official Windows Phone Summit 20-June-2012

[.Neo]

I'm completely torn on what to do. I really can't stand the though having to use this BlackBerry Torch 9860 for another five-six months until Windows Phone 8 and hardware are released. As it stands now I can get the Nokia Lumia 900 on a one-year contract next week. I figure I'll be owning the Lumia 900 for five-six months by the time Windows Phone 8 is available and only use for another six-seven months before I can get another phone.

That's not too bad I guess. It's not like I have to use it for two years.

Any thoughts?

[George P Global Moderator]

I'm completely torn on what to do. I really can't stand the though having to use this BlackBerry Torch 9860 for another five-six months until Windows Phone 8 and hardware are released. As it stands now I can get the Nokia Lumia 900 on a one-year contract next week. I figure I'll be owning the Lumia 900 for five-six months by the time Windows Phone 8 is available and only use for another six-seven months before I can get another phone.

That's not too bad I guess. It's not like I have to use it for two years.

Any thoughts?

If you're not going to get locked into a 2 year contract then I think it's fine. The Lumia 900 is a good device and we just don't know enough about the 7.8 update really. I think you could probably wait until their next event, probably late July or mid August when we should get more details of 7.8. If you feel you can stay with 7.8 for those 6 months after WP8 comes out then go for it. Hell by the time your 1 year is ending they could already be on a 2nd wave of WP8 devices for all we know.

[.Neo]

Yeah, that's what I figured too.

[Growled Member]

Gosh, I'm about to burst having to wait for all the MS goodness to come out.

[revanmj]

Most software features are apparently being ported, and apps targetting newer APIs won't run on older devices. This is no different than iOS/Android in a way.

Not really - on iOS or Android you can make one app package that works on older (of course not all, usually 4.x in case of iOS and 2.2 in case of Android for that moment) and newer versions of the OS. Some functions using newer API simply won't be available on those older releases. And from what I understand, developers targeting WP8 won't be able to write their apps to work that way. WP7 simply cannot run apps using WP8 APIs no matter what developer would do.

[psreloaded]

The feature I would miss most in Windows Phone 7.8 is deep VoIP support. Can VoIP support only be implemented using the Windows NT core!!!

I bet if they wanted they could have brought this feature to Windows Phone 7.8.

[rfirth]

Not really - on iOS or Android you can make one app package that works on older (of course not all, usually 4.x in case of iOS and 2.2 in case of Android for that moment) and newer versions of the OS. Some functions using newer API simply won't be available on those older releases. And from what I understand, developers targeting WP8 won't be able to write their apps to work that way. WP7 simply cannot run apps using WP8 APIs no matter what developer would do.

It's no different. You are correct, if you target WP8, it won't run on WP7. Solution? Don't target WP8. Target WP7. Microsoft will recompile it in the cloud into native code for Windows Phone 8. Problem solved. No problem.

On iOS, target iOS 4 instead of iOS 6. If you require iOS 6, anyone who hasn't upgraded yet won't be able to run your app! That means no original iPad! See? Same problem, same solution.

It's just like the Mango update. With the Mango SDK, you could target 7.0 or 7.1 (Mango). If you keep targeting 7.0, your app would run on both 7.0 and 7.1. If you target 7.1, then your app wouldn't work on any pre-Mango phones. Now just substitute 7.0 for 7.8 and 7.1 for 8, and it's the same situation.

EDIT:

One little thing here, though... from what I've seen on iOS, I think you can target a lower device version but still use the newer APIs if you compile with the newer SDK... but you have to do a version check around that code or the app will throw an exception...

The problem is that you can write native code in WP8 apps. And apparently WP7 devices lack certain hardware security features, I think, relating to sandboxing. I'm not certain about this part. They don't want unsafe apps running on WP7.8 devices. And for a mountain of reasons, WP8 couldn't all be ported to WP7 devices. It's a very sticky situation, but they have to get it all sorted eventually. It's best to get it out of the way now while Windows Phone is still small.

The feature I would miss most in Windows Phone 7.8 is deep VoIP support. Can VoIP support only be implemented using the Windows NT core!!!

I bet if they wanted they could have brought this feature to Windows Phone 7.8.

They haven't announced this yet. I hope it's coming. They have hinted very strongly that there are a lot of features that they haven't talked about yet that will be announced later.

As far as I can tell, VoIP support could be added to WP7.8 very very easily. It's actually not a very big tweak to get it to work. I would bet that it's included.

[.Neo]

Gosh, I'm about to burst having to wait for all the MS goodness to come out.

Yeah same here. I really looked forward to getting the Lumia 900 at the end of the month and ritually burn my BlackBerry. :/

[dafin0]

Yeah same here. I really looked forward to getting the Lumia 900 at the end of the month and ritually burn my BlackBerry. :/

just a quick question, it is known across the lands you are an apple fan so im a bit surprised you dont want a iphone, any reason for that?.

[.Neo]

just a quick question, it is known across the lands you are an apple fan so im a bit surprised you dont want a iphone, any reason for that?.

Does it make your head explode some people are able to enjoy products of both companies? Such a crazy world we live in huh? ;)

[dafin0]

Does it make your head explode some people are able to enjoy products of both companies? Such a crazy world we live in huh? ;)

you truly have rocked my world :p

[.Neo]

you truly have rocked my world :p

Can't say I blame you. Too many people here trying to indoctrinate everyone with you either belong to one side or another.

[dafin0]

Can't say I blame you. Too many people here trying to indoctrinate everyone with you either belong to one side or another.

yeah i hear you mate. but with that said sometimes its good just for usability to stick to one "side" because they work better together.

anyways good day/night to you kind sir

[.Neo]

yeah i hear you mate. but with that said sometimes its good just for usability to stick to one "side" because they work better together.

anyways good day/night to you kind sir

True. On the other hand it's fun to try something new out instead of sticking to the same thing year in year out. (Y)

G'day/night to you too.

[subcld]

eh i need more details on OS features :wacko: after watching the event i feel like someone giving me a lot of gifts then cut me off and telling me come back after 4 months

[.Neo]

eh i need more details on OS features :wacko: after watching the event i feel like someone giving me a lot of gifts then cut me off and telling me come back after 4 months

The competition within the mobile space is brutal. No company is playing out all their cards until the very last moment.

[George P Global Moderator]

eh i need more details on OS features :wacko: after watching the event i feel like someone giving me a lot of gifts then cut me off and telling me come back after 4 months

This was the basic developer intro, not much on the consumer side other than the new start screen and IE10. I don't know when they'll have another event but I'm going to guess and say August. Probably another BUILD conference. MS doesn't want to show many end user features until it's closer to release so others don't start copying things.

[subcld]

i know and i know a lot of features not ready for displaying and they don't want others to copy OS features but patience sometimes hard

looking forward to see the complete features when it reach its final version

[~Johnny]

I find it rather pointless having a developer event, but not actually giving developers either the tools to code with, or even a date too expect them. Why even bother playing your cards with only a subset of features when you could just wait a month or two and give a more impressive presentation... but aw well.

[watchthisspace]

I find it rather pointless having a developer event, but not actually giving developers either the tools to code with, or even a date too expect them. Why even bother playing your cards with only a subset of features when you could just wait a month or two and give a more impressive presentation... but aw well.

One thing Microsoft need to get ontop of is helping Devs make the most of the Windows Phone platform by offering vast API's and tools to make thing easier.

I have a friend who has to make some apps for Windows Phone 7 and said it's no way near as nice as Apple or even Android to programme on.

[.Neo]

I find it rather pointless having a developer event, but not actually giving developers either the tools to code with, or even a date too expect them. Why even bother playing your cards with only a subset of features when you could just wait a month or two and give a more impressive presentation... but aw well.

True. That is weird. I guess they're trying to build up some hype?

[George P Global Moderator]

The tools, well, mostly, are found on the Windows 8 WinRT SDK etc. They made it a point that the shared code base makes it super easy to port from Win8 to WP8 or WP8 to Win8. This whole event was to get people who are WP7 devs to make Win8 apps and Win8 devs to rethink their apps for WP8 or start to think up new ones. If you get used to WinRT on the desktop then WinRTP (P for Phone) is going to be more or less the same, I'd say at least 90% the same with the rest being Phone specific things to that form factor.

Also, giving out the SDK now would spill the beans on more feature that they just didn't want to talk about yet. They don't want anything copied etc. I expect the WP8 SDK by this time July or mid August.

[.Neo]

Also, giving out the SDK now would spill the beans on more feature that they just didn't want to talk about yet. They don't want anything copied etc. I expect the WP8 SDK by this time July or mid August.

Realistically speaking, what difference will 1,5 month make in the terms of competitors copying things? Probably not a thing. ~Johnny's point still stands, Microsoft could have just waited with the presentation or release the SDK now.

[BajiRav]

I find it rather pointless having a developer event, but not actually giving developers either the tools to code with, or even a date too expect them. Why even bother playing your cards with only a subset of features when you could just wait a month or two and give a more impressive presentation... but aw well.

I think they just wanted to get it out before Google I/O and after WWDC.

[jakem1]

The feature I would miss most in Windows Phone 7.8 is deep VoIP support. Can VoIP support only be implemented using the Windows NT core!!!

I bet if they wanted they could have brought this feature to Windows Phone 7.8.

I'm going to hazard a guess and say that full VOIP support won't be coming to WP7.8. I suspect that this will rely upon the new multitasking capabilities and will require the W8 core.

I'd be happy to be proven wrong though :)