactly the same thing" with Windows Vista upgrade kit... I wasn't "reading" things...

Experienced

Aero Ultimate

Posted
Posted

Hmm... so on the one side MS says you can't do it and on the side that you can... looks like the left hand doesn't know what the right hand does :rofl:

Very unprofessional. I really hope that you actually can boot from an upgrade CD, otherwise they would drive a lot more people into piracy who don't want to bother with having to install XP first each time.

Grand Master

Julius Caro

Posted
Posted

It doesnt make much sense to me. The point of upgrade versions is something more "License-wise" than installation wise. They sell you a cheaper version because it is assumed (and it will be checked) that you have a previous version of windows.

It would make more sense if this checked whether or not you have a LEGIT license of this previous windows version. I really don't think that microsoft would make a call like this out of their laziness of doing it the right way. But meh, what can you expect from then when the office 2000 upgrade check would take that SAME installation cd as a valid previous version!

Not to mention that people format their pcs from time to time, and they just won't install XP to install vista over it. And of course the upgrade DVD will be bootable, since you need to have access to the recovery tools anyway.

And, if it is not bootable, I'm sure you can still perform a clean install from within windows (either xp or vista).

So either way, this can't be right!!

Rising Star

Morpheus Phreak

Posted
Posted

I can explain this rather easily actually

Both sides are somewhat right and somewhat wrong.

The wording in the help file is somewhat poor.

Here's the easiest way to put it. With an upgrade only edition of XP you will not be able to perform a clean install from the boot process, which is why it says you cannot boot the upgrade disc to perform the install.

You have to start the install from inside of another copy of Windows

However you will not be able to upgrade Windows 2000 etc to Vista, you will only be able to start the install and a clean install while in the Win2k environment. It will then reboot and wipe 2k and install Vista as a fresh OS on your drive.

However with XP it will be able to detect and allow you to just upgrade the OS keeping your files and settings in place and secure.

The logic behind this is that Vista will be able to tell if your license has been set as a "Genuine" license via WGA. If it hasn't then Vista will not allow you to install the upgrade version which means pirates are crap out of luck here.

Fun eh?

Enthusiast

Gstar

Posted
Posted

OK... got it... I think... :blink: :wacko:

So long as you've got a full copy of XP (OEM or Retail), you'll be able to boot from the Vista "Upgrade" version, but not from "XP Upgrade" to "Vista Upgrade". Do we know if it's just based on media verification similar to XP? :ermm:

Rising Star

Morpheus Phreak

Posted
Posted
OK... got it... I think... :blink: :wacko:

So long as you've got a full copy of XP (OEM or Retail), you'll be able to boot from the Vista "Upgrade" version, but not from "XP Upgrade" to "Vista Upgrade". Do we know if it's just based on media verification similar to XP? :ermm:

Nope you still don't have it.

Any installs from an upgrade DVD will have to be started from inside of 2000 or XP.

With XP however you can choose to do an upgrade install which will leave all of your files and settings in place, or a clean install which will restart the PC and wipe everything and install Vista

With 2000, it will limit you to a clean install only which means you cannot do an upgrade so all of your files and settings will be lost.

Grand Master

Xerxes

Posted
Posted

I that is no good :( but one thing I don't understand, aren't all the Vista DVDs suppose to be the same? I always thought that all the DVDs were exactly the same and the only thing was that different amongst the different versions was the product key? and if that is the case...how could a different product stop a disk been bootable? it could stop you doing a clean install though...but maybe I'm completely wrong, as I haven't been following Vista that closely...

Experienced

Andy1369

Posted
  • Author
Posted

I guess that makes sense (only allowing an upgrade/clean install from within the operating system environment) BUT BUT BUT how would users handle it if their copy of Vista got corrupted? How would they "repair" from the DVD? How would they run the Startup Repair tool?

Something's just not right here.

On a side note: I HATE VISTA SO MUCH! God, sorry. I know that doesn't help my cause much, nor is it necessary, but... honestly. Vista is wrong on so many levels.

Rising Star

Morpheus Phreak

Posted
Posted
I guess that makes sense (only allowing an upgrade/clean install from within the operating system environment) BUT BUT BUT how would users handle it if their copy of Vista got corrupted? How would they "repair" from the DVD? How would they run the Startup Repair tool?

Something's just not right here.

On a side note: I HATE VISTA SO MUCH! God, sorry. I know that doesn't help my cause much, nor is it necessary, but... honestly. Vista is wrong on so many levels.

The repair tools come before the install so they are still accessible from the DVD.

Also to answer an earlier question yes all the DVD's are exactly the same so Xerxes what were are saying is that while the DVD is bootable you cannot just boot from the DVD and install Vista, do you see the difference?

If you use a full retail copy DVD it simply will not allow an upgrade install from a DVD boot, it's disabled there as well.

Grand Master

Xerxes

Posted
Posted

The repair tools come before the install so they are still accessible from the DVD.

Also to answer an earlier question yes all the DVD's are exactly the same so Xerxes what were are saying is that while the DVD is bootable you cannot just boot from the DVD and install Vista, do you see the difference?

If you use a full retail copy DVD it simply will not allow an upgrade install from a DVD boot, it's disabled there as well.

Fair enough, thx for the info :) seems rather strange way of doing it though, so an upgrade can't do a fresh install like the XP upgrade could (when you prove you own a copy of the previous OS your upgrading from) and the full install can't upgrade...seems rather odd considering that RC1 could do a clean install or upgrade...guess MS want to make it clear that the Upgrade version is only for upgrading and the Full is only for a clean install I guess.

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