Common sense fixes to Windows 8


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Dot Matrix

That is what is not true. All Apps. Everything is just there isn't it? No way to collapse the sections?

All Apps != Start Screen.

Not sure how you prefer that over Searching. It's a cumbersome UX no matter what OS you use.

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BajiRav

My god you guys are acting like I am just sitting here punching kittens for the fun of it. If Microsoft does not want users to use desktop shortcuts anymore, REMOVE THE FUNCTIONALITY.

Every time you create/use a shortcut on your desktop, a kitten dies.

p.s. Microsoft allows you to store music and documents in C:\Windows*. I hope you store all your stuff in there.

*or whatever is your %windir%

All Apps != Start Screen.

Not sure how you prefer that over Searching. It's a cumbersome UX no matter what OS you use.

His hands are not near his keyboard apparently. So he can't type when launching applications.

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xWhiplash

Every time you create/use a shortcut on your desktop, a kitten dies.

p.s. Microsoft allows you to store music and documents in C:\Windows*. I hope you store all your stuff in there.

*or whatever is your %windir%

His hands are not near his keyboard apparently. So he can't type when launching applications.

Nice, you are comparing to using a feature that everything uses (install a program "Would you like a desktop shortcut?") to throwing music files in the windows directory? You are really saying those two things are the same?

Wow....SHOW ME where Microsoft has said using desktop shortcuts are evil.

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Crimson Rain

.....

So instead of using desktop shortcuts (which I guess is like a feature you guys consider to be sooooooooooo unbelievably horrible), you suggest I resort to creating a batch file?! No thanks.

Show me where in an official statement from Microsoft, in the Windows 8 documentation somewhere, that desktop shortcuts are now such a big no-no.

DO not like how I use it? FINE. But to sit here and tell me they should not be used is just ridiculous. I like how I use them. If you do not, then again, fine. Everybody uses their computers differently.

For gods sake, did I ONCE say I am unable to click using the start screen? NO. I prefer desktop shortcuts. I prefer the Start Menu where everything was nice and organized in collapsible folders. Word is pinned to my taskbar already. But in the cases where I need OneNote or Access, I open the folder that has every office icon in there. MUCH better than throwing everything in the start screen where it is visible whether you need it once in a blue moon or need it every day.

Nobody asked you NOT to use the method you prefer until you started whining about it.

And it is whining because now there are other better ways to do what you are trying to do. If you do not like them and want to stick to old ways, nobody will say anything until you start to whine about it.

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BajiRav

Nice, you are comparing to using a feature that everything uses (install a program "Would you like a desktop shortcut?") to throwing music files in the windows directory? You are really saying those two things are the same?

Wow....SHOW ME where Microsoft has said using desktop shortcuts are evil.

IIRC MS Office does not have option to create desktop shortcut. (it's been a while since I installed it though)

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Brandon H

.....

So instead of using desktop shortcuts (which I guess is like a feature you guys consider to be sooooooooooo unbelievably horrible), you suggest I resort to creating a batch file?! No thanks.

Show me where in an official statement from Microsoft, in the Windows 8 documentation somewhere, that desktop shortcuts are now such a big no-no.

DO not like how I use it? FINE. But to sit here and tell me they should not be used is just ridiculous. I like how I use them. If you do not, then again, fine. Everybody uses their computers differently.

For gods sake, did I ONCE say I am unable to click using the start screen? NO. I prefer desktop shortcuts. I prefer the Start Menu where everything was nice and organized in collapsible folders. Word is pinned to my taskbar already. But in the cases where I need OneNote or Access, I open the folder that has every office icon in there. MUCH better than throwing everything in the start screen where it is visible whether you need it once in a blue moon or need it every day.

we're sitting here making suggestions on how you could do things because you're sitting here complaining how you have to take a quarter of a second to press the desktop tile among other things

if you despise the start screen so much and want the start menu back why not just install Start8 or similar?

you got Windows 8 at the discount price I'm sure. $5 more isn't going to kill you, especially if it gives you a more comfortable experience

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Dot Matrix

MUCH better than throwing everything in the start screen where it is visible whether you need it once in a blue moon or need it every day.

Once again, All Apps != Start Screen. :sleep2:

You can't blame MS for moving on. Again, shuffling through desktop and All Apps clutter is a thing of the past. Search is the new All Apps, and it's what Microsoft wants to build off of, and you can't blame them, it's a pretty powerful tool, and much faster than clicking through everything. The fact that you want to ignore this and app pinning is not Windows's or Microsoft fault. It's nothing they are going to fix - it's nothing they can fix, and nor should they.

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P.M.K

Also, don't judge Windows 8 until you've used it via touch, then you'll see why things are the way they are.

What a silly comment....................

What if I don't want to use it via a touch device??

If that is the case then there should have been a touch version and a non touch version.

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xWhiplash

we're sitting here making suggestions on how you could do things because you're sitting here complaining how you have to take a quarter of a second to press the desktop tile among other things

if you despise the start screen so much and want the start menu back why not just install Start8 or similar?

you got Windows 8 at the discount price I'm sure. $5 more isn't going to kill you, especially if it gives you a more comfortable experience

So do you consider any product review that voices anything they do no like as whining? I can no longer like a product but have things I hate about it?

I was asked why I like to boot to desktop instead of sticking in the start screen. I explained that I prefer the desktop icons. THEN everybody just got on my case.

Again. Tell me where I can find an official statement that desktop shortcuts are now severely evil to the point where you guys resort to calling my methods messy. Do you consider a person who puts their bills and insurance information in file folders messy? It is called being organized.

It is you guys that are the problem here. I am a very nice guy, but I do not just sit around while you guys just sit there and act like I am doing the worst thing in the world by using desktop shortcuts. So if you attack my methods, yes I will get frustrated and defend them as best as I can. Not that I have to. I have my methods. You have yours.

Did Microsoft actually say desktop icons are a huge, major, massive, no-no? Then why are you guys saying it? Why the hell does it matter to you if I use desktop icons?

I have used start8 before. I do not like using third party OS tools. I was simply saying MS should have pub a simple, little, tiny, small check box to boot directly to the desktop and hide the hot corners.

In a corporate environment, start8 would not be installed.

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Brandon H

So do you consider any product review that voices anything they do no like as whining? I can no longer like a product but have things I hate about it?

I was asked why I like to boot to desktop instead of sticking in the start screen. I explained that I prefer the desktop icons. THEN everybody just got on my case.

Again. Tell me where I can find an official statement that desktop shortcuts are now severely evil to the point where you guys resort to calling my methods messy. Do you consider a person who puts their bills and insurance information in file folders messy? It is called being organized.

It is you guys that are the problem here. I am a very nice guy, I do not just sit around while you guys just sit there and act like I am doing the worst thing in the world by using desktop shortcuts. So if you attack my methods, yes I will get frustrated and defend them as best as I can. Not that I have to. I have my methods. You have yours.

Did Microsoft actually say desktop icons are a huge, major, massive, no-no? Then why are you guys saying it? Why the hell does it matter to you if I use desktop icons?

I have used start8 before. I do not like using third party OS tools. I was simply saying MS should have pub a simple, little, tiny, small check box to boot directly to the desktop and hide the hot corners.

In a corporate environment, start8 would not be installed.

it's fine to complain about something you don't like with a new product but it get's old after a bit, especially when you shoot down everyone that tries to help you work around what you don't like and just continue to complain

and as far as the MS saying that using desktop icons is bad, they've hinted at wanting people to move away from them at least a few times over the past few years or so but they've never "officially" said stop using them

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xWhiplash

it's fine to complain about something you don't like with a new product but it get's old after a bit, especially when you shoot down everyone that tries to help you work around what you don't like and just continue to complain

and as far as the MS saying that using desktop icons is bad, they've hinted at wanting people to move away from them at least a few times over the past few years or so but they've never "officially" said stop using them

What I do not like is not being able to boot directly to the desktop.....people asked why....so I told them why.....But instead of accepting that microsoft should have put in a simple little check box that DOES NOT AFFECT YOU GUYS to simply boot directly to the desktop, people here called my methods WRONG, INCORRECT, and MESSY.

Yes I know work arounds exist. Again. You have your methods....I have mine. To sit here and call my methods wrong or messy is just not right.

Then as long as that feature exists, I consider OK to use as it is a feature provided to us. It is not WRONG or BAD to use them as some people here suggest.

That is what is driving me crazy. You can suggest things all you want. But how dare you sit there and try to convince me that desktop shortcuts are SUDDENLY and WITHOUT NOTICE the BANE of all existence and that I am horrible for using them. To sit there and call using desktop shortcuts incorrect, wrong, or messy is not right.

You can suggest new ways of doing things. But with my organization desires, they simply are not a replacement. I prefer folders, sub folders, and desktop icons. That functionality still exists in Windows 8. So how dare you tell me it is incorrect to use something provided by the OS itself?

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+LogicalApex

What I do not like is not being able to boot directly to the desktop.....people asked why....so I told them why.....But instead of accepting that microsoft should have put in a simple little check box that DOES NOT AFFECT YOU GUYS to simply boot directly to the desktop, people here called my methods WRONG, INCORRECT, and MESSY.

Yes I know work arounds exist. Again. You have your methods....I have mine. To sit here and call my methods wrong or messy is just not right.

Then as long as that feature exists, I consider OK to use as it is a feature provided to us. It is not WRONG or BAD to use them as some people here suggest.

Welcome to Neowin.

For the hardcore Microsoft Fanboys you're supposed to absolutely love everything about Windows 8 and Windows Phone 8. There is nothing that these OSes have done wrong and if you don't embrace 100% of what they offer you're "resistant to change" and "old" (and other not so nice words). Everything about Windows prior to 8 is crap and from the obsolete world. The future is Metro and it is the best thing since sliced bread.

If you don't share that opinion you're going to get torn to pieces here fast. Don't let it get to you. The reality is technology is there to serve you, not the other way around, despite what the fanboys would like to have you believe. Use it the way you feel is best for you.

I agree a boot to desktop option would have been great. Similar to how my Windows Server 2012 install boots to desktop out of the box. It wasn't impossible. Microsoft just doesn't care about users the way they used to.

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xWhiplash

Welcome to Neowin.

For the hardcore Microsoft Fanboys you're supposed to absolutely love everything about Windows 8 and Windows Phone 8. There is nothing that these OSes have done wrong and if you don't embrace 100% of what they offer you're "resistant to change" and "old" (and other not so nice words). Everything about Windows prior to 8 is crap and from the obsolete world. The future is Metro and it is the best thing since sliced bread.

If you don't share that opinion you're going to get torn to pieces here fast. Don't let it get to you. The reality is technology is there to serve you, not the other way around, despite what the fanboys would like to have you believe. Use it the way you feel is best for you.

I agree a boot to desktop option would have been great. Similar to how my Windows Server 2012 install boots to desktop out of the box. It wasn't impossible. Microsoft just doesn't care about users the way they used to.

I hope none of these guys work in IT. They would get fired so fast saying a fellow employee's methods is messy and incorrect. The feature is freaking built in to Windows....how is them using it making their procedures incorrect? So you know what the companies I talk to have decided....to skip Windows 8....Not because it is new, they were actually considering it, but because of the new interface would mess up other workers.

A boot to desktop will not only benefit myself and other people here, but it would also benefit in the corporate world. The avoidance of the new interface will be welcome in the corporate world if there is a simple way (SIMPLE check boxes during setup) to do so.

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c.grz

A boot to desktop will not only benefit myself and other people here, but it would also benefit in the corporate world. The avoidance of the new interface will be welcome in the corporate world if there is a simple way (SIMPLE check boxes during setup) to do so.

The "boot to desktop" option would not benefit the corporate world as you think it would. In a normal setup (not dual-booting with another OS); interaction with the start screen is minimal. From the few desktops with Windows 8 we've rolled out there's a slight learning curve but beyond that they've grown acustom to Windows 8 including the start screen.

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xWhiplash

The "boot to desktop" option would not benefit the corporate world as you think it would. In a normal setup (not dual-booting with another OS); interaction with the start screen is minimal. From the few desktops with Windows 8 we've rolled out there's a slight learning curve but beyond that they've grown acustom to Windows 8 including the start screen.

That is why it would be a simple check box....some companies and businesses would benefit from it. Therefore...all they need to do is check one little itty bitty box.

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Dashel

I loath Desktop shortcuts Whiplash but again you can see where Dot's flamebaiting and less than factual statements keep rearing their heads. If anything, the 'desktop shortcut' types should love StartScreen. Figuring out why they don't (no nested containers per your Office example) is another common sense fix.

He also wrongly cites muscle memory - which would only apply if the SS were a true grid and NOT a rearranging one. So I agree that another easy fix is to allow a simple grid and additional tile size a la WP. Sadly, they can't even decide which of those metaphors is right.

Of course they don't work in IT. As War noted, they are 'full screen' users, that laughably, use 'small' taskbar icons. I say we lobby to remove that feature cause its clearly a stupid setting that doesn't effect me.

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xWhiplash

I loath Desktop shortcuts but again you can see where Dot's flamebaiting and less than factual statements keep rearing their heads. If anything, the 'desktop shortcut' types should love StartScreen. Figuring out why they don't (no nested containers per your Office example) is another common sense fix.

He also wrongly cites muscle memory - which would only apply if the SS were a true grid and NOT a rearranging one.

I would love it if I can group things in something collapsable (like the folders) and where I do not need to scroll a lot to get to the tile I need.

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+LogicalApex

I hope none of these guys work in IT. They would get fired so fast saying a fellow employee's methods is messy and incorrect. The feature is freaking built in to Windows....how is them using it making their procedures incorrect? So you know what the companies I talk to have decided....to skip Windows 8....Not because it is new, they were actually considering it, but because of the new interface would mess up other workers.

A boot to desktop will not only benefit myself and other people here, but it would also benefit in the corporate world. The avoidance of the new interface will be welcome in the corporate world if there is a simple way (SIMPLE check boxes during setup) to do so.

No, the vast majority of them are some level of student (K-12, or College/University) or otherwise very young. In their world if someone doesn't agree with them they aren't intelligent. They grew up with the Internet and have internalized its disdane for alternative viewpoints.

That's why we can't have any normal discussion here regarding Windows 8.

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+warwagon

For the hardcore Microsoft Fanboys you're supposed to absolutely love everything about Windows 8 and Windows Phone 8. There is nothing that these OSes have done wrong and if you don't embrace 100% of what they offer you're "resistant to change" and "old" (and other not so nice words). Everything about Windows prior to 8 is crap and from the obsolete world. The future is Metro and it is the best thing since sliced bread.

Sooooo True!! It was so true it made me laugh!

On a different note, I was at a customers house today helping them transfer some stuff off their old xp desktop to their new Windows 8 desktop that she has had for about 2 weeks. The customer was female and was probably around my age (33).

I noticed that her clock on her computer was behind 2 hours *slaps forehead*. I looked at it, and told her how I thought it was stupid that Microsoft never gives people an option on Windows 8 to set their timezone during the boot. She said "ya, I noticed the clock was behind, I just wasn't sure where to go to fix it".

Which drives home the point i've been trying to make forever.

A) Microsoft should let people set their timezone on first boot just like in every other versions of windows

B) Most Pro shove windows 8 down your throat members here, really haven't delt with the average user that much.

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Brandon H

Sooooo True!! It was so true it made me laugh!

On a different note, I was at a customers house today helping them transfer some stuff off their old xp desktop to their new Windows 8 desktop that she has had for about 2 weeks. The customer was female and was probably around my age (33).

I noticed that her clock on her computer was behind 2 hours *slaps forehead*. I looked at it, and told her how I thought it was stupid that Microsoft never gives people an option on Windows 8 to set their timezone during the boot. She said "ya, I noticed the clock was behind, I just wasn't sure where to go to fix it".

Which drives home the point i've been trying to make forever.

A) Microsoft should let people set their timezone on first boot just like in every other versions of windows

B) Most Pro shove windows 8 down your throat members here, really haven't delt with the average user that much.

or even better, just have it auto detect like any other device anymore (can set based on ISP location, that shouldn't be too hard)
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Dot Matrix

Sooooo True!! It was so true it made me laugh!

On a different note, I was at a customers house today helping them transfer some stuff off their old xp desktop to their new Windows 8 desktop that she has had for about 2 weeks. The customer was female and was probably around my age (33).

I noticed that her clock on her computer was behind 2 hours *slaps forehead*. I looked at it, and told her how I thought it was stupid that Microsoft never gives people an option on Windows 8 to set their timezone during the boot. She said "ya, I noticed the clock was behind, I just wasn't sure where to go to fix it".

Which drives home the point i've been trying to make forever.

A) Microsoft should let people set their timezone on first boot just like in every other versions of windows

B) Most Pro shove windows 8 down your throat members here, really haven't delt with the average user that much.

You seem to be telling that same story everyday... Strangely involving new people. As I have yet to encounter this, I'm starting to not believe you. I deal with users everyday, however they're in the 15-30 category, who don't need their hands held. They're off an running without need a pushoff, especially teens. I've even seen younger children reach up to touch screens, and ask why the computer wasn't responding to their input. They honestly thought it was borked.

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Order_66

Pro tip: You never used the computer the way you wanted. Microsoft always designed Windows UI, not you.

And we as consumers have every right to point out its many flaws and vote with our wallets on whether we like their decisions or not, and if you look at the latest stats it looks like the people have voted and decided to keep their wallets in their pocket :)

You seem to be telling that same story everyday...

If this was directed toward yourself it would be a huge understatement, I mean seriously...

Welcome to Neowin.

For the hardcore Microsoft Fanboys you're supposed to absolutely love everything about Windows 8 and Windows Phone 8. There is nothing that these OSes have done wrong and if you don't embrace 100% of what they offer you're "resistant to change" and "old" (and other not so nice words). Everything about Windows prior to 8 is crap and from the obsolete world. The future is Metro and it is the best thing since sliced bread.

^This 100%

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Growled
I hope none of these guys work in IT. They would get fired so fast saying a fellow employee's methods is messy and incorrect. The feature is freaking built in to Windows....how is them using it making their procedures incorrect?

You know, it's funny. I hate desktop icons and refuse to have them on my home box but I have a slew of them at work. It's much easier to have a desktop icon for multiple locations and files.

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Torolol

Proper comparison to Start Screen is ... "A Full-Screen & Scrollable portion of Pinned Shortcut in Taskbar".

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BajiRav

No, the vast majority of them are some level of student (K-12, or College/University) or otherwise very young. In their world if someone doesn't agree with them they aren't intelligent. They grew up with the Internet and have internalized its disdane for alternative viewpoints.

That's why we can't have any normal discussion here regarding Windows 8.

Nice generalization there. I wish I was "very young" but as someone commented here the other day, I work in a "grocery store" because we are considering upgrading to Windows 8.

We can have all the discussions we want as long as both sides are willing to discuss alternatives. I want my shortcuts on the desktop and will not even consider any other place therefore...ALIENS! is not really a good starting point.

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