Man shot and killed caring airsoft rifle

[DocM]

Ahh you mean you poke your nose into other people's business and take the law into your own hands? That explains a lot.

Sighhhh... it's not in my nature not to intercede when something's going on in front of my damned face.

Try this:

I had been asked by my neighbors to keep an eye out for their 16 y/o daughter. She had come home from her summer job and was sleeping in, but her parents had to work. At about 9 AM I look out my back door to see three males breaking in their kitchen doorwall, wearing ski masks - in August. Not good, and she could be hurt or worse before the the cops arrive.

I pull out my firearm, pocket the cordless phone, exit and get the drop on them. One has a Ka-Bar combat knife, which he very wisely drops, and all three end up face down on the ground while I call the cops. It takes them 15 minutes to arrive - time enough for the perps to have done serious damage to the neighbors daughter.

By your standards I should have called the cops and let the chips fall as regards what they could have done to her until they arrived, but that isn't in most American's DNA - and certainly not mine.

[Noir Angel]

Not all situations are that bad though, I bet you'd be just as happy to pull your gun on a shoplifter. I know how your type works.

[DocM]

^{No, you don't know Jack. That much is obvious.}

^{I have only interceded when felonies were being committed in my presence and when the opening to properly intercede presented itself. That is what you learn in the carry classes, both Basic and Advanced Level. What we learn isn't that different than what a police cadet does, often from the same instructors. but on average civilians get more range time and are better shots than street cops.}

^{You also seem to be forgetting that in 49 of 50 states citizens have the right to perform citizens arrests - a limited police power.}

[Charisma Veteran]

I'm actually wishing I had a decent handgun right about now. I'm pretty sure someone followed me home and watched me go inside, and then left. No idea if something is going to happen later O_O

DocM, come protect me :laugh:

[Noir Angel]

So gun classes actually train people to act like vigilantes? that also explains a lot.

[Charisma Veteran]

So gun classes actually train people to act like vigilantes? that also explains a lot.

No, they do not. Please stop baiting him and making assumptions like that. Gun safety classes teach you how to use them SAFELY and not be as likely to freak out and cause an accident or use it unnecessarily. I do know a thing or two about this topic; my ex-husband was a cop, and while he was not a shining example of one, I did meet some who were. Modern-day heroes, some of them. Situations like the one before--if I were that 16-year-old girl, if this had happened to me when I was that age, I'd be thankful every day for a "vigilante" like him who stepped up and (peacefully, I may add) neutralised the situation. Often just having the gun and letting them see that you do is enough to stop them, as well as knowing how to handle yourself.

[Noir Angel]

He lies about my position to deliberately misrepresent it and I get accused of baiting him? lol. There may be the odd occasion where vigilantism may help, but conversely it can also be dangerous when you have people thinking they have the right to take the law into their own hands. It's the kind of power not everybody uses honestly, which is usually why we pay people money and train them to be cops. I'm not saying people should always be left to die, there will always be exceptional circumstances in which an intervention may be necessary, but those circumstances should be the exception not the rule.

[DocM]

Chjarisma;

Thank you, and you state how it really works on the ground precisely. Vigilantes go out hoping for trouble, but those who carry simply prepare for if trouble looks for and finds them. Different things entirely.

Suggestion for a ladies 'little friend': Ruger LC9, second from left in my signature.

[Charisma Veteran]

He lies about my position to deliberately misrepresent it and I get accused of baiting him? lol. There may be the odd occasion where vigilantism may help, but conversely it can also be dangerous when you have people thinking they have the right to take the law into their own hands. It's the kind of power not everybody uses honestly, which is usually why we pay people money and train them to be cops. I'm not saying people should always be left to die, there will always be exceptional circumstances in which an intervention may be necessary, but those circumstances should be the exception not the rule.

No, I didn't say that, I just mean on this particular topic I think you are reading too much into what he is saying. Some people do abuse that power, but not everyone does. That's all I am trying to say...

(and yes, those circumstances you mentioned are, thankfully, the exception.)

[Charisma Veteran]

Chjarisma;

Thank you, and you state how it really works on the ground precisely.

Suggestion for a ladies 'little friend': Ruger LC9, second from left in my signature.

Ah Doc, the ones I liked best from before were either a S&W .38 snubnose revolver or the standard issue 9mm Glock. Or maybe the 'baby Glock'. I haven't seen or used them since we divorced back in '07, but I do remember being fairly competent with those when I would accompany him to the shooting range.

Anyway, sorry, taking this thread a wee bit off topic. :)

[Tom]

Airsoft is fun. This is not.

[Noir Angel]

I never claimed that everyone abuses that power, but the problem is that for every person prepared to use that kind of power scrupulously I'd wager you'd find 2 that were not. And that is why I am opposed to it, not because I want to see innocent people being harmed, I just feel uneasy about people taking the law into their own hands. It's only a couple of steps away from anarchy.

Airsoft is fun. This is not.

Air rifles are great fun for practice shooting. I don't kill animals with them, but they're the right level for me. Fun but not too dangerous.

[DocM]

Anarchy is what exists on a lot of city streets, and your 1:2 proportion is way off. The crime rate for concealed or open cariers is extremely low, which would not be the case if they were running around acting out as you suggest.

[Noir Angel]

Except my comment was with regards to vigilante types, not all concealed weapon carriers. I'm sure there are plenty of concealed weapon carriers that don't act like vigilantes

[Tom]

Air rifles are great fun for practice shooting. I don't kill animals with them, but they're the right level for me. Fun but not too dangerous.

I'm in an airsoft society at university. We often go to a local place which is in a forest with significant high ground at both ends. It's freaking awesome.

[Noir Angel]

I'm in an airsoft society at university. We often go to a local place which is in a forest with significant high ground at both ends. It's freaking awesome.

I presume you don't shoot air rifles with metal slugs though? Airsofting does sound like a hell of a lot of fun (as does paintballing) but I don't really know enough people to partake in my local area.

[DocM]

^{Airsoft is a spring, electric or gas cartridge powered gun that fires 6mm plastic pellets, and they can be single shot, semi-auto or full-auto. Some use 2 or all 3 power systems. Velocities run 200-700 feet/second, but the energy is very low - maybe 1-2 lbf. There are targets for indoor/outdoor use, and they can be used for training in a basement.}

^{Many are very close replicas of real weapons. Some of the pistols are so accurate a copy even the slide moves back just like a real semi-auto pistol. I have one of these that's a dead ringer for a SIG Sauer P226, which makes it a great trainer for my real SIG P226 Mk25.}

[Noir Angel]

Ahh that explains it, I'm used to calling those BB guns.

[DocM]

A BB gun here has 'BB' meaning ball bearing. These are .177" (actual 0.172" to 0.173') steel balls, sometimes copper coated, and can be spring, pumped air or gas powered. No red tip for these as they can do real damage. The .177's often can also fire a .177" (actual) lead pellet with even more energy, and there are pellet guns that run larger - .20 (6mm), .22 or .25, which are very powerful and excellent for dispatching varmints.

[Noir Angel]

We tend to call those that fire real pellets air pistols although I understand that they can sometimes crossover. I sure as hell wouldn't want a metal BB fired at me, even with low energy they still hurt. I guess the term BB gun has became somewhat bastardised in this country, as a lot of the guns can fire both metal and plastic balls.

[DocM]

We also have another wrinkle that can be fired from the BB/pellet guns: darts.

[Noir Angel]

I've seen those in airsofting shops before, I've never been able to figure out exactly what their purpose is though? I only really have any experience in the use of air rifles.

[DocM]

Dart boards, foam or cardboard targets, or small vermin at close range.

[Noir Angel]

Makes sense. Can they be modified for the use of things like tranquilliser, or are those separate darts altogether?

[DocM]

Tranq darts are usually fired from a .50 caliber (12.95 mm) gas gun. The dart has a metal ball whose inertia drives the syringe plunger forward at impact. You might be able to make one for a single-shot .25 pellet gun, but the agents are restricted so....