Policy regarding OS X on non-Apple Hardware

[Hell-In-A-Handbasket]

i did, and can provide pics of the CD/DVD's to boot, as well as Aperture and 2 copies of XP Pro

I wonder how many of Mac users actually bought Leopard when they upgraded from Tiger. :whistle:

[markwolfe Veteran]

Anyone on Neowin who openly admits to pirating Windows (or anything else for that matter) is asking for trouble around here.

Software copyright infringement has always been very clearly forbidden here. Music less so. :ermm: And images... :p Well, I am infringing right now with my "Opus" the penguin in my avatar.

Oh, I know you have. It's just that you're making it sound like every hackintosh will be run with a pirated copy of OS X which is obviously not true.

...

Do you have my post confused with someone else's? :unsure: I followed the quotes back and my post was clearly in regards to a single comment that made it sound that "winking" and avoiding the truth was an acceptable way to skirt the warez issue - and it is not.

...

Breaking an EULA agreement is illegal too.

If you can't respect and comply with an EULA, don't use the software.

Except, in this case, the clause that ties the legally-purchased OSX media to Apple hardware has apparently been ruled null and void by a 1984 federal ruling. Anyone have a link to that ruling?

[MasterC]

I agree. :)

I wonder how many of Mac users actually bought Leopard when they upgraded from Tiger. :whistle:

*Raises Hand* I did. I waited outside of the store and was one of the first ones to purchase it. I can give pics as proof if you want. ;)

[Richard Hammond]

If you can build a superior looking machine... you should submit your resume to the Apple Design team I'm sure they are open to new ideas.

Wow yeah because we all know the white plastic or silver aluminium makes your pc go faster!!!!!!

[Eric Veteran]

It is STILL wrong to pirate anything.

It is illegal to take drugs, it is illegal to steal a bike, it is illegal to download pirated songs,...

They are all ILLEGAL activities.

Breaking an EULA agreement is illegal too.

If you can't respect and comply with an EULA, don't use the software.

Breaking the EULA is not illegal. It simply negates the contract between you and the vendor, which hardly makes a difference anymore since most software EULAs state that the manufacturer will not guarantee that the product will be useful for any specific purpose or even work. Copying and distributing is piracy.

Apple's EULA says:

7. Disclaimer of Warranties. YOU EXPRESSLY ACKNOWLEDGE AND AGREE THAT USE OF THE APPLE SOFTWARE IS AT YOUR SOLE RISK AND THAT THE ENTIRE RISK AS TO

SATISFACTORY QUALITY, PERFORMANCE, ACCURACY AND EFFORT IS WITH YOU. EXCEPT FOR THE LIMITED WARRANTY ON MEDIA SET FORTH ABOVE AND TO THE

MAXIMUM EXTENT PERMITTED BY APPLICABLE LAW, THE APPLE SOFTWARE AND ANY SERVICES PERFORMED OR PROVIDED BY THE APPLE SOFTWARE ("SERVICES") ARE

PROVIDED ?AS IS?, WITH ALL FAULTS AND WITHOUT WARRANTY OF ANY KIND, AND APPLE AND APPLE'S LICENSORS (COLLECTIVELY REFERRED TO AS ?APPLE? FOR THE

PURPOSES OF SECTIONS 7 and 8) HEREBY DISCLAIM ALL WARRANTIES AND CONDITIONS WITH RESPECT TO THE APPLE SOFTWARE AND ANY SERVICES, EITHER EXPRESS,

IMPLIED OR STATUTORY, INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, THE IMPLIED WARRANTIES AND/OR CONDITIONS OF MERCHANTABILITY, OF SATISFACTORY QUALITY, OF

FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE, OF ACCURACY, OF QUIET ENJOYMENT, AND NON-INFRINGEMENT OF THIRD PARTY RIGHTS. APPLE DOES NOT WARRANT AGAINST

INTERFERENCE WITH YOUR ENJOYMENT OF THE APPLE SOFTWARE, THAT THE FUNCTIONS CONTAINED IN, OR SERVICES PERFORMED OR PROVIDED BY, THE APPLE SOFTWARE

WILL MEET YOUR REQUIREMENTS, THAT THE OPERATION OF THE APPLE SOFTWARE OR SERVICES WILL BE UNINTERRUPTED OR ERROR-FREE, THAT THE APPLE SOFTWARE OR

SERVICES WILL BE COMPATIBLE WITH THIRD PARTY SOFTWARE, OR THAT DEFECTS IN THE APPLE SOFTWARE OR SERVICES WILL BE CORRECTED. NO ORAL OR WRITTEN

INFORMATION OR ADVICE GIVEN BY APPLE OR AN APPLE AUTHORIZED REPRESENTATIVE SHALL CREATE A WARRANTY. SHOULD THE APPLE SOFTWARE OR SERVICES PROVE

DEFECTIVE, YOU ASSUME THE ENTIRE COST OF ALL NECESSARY SERVICING, REPAIR OR CORRECTION. SOME JURISDICTIONS DO NOT ALLOW THE EXCLUSION OF IMPLIEDWARRANTIES OR LIMITATIONS ON APPLICABLE STATUTORY RIGHTS OF A CONSUMER, SO THE ABOVE EXCLUSION AND LIMITATIONS MAY NOT APPLY TO YOU.

[funciona]

I am looking at what I have in software at my house and I don't find anything pirated.

I work for an indie game studio and I know how much it costs in time, efforts, testing and how much you need to be passionate about your product to get it retailed. I won't ever pirate a software.

I can't really understand how you can think about buying OS X if you don't know if it will run on your computer. I think most (more than 90 %) of people using OSX86 have pirated the software. IMHO, any way of circumventing any kind of software protection is illegal. Even more if in the EULA it is written that you are not allowed to do it.

To answer someone who posted before, I have all these softwares and none of them is pirated :

- Windows Vista (yes, I must have a PC to test on all major platforms)

- Windows XP

- Mac OS 10.5

- Unity 3D (An excellent 3D software development tool)

- Cheetah3D

- Pixelmator 1.2

- Mac Office 2008

- Microsoft Office 2007

- Dreamweaver

- Quicktime Pro

- World of Warcraft (I make games and play them too)

- Civilization IV

- Puzzlequest : Challenge of the Warlords

And I also bought my share of games on my Wii and my Xbox 360.

And no, I don't have Adobe Photoshop because I don't really need it.

Question: Do you buy all your music CDs?

It is STILL wrong to pirate anything.

Its wrong yes but nowadays morals means 0.

It is illegal to take drugs

Not in some countries.

Breaking an EULA agreement is illegal too.

No it isnt.

Developers like you who worry SO much about pirating deserve to get pirated. If you would spend all the time you worry about your software getting pirated on developing you would create a outstanding product that everyone would HAVE to buy.

[pHaez]

It is quite simple people. EULA's have legal binding in civil court, not criminal court. Just because Apple writes in a contract that x isn't allowed, does not mean that by doing x, you are breaking any criminal laws. They don't have the authority to pass criminal laws. It simply means that you are opening yourself up to civil liability. Apple can sue you if they wish. In this case, I doubt that they would, as the law (at least in the US, where Neowin is registered as a company and is hosted) states that no operating system can be required to be installed on specific hardware, and to require that would put them in violation of said law. Also, by installing the software, you are agreeing to the EULA, not Neowin. We have no obligation to determine, report or enforce civil issues, nor are we liable because you are committing a civil offense.

We are however required to prevent the discussion/committal of illegal (criminal) activities. If we allow discussion/commital of criminal activity, we are assisting and encouraging (aiding and abetting) illegal activity, and at that point, we become an accomplice to that crime. This is why if you are violating a law, we don't want to know. That is your own business, and so long as you keep it to yourself, we are violating no laws by offering you support. It is not our responsibility to seek out, and punish those that are violating criminal laws anymore so than it is any of your responsibilities to do the same before replying to a support thread, that is what law enforcement agencies get paid to do.

[Hell-In-A-Handbasket]

outside of hardcore/benchmarks speed for a while has been moot with current systems. i personaly got a mac for OSX/Aesthetics of the OS and Hardware. I like the look of OSX and Apple's hardware

Wow yeah because we all know the white plastic or silver aluminium makes your pc go faster!!!!!!

[vanacid]

Question: Do you buy all your music CDs?

hmmm.... I buy the tunes I like over iTunes, and I bought some CDs too.

I don't have pirated music on my computer if it is what you mean.

8.9 Gb of legal music on my hard drive.

Developers like you who worry SO much about pirating deserve to get pirated. If you would spend all the time you worry about your software getting pirated on developing you would create a outstanding product that everyone would HAVE to buy.

If they can pirate the product, they will. They will never HAVE (in a technical view) to buy the software to get it. If they are used to pirate products, they will pirate products they like. Indie (independent) studio that doesn't make BIG money (and publish over Big Fish Games and/or XBLA) are really hurt by piracy.

We sell our games 8-15$ online, it is not all that much.

Still... I can find the games I worked 8-15 months on torrent sites. This is just STUPID.

I know I am offtopic, but Apple makes money from their (great and beautiful) hardware, just buy a mac to use Mac OS X. It will be worth it.

[starmatrix]

Well, I have Leopard isntalled on my nice Quad core PC.

Yes, that's right, I did have to MANUALLY install a kext!

I know no Mac user should ever be exposed to anything that deep in the OS.

But now I have it running perfectly, and if I had to do it again, I'd still rather waste an hour of my life doing it the complicated way than spending a lot more money on buying shiny Apple hardware. :)

[MasterC]

Well, I have Leopard isntalled on my nice Quad core PC.

Yes, that's right, I did have to MANUALLY install a kext!

I know no Mac user should ever be exposed to anything that deep in the OS.

But now I have it running perfectly, and if I had to do it again, I'd still rather waste an hour of my life doing it the complicated way than spending a lot more money on buying shiny Apple hardware. :)

I don't think this thread is here for people to come in and brag about it. ;)

[panicswitched]

a note on the whole pirating thing,

you can make your own install media on a mac with the efi bypass and such, downloading the iso file from the sites is still piracy, but technically you can make your own media that will install on the generic x86 and have a legal boxed copy (this is what pystar did with their 'open computer')

all in all this means if you want to use OSX on your non apple hardware BUY A BOXED COPY OF OSX

[vanacid]

a note on the whole pirating thing,

you can make your own install media on a mac with the efi bypass and such, downloading the iso file from the sites is still piracy, but technically you can make your own media that will install on the generic x86 and have a legal boxed copy (this is what pystar did with their 'open computer')

all in all this means if you want to use OSX on your non apple hardware BUY A BOXED COPY OF OSX

Well... I agree with this statement. But they will lose apple support in doing so.

[mrt2]

So what you are saying is that the look of the physical box is much more important than the guts of the box.

For me, it's the opposite.

Not at ALL what I was saying... what I'm saying is that it's a normal practice in business to pay a higher premium for aesthetics... That's why Sony crap charges a higher premium for some of the stuff; because it looks nice... that's why some cars are waaaay over priced; because they look nicer. That's why most cars that have 2 and 4 door versions the 2 door version costs more even with the same guts... because it looks good. In any retail type of situation there are 2 things you ALWAYS pay a higher premium for:

1) For convenience

2) For aesthetics

Apple has both of those covered with the convenience of having an amazing well designed, crafted, and stable box (and OS for that matter which is part of the reason that they are so stable... they make the OS for the stuff that they themselves put inside) and with the beautiful look of not only the inside and the outside... and just for the record I've been a PC fan boy for years (I'm an MS Network engineer by trade) I?ve built every PC I?ve ever owned myself. I mean I?m the kind of nerd that saws and drill parts and cut out the sides to add lights and frosted glass etc... So trust me when I say I?m well versed in the enthusiast world. When I first thought about a new system I priced a Dell with the SAME specs as the Apple I have now just to see if this myth was true and the Dell came out to be more. So this whole argument about Apples being overpriced is MUTE AT BEST. Now if your argument is for retail VS. home built then I would agree with you... I can personally build a machine with the same specs for less than I can buy ANY COMPUTER (Apple or any other PC retailer included). It seems that most argument on this topic is misdirected at Apple instead of being directed at PC retailers as a w;)le... ;)

[Wannes]

*Raises Hand* I did. I waited outside of the store and was one of the first ones to purchase it. I can give pics as proof if you want. ;)

I had it for free on my Macbook Air and I purchased it when upgrading from Tiger on my Macbook.

[dead.cell]

Do you have my post confused with someone else's? :unsure: I followed the quotes back and my post was clearly in regards to a single comment that made it sound that "winking" and avoiding the truth was an acceptable way to skirt the warez issue - and it is not.

My apologies. I do believe I have misread what you were trying to say.

It is STILL wrong to pirate anything.

Never said it wasn't. My post was also directed at Mark because I confused his previous post to suggest that every hackintosh uses or will use an illegal copy of OS X.

It is illegal to take drugs, it is illegal to steal a bike, it is illegal to download pirated songs,...

Well, duh...

They are all ILLEGAL activities.

Breaking an EULA agreement is illegal too.

Even when it has been proven that Apple cannot force you to use their product only on Apple computers? :huh:

If you can't respect and comply with an EULA, don't use the software.

People are still buying the software and that's mostly what the companies care about. I personally don't see Apple making any sort of move on any individual anyhow as 1) They may very well lose and 2) The hackintosh creates potential customers. I really feel that this isn't a big issue as some of you are making it out to be.

I do believe they should have their own forum though, simply for the fact that if something is wrong with the hackintosh, it may be due to something outside a pure installation of OS X on a Mac.

[ANova]

Petty arguing over the violation of laws pushed by special interest groups and written by corrupt government officials getting under the table payoffs to limit consumer rights for the purpose of corporate profit. EULAs and "licenses" specifying what you can and cannot do with the product you payed for and own.

I can't help but laugh at all of you playing into the game of greed.

[EnzoFX]

Would there be an issue if a partition of OSX and Vista/XP shared files? I'm talking about personal files/music/movies, etc... I once had an issue, maybe it was indexing? With dual booting Vista and XP, and I ended up having to re-install XP.

[Eric Veteran]

Would there be an issue if a partition of OSX and Vista/XP shared files? I'm talking about personal files/music/movies, etc... I once had an issue, maybe it was indexing? With dual booting Vista and XP, and I ended up having to re-install XP.

There shouldn't be. Windows doesn't recognize OSX partitions without extra software and unless Leopard is different, OSX can't write to NTFS partitions. (I guess FAT32 maybe? I don't do fruit, so I'm not completely certain.)

[Harlem39s Finest]

In that case if no one admits to pirating leopard we should receive the same help everyone else gets with asking for windows help, photoshop help, dreamweaver help.

i think apple fanboys/users are peed of to see that its "possible" to run OS X on a computer (which isn't made by apple[i'd feel ripped off tbh]) and you can do it much cheaper.

[EnzoFX]

OSX can't write to NTFS? Pretty sure I've done this, with an NTFS formatted USB drive, Or... Did I miss something?

[offroadaaron]

OSX can't write to NTFS? Pretty sure I've done this, with an NTFS formatted USB drive, Or... Did I miss something?

you can read and write to NTFS with certain drivers installed.

[EnzoFX]

^^ Well that was on my iBook running Tiger at the time, with no extra drivers installed.

[aussiefloyd_fan]

^^FAt32?

now i remember on MACworld.com they reviewed the frakenmac. the osx86 mac that you could buy with it pre installed.. would that be illegal if i were to stumble across this site and buy a mackinhackinfranketosh ? and use it?

i uddderstand thats a whole nuther issue in ittitself

[Cara Veteran]

^^FAt32?

now i remember on MACworld.com they reviewed the frakenmac. the osx86 mac that you could buy with it pre installed.. would that be illegal if i were to stumble across this site and buy a mackinhackinfranketosh ? and use it?

i uddderstand thats a whole nuther issue in ittitself

If it is not Apple Labeled (Official or Officially Licensed) Hardware, it is in violation of the EULA. Depending on who you ask around here you will get a different view of if it is legal or illegal.